The Real Trinity please stand up!

[Shimshon]

Greetings, WIP!

When Jesus ate with the disciples after he was resurrected, he did so to reassure them. They thought he was a 'spirit' and were quite disturbed by that. He showed them that he was still flesh.

Have you anything here to eat?

We, of course, do not yet know what we shall be but we shall be like HIM. It seems to me that that truth also confirms what we don't know while in our present state. I believe that we will be like Jesus, the man who came in Flesh even if we don't fully know what that means (yet).


This may answer your question, or at least give us a hint.


He ate with them in the passage found in the book of Luke (above) to reassure them he was flesh and not a spirit and said, "a spirit has not flesh and bones as you see that I have."

But that passage from Luke was right before his crusifixion, not after the resurrection.

 

[smaller]

Not trying to debate but would like clarification. Looking at the part I put in bold type above, do you think it should read Jesus Christ was a flesh and blood man? Do you think He is still flesh and blood or something else? His body was resurrected and He did appear to His disciples in physical form but I'm wondering if He is still maintaining that physical form or if He only did that for brief periods during the 40 days after his resurrection.

Some of orthodoxy insist that Jesus remains 'fully human.'

I can't say that a Glorified Body that can walk through walls and disguise His Identity to be unrecognized and to disappear or appear as a being with a flaming two edged sword coming out of His Mouth or eyes like fire and feet like brass constitutes being fully human by any stretch of the imaginations.

We do know that there was an Incarnation in a locked in time timeline that we can relate to. But as Paul advised we are to know Him after the flesh no longer.
(2 Cor. 5:16)

If I had a nickel for the knowitall members of a couple of certain old orthodox sects who insists to the point of potential damnation that I must adhere to the 'still fully human' aspect of Jesus...

I just don't see it that way. So excuse me and feel free to threaten my eternal fate.

 

[Gregg]

Not trying to debate but would like clarification. Looking at the part I put in bold type above, do you think it should read Jesus Christ was a flesh and blood man? Do you think He is still flesh and blood or something else? His body was resurrected and He did appear to His disciples in physical form but I'm wondering if He is still maintaining that physical form or if He only did that for brief periods during the 40 days after his resurrection.

I believe Jesus still has the same flesh and blood body, now resurrected [whatever other additional characteristics that might entail].

 

[Sparkey]

Greetings, WIP!

When Jesus ate with the disciples after he was resurrected, he did so to reassure them. They thought he was a 'spirit' and were quite disturbed by that. He showed them that he was still flesh.

Have you anything here to eat?

We, of course, do not yet know what we shall be but we shall be like HIM. It seems to me that that truth also confirms what we don't know while in our present state. I believe that we will be like Jesus, the man who came in Flesh even if we don't fully know what that means (yet).


This may answer your question, or at least give us a hint.


He ate with them in the passage found in the book of Luke (above) to reassure them he was flesh and not a spirit and said, "a spirit has not flesh and bones as you see that I have."

Some will eat with their Master. I can't imagine what that will be like. Can you? Sharing Passover with the Savior? The thought overwhelms, doesn't it?

I love you, brother.
~Michael

But that passage from Luke was right before his crusifixion, not after the resurrection.

Oh? Thank you for correcting me! BUT you should confirm your statement and belief. Start at the beginning of chapter 24. If your assertion is true, why does that chapter start out with "On the first day of the week, very early in the morning, the women took the spices they had prepared and went to the tomb."

Shimshon, you've said that the quote from the book of Luke (above in post # 95) was from before the crucifixion. Upon examination, we see that this is not the case. Simply stated, you sir, are wrong, not me. Your interpretation renders the passage to be non-nonsensical.

That aside, I think that the point that was made is valid. He ate in order to reassure them that he was a man, in flesh, and not a spirit as they has presumed. Jesus also promised that he would not eat another Passover meal (seder) until such time as it is "fulfilled in the Kingdom of God." The implication is that Jesus came in the flesh and remains in flesh.

Your correction did not address my thought, sir. Nor had I accused you of Gnosticism. My reply addressed WIP's valid question, "...do you think it should read Jesus Christ was a flesh and blood man? Do you think He is still flesh and blood or something else?"

~SparrowHawke

 

[Sinthesis]

When trying to understand and relate to an invisible entity one must employ the use of anthropomorphic descriptions. It's inevitable.

Jesus being the ultimate anthropomorphic description of the invisible Father.

 

[Sinthesis]

Not trying to debate but would like clarification. Looking at the part I put in bold type above, do you think it should read Jesus Christ was a flesh and blood man? Do you think He is still flesh and blood or something else? His body was resurrected and He did appear to His disciples in physical form but I'm wondering if He is still maintaining that physical form or if He only did that for brief periods during the 40 days after his resurrection.

Is there any reason why He couldn't take up or lay down His physical form at will?

 

[Sparkey]

Is there any reason why He couldn't take up or lay down His physical form at will?

