Understanding HOW Lord Jesus Returns and Our Gathering

[DavidT]

God's Word declares that Lord Jesus will return upon a cloud (Rev.1:7; Matt.24:29-31; 1 Thess.4:17; Matt.26:64; Mark 14:62; Luke 21:27; Acts 1:9-12; Rev.14:14).

Acts 1:9-12 is especially important about how Jesus returns in the future, because the angels said there that Jesus will return in "like manner" that He ascended to Heaven. And that Scripture points to that ascension having happened upon the Mount of Olives with His disciples there with Him and seeing Him go up on a cloud. That Scripture is very important simply because it links with the Zechariah 14 Scripture which reveals Jesus will return to that very Mount of Olives spot on earth, His feet touching down there upon the earth, and bringing all His saints with Him there.

Jesus Christ also linked the "day of the Lord" being the 'day' of His future return, which of course we cannot know which specific day or hour that will be.

In Revelation 16:15, on the 6th Vial timing, Lord Jesus said He comes "as a thief", and that Blessed are those who 'watch', and keep their garments. He is warning His Church about that timing.

That "as a thief" metaphor is the same idea that Apostles Paul and Peter used of the final day of this present world. In 1 Thess.5, Paul showed that is the day when the "sudden destruction" will come upon the deceived that will be saying, "Peace and safety", their having been deceived by the coming false-Messiah for the time of "great tribulation". In 2 Peter 3:10, Apostle Peter showed on that 'day' that God's consuming fire will burn man's works off this earth. Both examples point to the future literal 'end' of this present world time, and the start of Christ's future "thousand years" reign over all nations, with his 'resurrected' and gathered elect, per Rev.20.

1 Thessalonians 4 by Apostle Paul reveals at Jesus' coming, also on that "day of the Lord", He will resurrect the saints that have died first, and bring them with Him from heaven when He comes (1 Thess.4:13-16). Then those of us still alive on earth, will be "caught up" to Him, and them in the clouds, to meet The LORD in the 'air'.

These events will happen very quickly on that "day of the Lord". Some add an idea that Christ gathers His saints that are still alive from the earth prior... to God's consuming fire burning man's works off this earth. That's not really written though.

The Daniel 3 example of the hot fiery furnace, heated seven times hotter than necessary, is an example about the day of Christ's future coming to gather us, and God's consuming fire event that will also happen at that moment. Shadrach, Meshech, and Abed-nigo were cast into that hot fiery furnace of Daniel 3, and king Nebuchadnezzar saw a 4th Man in that furnace with them, with the likeness of The Son of God (Jesus). When they came out of that furnace, their clothes did not even smell of smoke. But when Neb's servants just got near that hot furnace, they were immediately incinerated. That serves as an example for us on the "day of the Lord" when Jesus comes to gather us, with God's consuming fire burning upon this earth. He does not have to wait to after He gathers us to send His consuming fire upon this earth.

This is actually what Paul meant with those of us still alive on earth being gathered to meet Lord Jesus in the "air". The Greek word there for "air" in 1 Thess.4:17 is connected with the idea of the 'breath', and can point to our spirit with soul. Do you recall what Paul taught in 1 Corinthians 15:51-52 that on the "last trump" the dead will be raised, and we alive shall all be "changed", "in the twinkling of an eye"? That "last trump" is the trumpet of God when Jesus comes from heaven in the clouds, bringing the resurrected saints with Him. All these events will occur very quickly, not all spread out like men's doctrines tend to think.

Those alive are thus 'changed' on that "last trump" moment on the "day of the Lord", and immediately are revealed in their spiritual bodies, and that is HOW they are "caught up" to Lord Jesus, to meet Him in the "air" (breath of life body, the spirit body).

Then once He descends to gather us, His Church, He takes us with Him to the Mount of Olives where His feet will touch down upon the Mount of Olives, and a very great valley will be formed there by that event. I believe it will be the "sudden destruction" of God's consuming fire upon this earth on that day which will also defeat Satan's host armies that will come upon Israel on the last day. That is the battle spoken of in Zechariah 14 at Christ's return that He will fight, and also the battle of Armageddon He showed will happen per Rev.16 on the final 7th Vial that will be poured out into the... "air"!

