1/3 shall die - Non-Christians will die

[TOG]

perhaps, but if just TEN PEOPLE RIGHTEOUS , 10, 1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1, that's all,
had been in Lot's town,
Yhwh would have spared it for those TEN, only TEN people righteous. i.e. not even 1/2% !

so it may be very very very optimistic to expect even 3% of the world's population are any better than they were in sodom and gomorrah, or in Noah's day,
BOTH OF which Jesus said the last days would be like.

I get your point, but I'm curious. You say it was less than 1/2%. Where does it say how many people there were in Sodom?

The TOG​

 

[follower]

I get your point, but I'm curious. You say it was less than 1/2%. Where does it say how many people there were in Sodom?

The TOG​

http://www.aish.com/ci/sam/48931527.html

 

[jasonc]

http://www.aish.com/ci/sam/48931527.html

you are using a Chassidic source?

 

[follower]

I don't know what a Chassidic source is, or where it is. Why do you ask ?

 

[jasonc]

I don't know what a Chassidic source is, or where it is. Why do you ask ?

because its orthodox jewish. they are quoting the Talmud. I doesn't bother me but one cant use Talmudic sources and not call it doctrine if nothing in the bible supports that.

 

[follower]

since when did a population of a historic site become "doctrine" !?

 

[jasonc]

since when did a population of a historic site become "doctrine" !?

you claimed that. that is an estimation at best. seem to hold. 1.5 million. an estimate.you also then claimed beacause of jesus's statement that it would be less then 10% of the population based on that estimate.. there is a problem with that. see one peter 3 on those souls in the flood that died and were in sheol. what happened to them? why would jesus preach to the lost in a judgement. so that means more then just 8 made it in the end.

 

[YogiD2]

war an loss affects christians, an non christians alike

 

[jasonc]

you claimed that. that is an estimation at best. seem to hold. 1.5 million. an estimate.you also then claimed beacause of jesus's statement that it would be less then 10% of the population based on that estimate.. there is a problem with that. see one peter 3 on those souls in the flood that died and were in sheol. what happened to them? why would jesus preach to the lost in a judgement. so that means more then just 8 made it in the end.

but here is the killer in 52 years a city starts up and builds up 500k in that time?

Numeira, on the other hand, existed for a very short span of time, certainly less than 100 years. The Talmud (Babylonian Talmud Shabbos 11a) says that Sodom existed for a mere 52 years. This would make Numeira a likely candidate for Sodom

that is one busy group of couples then and moses never mentions that Sodom and gommorah were cities to be desired. wealthy yes but Egypt's land was far more fertile then that.

then this

If, as the Talmud records, traveling into the area of Sodom and Gomorrah was sharply curtailed -- forbidden, or at least discouraged -- the introduction of outside styles of pottery and metal working would seriously fall behind the style and techniques of the more advanced Egyptians. How far the Cities of the Plain would have straggled is unknown. We must be patient and await further evidence to emerge

you are in short basing evidence on a possible place.likley but caution is adivced.

 

[DRS81]

1 Thessalonians 5:9
Revelation 3:10
These verses tell me I will not experience the tribulation.But you can read them for whatever purpose you wish.

But that's based on ignorance. Christians have been dying from persecution and tribulation all around the world for 2,000 + years, but God is going to protect Kathi? What makes you so special.

 

[Kathi]

But that's based on ignorance. Christians have been dying from persecution and tribulation all around the world for 2,000 + years, but God is going to protect Kathi? What makes you so special.

What makes me so special?I am a Saint.Just like all the other born again believers in this world.I am a child of God.I think that makes me pretty special and so does Christ.

 

[follower]

But that's based on ignorance. Christians have been dying from persecution and tribulation all around the world for 2,000 + years, but God is going to protect Kathi? What makes you so special.

What makes me so special?I am a Saint.Just like all the other born again believers in this world.I am a child of God.I think that makes me pretty special and so does Christ.

Yhwh says that everyone immersed in Yeshua is special, in many different ways.
Particularly that Yeshua died and rose again, and bought them with His shed blood.
Yeshua also said that His followers will suffer as He did, and it's repeated several times throughout the Scriptures.
His followers are not afraid of death, nor of the enemy, nor of man, but only of Yhwh.
So even all of His followers who are martyred are not at all afraid, as they are already "dead and their life is hid with Christ in Yhwh" according to Scripture.
somewhere as it also says something like 'death, where is your sting?' etc ....

so even if there is no rapture, there is no fear, and Yhwh calls His true followers special - even also set apart, holy, righteous(in Christ Jesus), and they (we) obey Him.

