The Lord Jesus Christ IS God's ELECT...

[savedbygrace57]

even:

Well if you'd like to show where I have denied scripture, that will be fine..

You can start by all the places you have opposed the scripture witness I have given..

here is scriptural testimony of the Eternal Union of Christ with His Children!

http://www.christianforums.net/f17/eternal-union-christ-his-children-27246/

 

[Eventide]

even:



You can start by all the places you have opposed the scripture witness I have given..

here is scriptural testimony of the Eternal Union of Christ with His Children!

http://www.christianforums.net/f17/eternal-union-christ-his-children-27246/

And WHO wrote this article, you ? Are you one of those Calvinists who believe that everything you write and believe could not be wrong ? Is your understanding of these things beyond reproof ? Is the eternally glorious word of God summed up in TULIP for you personally ?

 

[Eventide]

Maybe time to bump this one up again..

 

[Eventide]

Calvinism is based upon a false understanding of ELECTION.. and you'll notice that whenever a Calvinist does speak about election it is always within the context of men... and not Christ.. in fact, the Lord Jesus Christ (the one who IS the elect of God) is never mentioned.. amazing isn't it..

I think it's one of the more subtle deceptions in Christendom today.. and IMO the god of this present evil world is doing a good job at steering men away from Christ.. and this is no different.. rather than Christ being glorified in election, Calvinism places this emphasis upon condemned men.. for all in Adam are under the same condemnation.

FLESH gives birth to the FLESH

SPIRIT gives birth to the SPIRIT

 

[Eventide]

Biblical election is a glorious and fascinating subject (as all biblical subjects are) when it is centered upon the person of the Lord Jesus Christ and His infinite glory !

 

[Eventide]

Predestined to the adoption of children by Jesus Christ...

PREDESTINATION is the same way.. simple and biblical when it's all focused on the Lord Jesus Christ alone..

What has God predestined for those who love Him... that they would be adopted as children by Jesus Christ.. and that's still a future event according to Romans 8.. ie, how that they whole creation groans and even those who have the Spirit.. we are waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our bodies.

 

[savedbygrace57]

Christ was considered in Election Isa 42:

1Behold my servant, whom I uphold; mine elect, in whom my soul delighteth; I have put my spirit upon him: he shall bring forth judgment to the Gentiles [Of His elect].

Because He was the Chosen Head of His People, the Church, His Body, as members in Him, and so they had a Representative Being, being Chosen in Him [His seed] before the world began; Now even though they [ His Members] did not as of then personally exist, Yet He did, and as the Elect Head Represented them, and hence it is written they were chosen in Him eph 1:


4According as he[The Father] hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

Notice, The Father did not choose them to be in or into Christ, but chose them in Christ, at the same date and time He chose Christ as their head. Thats why Jesus in His Prayer says that the world may know that thou Lovest them [The chosen] as thou has Lovedst me [The Chosen] and thou Lovedst Me [The Chosen] before the foundation:

Jn 17:

23I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.

24Father, I will that they also, whom thou hast given me, be with me where I am; that they may behold my glory, which thou hast given me: for thou lovedst me before the foundation of the world.

So obviously the Father Loved the Chosen at that time, before the foundation.

Paul prays that believers may know the dimensions of God's Love to them eph 3:

17That Christ may dwell in your hearts by faith; that ye, being rooted and grounded in love,


18May be able to comprehend with all saints what is the breadth, and length, and depth, and height;

19And to know the love of Christ, which passeth knowledge, that ye might be filled with all the fulness of God.

The reason why this is so deep, is because the dimensions of this Love to the saints is equal to that of which the Father had to them as consisting in His Son, as Part of Him.


Without Christ being the Head of a Chosen Family in Him, there simply would be no need for Him to Be God's Elect.

 

[Eventide]

Without Christ being the Head of a Chosen Family in Him, there simply would be no need for Him to Be God's Elect.

And that's why we are the elect of God IN CHRIST.. because we're members of HIS BODY.. all of us in the FLESH are under the same condemnation.. and that's why there is no condemnation to those who are IN Christ Jesus, who walk NOT after the FLESH but after the SPIRIT.

 

[savedbygrace57]

even:

And that's why we are the elect of God IN CHRIST..

Who is ?

 

[Eventide]

even:



Who is ?

Everyone who is IN CHRIST.. of course.. because HE IS the elect of God.

 

[Prince]

And that's why we are the elect of God IN CHRIST.. because we're members of HIS BODY.. all of us in the FLESH are under the same condemnation.. and that's why there is no condemnation to those who are IN Christ Jesus, who walk NOT after the FLESH but after the SPIRIT.

I still do not understand how you come to these conclusions, are you basing this of scripture?

You seem to believe people are called elect becasue of there belief in Christ, although that sounds good, its is not the truth.

