Who Are The Two Witnesses?

[Randy]

Oh PS
The two witnesses are not exactly peaceful.According to scripture they will be killing and tormenting people outside of Israel.They persecute Israel's Muslim neighbors for 3.5 years ,but it's a peaceful transition for Israel when their occupation begins.The Muslims won't like it though.

Its from God. So what?

 

[Randy]

When the Israeli government gives those gentiles the authority to occupy Jerusalem for those 42 months ,it's a peaceful transition.In fact the king of those gentiles will flatter the Israeli government.

Dan 11:32
With flattery he will corrupt those who have violated the covenant, but the people who know their God will firmly resist him.

And this is when the persecution of the saints in Israel begins.

Daniel 11:33
Those who are wise will instruct many, though for a time they will fall by the sword or be burned or captured or plundered.

For the next 3.5 years everyone in Israel will recieve the mark of the beast.The saints who warn against it and preach the kingdom of God is near will be persecuted during this time throughout Israel fulfilling what Jesus taught in the gospel.

The complete destruction doesn't take place till the end of the 42 months.
It takes place after the king of the south (beast from the pit)attacks the gentiles occupying Jerusalem in

Daniel 11:40
At the time of the end the king of the South will engage him in battle, and the king of the North will storm out against him with chariots and cavalry and a great fleet of ships. He will invade many countries and sweep through them like a flood.

The destruction is here

Daniel 11:44
But reports from the east and the north will alarm him, and he will set out in a great rage to destroy and annihilate many.

And the abomination that causes desolation is placed in Jerusalem here.On the day of the Lord when the heavens burn with a fervent heat and the elements shall be melted.

Daniel 12:1
And at that time Michael the great prince shall stand up, that stands over the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of tribulation, such tribulation as has not been from the time that there was a nation on the earth until that time: at that time thy people shall be delivered, even every one that is written in the book.

Jerusalem is not the Babylon of Rev.
I don't see the nations attacking Jerusalem as peaceful.

 

[Edward]

I have a question for you Edward.
According to revelations ,the two witnesses kill and torment people for 1260 days.It does not say they preach the gospel ,heal the sick,nor raise the dead.Scripture does not show them doing anything Christlike even though their Lord was crucified in that city.

So why do many people assume these two witnesses are good when their fruit doesn't look very good?

What are you talking about, it's all right there in Revelation 11.
3 And I will give power to my two witnesses, and they will prophesy one thousand two hundred and sixty days, clothed in sackcloth.”.../

He identifies them as His. How about prophesying? Is that Christlike or does the enemy prophesy too?

According to my comprehension, there is no assumptions being made about the witnesses. They are God's witnesses, it says so. And if anyone tries to harm them, then they will defend themselves.

V5. 5 And if anyone wants to harm them, fire proceeds from their mouth and devours their enemies. And if anyone wants to harm them, he must be killed in this manner.../

So, you're doing a whole lot of assuming things about them.

 

[Shilohsfoal]

Its Global
I watched as he opened the sixth seal. There was a great earthquake. The sun turned black like sackcloth made of goat hair, the whole moon turned blood red, 13 and the stars in the sky fell to earth, as figs drop from a fig tree when shaken by a strong wind. 14 The heavens receded like a scroll being rolled up, and every mountain and island was removed from its place.

15 Then the kings of the earth, the princes, the generals, the rich, the mighty, and everyone else, both slave and free, hid in caves and among the rocks of the mountains. 16 They called to the mountains and the rocks, “Fall on us and hide us[f] from the face of him who sits on the throne and from the wrath of the Lamb! 17 For the great day of their[g] wrath has come, and who can withstand it?”

Doesn't say anything about it being global in the texts.
Keep in mind,Jerusalem itself sits on seven mountains.

But no,it's just the middle east being destroyed.The promised land.

 

[Shilohsfoal]

Jerusalem is not the Babylon of Rev.
I don't see the nations attacking Jerusalem as peaceful.

The king of the north doesn't attack Jerusalem at the beginning of the occupation.

Daniel 11:32
With flattery he will corrupt those who have violated the covenant, but the people who know their God will firmly resist him.

I don't see how you feel "flattery" as being an attack.When you flatter someone ,your not attacking them.

