The midpoint "intermission."

[Gabbylittleangel]

***
All of the Godheads threatenings & blessings are Eternal Covenant Conditional, They do not change, but we do. And the Lord always tells us of the few times something is to be altered.

---John

Amen John.

I think the biggest word in all prophesies causes most of the misunderstandings. It is the word "IF".

Like an "if/then" statement in computer programs. Things are conditional. Promises are conditional. Even if God's love is unconditional.

Unfortunately, the word occurs so many times that it is hard to do a study on it. According to the concordance that I just looked in... the word "If" occurs 1595 times in 1420 verses.

 

[John the Baptist]

Amen John.

I think the biggest word in all prophesies causes most of the misunderstandings. It is the word "IF".

Like an "if/then" statement in computer programs. Things are conditional. Promises are conditional. Even if God's love is unconditional.

Unfortunately, the word occurs so many times that it is hard to do a study on it. According to the concordance that I just looked in... the word "If" occurs 1595 times in 1420 verses.

****
You are so right. Good post! :fadein:
Right from the Go of creation of either Lucifer or Adam the Eternal Covenant was 'Eternally' there in place. Hebrews 13:20 Along with the Eternal Gospel of Revelation 14:6 which equals Philippians 4:13 & 2 Corinthians 12:9 for some. (Genesis 3:11-Matthew 22:11)

Love is another Word that the devil has botched up, huh?
It is interesting to understand, that if one Loved (Agape Love) without being Born Again, Christ would not need to have been offered in the first place.

One verse in the Word (Romans 4:17's last part of the verse) has helped me keep things sorted out. I always try to see when God's Word are.. in the time/period speaking of. Like Psalm 2:7 & Hebrews 1:5's 'This Day have I begotten Thee'. What day did the Godhead have a God/Son, huh? :wink:

---John

 

[Darrell dunn]

Matt.24:22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no fleash be saved: but for the elects sake those days shall be shortened.

I do not find an IF in this statement.

And the reason that the days have to be shortened is because of the intence heat of the sun.

Rev.16:8-9And the fourth angel poured out his vial AND POWER WAS GIVEN UNTO HIM TO SCORCH MEN WITH FIRE. V9 AND MEN WERE SCORCHED WITH GREAT HEAT,

Also the remaining plagues kill man by the thousands.

The star that fell on the earth Rev.8:10 burned away the ozone allowing the sun to burn man much more.

You really should ask God to help you read scripture, reather than some one eles.

 

[Zero Link]

Darrel Dunn is right,

God's Wrath starts in the mid-point of the great tribulation(Post-Trib)

Proof:

Rev.16:1-2

Then I heard a loud voice from the temple saying to the seven angels, "Go, pour out the seven bowls of God's wrath on the earth." 2The first angel went and poured out his bowl on the land, and ugly and painful sores broke out on the people who had the mark of the beast and worshiped his image.

Being that there will still be people who has the mark of the beast on them we are still going through the great tribulation.. Also, he is mentioned up ahead when the 6th bowl is poured.

Go, pour out the seven bowls of God's wrath on the earth

basically nuff said to prove to you that this his God's wrath.. but I will keep going.

Rev.16:12-14

12The sixth angel poured out his bowl on the great river Euphrates, and its water was dried up to prepare the way for the kings from the East. 13Then I saw three evil[a] spirits that looked like frogs; they came out of the mouth of the dragon, out of the mouth of the beast and out of the mouth of the false prophet. 14They are spirits of demons performing miraculous signs, and they go out to the kings of the whole world, to gather them for the battle on the great day of God Almighty.

13Then I saw three evil[a] spirits that looked like frogs; they came out of the mouth of the dragon, out of the mouth of the beast and out of the mouth of the false prophet

The anti-christ is still on earth, and so is the false prophet.. proving that the great tribulation is STILL going on and God's Wrath is going on aswell.

