What is "GODS RIGHTEOUSNESS"

[smaller]

I will stay with Jesus the Holy Spirit and the Word of God given through the Apostles! I have received permission to preach and teach from the Lord, I dont think I will worry much about mens opinion!

It is the goodness of God that leads men to repentance.

the strength of sin is the law! The power over sin is the grace of God!

That does not change, I will not be moved!

And you are welcome to try and drape Gods Righteousness over the internal workings of the tempter and the tempter as well.

That effort was doomed before it left the starting gate no matter how much rosy scenario is painted over it.

s

 

[Deborah13]

The presumption you continue to put in play is that any given believer is only they, themselves, alone. Or at best, them and God.

That is not an accurate 'inside' look.

Gods righteousness was never meant to be laid in that manner.

Believers are also subject to the internal workings of the tempter. That comes automatically with the territory of belief and the 'battles' we enter into with that working and worker.

So to spread and heap righteousness to that working and worker will remain an utter SHAM.

A believer does have. The other working, not. It is not so easy as to apply Gods Righteousness to EVERYTHING in man as workings of evil, internal or external, are neither righteous or blessed. But condemned.

This division has been brought up before and you never ever factor in that fact, not on any subject.

What applies to YOU as a believer does in no way apply to the other working. If you say the tempter never tempts you in mind, or that if that happens it's not happening 'within' your claims will remain rightfully suspect on that basis alone. And when I say 'you' it is meant as a general observation for every believer, not just 'you.' I include myself in this same sight.

It's just poor accounting.

s

Yeh, he can be pretty annoying at times but that is all he is annoying. He roars, so what, ROAR back. A sinful thought comes in, flick it away like an annoying fruit fly. I refuse to ever let him make me afraid ever again in my life. My LORD is stronger, HIS name is power over ALL darkness, including any darkness that remains in me from the old man.
So...I choose to BEHOLD the LORD JESUS CHRIST the redeemer, I Behold HIS righteousness. In my weakness, I am strong in HIM.

 

[Mitspa]

Yeh, he can be pretty annoying at times but that is all he is annoying. He roars, so what, ROAR back. A sinful thought comes in, flick it away like an annoying fruit fly. I refuse to ever let him make me afraid ever again in my life. My LORD is stronger, HIS name is power over ALL darkness, including any darkness that remains in me from the old man.
So...I choose to BEHOLD the LORD JESUS CHRIST the redeemer, I Behold HIS righteousness. In my weakness, I am strong in HIM.

The Lord told the religious class of His earthly time, If the light that be in you, is darkness, how great is that darkness?

Over and over, around and around the same mountain, many wonder in the wilderness of their own sin and weakness!

They think if we just look at our own weakness enough, then we will figure it out? VANITY OF ALL VANITY!
ALL IS VANITY!

No man can by the flesh, fix the flesh!

Only by faith in Christ and His Grace ALONE, can any man enter into the promised land, of Gods rest! victory over our sin and weakness, comes when we admit we cannot do it.

 

[smaller]

Yeh, he can be pretty annoying at times but that is all he is annoying. He roars, so what, ROAR back. A sinful thought comes in, flick it away like an annoying fruit fly. I refuse to ever let him make me afraid ever again in my life. My LORD is stronger, HIS name is power over ALL darkness, including any darkness that remains in me from the old man.
So...I choose to BEHOLD the LORD JESUS CHRIST the redeemer, I Behold HIS righteousness. In my weakness, I am strong in HIM.

The instant thought that comes is "I" do or believe X, therefore I am exempt from the other worker actually being operational, which of course you yourself point to as NOT a fact.

The observation remains a fact. What applies to believers does not now or ever apply to that other working which does in fact also work within believers.

And as a fact it is a reminder that God does also work adversely against that operator, even in believers, to the end result that believers in general seek to destroy each others and fail to consider their own factual circumstance in these matters.

s

 

[Deborah13]

And as a fact it is a reminder that God does also work adversely against that operator, even in believers, to the end result that believers in general seek to destroy each others and fail to consider their own factual circumstance in these matters.

s

I fail to see where anyone in any of the threads that I have read claim that satan does not tempt them or try to destroy them. I don't think that even the most staunch Calvanist believes such a thing. Correct me if I am wrong.