 

[Shilohsfoal]

What are you talking about, it's all right there in Revelation 11.
3 And I will give power to my two witnesses, and they will prophesy one thousand two hundred and sixty days, clothed in sackcloth.”.../

He identifies them as His. How about prophesying? Is that Christlike or does the enemy prophesy too?

According to my comprehension, there is no assumptions being made about the witnesses. They are God's witnesses, it says so. And if anyone tries to harm them, then they will defend themselves.

V5. 5 And if anyone wants to harm them, fire proceeds from their mouth and devours their enemies. And if anyone wants to harm them, he must be killed in this manner.../

So, you're doing a whole lot of assuming things about them.

Christ said in the gospel that God sent his prophets first and his son would be last.God has not sent another prophet since and if Christ is correct,God did not send these two prophets.
Your assuming God sent them.Your forgetting that Christ said he would send his own prophets in the name of a prophet.

Now can you tell me who you think these two prophets are good?

Is it because they kill people in Jesus name,or because they torment people in Jesus name?

 

[Shilohsfoal]

What are you talking about, it's all right there in Revelation 11.
3 And I will give power to my two witnesses, and they will prophesy one thousand two hundred and sixty days, clothed in sackcloth.”.../

He identifies them as His. How about prophesying? Is that Christlike or does the enemy prophesy too?

According to my comprehension, there is no assumptions being made about the witnesses. They are God's witnesses, it says so. And if anyone tries to harm them, then they will defend themselves.

V5. 5 And if anyone wants to harm them, fire proceeds from their mouth and devours their enemies. And if anyone wants to harm them, he must be killed in this manner.../

So, you're doing a whole lot of assuming things about them.

PS
Jesus instructs his prophets to not defend themselves in the gospel.
It's not Christlike to defend oneself.

Mathew 5:39
But I tell you, do not resist an evil person. If anyone slaps you on the right cheek, turn to them the other cheek also.

Did you see Christ attempting to defend himself at any time in the Bible?

So why do you believe these two prophets are good seeing they disobey Christ?

 

[Edward]

Christ said in the gospel that God sent his prophets first and his son would be last.God has not sent another prophet since and if Christ is correct,God did not send these two prophets.
Your assuming God sent them.Your forgetting that Christ said he would send his own prophets in the name of a prophet.

Now can you tell me who you think these two prophets are good?

Is it because they kill people in Jesus name,or because they torment people in Jesus name?

Sorry Brother, but I aint taking that bait. Believe as you wish too. But the text is pretty plain. God said, My two witnesses. Much surrounding them can be unknown for sure but one thing is clear, those are God's people.

Do I think that you will be able to creat doubt and confusion where none is needed? Sure, that ol' Lawyer talk. An argument against anything is possible. But that in nowise means that your argument is true or even makes sense.

 

[Shilohsfoal]

Edward ,do you think it's funny that Christs prophets disobey him?
I don't see the humor in this.

Luke 12:45
But if that servant says in his heart, ‘My master is delaying his coming,’ and begins to beat the male and female servants, and to eat and drink and be drunk,
The master of that servant will come on a day when he does not expect him and at an hour he is not aware of. He will cut him to pieces and assign him a place with the unbelievers.

 

[Edward]

PS
Jesus instructs his prophets to not defend themselves in the gospel.
It's not Christlike to defend oneself.

Mathew 5:39
But I tell you, do not resist an evil person. If anyone slaps you on the right cheek, turn to them the other cheek also.

Did you see Christ attempting to defend himself at any time in the Bible?

So why do you believe these two prophets are good seeing they disobey Christ?

Conditions change. If you do some reading you will see that the world is in a state of war at that time. So context alone makes a poor analogy. Those two witnesses are the good guys and none of your disbelief is going to change that.
Have a Great day, Brother!

 

[Shilohsfoal]

Sorry Brother, but I aint taking that bait. Believe as you wish too. But the text is pretty plain. God said, My two witnesses. Much surrounding them can be unknown for sure but one thing is clear, those are God's people.

Do I think that you will be able to creat doubt and confusion where none is needed? Sure, that ol' Lawyer talk. An argument against anything is possible. But that in nowise means that your argument is true or even makes sense.

So you believe Christ is wrong and he is not the last to be sent by God?