This means also on that "day of the Lord", the veil of this present flesh world age, will be lifted off for everyone, all will cast off their flesh, with our spirit bodies revealed right here on earth. This is actually hinted at to occur for all peoples and nations, per the Isaiah 25 Scripture, which is where Apostle Paul was pulling from about 'death swallowed up in victory'. Jesus has already defeated death and the devil for us, but there will still exist the "second death" of the casting of the spirit with soul of the unsaved and unrepentant into the future "lake of fire" after His future "thousand years" reign of Rev.20. But when Jesus returns in our near future, we aren't going to have these perishable flesh bodies anymore. Thus the heavenly dimension is going to be revealed right here, on earth, where Jesus is coming to. Both the earthly and heavenly will be joined back together as before.

 

[follower]

Yes, maybe.
re I think it's written if anyone dies younger than one hundred, that will be considered unusual ....
re very strange also people on earth will still try to fight against Jesus Authority at the end, then they are defeated effortlessly by Jesus.

 

[DavidT]

Yes, maybe.
re I think it's written if anyone dies younger than one hundred, that will be considered unusual ....
re very strange also people on earth will still try to fight against Jesus Authority at the end, then they are defeated effortlessly by Jesus.

Yeah, the dying younger than a hundred years old reference is actually an expression for longevity in the future Millennium. Per Rev.20, we know no one is cast into the "lake of fire", i.e., the "second death", until after Christ's future "thousand years" reign with His elect. And per 1 Corinthians 15, on the "last trump", Paul showed that we 'all' shall be changed, and that includes the unsaved too for Christ's future reign. The only type of death remaining after Jesus returns is the "second death".

The time of flesh death will be over when Jesus returns to take reign over all nations.

As per the end of Zechariah 14, it shows the leftovers who came up against Jerusalem will be made to come up to Jerusalem from year to year, to worship The KING, and keep the feast of tabernacles. And any nation that refuses to do that, there will be no rain upon their lands. So yes, that shows even during Christ's future "thousand years" reign on earth, the possibility for rebellion against Him will still exist. That is shown even more once Satan is loosed at the end of the 1,000 years, and goes to tempt the unsaved one final time.

 

[JLB]

God's Word declares that Lord Jesus will return upon a cloud (Rev.1:7; Matt.24:29-31; 1 Thess.4:17; Matt.26:64; Mark 14:62; Luke 21:27; Acts 1:9-12; Rev.14:14).

Acts 1:9-12 is especially important about how Jesus returns in the future, because the angels said there that Jesus will return in "like manner" that He ascended to Heaven. And that Scripture points to that ascension having happened upon the Mount of Olives with His disciples there with Him and seeing Him go up on a cloud. That Scripture is very important simply because it links with the Zechariah 14 Scripture which reveals Jesus will return to that very Mount of Olives spot on earth, His feet touching down there upon the earth, and bringing all His saints with Him there.

Jesus Christ also linked the "day of the Lord" being the 'day' of His future return, which of course we cannot know which specific day or hour that will be.

In Revelation 16:15, on the 6th Vial timing, Lord Jesus said He comes "as a thief", and that Blessed are those who 'watch', and keep their garments. He is warning His Church about that timing.

That "as a thief" metaphor is the same idea that Apostles Paul and Peter used of the final day of this present world. In 1 Thess.5, Paul showed that is the day when the "sudden destruction" will come upon the deceived that will be saying, "Peace and safety", their having been deceived by the coming false-Messiah for the time of "great tribulation". In 2 Peter 3:10, Apostle Peter showed on that 'day' that God's consuming fire will burn man's works off this earth. Both examples point to the future literal 'end' of this present world time, and the start of Christ's future "thousand years" reign over all nations, with his 'resurrected' and gathered elect, per Rev.20.

1 Thessalonians 4 by Apostle Paul reveals at Jesus' coming, also on that "day of the Lord", He will resurrect the saints that have died first, and bring them with Him from heaven when He comes (1 Thess.4:13-16). Then those of us still alive on earth, will be "caught up" to Him, and them in the clouds, to meet The LORD in the 'air'.