 

[smaller]

I fail to see where anyone in any of the threads that I have read claim that satan does not tempt them or try to destroy them. I don't think that even the most staunch Calvanist believes such a thing. Correct me if I am wrong.

And I would again point to the fact that a believer has life and His Righteousness and simultaneously the other working/worker NOT.

It is not therefore so easy to spread His Righteousness upon the entirety of what we presently carry.

Simple observation.

s

 

[Deborah13]

And I would again point to the fact that a believer has life and His Righteousness and simultaneously the other working/worker NOT.

It is not therefore so easy to spread His Righteousness upon the entirety of what we presently carry.

Simple observation.

s

Sin in any form is never righteous or can be made righteous. I don't find where anyone has said this or implied it in any way.?

 

[smaller]

Sin in any form is never righteous or can be made righteous. I don't find where anyone has said this or implied it in any way.?

Very good.

You understand then that what facts applied to Paul did not apply to the 'evil present' with him that he admittedly had.

NOR the messenger of Satan that was put upon him.

The notion that any believer is all and only 'them' and 'them alone' does not hold scriptural water.

Paul was the chief of sinners precisely because Apostles are singled out for greater attacks INTERNALLY by the tempter.

Whatever Paul extended to believers NEVER ever extends to that other factual working and worker.

That is why I generally object to the broad brush "I am all and only this" in Christ followed by all and only the good parts of scriptures. That's not how it works.

Paul was very precise in showing 'how' temptation works in adverse fashions to the LAW and that principle is also taught by Jesus in Mark 4:15 and other places.

It is not then, based on those facts, just 'us' as individual believers in any of these equations. And the heapings of all and only the good things is a cop out to speaking truthfully about the other working.

Unfortunately believers are quickly put to 'sleep' on that side of reality and will instead drag the entirety of themselves under Grace and Mercy, not even perceiving that it is the exact OPPOSITE for the other working.

Gods Righteousness blesses the evil and indwelling sin is exactly ZERO believers and we can not logically dodge the fact of having same unless we are led into lying about it. And then expecting blessings and understandings?

Uh, no. Not one bit.

s

 

[Deborah13]

When preachers of the gospel of grace teach as Paul did we will always hear the same outcry that Paul did. "should we keep on sinning that grace may abound?" Paul, "Heaven forbid!"

We especially hear this outcry from the "righteous works" people. In order to reconcil Paul's teachings most of them (that are actually out in the world interacting with other people) have to do one of two things, if they are being honest.

1) Spend a good % of their time on their knees begging for forgivness.
2) Or they put sin into categories, one is worse than another, like God grades on a curve.

 

[smaller]

Or they recognize/source that working as a fact and walk in division.

But to admit the entrance of the tempter into the mind/heart spoils a lot of theology parties.

s

 

[Deborah13]

Or they recognize/source that working as a fact and walk in division.

But to admit the entrance of the tempter into the mind/heart spoils a lot of theology parties.

s

I don't see how recognizing that satan is at work has anything to do with them believing their righteous works have anything to do with their salvation. Unless you are saying that they can use that as an excuse for behaviors. Boy is that a lie from the pit of hell, talk about deception.

 

[smaller]

I don't see how recognizing that satan is at work

It's a fact and is so 'in' the mind and heart.

What applies to believers has in fact an opposite effect on the 'other' worker. One does not paint the entirety of themselves with Gods (anything good) across the board in acknowledgement of that fact.

The same Word that impels us to LOVE is the same Word that impels Satan to HATE. And this 'later' expression is shown out in everyone who does not love their fellow believers and seeks instead to burn them alive in fire.

Where then is the worker the most active and vile?

Why, right there in the hearts of BELIEVERS.

Who are all 'righteous' in Christ in doing so? Uh, no, not much at all in that effort.

go figure.