Greetings, Sinthesis! It's been awhile.

You ask if there might be a reason for why Jesus could not 'take up or lay down His physical form at will'.

John speaks undeniably about the doctrine of Christ, that he came in the flesh. You've read 2John, chapter 1. Do you think that what he said may apply to your question above? As always, I'm interested to hear your thoughts.

Cordially,
Sparrow

 

[WIP]

Is there any reason why He couldn't take up or lay down His physical form at will?

That's partly where my question comes from I think. I believe He can take up or lay down His physical form at His will but I was wondering what Gregg's view was. Now, I see that he has posted an answer to my question so I will ask what scriptural basis he has to support his view.

 

[WIP]

I believe Jesus still has the same flesh and blood body, now resurrected [whatever other additional characteristics that might entail].

Can you provide scriptural support for your belief? I can't seem to find it exactly. Thanks.

 

[Gregg]

Can you provide scriptural support for your belief? I can't seem to find it exactly. Thanks.

Why would one believe otherwise? After His Resurrection He continued to be God in the flesh, unless Scripture says otherwise.

Rather, please provide a Scripture that says the LORD Jesus Christ is no longer flesh and blood. Otherwise, He has remained as He was when He ascended into heaven.

 

[gr8grace3]

Why would one believe otherwise? After His Resurrection He continued to be God in the flesh, unless Scripture says otherwise.

Rather, please provide a Scripture that says the LORD Jesus Christ is no longer flesh and blood. Otherwise, He has remained as He was when He ascended into heaven.

And His Glory is in His scars. He ain't losing them.

 

[WIP]

I guess you're not interested in answering my questions directly. I have some followup questions though.

Can flesh and blood walk through walls?
John 20:26 NKJV And after eight days His disciples were again inside, and Thomas with them. Jesus came, the doors being shut, and stood in the midst, and said, “Peace to you!”

This would seem to indicate that He may not be entirely flesh and blood but I do believe He can now change His character to be flesh and blood at His own will.
John 20:27 NKJV Then He said to Thomas, “Reach your finger here, and look at My hands; and reach your hand here, and put it into My side. Do not be unbelieving, but believing.”

Can flesh and blood vanish into thin air?
Luke 24:30-31 NKJV Now it came to pass, as He sat at the table with them, that He took bread, blessed and broke it, and gave it to them. Then their eyes were opened and they knew Him; and He vanished from their sight.

Prior to his crucifixion it seems He did not have this ability as He was obedient to his human condition even to the point of death on the cross.
Philippians 2:6-8 NKJV Let this mind be in you which was also in Christ Jesus, 6 who, being in the form of God, did not consider it robbery to be equal with God, but made Himself of no reputation, taking the form of a bondservant, and coming in the likeness of men. And being found in appearance as a man, He humbled Himself and became obedient to the point of death, even the death of the cross.

 

[Shimshon]

Why would one believe otherwise? After His Resurrection He continued to be God in the flesh, unless Scripture says otherwise.

Rather, please provide a Scripture that says the LORD Jesus Christ is no longer flesh and blood. Otherwise, He has remained as He was when He ascended into heaven.

A human being ascended into space? It's phathomable to think that the Spirit came and created a body in Mary because the Spirit has no coporeal form. But once the Spirit of God created a human being called Jesus it becomes very hard to begin to understand how he ascended back to heaven. This is why some have contemplated that he was/is an angel. Because angels are from heaven and have appeared on earth, and the angel of the Lord has appeared and eaten with man. I believe this is what Jesus was patterning when he ate after his resurrection. The time when he ate with Abraham. In his 'pre-incarnate' form.

 

[Brother Mike]

Why would one believe otherwise? After His Resurrection He continued to be God in the flesh, unless Scripture says otherwise.

Rather, please provide a Scripture that says the LORD Jesus Christ is no longer flesh and blood. Otherwise, He has remained as He was when He ascended into heaven.

Heb 2:17 kjva Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people.

Was Flesh and blood.

1Jn 4:17 kjva Herein is our love made perfect, that we may have boldness in the day of judgment: because as he is, so are we in this world.

1Jn 3:2 kjva Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.

-As He is now, we are like Him. (Should be anyway, or working on it) When He appears, we shall be exactly like Him.

Luk 24:39 kjva Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.

-Jesus said, a spirit does not have flesh and BONES, as I have. Jesus never mentioned blood being in his body.

1Co 15:50-54 kjva 50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption. 51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, 52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. 53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. 54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

-Flesh and Blood does not inherit the Kingdom but dead is raised incorruptible, with a new body, and blood is not mentioned. So, Jesus would to have had the new body, without blood, and redemened flesh.

 

[Malachi]

I believe Jesus still has the same flesh and blood body, now resurrected [whatever other additional characteristics that might entail].

