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Workers in HIS Vineyard

Classik

Classik

Member
Who and who should be workers in a church? Only born-again Christians?

We have such departments as: Ushering, Choir, youth leaders etc. There's a church I know that emphasises that all workers must be born-again. How fair is this? I am of the opinion (one of the days I tried defending the choir) that we use the talented bests. The best might be a mixture born-again and people who have not yet made peace with God. I think God will touch them one day.

What do you think?
 
I think that, for obvious reasons, the "decision-making staff" (pastors, deacons, etc.) should be only those who are born-again Christians. However, if a non-believer is willing to, say, sing with the worship group in service, or run the sound board, or balance the church's budget, or basically help out the church in any way, I don't think it's right (especially for Christians) to turn away that help because they haven't made it to the same point on their road that we have on ours. You may be turning that soul away from the door-opening "Aha!" that God has in store for them, just because you want to protect your church's image.
 
Every appointed worker in our church is a professed believer.

We have several opportunities for people to volunteer to help with one ministry or another, "seekers" would be welcome to help out, and several do.
A couple of examples would be our clothing or food give-a-ways.
 
Matthew G said:
I think that, for obvious reasons, the "decision-making staff" (pastors, deacons, etc.) should be only those who are born-again Christians. However, if a non-believer is willing to, say, sing with the worship group in service, or run the sound board, or balance the church's budget, or basically help out the church in any way, I don't think it's right (especially for Christians) to turn away that help because they haven't made it to the same point on their road that we have on ours. You may be turning that soul away from the door-opening "Aha!" that God has in store for them, just because you want to protect your church's image.
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Splendid. I told our director (choir). If we ever make it as a rule to have only born-again musicians in the choir two things will happen: we will lose some talented musicians; some might feel deeply hurt and live the church. Don't be surprised the desperate ones would lie to you that they are born-again.
 
Classik said:
I don't think it was publicly made a rule....was it?
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I don't really know how public it is, but it is our rule.

While we allow anyone to "sing a special", we ask every week if the Lord has laid a song on anyone's heart. One lady will sometimes bring a poem to read.

If someone is part of the team leading the congregation in Worship, we think they should be a professed Christian. If you are going to lead people in praises to our God we feel you should know God on a personal level.

I know others feel differently, It would not cause me to break fellowship to disagree on it. ;)
 
I think anyone that has anything to do with worship service should be born-again.
Outside of that, no.
 
I joined my church before I became a christian. I was new in town and wanted to meet people. In order to make the getting to know people easier for me I asked the people of that church if there's some place for me to volunteer and they found something for me. No spiritual work, but stuff like handing out the songbooks to the service attendands, cleaning up the church room afterwards, toll the church bell before the services (very fun work, we do that mechanically in a real old fashioned way, it's hard and loud physical work. :lol very fun) and doing some office work.
My volunteer work for my church helped to create a bond with my church, even before I really believed in God. And by working there I could see how kind and accepting those people were.
It was a very important step on God's path with me. If they'd turned down my request to volunteer in their chruch..... God only knows what would have happened to my salvation.

Though I agree with everyone else that any leadership or spiritual work should be a "born again" or professed christian.

One sunday during my non christian church volunteer days the pastor asked me if I could help hand out the communion during the service. The way we do it we need like 5 people in addition to the pastor, and on that day he was two helpers short, and in that very moment he probably just didn't remember that I was not a christian. And I didn't want to turn him down and did what I was asked, but I felt very uneasy with it. I felt like I had crossed the treshold of what my church should allow me to do. Thankfully nobody noticed it.
 
Claudya said:
I joined my church before I became a christian. I was new in town and wanted to meet people. In order to make the getting to know people easier for me I asked the people of that church if there's some place for me to volunteer and they found something for me. No spiritual work, but stuff like handing out the songbooks to the service attendands, cleaning up the church room afterwards, toll the church bell before the services (very fun work, we do that mechanically in a real old fashioned way, it's hard and loud physical work. :lol very fun) and doing some office work.
My volunteer work for my church helped to create a bond with my church, even before I really believed in God. And by working there I could see how kind and accepting those people were.
It was a very important step on God's path with me. If they'd turned down my request to volunteer in their chruch..... God only knows what would have happened to my salvation.

Though I agree with everyone else that any leadership or spiritual work should be a "born again" or professed christian.

One sunday during my non christian church volunteer days the pastor asked me if I could help hand out the communion during the service. The way we do it we need like 5 people in addition to the pastor, and on that day he was two helpers short, and in that very moment he probably just didn't remember that I was not a christian. And I didn't want to turn him down and did what I was asked, but I felt very uneasy with it. I felt like I had crossed the treshold of what my church should allow me to do. Thankfully nobody noticed it.
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Claudya:

It's interesting that in the New Testament deacons - the word seems to mean anyone performing some kind of Christian service - have to have spiritual qualifications.

