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Understanding Mary - Ever Virgin

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Mungo

Mungo

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Understanding Mary - Ever Virgin

Although the Perpetual Virginity of Mary has never been formally proclaimed as a Marian Dogma of the Catholic Church, because of its universal acceptance and continued reference to it in Papal documents throughout the history of the Catholic Church (and at the 5th Ecumenical council), it has come to be accepted as a Marian Dogma. Consequently, it can be said that the perpetual virginity of Mary is a Catholic Dogma by virtue of the ordinary and universal Magisterium.

It was also accepted by the Orthodox and by the early "reformers".

Martin Luther:
"It is an article of faith that Mary is Mother of the Lord and still a virgin....Christ, we believe, came forth from a womb left perfectly intact." (Weimer, The Works of Luther, English Transl. by Pelikan, Concordia, St. Louis, v.11,pp. 319-320; v. 6 p. 510.)

"Christ...was the only Son of Mary, and the Virgin Mary bore no children besides Him..."brothers" really means "cousins" here, for Holy Writ and the Jews always call cousins brothers. (Sermons on John, chapters 1-4, 1537-39.)

"He, Christ, our Savior, was the real and natural fruit of Mary's virginal womb...This was without the cooperation of a man, and she remained a virgin after that." (Ibid.)

John Calvin:
"There have been certain folk who have wished to suggest that from this passage (Matt 1:25) that the Virgin Mary had other children than the Son of God, and that Joseph then dwelt with her later; but what folly this is! For the gospel writer did not wish to record what happened afterwards; he simply wished to make clear Joseph's obedience and to show also that Joseph had been well and truly assured that it was God who had sent His angel to Mary. He had therefore never dwelt with her nor had he shared her company....And besides this Our Lord Jesus Christ is called the first-born. This is not because there was a second or a third, but because the gospel writer is paying regard to the precedence. Scripture speaks thus of naming the first-born whether or not there was any question of the second." (Sermon on Matthew 1:22-25, published 1562.)

Ulrich Zwingli:
"I esteem immensely the Mother of God, the ever chaste, immaculate Virgin Mary....Christ...was born of a most undefiled Virgin." (Stakemeier, E. in De Mariologia et Oecumenismo, Balic, K., ed., Rome, 1962, p. 456.)

"I firmly believe that Mary, according to the words of the gospel as a pure Virgin brought forth for us the Son of God and in childbirth and after childbirth forever remained a pure, intact Virgin." (Zwingli Opera, Corpus Reformatorum, Berlin, 1905, in Evang. Luc., v. 1, p. 424.)

The next post will start the arguments for Mary's perpetual virginity. There are 6 of them.
 
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wondering said:
Was Jesus human or divine?
Click to expand...
I wrote "It doesn't matter if you have a problem accepting that Mary was conceived without original sin or not. What does matter is what the Bible says. Where in the Bible does it say that Mary was conceived without original sin?"

And you replied with "Was Jesus human or divine". I don't see the connection.

However, to answer your question, Jesus was both human and divine.
 
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Mungo said:
To continue:
4. Mary as Bride and Church
When Mary said “yes” to God she entered into full communion with God, body and soul. She becomes “one flesh” with God because she bears God in her womb, just as man and wife become “one flesh”. Therefore to give herself to another would be a form of adultery.

Isaiah prophesied (Is 62:4-5)
No more shall men call you “Forsaken,”
or your land “Desolate,”
But you shall be called “My Delight,”
and your land “Espoused.”
For the Lord delights in you,
and makes your land his spouse.
As a young man marries a virgin,
your Builder shall marry you;
And as a bridegroom rejoices in his bride
so shall your God rejoice in you.

Here we can see references to Mary’s virginal motherhood, her mystical marriage to God who is at the same time her Father, her Son and her Spouse.

5. One Son
An important argument from a theological perspective is that always, when a birth is announced by an angel of a son, it is a matter of an only son.
  • Isaac (Gen 18:10)
  • Samson (Judges 13:4)
  • John the Baptist (Lk 1:13)
If these were figures of the Messiah, it would be illogical that they would be only sons, and the one represented by them were not like them.

6. No Mention of Other Children
Finally when Luke tells us about the family in Nazareth, he only mentions three persons, not more. (Lk 2:41-52) When Jesus was lost in the temple, Joseph and Mary did not return with other sons. If one were lost, surely they would not leave the others (if there were any) at risk of losing them as well.