Not "the same flesh and blood" but "the same body, resurrected and glorified, and rendered immortal". We must always remember that Christ poured out His blood for our redemption. That is why Christ specifically mentioned "flesh and bones" (Lk 24:39) after His resurrection, and Paul said "flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God" (1 Cor 15:50).

Christ's glorious and glorified body (Rev 1:10-16) is unique and also eternal. He is "the Man Christ Jesus" (1 Tim 2:5) who is presently seated at the right hand of the Father (Heb 1:3). He ascended in that body (Acts 1:9-11) and He will also descend in that Body at His Second Coming (Rev 19:11-16).

 

[gr8grace3]

Not trying to debate but would like clarification. Looking at the part I put in bold type above, do you think it should read Jesus Christ was a flesh and blood man? Do you think He is still flesh and blood or something else? His body was resurrected and He did appear to His disciples in physical form but I'm wondering if He is still maintaining that physical form or if He only did that for brief periods during the 40 days after his resurrection.

I think He maintains His physical form. In a resurrection body, like Gregg said, all that entails I have no clue. But we do have some scriptures that clue us in to a certain extent.

Hebrews 6:19–20 (NASB95)
19 This hope we have as an anchor of the soul, a hopeboth sure and steadfast and one which enters within the veil,

20 where Jesus has entered as a forerunner for us, having become a high priest forever according to the order of Melchizedek.

The use of just 'Jesus' and not ' Jesus Christ' implies/suggests the humanity of Jesus Christ is in view here.

Zech 13:6~~"And one will say to him, 'What are these wounds between your arms?' Then he will say, 'Those with which I was wounded in the house of my friends.'

 

[Gregg]

And His Glory is in His scars. He ain't losing them.

I think that you and I will see His scars.

 

[Gregg]

I guess you're not interested in answering my questions directly. I have some followup questions though.

Can flesh and blood walk through walls?
John 20:26 NKJV And after eight days His disciples were again inside, and Thomas with them. Jesus came, the doors being shut, and stood in the midst, and said, “Peace to you!”

This would seem to indicate that He may not be entirely flesh and blood but I do believe He can now change His character to be flesh and blood at His own will.
John 20:27 NKJV Then He said to Thomas, “Reach your finger here, and look at My hands; and reach your hand here, and put it into My side. Do not be unbelieving, but believing.”

Can flesh and blood vanish into thin air?
Luke 24:30-31 NKJV Now it came to pass, as He sat at the table with them, that He took bread, blessed and broke it, and gave it to them. Then their eyes were opened and they knew Him; and He vanished from their sight.

Prior to his crucifixion it seems He did not have this ability as He was obedient to his human condition even to the point of death on the cross.
Philippians 2:6-8 NKJV Let this mind be in you which was also in Christ Jesus, 6 who, being in the form of God, did not consider it robbery to be equal with God, but made Himself of no reputation, taking the form of a bondservant, and coming in the likeness of men. And being found in appearance as a man, He humbled Himself and became obedient to the point of death, even the death of the cross.

Jesus did have the ability to walk on water. What is a wall to the one who created water . . . earth, wind, and fire?

He had the ability to ascend into heaven, and will Himself descend again from Heaven. Surely His flesh and blood can walk through walls.

His Resurrections was a bodily resurrection.

 

[gr8grace3]

Not "the same flesh and blood" but "the same body, resurrected and glorified, and rendered immortal". We must always remember that Christ poured out His blood for our redemption. That is why Christ specifically mentioned "flesh and bones" (Lk 24:39) after His resurrection, and Paul said "flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God" (1 Cor 15:50).

Christ's glorious and glorified body (Rev 1:10-16) is unique and also eternal. He is "the Man Christ Jesus" (1 Tim 2:5) who is presently seated at the right hand of the Father (Heb 1:3). He ascended in that body (Acts 1:9-11) and He will also descend in that Body at His Second Coming (Rev 19:11-16).

Christ did not "pour out His blood" for our redemption. He was forsaken by the Father and died a substitutionary spiritual death for our redemption. He physically died for our bodily resurrection.

Jesus Christ was still alive and had blood when He said,"It is finished."

"The Blood" refers to the total work of Christ on the Cross.

 

[Gregg]

A human being ascended into space? It's phathomable to think that the Spirit came and created a body in Mary because the Spirit has no coporeal form. But once the Spirit of God created a human being called Jesus it becomes very hard to begin to understand how he ascended back to heaven. This is why some have contemplated that he was/is an angel. Because angels are from heaven and have appeared on earth, and the angel of the Lord has appeared and eaten with man. I believe this is what Jesus was patterning when he ate after his resurrection. The time when he ate with Abraham. In his 'pre-incarnate' form.

The incarnate Son of God ascended into the highest heaven, where He is now seated at the right hand of the Father.

He could ascend because He was not only a Man, but 'the' Son God.

I do not contemplate that Jesus is an angel. Do you contemplate this?