Ephesians 1:4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

The elects were chosen long before God came in the flesh. The script says before the foundation of the world

 

[Eventide]

I still do not understand how you come to these conclusions, are you basing this of scripture?

You seem to believe people are called elect becasue of there belief in Christ, although that sounds good, its is not the truth.

Ephesians 1:4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

The elects were chosen long before God came in the flesh. The script says before the foundation of the world

And it has already been explained to you that even though God made a decision (choice) before the foundation of the world that all would be blessed in His Son... that doesn't mean that we were IN CHRIST from before the foundation of the world.. because EPH 2 makes it painfully clear that prior to trusting in Christ that we were dead and lost in trespasses and in sins... and the bible is also very clear that ALL IN ADAM are condemned...

Did you get that... ? Do you understand that YOU and I are NOT the elect.. we're condemned in the FLESH just like every other person in Adam IS...

Did you forget that if we shall seek to save our life that we shall lose it, and that if we lose it for HIM and the gospel that we shall save it.. or for the Christian... that I am crucified with Christ, nevertheless I live, YET NOT I, but Christ liveth in me..

Who's the elect there in Gal 2:20 ?

 

[Prince]

And it has already been explained to you that even though God made a decision (choice) before the foundation of the world that all would be blessed in His Son... that doesn't mean that we were IN CHRIST from before the foundation of the world.. because EPH 2 makes it painfully clear that prior to trusting in Christ that we were dead and lost in trespasses and in sins... and the bible is also very clear that ALL IN ADAM are condemned...

Did you get that... ? Do you understand that YOU and I are NOT the elect.. we're condemned in the FLESH just like every other person in Adam IS...

Did you forget that if we shall seek to save our life that we shall lose it, and that if we lose it for HIM and the gospel that we shall save it.. or for the Christian... that I am crucified with Christ, nevertheless I live, YET NOT I, but Christ liveth in me..

Who's the elect there in Gal 2:20 ?

And it has already been explained to you that even though God made a decision (choice) before the foundation of the world that all would be blessed in His Son

Perhaps the mis-understaning is that you are not backing your words with scripture - when rendering the word one must let the word speak.

Do you understand that YOU and I are NOT the elect

I dont know if you are an elect or not, and whether I am - well thats not crucial to the conversation...

Who's the elect there in Gal 2:20

Galatians 2:20 "I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, Who loved me, and gave Himself for me."

The word "elect" is not utilized in that scripture.

God has made a distinction between those that are called and those that are chosen.

Matthew 22:14 For many are called, but few [are] chosen.

There are people who God chose long ago (before Christ in the flesh) do you understand that these couple of scriptures dismiss your claim..

1) According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

2) Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

3) 11 for the children not yet being born, nor having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of the One calling,

See here is where your doctrine falls apart notice the term "not yet being born" Your whole theory rest upon people who believe in Christ are the elcts

NO the scripture tells us clearly "not being born yet" perhaps you should re-think your posistions as it is against the word of God....

 

[Eventide]

Perhaps the mis-understaning is that you are not baking your words with scripture - when rendering the word one must let the word speak.

Yeah, obviously everything I just wrote has no bearing on scripture.. are you serious ?

I dont know if you are an elect or not, and whether I am - well thats not crucial to the conversation...

I know for certain that neither YOU or me are the elect.. and that CHRIST is and the only reason that people are referred to the elect in scripture is because they are IN CHRIST.. who IS the elect.. AND that's what THIS THREAD is about.. the Lord Jesus Christ being the elect of God.

God has made a distinction between those that are called and those that are chosen.

Matthew 22:14 For many are called, but few [are] chosen.

No kidding...

There are people who God chose long ago (before Christ in the flesh) do you understand that these couple of scriptures dismiss your claim..

1) According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

2) Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

3) 11 for the children not yet being born, nor having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of the One calling,

See here is where your doctrine falls apart notice the term "not yet being born" Your whole theory rest upon people who believe in Christ are the elcts

NO the scripture tells us clearly "not being born yet" perhaps you should re-think your posistions as it is against the word of God....

So you don't think that God could decide things (like blessing all in His Son) before the foundation of the world.. ?

And do you ignore Eph 2 which I just posted that plainly says that prior to trusting in Christ that we were dead in trespasses and in sins... are you going to argue that you were actually in Christ before the foundation of the world when you didn't even exist yet..

Or maybe you deny the simple biblical fact that ALL are condemned in Adam.. and all justified freely IN CHRIST..

Maybe it's time to leave the teachings of Calvinism and actually agree with the word of God.

 

[Prince]

Yeah, obviously everything I just wrote has no bearing on scripture.. are you serious ?




I know for certain that neither YOU or me are the elect.. and that CHRIST is and the only reason that people are referred to the elect in scripture is because they are IN CHRIST.. who IS the elect.. AND that's what THIS THREAD is about.. the Lord Jesus Christ being the elect of God.



No kidding...