These events will happen very quickly on that "day of the Lord". Some add an idea that Christ gathers His saints that are still alive from the earth prior... to God's consuming fire burning man's works off this earth. That's not really written though.

The Daniel 3 example of the hot fiery furnace, heated seven times hotter than necessary, is an example about the day of Christ's future coming to gather us, and God's consuming fire event that will also happen at that moment. Shadrach, Meshech, and Abed-nigo were cast into that hot fiery furnace of Daniel 3, and king Nebuchadnezzar saw a 4th Man in that furnace with them, with the likeness of The Son of God (Jesus). When they came out of that furnace, their clothes did not even smell of smoke. But when Neb's servants just got near that hot furnace, they were immediately incinerated. That serves as an example for us on the "day of the Lord" when Jesus comes to gather us, with God's consuming fire burning upon this earth. He does not have to wait to after He gathers us to send His consuming fire upon this earth.

This is actually what Paul meant with those of us still alive on earth being gathered to meet Lord Jesus in the "air". The Greek word there for "air" in 1 Thess.4:17 is connected with the idea of the 'breath', and can point to our spirit with soul. Do you recall what Paul taught in 1 Corinthians 15:51-52 that on the "last trump" the dead will be raised, and we alive shall all be "changed", "in the twinkling of an eye"? That "last trump" is the trumpet of God when Jesus comes from heaven in the clouds, bringing the resurrected saints with Him. All these events will occur very quickly, not all spread out like men's doctrines tend to think.

Those alive are thus 'changed' on that "last trump" moment on the "day of the Lord", and immediately are revealed in their spiritual bodies, and that is HOW they are "caught up" to Lord Jesus, to meet Him in the "air" (breath of life body, the spirit body).

Then once He descends to gather us, His Church, He takes us with Him to the Mount of Olives where His feet will touch down upon the Mount of Olives, and a very great valley will be formed there by that event. I believe it will be the "sudden destruction" of God's consuming fire upon this earth on that day which will also defeat Satan's host armies that will come upon Israel on the last day. That is the battle spoken of in Zechariah 14 at Christ's return that He will fight, and also the battle of Armageddon He showed will happen per Rev.16 on the final 7th Vial that will be poured out into the... "air"!

This means also on that "day of the Lord", the veil of this present flesh world age, will be lifted off for everyone, all will cast off their flesh, with our spirit bodies revealed right here on earth. This is actually hinted at to occur for all peoples and nations, per the Isaiah 25 Scripture, which is where Apostle Paul was pulling from about 'death swallowed up in victory'. Jesus has already defeated death and the devil for us, but there will still exist the "second death" of the casting of the spirit with soul of the unsaved and unrepentant into the future "lake of fire" after His future "thousand years" reign of Rev.20. But when Jesus returns in our near future, we aren't going to have these perishable flesh bodies anymore. Thus the heavenly dimension is going to be revealed right here, on earth, where Jesus is coming to. Both the earthly and heavenly will be joined back together as before.

THREE MAIN THINGS that occur at the coming of the Lord -

Context: 1 Thessalonians 4:15-5:11

For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. 1 Thessalonians 4:15

1. the resurrection of the dead in Christ.

For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. 1 Thessalonians 4:16

2. The second thing that occurs at his coming, after the resurrection of the dead in Christ, is the rapture of the church.​

Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord.1 Thessalonians 4:17

3. The third thing we see that occurs at His coming is the destruction of the wicked including the antichrist.​

But concerning the times and the seasons, brethren, you have no need that I should write to you. For you yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so comes as a thief in the night. For when they say, “Peace and safety!” then sudden destruction comes upon them, as labor pains upon a pregnant woman. And they shall not escape. But you, brethren, are not in darkness, so that this Day should overtake you as a thief. 1 Thessalonians 5:1-4

Context: 2 Thessalonians 2:1-12​

And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will consume with the breath of His mouth and destroy with the brightness of His coming. 2 Thessalonians 2:8

The three mains things that occur at the coming of the Lord:​

1. The resurrection of the dead in Christ.
2. The rapture of the church.
3. The destruction of the wicked: including the antichrist

 

[DavidT]

THREE MAIN THINGS that occur at the coming of the Lord -

Context: 1 Thessalonians 4:15-5:11

For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. 1 Thessalonians 4:15

1. the resurrection of the dead in Christ.