Did you see the thread about Christians owning tattoo parlors? some of these and similar issues were discussed there, too. I guess part of it is, how much should people expect to insulate themselves from unbelievers, especially if some of what they do can be a good witness in any case.

Blessings.
 
Any form of service you do in a church is 100% spiritual, be it sweeping, cleaning, singing etc. None is less spiritual than the other and none is more spiritual than the other. My POV. I will ask a question, a smart one. Should unbelievers and sinners give offering? Isn't that spiritual???;););)
 
Workers in the Church, which is the body of Christ by that of the Holy Spirit, need to be in Christ through that of John 5:3 before they can do any works of the Lord. I'm not saying they need to be perfect as none of us are perfect, but it is by the Holy Spirit working in us and through us that perfects Christ in us and gives us the gifts of Gods Ministry.

John 3:
5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.

1 Corinthians 12:3 Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and that no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost.

Acts 1:
1 The former treatise have I made, O Theophilus, of all that Jesus began both to do and teach,

2 Until the day in which he was taken up, after that he through the Holy Ghost had given commandments unto the apostles whom he had chosen:

3 To whom also he shewed himself alive after his passion by many infallible proofs, being seen of them forty days, and speaking of the things pertaining to the kingdom of God:

4 And, being assembled together with them, commanded them that they should not depart from Jerusalem, but wait for the promise of the Father, which, saith he, ye have heard of me.

5 For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence.

6 When they therefore were come together, they asked of him, saying, Lord, wilt thou at this time restore again the kingdom to Israel?

7 And he said unto them, It is not for you to know the times or the seasons, which the Father hath put in his own power.

8 But ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth.
 
for his glory:

I'm reminded of the verse in the Psalms: 'Except the Lord build the house, they labor in vain that build it; except the Lord keep the city, the watchman waketh but in vain.' (Psalm 127.1).

Blessings.
 
(Amos 5:21) I hate, I despise your feast days, and I will not smell in your solemn assemblies.
(Amos 5:22) Though ye offer me burnt offerings and your meat offerings, I will not accept them: neither will I regard the peace offerings of your fat beasts.
(Amos 5:23) Take thou away from me the noise of thy songs; for I will not hear the melody of thy viols.
(Amos 5:24) But let judgment run down as waters, and righteousness as a mighty stream.

(1 Samuel 15:22) And Samuel said, Hath the LORD as great delight in burnt offerings and sacrifices, as in obeying the voice of the LORD? Behold, to obey is better than sacrifice, and to hearken than the fat of rams.

The unbeliever might make an "offering" and it may be put to use in Kingdom work, but spiritually they are still bankrupt without Christ.
 
seagullplayer said:
The unbeliever might make an "offering" and it may be put to use in Kingdom work, but spiritually they are still bankrupt without Christ.
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Yes - they need Christ. They sure do. Not long ago an alcoholic entered a church to worship God and pray with the people. (I witnessed it). One of the leaders noticing he was drunk rebuked him and tried kicking him out of the environment. He resisted the leader. Few people gathered...the guy told them the reason he came. He said: I came to see if I could be saved in this church..
 
I think that every church worker should be born again. I know a janitor who led someone to the Lord when she answered the phone after everone had gone home. I also know a soloist who was not born again but represented the church when she sang before it. Her body language was not
the best. I was embarassed. If the unbelievers are seen outside of a church setting say, smoking pot, what kind of an influence is this?
Our church watches new believers for a year before they allow them to minister in the church, and new members as well. Among other things, they wait for them to demonstrate their willngness to be servents as well as to first demonstrate their gifts outside the church. They might start a successful home bible study on their own. Or they might start witnessing at the county fair on their own.
 
Carolyn said:
I think that every church worker should be born again. I know a janitor who led someone to the Lord when she answered the phone after everone had gone home. I also know a soloist who was not born again but represented the church when she sang before it. Her body language was notthe best. I was embarassed. If the unbelievers are seen outside of a church setting say, smoking pot, what kind of an influence is this? Our church watches new believers for a year before they allow them to minister in the church, and new members as well. Among other things, they wait for them to demonstrate their willngness to be servents as well as to first demonstrate their gifts outside the church. They might start a successful home bible study on their own. Or they might start witnessing at the county fair on their own.
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Goodness! That's ok.
 
Classik said:
Who and who should be workers in a church? Only born-again Christians?

We have such departments as: Ushering, Choir, youth leaders etc. There's a church I know that emphasises that all workers must be born-again. How fair is this? I am of the opinion (one of the days I tried defending the choir) that we use the talented bests. The best might be a mixture born-again and people who have not yet made peace with God. I think God will touch them one day.

What do you think?
Click to expand...

I would ask, "Who in our church is qualified to judge whether another is born again?" I certainly wouldn't want that responsibility.
 
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