Is believing/faith a work ?

[rogerg]

Agreed.
The gift is His graceful kindness and deliverance, not our faith.

[Eph 2:8 KJV] 8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: [it is] the gift of God:

I think the gift is God - by whom are grace and faith

 

[JLB]

I answered with an exegetical answer. If you don't believe me, please provide an exegetical answer to refute my answer.

Bye,
Oz

No you didn’t, your referred to someone else’s opinion, their commentary, now you want to pass it off as your own.


You cant even answer a simple question. Sad.


I want to hear what you yourself believe, not what someone's commentary teaches.

For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God. Ephesians 2:8


Does Faith come from God?

Is faith a gift from God or do we earn it?




JLB

 

[JLB]

All my sin was remitted at my death and burial; and I was raised with Christ to walk in newness of life.

You won’t be resurrected until you die, and Christ returns.


That occurs on the last day.





JLB

 

[Hopeful]

Did you bother to read what I wrote?

Yes, I did.

The death and resurrection mentioned in Romans 6, contextually refers to Christ, not us. We do not die and are resurrected from the dead at water baptism.

And by water baptism, we are immersed into it.

Or do you not know that as many of us as were baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into His death? Therefore we were buried with Him through baptism into death, that just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life. Romans 6:3-4

You keep printing the words and then turn around and deny it actually happens???

Paul is teaching us is the death of Christ, not our “literal” death.

If we are "immersed" into that death, burial, and raised with Christ to walk in newness of life...we can walk in newness of life.

• Or do you not know that as many of us as were baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into His death?

The death that is spoken of here is His death, not our death.

By our "immersion" into it, it is our death too.

• Therefore we were buried with Him through baptism into death, that just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.

How is a life with sin still in it any kind of "newness of life" ?

You are putting new wine in old bottles. (Matt 9:16-17)

 

[Hopeful]

You won’t be resurrected until you die, and Christ returns.
That occurs on the last day.

My vessel will be raised on the last day, but I have already been "raised with Christ to walk in newness of life". (Rom 6:4)
I am now a new creature, re-born of the seed of God. (1 John 3:9)
God's seed cannot bring forth evil fruit.

 

[JLB]

And by water baptism, we are immersed into it.

That’s a far cry from your claim that our physical body literally dies and is resurrected sinless, at water baptism.






JLB

 

[OzSpen]

Agreed.
The gift is His graceful kindness and deliverance, not our faith.

The "it" is salvation.

Come on bro,

You quoted someone's commentary.


Please just answer the simple commonsense straightforward questions.

I want to hear what you yourself believe, not what someone's commentary teaches.

For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God. Ephesians 2:8


Does Faith come from God?

Is faith a gift from God or do we earn it?




JLB

JLB,

Why don't you accept God's gift of a teacher whom I quoted? You are denigrating God's gift. Why should I listen to you, a teacher, and not the teacher whom I quoted, one of the greatest Greek exegetes of all time, Dr A T Robertson?

Oz

 

[JLB]

How is a life with sin still in it any kind of "newness of life" ?

Because my true life resides in my inner man which is eternal, as opposed to my physical body which is temporary.


My spirit was born again not my physical body.






JLB

 

[OzSpen]

[Eph 2:8 KJV] 8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: [it is] the gift of God:

I think the gift is God - by whom are grace and faith

You've added to Scripture. What you said here is not in the Bible.

 

[JLB]

Why don't you accept God's gift of a teacher whom I quoted? You are denigrating God's gift. Why should I listen to you, a teacher, and not the teacher whom I quoted, one of the greatest of all time, Dr A T Robertson?

That’s nonsense.


You inserted yourself into my discussion and decided to correct me by saying faith isn’t a gift from God, by quoting one of the many scholars you follow.


As I said, I would like to know what you believe.


For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God. Ephesians 2:8


Does Faith come from God? My answer is yes.

Is faith a gift from God or do we earn it? Yes, faith is a gift from God.


Would you care to answer?





JLB

 

[Hopeful]

That’s a far cry from your claim that our physical body literally dies and is resurrected sinless, at water baptism.

I don't see why.
We take part in the death.
We take part in the burial.
And we take part in the resurrection...of Christ.

 

[Hopeful]

The "it" is salvation.

"For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:" (Eph 2:8)
"IT" could be numerous things.
But in that verse, the noun is grace.

 

[Hopeful]

Because my true life resides in my inner man which is eternal, as opposed to my physical body which is temporary.
My spirit was born again not my physical body.

Will the Holy Spirit reside in a polluted temple?
Will you put new wine in an old bottle?

 

[Hopeful]

Because my true life resides in my inner man which is eternal, as opposed to my physical body which is temporary.


My spirit was born again not my physical body.

It is written..."But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you." (Rom 8:11)
What is quickened (made alive) ?
Your body.
Why?
Because it was dead.

 

[OzSpen]

"For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:" (Eph 2:8)
"IT" could be numerous things.
But in that verse, the noun is grace.

No, the nouns are grace, faith and it. The grammar indicates "it" refers to the phrases "For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves." "It" cannot refer to numerous things. it refers to the antecedent.

Oz

 

[rogerg]

You've added to Scripture. What you said here is not in the Bible.

Added? I have? I definitely don't want that. But you've kind of lost me there. Since the verse says "it is the gift of God", and especially since grace, salvation, and faith were not of/by the Ephesians ("and that not of yourselves"), then logically speaking, those would have had to come from/by/with God, making Him the gift, right?
Is there another possibility?
Please clarify because I'm not seeing it and I'd really like to understand that- thanks

 

[OzSpen]

Added? I have? I definitely don't want that. But you've kind of lost me there. Since the verse says "it is the gift of God", and especially since grace, salvation, and faith were not of/by the Ephesians ("and that not of yourselves"), then logically speaking, those would have had to come from/by/with God, making Him the gift, right?
Is there another possibility?
Please clarify because I'm not seeing it and I'd really like to understand that- thanks

Roger,

What is the "it" that is a gift of God according to Eph 2:8-9, based on the grammar?

Oz

 

[JLB]

I don't see why.
We take part in the death.
We take part in the burial.
And we take part in the resurrection...of Christ.

My point is we don't literally die and are literally resurrected from the dead, so that we have sinless bodies.


Our bodies still contain sin and we must by the Spirit, put to death the sinful deeds that our mortal body desires to do.

For if you live according to the flesh you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the deeds of the body, you will live.
Romans 8:12



JLB

 

[brightfame52]

Absolutely, brightfame52 - IMHO, well done. Christ alone is the Saviour. As Savior, His faith (Christ's faithfulness and obedience to the Father's will) brings forth salvation; from that is our faith given us by God as a gift. As a gift, it is not earned nor is it of (our) doing.
So, in a sense, there are two faiths: 1) Christ's faith to the Father which is the faith that saves us; and, 2) the faith that God imparts within those He saves, which is from being saved. Many people do not understand the distinction between the two, and thereby confuse the respective attributes of each, perceiving them as being of one.

[Jhn
6:29 KJV] 29 Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.
[1Pe 1:21, 23 KJV]
21 Who by him do believe in God, that raised him up from the dead, and gave him glory; that your faith and hope might be in God. ...
23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

I think we are in agreement here on this very important point.

 

[rogerg]

I think we are in agreement here on this very important point.

Yes, I definitely agree