For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. 1 Thessalonians 4:16

2. The second thing that occurs at his coming, after the resurrection of the dead in Christ, is the rapture of the church.​

Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord.1 Thessalonians 4:17

3. The third thing we see that occurs at His coming is the destruction of the wicked including the antichrist.​

But concerning the times and the seasons, brethren, you have no need that I should write to you. For you yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so comes as a thief in the night. For when they say, “Peace and safety!” then sudden destruction comes upon them, as labor pains upon a pregnant woman. And they shall not escape. But you, brethren, are not in darkness, so that this Day should overtake you as a thief. 1 Thessalonians 5:1-4

Context: 2 Thessalonians 2:1-12​

And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will consume with the breath of His mouth and destroy with the brightness of His coming. 2 Thessalonians 2:8

The three mains things that occur at the coming of the Lord:​

1. The resurrection of the dead in Christ.
2. The rapture of the church.
3. The destruction of the wicked: including the antichrist

Paul in 1 Thessalonians 4 does not mention the "sudden destruction" timed after Christ comes to gather His saints. So trying to read 1 Thess.4 and 1 Thess.5 like it is in sequential order does not work.

The "day of the Lord" is the 'day' when those 1 Thess.4:13-17 events also happen. And the "day of the Lord" events upon the wicked do not have to wait for the Church to be raptured first.

Study the event of John 5:28-29 where Jesus showed at the time of His coming, ALL... in the graves will come forth, including the wicked dead, and will go to one of two types of the resurrection, either the "resurrection of life", or to the "resurrection of damnation". That reveals that not just Christ's saints are resurrected at that moment, but the wicked dead also. And that has to mean all still alive on earth will have been 'changed' at that moment too, not just Christ's elect Church.

 

[JLB]

Paul in 1 Thessalonians 4 does not mention the "sudden destruction" timed after Christ comes to gather His saints. So trying to read 1 Thess.4 and 1 Thess.5 like it is in sequential order does not work.

The "day of the Lord" is the 'day' when those 1 Thess.4:13-17 events also happen. And the "day of the Lord" events upon the wicked do not have to wait for the Church to be raptured first.

The coming of the Lord is the Day of the Lord; The Day of Christ, when He gathers His people at the resurrection and rapture and destroys the wicked.


For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord. Therefore comfort one another with these words. But concerning the times and the seasons, brethren, you have no need that I should write to you. For you yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so comes as a thief in the night. For when they say, “Peace and safety!” then sudden destruction comes upon them, as labor pains upon a pregnant woman. And they shall not escape. But you, brethren, are not in darkness, so that this Day should overtake you as a thief. 1 Thessalonians 4:15 - 5:4

 

[DavidT]

The coming of the Lord is the Day of the Lord; The Day of Christ, when He gathers His people at the resurrection and rapture and destroys the wicked.


For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord. Therefore comfort one another with these words. But concerning the times and the seasons, brethren, you have no need that I should write to you. For you yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so comes as a thief in the night. For when they say, “Peace and safety!” then sudden destruction comes upon them, as labor pains upon a pregnant woman. And they shall not escape. But you, brethren, are not in darkness, so that this Day should overtake you as a thief. 1 Thessalonians 4:15 - 5:4

You just joined the end of 1 Thess.4 with the 1 Thess.5 chapter which is a separate subject. Why do you think those 2 chapters were separated into different chapters in Bible translations?

The division between the 4th chapter and the 5th chapter is because it is speaking of events involving different groups. In 1 Thess.4 it's about Christ's Church. In 1 Thess.5 it's about the "sudden destruction" upon the wicked and deceived on the "day of the Lord" by God's cup of wrath.

Both events (Christ's coming to gather His Church), and that "sudden destruction" event do happen at the same time. But the 4th and 5th Thessalonian chapters are separated because of the different events and how those events affect two different groups.

 

[JLB]

You just joined the end of 1 Thess.4 with the 1 Thess.5 chapter which is a separate subject.

Paul contextually joins what he has just stated, with what he is about to say with the conjunction he uses, which is the word "But".

A conjunction is a word that is used to connect words, phrases, and clauses. There are many conjunctions in the English language, but some common ones include and, or, but, because, for, if, and when.