1 John 3:14
We know that we have passed from death unto life, because we love the brethren.

He that loveth not his brother abideth in death.

s

 

[Deborah13]

When Peter spoke without thinking as to something he didn't understand, in that wonderful brash, straight forward way he had, Jesus did not rebuke Peter, he rebuked satan. Self-control was not one of Peter's strong points. Open mouth insert foot.
One minute he is so brave as to cut off a soldier's ear and then he terrifed to admit he even knew Jesus. But how did the Lord respond?
By asking Peter if he loved Him. Not just once but three times. Jesus, restored Peter by showing him compassion, mercy, and grace and by showing Peter what was really in Peter's heart. He loved Jesus.
Jesus knew that Peter loved Him but he wanted Peter to know that he loved Him. Peter was broken by his actions, Jesus restored Him.

 

[smaller]

When Peter spoke without thinking as to something he didn't understand, in that wonderful brash, straight forward way he had, Jesus did not rebuke Peter, he rebuked satan. Self-control was not one of Peter's strong points. Open mouth insert foot.

Peter had little to do with it except to show Gods Purpose of showing a working factual principle:

Mark 4:15
And these are they by the way side, where the word is sown; but when they have heard, Satan cometh immediately, and taketh away the word that was sown in their hearts.

Peter could not have stopped Satan from speaking from his own lips for all the tea in China because it is A FACT that happens where THE WORD is sown.

At that point it was no longer a question of only Peter. Judas showed this exact same matter when Satan entered him. Paul shows the same matter when he stated he had 'evil present' and 'a devil' put upon him, by God no less. John says the same matter when he says 'we can not say we have no sin and be in Truth' and that sin is in fact of the DEVIL.

The math is pretty clear on this scriptural matter.

That is in fact what happens when the Word is sown.

It was never a question of just Peter or just any other believer.

There are other players on the board of the heart.

Paul shows this exact same matter as it pertains to the blinded unbelievers of this world:

2 Corinthians 4:4
In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

And shows the same matter in Romans 11:8 with regards to unbelieving Israel.

That working of fact that exists in ALL has no righteousness or blessing of God in any form or fashion whatsoever other than His Own Patient TOLERANCE.

s

 

[Deborah13]

It's a fact and is so 'in' the mind and heart.

What applies to believers has in fact an opposite effect on the 'other' worker. One does not paint the entirety of themselves with Gods (anything good) across the board in acknowledgement of that fact.

The same Word that impels us to LOVE is the same Word that impels Satan to HATE. And this 'later' expression is shown out in everyone who does not love their fellow believers and seeks instead to burn them alive in fire.

Where then is the worker the most active and vile?

Why, right there in the hearts of BELIEVERS.

Who are all 'righteous' in Christ in doing so? Uh, no, not much at all in that effort.

go figure.

1 John 3:14
We know that we have passed from death unto life, because we love the brethren.

He that loveth not his brother abideth in death.

s[/QUOT.E]

The gospel of grace never seeks to burn believers alive, just the opposite. It teaches the pure unadulterated love of God for us.
We only can love God because He loved us first. AND we can only love others as we love ourselves, that is all we know of love. When we understand how much God loves us and that if He says HE has made us worthy of that love through His Son then we need to agree with Him. We do not deserve anything from God on our own standing but we don't stand, are not justified by our own anything, only in Christ are we justified. When we can see this only then can we love ourselves in Christ and only then can we love others as God intends for us to love them with His love. We cannot give away what we do not possess.
It's funny, talk about not being honest. Ask many christians if they love themselves, they will stammer, stutter, and even deny. "Love your neighbor as you love yourself." Jesus, knew better.

Defeated christians are of no use to anyone.

 

[Mitspa]

It's a fact and is so 'in' the mind and heart.

What applies to believers has in fact an opposite effect on the 'other' worker. One does not paint the entirety of themselves with Gods (anything good) across the board in acknowledgement of that fact.