There is no mention of any other children being born to Mary.
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Mar 6:3 Is not this the carpenter, the son of Mary and brother of James and Joses and Judas and Simon? And are not his sisters here with us?” And they took offense at him.
 
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Joseph was Mary's husband and Jesus had brothers. That is what the Bible says and that is what I believe. You can spin all kinds of extraBiblical fiction about Mary but that doesn't make it true. I believe God, not RCC doctrine.
 
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rod1011 said:
Mar 6:3 Is not this the carpenter, the son of Mary and brother of James and Joses and Judas and Simon? And are not his sisters here with us?” And they took offense at him.
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Doesn't say what sort of brothers they were.
According to Dave Armstrong (a Catholic apologist), a Protestant work The Expository Dictionary of New Testament Words defines adelphos as follows:
Adelphos: denotes a brother, or near kinsmen; in the plural, a community based on identity of origin or life. It is used of:
1. male, children of the same parents….
2. male descendant of the same parents, Acts 7:23,26; Hebrews 7:5
4. people of the same nationality, Acts 3:17,22; Romans 9:3…
5. any man or neighbor, Luke 10:29; Matthew 5:22, 7:3;
6. persons united by a common interest, Matthew 5:47
7. persons united by a common calling, Revelation 22:9
8. mankind, Matthew 25:40; Hebrews 2:17
9. the disciples, and so, by implication, all believers Matthew 28;10, John 20;17
10. believers, apart from sex, Matthew 23:8, Acts 1:15; Romans 1:13; ! Thessalonians 1:4; Revelation 19:10 (the word sisters is used of believers only in 1Tim 5:2)
Nor does the Bible say Mary had other children.
 
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jaybo said:
Joseph was Mary's husband and Jesus had brothers. That is what the Bible says and that is what I believe. You can spin all kinds of extraBiblical fiction about Mary but that doesn't make it true. I believe God, not RCC doctrine.
Click to expand...

I believe what he Bible says but not your personal and fallible interpretation.
 
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Mungo said:
Sola Scriptura is unbiblical.
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You're actually telling me what is unBiblical? You're joking! Catholic beliefs and doctrine are anything but Biblical.

For example...
Where is "Pope" in the Bible? Nowhere!
Where is "Cardinal" in the Bible? Nowhere!
Where is "Catholic" in the Bible? Nowhere!
Where is does it say that Mary is "ever virgin in the Bible"? Nowhere!
Where is does it say that Jesus is still on the cross in the Bible? Nowhere! (Why do you depict Him that way then?)
... etc, etc, etc.
 
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jaybo said:
You're actually telling me what is unBiblical? You're joking! Catholic beliefs and doctrine are anything but Biblical.

For example...
Where is "Pope" in the Bible? Nowhere!
Where is "Cardinal" in the Bible? Nowhere!
Where is "Catholic" in the Bible? Nowhere!
Where is does it say that Mary is "ever virgin in the Bible"? Nowhere!
Where is does it say that Jesus is still on the cross in the Bible? Nowhere! (Why do you depict Him that way then?)
... etc, etc, etc.
Click to expand...

All that is irrelevant to Sola Scriptura being unbiblical.
You are just trying to divert from your failure to find any proof for it.
 
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Mungo said:
Oh, the Holy Spirit make you infallible. WOW!
You follow Sola Scriptura- a man made, unbiblical doctrine.
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In your opinion only. Which I clearly don't respect.

John 16:13, "But when he, the Spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you into all truth. For he will not speak on his own authority, but will speak whatever he hears, and will tell you what is to come."
 
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jaybo said:
In your opinion only. Which I clearly don't respect.

John 16:13, "But when he, the Spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you into all truth. For he will not speak on his own authority, but will speak whatever he hears, and will tell you what is to come."
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John 16:13 was addressed to the apostles - the leaders of his Church. He didn't make that promise to everyone.
If he did why are there 40,000 Protestant denominations, sects, cults and one pastor churches teaching different doctrines all believing they are lead into those doctrines by the Holy Spirit?
 
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Mungo said:
John 16:13 was addressed to the apostles - the leaders of his Church. He didn't make that promise to everyone.
If he did why are there 40,000 Protestant denominations, sects, cults and one pastor churches teaching different doctrines all believing they are lead into those doctrines by the Holy Spirit?
Click to expand...
So you clearly don't believe what Jesus says in the Bible! How many people has the Protestant church murdered in the name of "true religion"?
 
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