For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord. Therefore comfort one another with these words. But concerning the times and the seasons, brethren, you have no need that I should write to you. For you yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so comes as a thief in the night. For when they say, “Peace and safety!” then sudden destruction comes upon them, as labor pains upon a pregnant woman. And they shall not escape. But you, brethren, are not in darkness, so that this Day should overtake you as a thief. 1 Thessalonians 4:15 - 5:4


Do you understand that the coming of the Lord, is the Day of the Lord, or the Day of Christ?

 

[DavidT]

Do you understand that the coming of the Lord, is the Day of the Lord, or the Day of Christ?

Yes, I understand that.

But do you understand why the translators separated that into two different chapters?

And do you realize that some Greek texts have the Greek word 'kurios' (lord) in 2 Thessalonians 2:2 instead of Textus Receptus 'christos'? That 'kurios' would mean Paul was pointing to the "day of the Lord" in 2 Thess.2:2.

 

[JLB]

Yes, I understand that.

But do you understand why the translators separated that into two different chapters?

The scripture was not written with chapters.

I already showed you that the conjunction word "BUT" ties Chapter 4 with Chapter 5.

 

[DavidT]

The scripture was not written with chapters.

I already showed you that the conjunction word "BUT" ties Chapter 4 with Chapter 5.

Well, the later Bible 'translations' were... divided into chapter sections, and the translators did that according to the subject. And I agree with those chapter divisions. But E.W. Bullinger's Companion Bible, a KJV study Bible, is even better in my opinion, because Bullinger pointed out the subject and objects within a Book and Chapter in outline form, showing Holy Spirit markings as to the division of subjects in God's Word. https://levendwater.org/The Companion Bible.htm

Back to my original point...

Doctrines of men add... a short time period for the 'rapture' to happen prior... to the events of the "day of the Lord", which is not what God's Word reveals. All the following events will happen very quickly within the same 'hour' of Jesus' coming to gather His Church...

* Jesus' descent to earth
* the resurrection
* Jesus brings the 'asleep' resurrected saints with Him
* God's consuming fire burns mans works off the earth, and destroys Satan's army out of the northern quarters that comes upon God's Israel on the last day.
* All still alive on earth are suddenly 'changed' to their spirit bodies at the twinkling of an eye.
* Jesus gathers the saints still alive from the earth and joins them with the saints from heaven.
* Jesus' feet touch down upon the Mount of Olives east of Jerusalem on earth, bringing all His saints with Him there.
* 4/5ths of the wicked that went up against the nation of Israel on that last day are destroyed by God's consuming fire.
* Satan is bound in chains and locked in his pit prison for the "thousand years", not allowed to deceive the nations during the "thousand years".
* All kingdoms of this world become those of Jesus Christ, and He begins His "thousand years" reign with His elect resurrected and gathered saints.

 

[JLB]

Doctrines of men add... a short time period for the 'rapture' to happen prior... to the events of the "day of the Lord",

The scriptures are clear.

The Resurrection of the dead in Christ occurs at the coming of the Lord, BEFORE the Rapture.

For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. 1 Thessalonians 4:15

• will by no means precede those who are asleep.

JLB

 

[DavidT]

The scriptures are clear.

The Resurrection of the dead in Christ occurs at the coming of the Lord, BEFORE the Rapture.

Yeah, on the event of Jesus' descent.

1 Thess 4:16
16 For the Lord Himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
KJV

So trying to squeeze... a delay period in between His descent and the resurrection of the saints He brings with Him is kind of stretching... that event of Scripture just to suit man's doctrine.

 

[JLB]

So trying to squeeze... a delay period in between His descent and the resurrection of the saints He brings with Him is kind of stretching... that event of Scripture just to suit man's doctrine.

There is no delay period.

He descends from heaven and gathers His people, and destroys the wicked.

Who said there is a delay?



JLB

 

[DavidT]

There is no delay period.

He descends from heaven and gathers His people, and destroys the wicked.

Who said there is a delay?



JLB

I don't think you correctly understand the 1 Thess.4 Scripture.