The same Word that impels us to LOVE is the same Word that impels Satan to HATE. And this 'later' expression is shown out in everyone who does not love their fellow believers and seeks instead to burn them alive in fire.

Where then is the worker the most active and vile?

Why, right there in the hearts of BELIEVERS.

Who are all 'righteous' in Christ in doing so? Uh, no, not much at all in that effort.

go figure.

1 John 3:14
We know that we have passed from death unto life, because we love the brethren.

He that loveth not his brother abideth in death.

s[/QUOT.E]

The gospel of grace never seeks to burn believers alive, just the opposite. It teaches the pure unadulterated love of God for us.
We only can love God because He loved us first. AND we can only love others as we love ourselves, that is all we know of love. When we understand how much God loves us and that if He says HE has made us worthy of that love through His Son then we need to agree with Him. We do not deserve anything from God on our own standing but we don't stand, are not justified by our own anything, only in Christ are we justified. When we can see this only then can we love ourselves in Christ and only then can we love others as God intends for us to love them with His love. We cannot give away what we do not possess.
It's funny, talk about not being honest. Ask many christians if they love themselves, they will stammer, stutter, and even deny. "Love your neighbor as you love yourself." Jesus, knew better.

Defeated christians are of no use to anyone.

Well, I must disagree?
there is one who loves to parade out a group of defeated "christians"!
Saying look , here is the christian, sinful, sick, angry, judgmental, bitter etc....

satan has much for these so-called "christians" to do!

 

[Deborah13]

Well, I must disagree?
there is one who loves to parade out a group of defeated "christians"!
Saying look , here is the christian, sinful, sick, angry, judgmental, bitter etc....

satan has much for these so-called "christians" to do!

Oh..I stand corrected!!! You are so right.

 

[Mitspa]

Isa 61:10



I will greatly rejoice in the LORD, my soul shall be joyful in my God; for he hath clothed me with the garments of salvation, he hath covered me with the robe of righteousness, as a bridegroom decketh himself with ornaments, and as a bride adorneth herself with her jewels.
Isa 61:11



For as the earth bringeth forth her bud, and as the garden causeth the things that are sown in it to spring forth; so the Lord GOD will cause righteousness and praise to spring forth before all the nations.



Clearly some deny clear scripture, that we who have been given the Holy Spirit have also been clothed in the robes of salvation and righteousness!

When the Father looks upon us, He does not see the "flesh", but beholds the "Spiritual" garments that Christ has given to us!

Now we have the responsibility to keep these garments from being defiled, How? By walking in the Spirit, by faith alone! "For the just shall live by faith"


Rev 3:4

Thou hast a few names even in Sardis which have not defiled their garments; and they shall walk with me in white: for they are worthy.

Rev 16:15


Behold, I come as a thief. Blessedishe that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame.



I tell you that unless one is "righteous" by faith in His blood, that same one, is naked!
No wonder satan destroys your body and brings destuction upon your families! You who are not covered in His Righteousness are naked and cursed, just as all flesh of this world!

Awake to righteousness and sin not!
The great veil of flesh and self-justification lies upon the church, satan has deceived the church (eve) by his first lie?
"did God really say" is the doctrine taught in almost ever bible college and pulpit.

Did he really say that the righteous shall live by faith?
Did he really say that grace is the power over sin?
Did he really say that the law is cursed?
Did he really say I will never leave nor forske you?
Did he really say these signs will follow them that believe?
Did he really say that you must become weak to be made strong?
Did he really say this is My commandment?

etc..etc..

blind men have taken the church by deception!

But a New Day is coming!
As the Sun rises the darkness will flee.
woe unto them who reject the true Light!

 

[farouk]

Romans 3 has a good treatment of God's righteousness, doctrinally.

Both from man in his natural state and when justified by faith in Christ.

 

[Mitspa]

Romans 3 has a good treatment of God's righteousness, doctrinally.

Both from man in his natural state and when justified by faith in Christ.

Amen its all there but it takes some time for us to believe Gods ways?

For line must be upon line and percept upon precept.

God bless