So you don't think that God could decide things (like blessing all in His Son) before the foundation of the world.. ?

And do you ignore Eph 2 which I just posted that plainly says that prior to trusting in Christ that we were dead in trespasses and in sins... are you going to argue that you were actually in Christ before the foundation of the world when you didn't even exist yet..

Or maybe you deny the simple biblical fact that ALL are condemned in Adam.. and all justified freely IN CHRIST..

Maybe it's time to leave the teachings of Calvinism and actually agree with the word of God.

Yeah, obviously everything I just wrote has no bearing on scripture

Im not saying that, what I am saying is your post seem to have more of what you think then what the bible declares, and that could be avoided if you would post scripture.

I know for certain that neither YOU or me are the elect

Believe what you will - but try to refrain from putting me in your category, for you do not if i am a elect or not, based on your doctrine evry christian is a elect, which is untrue.

Maybe it's time to leave the teachings of Calvinism and actually agree with the word of God

I dont follow Calvinism, jumping the gun a little arent we...

Anyhow all a readers must do is read the simple verses i posted and your idea of elects goes right out the window..

1) According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

2) Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

3) 11 for the children not yet being born, nor having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of the One calling,

See here is where your doctrine falls apart notice the term "not yet being born" Your whole theory rest upon people who believe in Christ are the elcts

NO the scripture tells us clearly "not being born yet" perhaps you should re-think your posistions as it is against the word of God....

So you don't think that God could decide things (like blessing all in His Son) before the foundation of the world.. ?

scripture please?

 

[savedbygrace57]

Everyone who is IN CHRIST.. of course.. because HE IS the elect of God.

When were they first in Christ ?

 

[Vic C.]

LOL, I can't believe this topic is still going.

Well anyway, according to some and their theology, God elected Himself!

It's either that or those expounding this idea that Jesus is the Elect, do not believe He was God incarnate. :shocked!

 

[Eventide]

Believe what you will - but try to refrain from putting me in your category, for you do not if i am a elect or not, based on your doctrine evry christian is a elect, which is untrue.

There's no doubt in my mind that you and I are NOT the elect.. and of course you can think what you want as well.. like when the LORD says that IF YOU shall seek to SAVE YOUR LIFE that YOU SHALL LOSE IT... that sounds like He's choosing YOU right..? LOL..

I dont follow Calvinism, jumping the gun a little arent we...

If it sounds like a duck it probably is a duck...

Anyhow all a readers must do is read the simple verses i posted and your idea of elects goes right out the window..

1) According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

OK.. let me stop you here and ask..

Does this verse teach that YOU were IN CHRIST from before the foundation of the world..? For some reason many people place the emphasis on the US part of this verse, rather than on the IN HIM part..

Now do a little bit of thinking here.. Did you even EXIST before the foundation of the world.. ? NO of course not.. but of course the Lord Jesus Christ did and He is the Lamb slain from before the foundation of the world.. so OF COURSE God is going to choose ALL that trust in HIM.. and HE ALONE made that choice before the foundation of the world.. before ANYONE existed..

NOW Eph 2 tells us plainly that we were dead and lost in trespasses and in sins before we trusted in Christ.. so do the simple math.. you were NOT in Christ before the foundation of the world.. even though this verse makes you believe that.. and I think it's because you're placing the emphasis on YOU rather than on IN HIM..

2) Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

That's right, all who love God have been predestinated to the ADOPTION OF CHILDREN by Jesus Christ.. and according to Romans 8 we're WAITING for the ADOPTION, to wit, the redemption of our bodies..

3) 11 for the children not yet being born, nor having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of the One calling,

Here's the Calvinist's only verse in the bible which they use to try and support UNCONDITIONAL ELECTION.. although as the Romans 9 study thread has shown, this has nothing to do with electing these people to salvation, but rather that the ELDER SHALL SERVE THE YOUNGER..

See here is where your doctrine falls apart notice the term "not yet being born" Your whole theory rest upon people who believe in Christ are the elcts

Well, you're welcome to keep your own opinion and continue to believe that GOD chose YOU while disreagarding the mountains of scripture which refute that..

NO the scripture tells us clearly "not being born yet" perhaps you should re-think your posistions as it is against the word of God....

That's right.. the ELDER SHALL SERVE THE YOUNGER.. was decided by GOD before they were even born..

 

[Eventide]

When were they first in Christ ?

Eph 1:13 tells us exactly when we were placed into the body of CHRIST.. AFTER we trusted in Christ, AFTER hearing the gospel, and AFTER we believed.

 

[Eventide]

LOL, I can't believe this topic is still going.

Well anyway, according to some and their theology, God elected Himself!

It's either that or those expounding this idea that Jesus is the Elect, do not believe He was God incarnate. :shocked!

It's a biblical fact that the Lord Jesus Christ is the elect of God, so I'm sorry if you can't see that.

As for your second point, it's nonsense.