Matthew 21

King James Version

​

21 And when they drew nigh unto Jerusalem, and were come to Bethphage, unto the mount of Olives, then sent Jesus two disciples,
2 Saying unto them, Go into the village over against you, and straightway ye shall find an ass tied, and a colt with her: loose them, and bring them unto me.
3 And if any man say ought unto you, ye shall say, The Lord hath need of them; and straightway he will send them.
4 All this was done, that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophet, saying,
5 Tell ye the daughter of Sion, Behold, thy King cometh unto thee, meek, and sitting upon an ass, and a colt the foal of an ass.
6 And the disciples went, and did as Jesus commanded them,
7 And brought the ass, and the colt, and put on them their clothes, and they set him thereon.
8 And a very great multitude spread their garments in the way; others cut down branches from the trees, and strawed them in the way.
9 And the multitudes that went before, and that followed, cried, saying, Hosanna to the son of David: Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord; Hosanna in the highest.
10 And when he was come into Jerusalem, all the city was moved, saying, Who is this?
11 And the multitude said, This is Jesus the prophet of Nazareth of Galilee.
12 And Jesus went into the temple of God, and cast out all them that sold and bought in the temple, and overthrew the tables of the moneychangers, and the seats of them that sold doves,
13 And said unto them, It is written, My house shall be called the house of prayer; but ye have made it a den of thieves.
14 And the blind and the lame came to him in the temple; and he healed them.
15 And when the chief priests and scribes saw the wonderful things that he did, and the children crying in the temple, and saying, Hosanna to the son of David; they were sore displeased,
16 And said unto him, Hearest thou what these say? And Jesus saith unto them, Yea; have ye never read, Out of the mouth of babes and sucklings thou hast perfected praise?
17 And he left them, and went out of the city into Bethany; and he lodged there.
18 Now in the morning as he returned into the city, he hungered.
19 And when he saw a fig tree in the way, he came to it, and found nothing thereon, but leaves only, and said unto it, Let no fruit grow on thee henceforward for ever. And presently the fig tree withered away.
20 And when the disciples saw it, they marvelled, saying, How soon is the fig tree withered away!
21 Jesus answered and said unto them, Verily I say unto you, If ye have faith, and doubt not, ye shall not only do this which is done to the fig tree, but also if ye shall say unto this mountain, Be thou removed, and be thou cast into the sea; it shall be done.
22 And all things, whatsoever ye shall ask in prayer, believing, ye shall receive.
23 And when he was come into the temple, the chief priests and the elders of the people came unto him as he was teaching, and said, By what authority doest thou these things? and who gave thee this authority?
24 And Jesus answered and said unto them, I also will ask you one thing, which if ye tell me, I in like wise will tell you by what authority I do these things.
25 The baptism of John, whence was it? from heaven, or of men? And they reasoned with themselves, saying, If we shall say, From heaven; he will say unto us, Why did ye not then believe him?
26 But if we shall say, Of men; we fear the people; for all hold John as a prophet.
27 And they answered Jesus, and said, We cannot tell. And he said unto them, Neither tell I you by what authority I do these things.
28 But what think ye? A certain man had two sons; and he came to the first, and said, Son, go work to day in my vineyard.
29 He answered and said, I will not: but afterward he repented, and went.
30 And he came to the second, and said likewise. And he answered and said, I go, sir: and went not.
31 Whether of them twain did the will of his father? They say unto him, The first. Jesus saith unto them, Verily I say unto you, That the publicans and the harlots go into the kingdom of God before you.
32 For John came unto you in the way of righteousness, and ye believed him not: but the publicans and the harlots believed him: and ye, when ye had seen it, repented not afterward, that ye might believe him.
33 Hear another parable: There was a certain householder, which planted a vineyard, and hedged it round about, and digged a winepress in it, and built a tower, and let it out to husbandmen, and went into a far country:
34 And when the time of the fruit drew near, he sent his servants to the husbandmen, that they might receive the fruits of it.
35 And the husbandmen took his servants, and beat one, and killed another, and stoned another.
36 Again, he sent other servants more than the first: and they did unto them likewise.
37 But last of all he sent unto them his son, saying, They will reverence my son.
38 But when the husbandmen saw the son, they said among themselves, This is the heir; come, let us kill him, and let us seize on his inheritance.

 

[Shilohsfoal]

Conditions change. If you do some reading you will see that the world is in a state of war at that time. So context alone makes a poor analogy. Those two witnesses are the good guys and none of your disbelief is going to change that.
Have a Great day, Brother!