And in the 7th Seal, the tremendous earth quake occurs.

 

[lecoop]

Darrel Dunn is right,

God's Wrath starts in the mid-point of the great tribulation(Post-Trib)

Proof:

Rev.16:1-2

The anti-christ is still on earth, and so is the false prophet.. proving that the great tribulation is STILL going on and God's Wrath is going on aswell.

And in the 7th Seal, the tremendous earth quake occurs.

It is certain that God's wrath is there in the vials, but does it start there? Didn't you forget what was written at the 6th seal:

16 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:
17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?

Why did they call for the rocks to hide them? They recognized the wrath of God in the earthquake. IF not in the earthquake, then they recognized by the cosmic signs that the Day of the Lord was about to start, and they knew by old covenant prophecies that HIS wrath would be poured out in the day of the Lord.

So anyway you read it, God's wrath is throughout the 70th week, from start to finish, NOT just starting at the last half of the week, after the midpoint. Of course God's wrath is still going on in Chapter 16, for this is the plagues mixed with the vials of His wrath. The 70th week of Daniel will not end until the 7th vial, where it is written: "it is done."

Coop

 

[John the Baptist]

Matt.24:22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no fleash be saved: but for the elects sake those days shall be shortened.

I do not find an IF in this statement.

***
Sarcasm meant? :wink: It was a misplaced remark 'me' thinks! :fadein:
Anyway: John here on your Matthew 24:22nd verse. This prophesy was fullfilled in 70AD as you get the context of verse 15 on. Matthew 24:15-22.

It is a two/fold prophecy as 'documented' in Ecclesiastes 1:9-10 & Ecclesiastes 3:15. Yet, we can attest to it finding earth in the same condition both times. We are to be on earth during the time of trouble, even the LAST time of trouble. If (there is that word, huh?) one truely believes the Godhead that there is no new thing under the sun???

And the 'heat of the sun?? There will be heat all right, but it will not be that kind of such! Deuteronomy 4:24, Deuteronomy 9:3, Hebrews 12:29.
Even so, how anyone can use the 'shortened days' verse of Matthew 24:22 in the setting of the 7 last plagues is disturbing!

***
And the reason that the days have to be shortened is because of the intence heat of the sun.

Rev.16:8-9 And the fourth angel poured out his vial AND POWER WAS GIVEN UNTO HIM TO SCORCH MEN WITH FIRE. V9 AND MEN WERE SCORCHED WITH GREAT HEAT,

Also the remaining plagues kill man by the thousands.

The star that fell on the earth Rev.8:10 burned away the ozone allowing the sun to burn man much more.

You really should ask God to help you read scripture, reather than some one eles.

 

[Darrell dunn]

John

You are right in the fact that a form of all of the prophetesses that were before Christ were fulfilled after his death.

And if the Jews as a whole had excepted their messiah then the 1,000 year reign of Christ could have started about 70 AD.

That is why Christ preached the kingdom of Heaven is at hand. And he said that John the baptist fulfilled the prophetesses of Elijah.

But they didn't so then the church preached the the kingdom of God, instead of the kingdom of heaven, as Christ did.

Then John wrote the book of Rev. in about 95 AD. and it will all take place again.
This time with Elijah.

 

[Gabbylittleangel]

You really should ask God to help you read scripture, reather than some one eles.

Really good advice Darrell. Could I suggest that when you give good advice that it be given with the love of Christ, and the attitude of wanting to help others draw closer to the Lord.

The way you wrote it here could push a weaker Christian away.

 

[Darrell dunn]

Titus1 1:13 For there are many unruly and vain talkers and deceivers,

Ellen White. The writer of Seventh day books.

11. Whose mouths must be stopped. who subvert whole houses.

13 Wherefore rebuke them sharply, that they may be sound in the faith.

Titus 2: 15 These things speak, and exhort, and rebuke with all authority.