Christ's gathering of His saints, both those He brings with Him at His descent, and those still alive that are "caught up", is one event. The 'asleep' saints, 'today', are already with Jesus right now (recall 2 Corinthians 5).

 

[DavidT]

There is no delay period.

He descends from heaven and gathers His people, and destroys the wicked.

Who said there is a delay?



JLB

I do not agree that Jesus must gather His saints that are still alive on earth first prior to the "sudden destruction" of 1 Thess.5.

I see God's consuming fire being what will cause the "sudden destruction", which will include the battle of Armageddon destruction of Satan's armies out of the northern quarters, i.e., those that come up against Jerusalem on the last day of this world. And that "consuming fire" I see happening at the same time as the "last trump" when Jesus comes to gather His saints still alive on earth.

God's consuming fire will not harm His saints still alive on earth, just as the Daniel 3 event of the hot fiery furnace serves as an ensample for the day of Christ's coming to gather His Church. Do you recall the king's fifty and their captain that came to arrest Elijah, and fire came down from heaven and consumed the fifty? Elijah was right next to the fifty and it did not harm him. God can be that accurate with His Fire.

 

[JLB]

I do not agree that Jesus must gather His saints that are still alive on earth first prior to the "sudden destruction" of 1 Thess.5.

I see God's consuming fire being what will cause the "sudden destruction", which will include the battle of Armageddon destruction of Satan's armies out of the northern quarters, i.e., those that come up against Jerusalem on the last day of this world. And that "consuming fire" I see happening at the same time as the "last trump" when Jesus comes to gather His saints still alive on earth.

God's consuming fire will not harm His saints still alive on earth, just as the Daniel 3 event of the hot fiery furnace serves as an ensample for the day of Christ's coming to gather His Church. Do you recall the king's fifty and their captain that came to arrest Elijah, and fire came down from heaven and consumed the fifty? Elijah was right next to the fifty and it did not harm him. God can be that accurate with His Fire.

I never said Jesus "must" gathering the living saints.

I only quoted what the scripture says.


For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord. 1 Thessalonians 4:15-17

• For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout,
• with the voice of an archangel,
• and with the trumpet of God.
• And the dead in Christ will rise first.
• Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air.

So far there is no mention of destruction.


JLB

 

[Consecrated Life]

God's Word declares that Lord Jesus will return upon a cloud (Rev.1:7; Matt.24:29-31; 1 Thess.4:17; Matt.26:64; Mark 14:62; Luke 21:27; Acts 1:9-12; Rev.14:14).

Acts 1:9-12 is especially important about how Jesus returns in the future, because the angels said there that Jesus will return in "like manner" that He ascended to Heaven. And that Scripture points to that ascension having happened upon the Mount of Olives with His disciples there with Him and seeing Him go up on a cloud. That Scripture is very important simply because it links with the Zechariah 14 Scripture which reveals Jesus will return to that very Mount of Olives spot on earth, His feet touching down there upon the earth, and bringing all His saints with Him there.

Jesus Christ also linked the "day of the Lord" being the 'day' of His future return, which of course we cannot know which specific day or hour that will be.

In Revelation 16:15, on the 6th Vial timing, Lord Jesus said He comes "as a thief", and that Blessed are those who 'watch', and keep their garments. He is warning His Church about that timing.

That "as a thief" metaphor is the same idea that Apostles Paul and Peter used of the final day of this present world. In 1 Thess.5, Paul showed that is the day when the "sudden destruction" will come upon the deceived that will be saying, "Peace and safety", their having been deceived by the coming false-Messiah for the time of "great tribulation". In 2 Peter 3:10, Apostle Peter showed on that 'day' that God's consuming fire will burn man's works off this earth. Both examples point to the future literal 'end' of this present world time, and the start of Christ's future "thousand years" reign over all nations, with his 'resurrected' and gathered elect, per Rev.20.

1 Thessalonians 4 by Apostle Paul reveals at Jesus' coming, also on that "day of the Lord", He will resurrect the saints that have died first, and bring them with Him from heaven when He comes (1 Thess.4:13-16). Then those of us still alive on earth, will be "caught up" to Him, and them in the clouds, to meet The LORD in the 'air'.

These events will happen very quickly on that "day of the Lord". Some add an idea that Christ gathers His saints that are still alive from the earth prior... to God's consuming fire burning man's works off this earth. That's not really written though.

