When does a believer receive eternal life?

[FreeGrace]

For my understanding and since you interjected the term that I'd thought of but had not yet voiced, is this a community dedicated to the Arminian doctrine? If you know.

There is a mix here, including among the moderators.

 

[Winter Tapioca]

There is a mix here, including among the moderators.

Thank you.

 

[for_his_glory]

FreeGrace, this is a reply to your post #224. BTW, did you honestly think your thread would not turn into a OSAS debate!!!
Galatians 3:1 O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you? 2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith? 3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?

Like I said, you need the whole of scripture and not just a single verse to gain full understanding. Some, including myself have given you many scriptures that teach one can lose their salvation, but you blew them off without even reading them even going as far as saying they do not exist. There is nothing contradicting in the word of God, but when one holds fast just a few verses without searching out the whole then knowledge is lost to them.

 

[for_his_glory]

Duplicate

 

[th1b.taylor]

I understand where you and the others are at, and that is fine with me. But I will always strive to be closer to Christ and God, to improve my following His footsteps. For me, personally, to abide to what you say tempts me to compromise my desire (love) to please Christ and God. My desire to please is not a selfish act but a selfless one.

The Holy Spirit fills my heart with love when I desire to please Christ or God. I listen to Christ's Spirit in me. Because it is a loving act, I do what I know is the true thing for the soul. Obedience is not a chore but a heavenly desire, it is an act of love for me. So please allow me to carry on the way that fills my heart.

But in all of this, I can see no percentages of my soul being saved and that leaves me thinking that the soul isw saved or it is lost, 100% of it.

 

[Winter Tapioca]

Why would anyone who is in Christ argue and bend scripture in order to say, eternal salvation is not so?
Maybe it boils down to one direct question. Does God save completely?



There have been plenty of verses and even articles linked containing explanatory verses that affirm God's word teaches those who are His shall never be cast out. Those who are not His though they professed His name He never knew. Matthew 7:21-23

 

[Winter Tapioca]

"God does not call the qualified but He qualifies the called."

What Christians Want To Know - https://www.whatchristianswanttoknow.com -
Can a Christian Lose Their Salvation? A Biblical Analysis
Posted By Jack Wellman On June 13, 2011


Once a Christian is saved, can they lose their salvation? What if a believer falls away from the faith [1], can they be restored again to God? Have you ever doubted your own salvation? Is once saved always saved true? Once a Christian is saved, can they be lost again? Is there such a thing as eternal security? Can a person’s name be erased from the Book of Life?

What Saves the Believer?

Some denominations and some Christians believe that once you are saved it is possible to lose their salvation. But what is salvation in the first place? We can believe what the Bible says above what people or churches say. Let’s review some of the scriptures that talk about salvation:

John 3:16: “For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.” A literal rendering of “shall” is actually “will” so this scripture, according to the Greek, ought to read “…that whoever believes in him will not perish but has [the present indicative means they already possess] eternal life.”

Acts 16:30-31: ““Sirs, what must I do to be saved?” They replied, “Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved—you and your household.”

Acts 4:13: “Salvation is found in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given to mankind by which we must be saved.”

John 3:18: “Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because he has not believed in the name of God’s one and only Son.”

The overriding factor in our salvation is that we must believe that Jesus Christ is Who He says He is and is not tied in any way to what the believer does. We do not initiate our salvation nor do we do anything to achieve it. In fact no one really seeks after God (Rom 3:11) but it is God who seeks after us and calls us (Gal. 1:15-16). That He saves us to completion and to the uttermost is directly attributed to God. We are in no position to save ourselves. It is not about letting Jesus [2] “come into your heart” or about thinking that “God has a wonderful plan for your life [3]” but it is about believing in Jesus Christ. And whoever believes in Him walks in faith and accepts Him in faith. You are saved only by the grace of God and apart from yourself, it is impossible, but with God all things are possible. Ephesians 2:8-9 echo this, “For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— not by works, so that no one can boast.”