 

[John the Baptist]

Titus1 1:13 For there are many unruly and vain talkers and deceivers,

Ellen White. The writer of Seventh day books.

11. Whose mouths must be stopped. who subvert whole houses.

13 Wherefore rebuke them sharply, that they may be sound in the faith.

Titus 2: 15 These things speak, and exhort, and rebuke with all authority.

********
???????? :robot:

 

[lecoop]

As Socrates said:

"The ills of the whole world are caused by those that think they know - when in fact, they don't!

Coop

 

[lecoop]

John the Baptist said

Even so, how anyone can use the 'shortened days' verse of Matthew 24:22 in the setting of the 7 last plagues is disturbing!

It is really very simple. The time Jesus pointed to, that time of intense persecution would be after the abomination event at the midpoint of the week. It was this time of intense persecution that must be "shortened." Hmmm. This is the same time that the vials will be poured out: after the midpoint in the second half of Daniel's 70th week. It is the plagues, with the wrath of God poured out with them, that bring the intense persecution to a halt, hense, "shortening" the days [of intense persecution.]

Coop

 

[John the Baptist]

John the Baptist said:
Quote:
Even so, how anyone can use the 'shortened days' verse of Matthew 24:22 in the setting of the 7 last plagues is disturbing!

And lecoop replys:
It is really very simple. The time Jesus pointed to, that time of intense persecution would be after the abomination event at the midpoint of the week. It was this time of intense persecution that must be "shortened." Hmmm. This is the same time that the vials will be poured out: after the midpoint in the second half of Daniel's 70th week. It is the plagues, with the wrath of God poured out with them, that bring the intense persecution to a halt, hense, "shortening" the days [of intense persecution.]

Coop

*********
Matthew 23:38 "Your HOUSE IS LEFT UNTO YOU D-E-S-O-L-A-T-E" That is old Israel's REJECTION! Revelation 3:9 then applied! satan took over the 'old' Virgin fold. (church, synagogue, temple, whatever suits you?) They had a 'seven times' of full maturity DECISION to make or be REJECTED! 27-34AD will again be the same outpouring of the Holy Spirit MATURE DECISION TIME! Leviticus 16:19 & Christ has AGAIN been re/crucified in principle by His Virgin fold Laodicea! Hebrews 6:6 OPENLY!

Now: The SLAUGHTER of Israel as a nation, church, fold, synagogue of satan, did not come until 70AD. Almost 39 years later. This is what will be cut short 'in righteousness' for the last Virgin fold of Revelation 3:16-17's Laodicea SPEWED OUT WHOLE FOLD.. AGAIN! Again Ezekiel 9's Slaughter. Ecclesiastes 1:9-10 & Ecclesiastes 3:15 DOCUMENTED FACT!

That is what Christ meant in Matthew 24:22, along with Paul's penned Inspiration in Romans 9:28 as well! "For He will finish the work, AND CUT IT SHORT IN righteousness: because a SHORT WORK WILL THE LORD MAKE UPON EARTH." (the plagues? Hardly are they meant :roll: !!) And how so?? He has given once again the LATTER RAIN (Acts 2 & Joel 2 time again) along with the increase of knowledge! (TV & a world court 'testimony' & viewing!)

Inside Laodicea we see the same history as was seen in old Israel in Matthew 23:15! They as a Virgin 'fold' in doctrine only are going all over the planet earth making LAODICEAN Converts that as the verse states! "Making them twofold more the child of hell than themselves."
God in His Loving Mercy mercy gave these ones who were not yet MATURE, 39 years to come Mature, and leave the yoked membership of that DESOLATE CLOSED ARK DOOR OF MERCY FOR THE ABOMINATIONAL satanic EX/FOLD (Revelation 2:5) or be slaughtered! : (compare Revelation 18:4-Matthew 25:10)

This world court trial is what will finish the work & cut it short in righteousness for the rest of the worlds few. And all of the others?? Then, on comes 666 by these professed Christian's to try to have a Living God be appeased with a forced day of worship, to stop the FINAL trouble coming upon the earth. That TROUBLE will not come until after the death penalty of 666 has been reached. THEN COMES THE SEVEN LAST PLAGUES! Comparable to Egypts Pharaoh. Did he repent? This is the cut-off period of ALL PROBATION, and it is ONLY THEN that the SEVEN LAST PLAGUES COME!
---John

PS: I will try to remember to move this over to Matthew 4:4 later on. It is to deep for this thread perhaps?