You have not been able to show anything they do is good ,other than you believe it's good to kill and torment other people in the name of Christ.

 

[Edward]

You have not been able to show anything they do is good ,other than you believe it's good to kill and torment other people in the name of Christ.

That has to be one of the most ridiculous things that I've ever heard anyone say.
You're trying to accuse me feeling it is good to kill and torment people in the name of Christ?! Dude, cut the dose, immediately.

What it amounts to is...I trust Jesus. I trust you Jesus. I TRUST Jesus. So I have no need to play connect the dots with you. That's quite a connection you made there, lol.

 

[Edward]

You have not been able to show anything they do is good ,other than you believe it's good to kill and torment other people in the name of Christ.

Ok, I think I get it. You are not showing yourself to be Christian by your avatar and with the sort of thngs you say...ok, you're here to sow discord and distraction among God's people. One of those guys. Troublemaker.

Hey that's quite a screen name. Have you been banned before? Maybe you sound familiar to me a little...

 

[Edward]

Your posts seem to be chanting, God is no good, God is unjust, and so forth. So there's no point conversing with you. I have better ways to spend my time.

 

[Randy]

The king of the north doesn't attack Jerusalem at the beginning of the occupation.

Daniel 11:32
With flattery he will corrupt those who have violated the covenant, but the people who know their God will firmly resist him.

I don't see how you feel "flattery" as being an attack.When you flatter someone ,your not attacking them.

The beast hates Babylon and will completed destroy that wealthy City in one day never to be occupied again. A smoldering wasteland.

But about Jerusalem have you read:
I will gather all the nations to Jerusalem to fight against it; the city will be captured, the houses ransacked, and the women raped. Half of the city will go into exile, but the rest of the people will not be taken from the city

People still remain in that city. It still is habitable.

 

[Shilohsfoal]

That has to be one of the most ridiculous things that I've ever heard anyone say.
You're trying to accuse me feeling it is good to kill and torment people in the name of Christ?! Dude, cut the dose, immediately.

What it amounts to is...I trust Jesus. I trust you Jesus. I TRUST Jesus. So I have no need to play connect the dots with you. That's quite a connection you made there, lol.

Why,that's what the two witnesses do.
Kill and torment other people in the name of Christ.

So you have not been able to show anything they do as good.

 

[Shilohsfoal]

Your posts seem to be chanting, God is no good, God is unjust, and so forth. So there's no point conversing with you. I have better ways to spend my time.

The two witnesses are not God.

Don't confuse the three.

 

[Randy]

Why,that's what the two witnesses do.
Kill and torment other people in the name of Christ.

So you have not been able to show anything they do as good.

They serve God and could do none of those things stated in Rev 11 if God wasn't with them.
And those who take joy in their deaths will fall to the lies of the beast so as to be condemned for they have not repented of their wicked ways and have not believed God.

 

[Shilohsfoal]

The beast hates Babylon and will completed destroy that wealthy City in one day never to be occupied again. A smoldering wasteland.

But about Jerusalem have you read:
I will gather all the nations to Jerusalem to fight against it; the city will be captured, the houses ransacked, and the women raped. Half of the city will go into exile, but the rest of the people will not be taken from the city

People still remain in that city. It still is habitable.

The king of the north is not the beast from the pit.The king of the south is.

The king of the north is the Israeli governments ally.
To think NATO hates Israel is outlandish.
It is the Muslim countries that want to destroy Israel.
Especially Palestinians.


Psalm 83

King James Version

​

83 Keep not thou silence, O God: hold not thy peace, and be not still, O God.
2 For, lo, thine enemies make a tumult: and they that hate thee have lifted up the head.
3 They have taken crafty counsel against thy people, and consulted against thy hidden ones.
4 They have said, Come, and let us cut them off from being a nation; that the name of Israel may be no more in remembrance.
5 For they have consulted together with one consent: they are confederate against thee:
6 The tabernacles of Edom, and the Ishmaelites; of Moab, and the Hagarenes;
7 Gebal, and Ammon, and Amalek; the Philistines with the inhabitants of Tyre;
8 Assur also is joined with them: they have holpen the children of Lot. Selah.
9 Do unto them as unto the Midianites; as to Sisera, as to Jabin, at the brook of Kison:
10 Which perished at Endor: they became as dung for the earth.