Jesus Plus Works Equals Nothing

If anyone believes that their works can save them remember that God calls even the best of good works filthy rags (Isaiah 64:6). Here is the one and only work that God accepts and that Jesus testified to, “…This is the work of God, that you believe on Him Whom He has sent” (John 6:29). “For they being ignorant of God’s righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God” (Rom 10:3). Romans 4:6 clearly says that we are saved “without the deeds of the Law” (Rom 3:28), and it is “not of works” (Eph. 2:9) “It is the gift of God” (Eph. 2:8). No one is saved by works…we are saved for works. God would not give us the gift of grace only to take it again. Who gives someone a gift and then goes and takes it back?

God Saves Completely

John 6:37 and John10:28-29 both testify that once God calls you and saves you, He will not ever caste you away or you can never be snatched from Jesus’ hand or the Father’s hand. Philippians 1:6 says, “being confident of this, that he who began a good work in you will carry it on to completion until the day of Christ Jesus.” Further, I Corinthians 1:8 states, “He will keep you strong to the end, so that you will be blameless on the day of our Lord Jesus Christ. “ God does not call the qualified but He qualifies the called. Holiness is not the way to Jesus; Jesus is the way to holiness. Your own salvation is not all of your responsibility; it is your response to His ability.



Source URL to article: https://www.whatchristianswanttoknow.com/can-a-christian-lose-their-salvation-a-biblical-analysis/
Used with permission

 

[for_his_glory]

OK, finally the "agenda" comes out into the light. The bane of everyone who just can't stand the idea that a saved person is somehow gonna get away with sin, or "live like a heathen".

Such people really do not understand grace at all. Even the most faithful and obedient Christian is saved solely by the grace of God. Nothing by what they do. Eph 2:9 - not of works (what they do), lest any man should boast.

First off I am talking about those on the milk of the word that do not yet understand what grace is that come into these forums to learn.

There is no agenda as a Christian can not get away with unrepentant sin as we will all stand in the judgement of Christ, 2 Corinthians 5:1-11.

 

[for_his_glory]

I don't even know what Armenian doctrine is nor do I want to know. All I know is the doctrine of Christ and that's good enough for me.

 

[FreeGrace]

FreeGrace, this is a reply to your post #224. BTW, did you honestly think your thread would not turn into a OSAS debate!!!

I post according to what is posted.

Galatians 3:1 O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you? 2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith? 3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?

And what is the point here?

Like I said, you need the whole of scripture and not just a single verse to gain full understanding.

Is this suggesting that plain promises may not actually mean what the words say?

Some, including myself have given you many scriptures that teach one can lose their salvation, but you blew them off without even reading them even going as far as saying they do not exist.

None of the verses ever given plainly say that salvation can be lost. Every one of them MUST ASSUME that idea. Which contradicts Jesus' very plain promise in John 10:28.

There is nothing contradicting in the word of God

Then it should be obvious that salvation cannot be lost. John 10:28

Eternal salvation is exactly that.

It's sure not probationary salvation, as Arminians would try to have it.

 

[for_his_glory]

Why would anyone who is in Christ argue and bend scripture in order to say, eternal salvation is not so?
Maybe it boils down to one direct question. Does God save completely?



There have been plenty of verses and even articles linked containing explanatory verses that affirm God's word teaches those who are His shall never be cast out. Those who are not His though they professed His name He never knew. Matthew 7:21-23

No one is saying that eternal salvation is not so, but showing how one can lose their salvation, but yet those scriptures especially Matthew 12:31-33 are discarded.

 

[Winter Tapioca]

No one is saying that eternal salvation is not so, but showing how one can lose their salvation, but yet those scriptures especially Matthew 12:31-33 are discarded.

You keep saying that and yet, you discard the guarantee of eternal life and salvation for those who are in Christ.As if to believe and argue eternal salvation is something we achieve through our own efforts. And thus is something we can rescind. And that is the doctrine of conditional salvation. There is no such thing as that for which Jesus died.