 

[lecoop]

*********
Matthew 23:38 "Your HOUSE IS LEFT UNTO YOU D-E-S-O-L-A-T-E" That is old Israel's REJECTION! Revelation 3:9 then applied! satan took over the 'old' Virgin fold. (church, synagogue, temple, whatever suits you?) They had a 'seven times' of full maturity DECISION to make or be REJECTED! 27-34AD will again be the same outpouring of the Holy Spirit MATURE DECISION TIME! Leviticus 16:19 & Christ has AGAIN been re/crucified in principle by His Virgin fold Laodicea! Hebrews 6:6 OPENLY!

Now: The SLAUGHTER of Israel as a nation, church, fold, synagogue of satan, did not come until 70AD. Almost 39 years later. This is what will be cut short 'in righteousness' for the last Virgin fold of Revelation 3:16-17's Laodicea SPEWED OUT WHOLE FOLD.. AGAIN! Again Ezekiel 9's Slaughter. Ecclesiastes 1:9-10 & Ecclesiastes 3:15 DOCUMENTED FACT!

That is what Christ meant in Matthew 24:22, along with Paul's penned Inspiration in Romans 9:28 as well! "For He will finish the work, AND CUT IT SHORT IN righteousness: because a SHORT WORK WILL THE LORD MAKE UPON EARTH." (the plagues? Hardly are they meant :roll: !!) And how so?? He has given once again the LATTER RAIN (Acts 2 & Joel 2 time again) along with the increase of knowledge! (TV & a world court 'testimony' & viewing!)

Inside Laodicea we see the same history as was seen in old Israel in Matthew 23:15! They as a Virgin 'fold' in doctrine only are going all over the planet earth making LAODICEAN Converts that as the verse states! "Making them twofold more the child of hell than themselves."
God in His Loving Mercy mercy gave these ones who were not yet MATURE, 39 years to come Mature, and leave the yoked membership of that DESOLATE CLOSED ARK DOOR OF MERCY FOR THE ABOMINATIONAL satanic EX/FOLD (Revelation 2:5) or be slaughtered! : (compare Revelation 18:4-Matthew 25:10)

This world court trial is what will finish the work & cut it short in righteousness for the rest of the worlds few. And all of the others?? Then, on comes 666 by these professed Christian's to try to have a Living God be appeased with a forced day of worship, to stop the FINAL trouble coming upon the earth. That TROUBLE will not come until after the death penalty of 666 has been reached. THEN COMES THE SEVEN LAST PLAGUES! Comparable to Egypts Pharaoh. Did he repent? This is the cut-off period of ALL PROBATION, and it is ONLY THEN that the SEVEN LAST PLAGUES COME!
---John

PS: I will try to remember to move this over to Matthew 4:4 later on. It is to deep for this thread perhaps?

John the Baptist, you sure have a wild imagination!

If John wrote Revelation after 70 AD, and he surely did, all you say is just imagination, for John has the 7 years of Daniel's 70th week clearly laid out, first 3.5 years with the trumpet judgements, and the last 3.5 years with the plagues and vials. Another words, he CLEARLY showed them to be FUTURE events that would come some time AFTER about 95 AD.

In fact, he showed the first five seals that would cover the time from about 33 AD right up till now: almost the entire church age. Yes, their house was left desolate, but John shows a remnant that is NO LONGER DESOLATE! They are protected by God in the wilderness for the last half of the 70th week, (Revelation 12)still in OUR future.