The Daniel 3 example of the hot fiery furnace, heated seven times hotter than necessary, is an example about the day of Christ's future coming to gather us, and God's consuming fire event that will also happen at that moment. Shadrach, Meshech, and Abed-nigo were cast into that hot fiery furnace of Daniel 3, and king Nebuchadnezzar saw a 4th Man in that furnace with them, with the likeness of The Son of God (Jesus). When they came out of that furnace, their clothes did not even smell of smoke. But when Neb's servants just got near that hot furnace, they were immediately incinerated. That serves as an example for us on the "day of the Lord" when Jesus comes to gather us, with God's consuming fire burning upon this earth. He does not have to wait to after He gathers us to send His consuming fire upon this earth.

This is actually what Paul meant with those of us still alive on earth being gathered to meet Lord Jesus in the "air". The Greek word there for "air" in 1 Thess.4:17 is connected with the idea of the 'breath', and can point to our spirit with soul. Do you recall what Paul taught in 1 Corinthians 15:51-52 that on the "last trump" the dead will be raised, and we alive shall all be "changed", "in the twinkling of an eye"? That "last trump" is the trumpet of God when Jesus comes from heaven in the clouds, bringing the resurrected saints with Him. All these events will occur very quickly, not all spread out like men's doctrines tend to think.

Those alive are thus 'changed' on that "last trump" moment on the "day of the Lord", and immediately are revealed in their spiritual bodies, and that is HOW they are "caught up" to Lord Jesus, to meet Him in the "air" (breath of life body, the spirit body).

Then once He descends to gather us, His Church, He takes us with Him to the Mount of Olives where His feet will touch down upon the Mount of Olives, and a very great valley will be formed there by that event. I believe it will be the "sudden destruction" of God's consuming fire upon this earth on that day which will also defeat Satan's host armies that will come upon Israel on the last day. That is the battle spoken of in Zechariah 14 at Christ's return that He will fight, and also the battle of Armageddon He showed will happen per Rev.16 on the final 7th Vial that will be poured out into the... "air"!

This means also on that "day of the Lord", the veil of this present flesh world age, will be lifted off for everyone, all will cast off their flesh, with our spirit bodies revealed right here on earth. This is actually hinted at to occur for all peoples and nations, per the Isaiah 25 Scripture, which is where Apostle Paul was pulling from about 'death swallowed up in victory'. Jesus has already defeated death and the devil for us, but there will still exist the "second death" of the casting of the spirit with soul of the unsaved and unrepentant into the future "lake of fire" after His future "thousand years" reign of Rev.20. But when Jesus returns in our near future, we aren't going to have these perishable flesh bodies anymore. Thus the heavenly dimension is going to be revealed right here, on earth, where Jesus is coming to. Both the earthly and heavenly will be joined back together as before.

His return to dry ground "In Like Manner" means exactly that .
Words mean things.
The feet of believers will never leave dry ground as they watch Jesus come in great glory to plant His feet.
Just as the feet of believers never left the ground when that watched Him leave ground and ascend,
The feet of believers will never lose comtact with top side earth as they watch Him descend.

"IN LIKE MANNER" of those whose feet never lost contact with the ground as they watched Him ascend.

Plain English could not be any more plain.

The "meeting in the air" is "in like manner" of NOTHING that took place the day Jesus Ascended.

 

[Ezekiel]

So I just want to understand this reality. So the dead in Christ rise, meet Christ in the heavens, then later them alive meet Christ with those with him but we don't go to the place Christ prepared for us. Then we all return to this earth for a 1000 years in that this planet will not house all these angels. Then after all we must go to the place he made for us. And after that the earth is destroyed. Then the new heavens are created.

This all starts well. Just so you know 1000 is wrong. Why would the 1000 years , then Christ leave and destroy earth. Just so you know it is wrote earth will be destroyed.

 

[Consecrated Life]

This all starts well. Just so you know 1000 is wrong. Why would the 1000 years , then Christ leave and destroy earth. Just so you know it is wrote earth will be destroyed.

My guess would be the same reason that Satan is bound for just a 1000 years.

Rev 20:2
And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,