I've decided it isn't something I want to pursue. This type thread. I did a little searching when I was off the site and in a different browser so I could pull tabs up and group them accordingly. I found this topic has been done to death here. And it rolls like a stone down an infinite mountain that has no base, no end.

After I did that and after I posted my last remarks in this thread sharing that article I thought a great help to those who would read it and glean its tidings, the voice of the Holy Spirit that has been with me since I found Christ as a child said as clear as a bell, not the first time we've talked, who are you to think you can lead a people away from where they first believe they belong?

I agree. When the Bible is the word of God that's it.

 

[th1b.taylor]

I post according to what is posted.


And what is the point here?


Is this suggesting that plain promises may not actually mean what the words say?


None of the verses ever given plainly say that salvation can be lost. Every one of them MUST ASSUME that idea. Which contradicts Jesus' very plain promise in John 10:28.


Then it should be obvious that salvation cannot be lost. John 10:28

Eternal salvation is exactly that.

It's sure not probationary salvation, as Arminians would try to have it.

I agree, if Salvation were temporary and then you receive eternal damnation, why would one bother, eternal, in either case, is a long, long, time. But then to the real point, when we are in the air and going to meet Jesus in the sky, I'll wave to you if you're going also. Oh, and it is because I am eternally His that I do not do a lot of my notabe past activities.

 

[for_his_glory]

I think it's time for me to move on as I have given all I know to give to this discussion and all we are doing is rehashing over and over.
My final statement:
No one can lose their salvation or eternal life if they are in Christ and He in them as we walk in the Spirit so that we will not fulfill the lust of the flesh.

 

[FreeGrace]

I said this:
"OK, finally the "agenda" comes out into the light. The bane of everyone who just can't stand the idea that a saved person is somehow gonna get away with sin, or "live like a heathen".

Such people really do not understand grace at all. Even the most faithful and obedient Christian is saved solely by the grace of God. Nothing by what they do. Eph 2:9 - not of works (what they do), lest any man should boast."

First off I am talking about those on the milk of the word that do not yet understand what grace is that come into these forums to learn.

The view that salvation can be lost implies a misunderstanding or lack of understanding of what grace is.

There is no agenda as a Christian can not get away with unrepentant sin as we will all stand in the judgement of Christ, 2 Corinthians 5:1-11.

I know that. But it seems Arminians resist eternal security because they see it as "getting away with sin", or something like that.

 

[FreeGrace]

I don't even know what Armenian doctrine is nor do I want to know.

Arminian doctrine includes the belief that salvation can be lost.

All I know is the doctrine of Christ and that's good enough for me.

Which is eternal security. Those He gives eternal life shall never perish.

One who is saved is eternally saved.

 

[th1b.taylor]

I think it's time for me to move on as I have given all I know to give to this discussion and all we are doing is rehashing over and over.
My final statement:
No one can lose their salvation or eternal life if they are in Christ and He in them as we walk in the Spirit so that we will not fulfill the lust of the flesh.

 

[FreeGrace]

No one is saying that eternal salvation is not so, but showing how one can lose their salvation[/QUTOE]
The words "eternal salvation" mean that one cannot lose it. If that were true, then we can't put the word "eternal" in front of it.

Maybe probationary salvation, which seems to fit the Arminian doctrine.

but yet those scriptures especially Matthew 12:31-33 are discarded.

They're not discarded. They are properly understood IN LIGHT OF the doctrine of eternal security, taught by Jesus Christ Himself.

 

[FreeGrace]

I agree, if Salvation were temporary and then you receive eternal damnation, why would one bother, eternal, in either case, is a long, long, time. But then to the real point, when we are in the air and going to meet Jesus in the sky, I'll wave to you if you're going also. Oh, and it is because I am eternally His that I do not do a lot of my notabe past activities.

Exactly! And I'll too!!

 

[th1b.taylor]

Arminian doctrine includes the belief that salvation can be lost.


Which is eternal security. Those He gives eternal life shall never perish.

One who is saved is eternally saved.