Therefore, all I can do is disagree with you, and shake my head in wonder, how someone can read the same book, and get so confused.

Coop

 

[John the Baptist]

lecoop
123 Christian Regular


Joined: 15 Dec 2005
Posts: 358
Location: Tulsa
Posted: Sat Nov 04, 2006 4:19 am Post subject:

*****
John here: I suggest that you and your clone both go back to bed and get some more shut-eye. :wink: Matthew 25:5 (but 'i' do like early risers! :fadein

 

[Zero Link]

lol John I didn't get ANY of that. Im sorry. I seen this happen before, alot of Satanists(not saying you are because I know you are FAR from one) put scriptures from different parts of the book they read or the bible or w/e they read to make it seem as if Satan is God or God isn't true.. Its kinda like what you are doing.. Putting scriptures together from all around the bible to come up with something like what you just posted.

It says clearly in the bible that the days of the post-trib will be shorten. Maybe not literally, but as for the anti-christ, days will get harder for him and his people.. Because of the intense pain they will feel when the 7 bowls are poured. Which is going to lift some weight off of the Christians. Each time a bowl is poured, the harder it is for the anti-christ to persecute and the slower he move.. the slower he moves, the number of days is shorten for him.. For he will NOT be as strong as before the last bowl that was poured onto him and his people.

When I say the slower he moves, I do not mean he will run slow, It simply means the bowls will slow his persecution and his work down.

Rev.16: 1-2

1Then I heard a loud voice from the temple saying to the seven angels, "Go, pour out the seven bowls of God's wrath on the earth." 2The first angel went and poured out his bowl on the land, and ugly and painful sores broke out on the people who had the mark of the beast and worshiped his image.

this will slow them down big time.

Rev.16: 3

3The second angel poured out his bowl on the sea, and it turned into blood like that of a dead man, and every living thing in the sea died.

Where would they get their water from now?

Rev.16: 8-9

8The fourth angel poured out his bowl on the sun, and the sun was given power to scorch people with fire. 9They were seared by the intense heat and they cursed the name of God, who had control over these plagues, but they refused to repent and glorify him.

Rev.16: 10-11

10The fifth angel poured out his bowl on the throne of the beast, and his kingdom was plunged into darkness. Men gnawed their tongues in agony 11and cursed the God of heaven because of their pains and their sores, but they refused to repent of what they had done.

Proving to you that the beast is STILL HERE.. So this must mean that we are still in the post-trib because Jesus Christ haven't came to stop the beast yet.. But wait, Isn't this apart of God's Wrath? The Seven Bowls? Yep..

God's Wrath and Great Trib isn't the same.. no, but that doesn't mean the times of God's Wrath and The Great Tribulation can meet somewhere.. It is possible for God's Wrath to happen during the Great Tribulation WITHOUT God's Wrath being the Great Tribulation... So now that thats cleared up,
lets get back to what I quoted earlier.

If the pre-trib rapture occurs before the anti-christ is revealed..

and the wrath is triggered when the post-trib starts... then aren't the pre-trib
and pre-wrath the same?

Because if its pre- wrath (pre) meaning before the wrath... meaning that we will be gone before the wrath, before he reveals himself.

same as with the pre-trib rapture.

 

[lecoop]

lecoop
123 Christian Regular


Joined: 15 Dec 2005
Posts: 358
Location: Tulsa
Posted: Sat Nov 04, 2006 4:19 am Post subject:

*****
John here: I suggest that you and your clone both go back to bed and get some more shut-eye. :wink: Matthew 25:5 (but 'i' do like early risers! :fadein

Me and my clone????

Sorry, just me here, and I do get up early! After about 21,900 mornings, I got used to it! Impossible to "sleep in" now. :

Btw, I could not understand if this meant that you agreed or disagreed, and why?

Coop