 

[John S]

What makes me so special?I am a Saint.Just like all the other born again believers in this world.I am a child of God.I think that makes me pretty special and so does Christ.

As I have said before, NO ONE is "special'. That is the basis of Satan's deception to think that they are special. There will NOT be a Pre-Trib Rapture.

 

[Sinthesis]

Unfortunately the OP omits exactly what verses are used to support the contention that the 1/3 which die are Non-Christians. Depending on the context, in at least one biblical instance a 1st/3rd die who are in fact only Christians, where death refers to the exclusive Christian concept of 'dying to self' and raised to new life in Jesus. Then we can identify who the 2nd/3rd and 3rd/3rd groups of the chosen population are.

 

[follower]

being purchased by the blood of the Messiah, the Perfect Lamb of Yhwh, Creator born of man! ... now that is special! (but not any merit to the believer, no, all sheer grace in the faithfulness of Yeshua) ...
allowed to be beaten - share His suffering - now that is special! (rare and true faith,on the narrow way to salvation)

Acts 5:40-42J.B. Phillips New Testament (PHILLIPS)
40-42 They accepted his advice and called in the apostles. They had them beaten and after commanding them not to speak in the name of Jesus they let them go. So the apostles went out from the presence of the Sanhedrin full of joy that they had been considered worthy to bear humiliation for the sake of the name. Then day after day in the Temple and in people’s houses they continued to teach unceasingly and to proclaim the good news of Jesus Christ.

1 Peter 4:12-13Complete Jewish Bible (CJB)
12 Dear friends, don’t regard as strange the fiery ordeal occurring among you to test you, as if something extraordinary were happening to you. 13 Rather, to the extent that you share the fellowship of the Messiah’s sufferings, rejoice; so that you will rejoice even more when his Sh’khinah is revealed.


1 Peter 4:12-13Amplified Bible (AMP)
12 Beloved, do not be amazed and bewildered at the fiery ordeal which is taking place to test your quality, as though something strange (unusual and alien to you and your position) were befalling you.13 But insofar as you are sharing Christ’s sufferings, rejoice, so that when His glory [full of radiance and splendor] is revealed, you may also rejoice with triumph [exultantly].

 

[follower]

Unfortunately the OP omits exactly what verses ......

Revelation 9:14-21J.B. Phillips New Testament (PHILLIPS)
The sixth trumpet: the destroying angels
13-14 Then the sixth angel blew his trumpet, and I heard a solitary voice speaking from the four corners of the golden altar that stands in the presence of God. And it said to the sixth angel who held the trumpet, “Release the four angels who are bound at the great river Euphrates!”

15 Then these four angels who had been held ready for the hour, the day, the month and the year, were set free to kill a third-part of all mankind.

16-19 The number of their horsemen was two hundred million—I heard what their number was. In my vision I saw these horses and their riders, and their breastplates were fiery-red, blue and yellow. The horses’ heads looked to me like the heads of lions, and out of their mouths poured fire and smoke and sulphur. A third of all mankind died from the fearful effects of these three, the fire, the smoke and the sulphur which pours out of their mouths. For the power of these horses lies in their mouths and in their tails. Indeed their tails are like serpents with heads, and with these they inflict injury.

20-21 The rest of mankind, who did not die in this fearful destruction, neither repented of the works of their own hands nor ceased to worship evil powers and idols of gold, silver, brass, stone or wood, which can neither see nor hear nor move. Neither did they repent of their murders, their sorceries, their sexual sins, nor of their thieving.

 

[Sinthesis]

But that's based on ignorance. Christians have been dying from persecution and tribulation all around the world for 2,000 + years, but God is going to protect Kathi? What makes you so special.

What makes me so special?I am a Saint.Just like all the other born again believers in this world.I am a child of God.I think that makes me pretty special and so does Christ.

As I have said before, NO ONE is "special'. That is the basis of Satan's deception to think that they are special. There will NOT be a Pre-Trib Rapture.

The problem with 'special' is it can lead to erroneous expectations of entitlement which, if not fulfilled by God, can lead to indignation, and in the case of Genesis 4, even murder.

 

[Sinthesis]

Revelation 9:14-21J.B. Phillips New Testament (PHILLIPS)
The sixth trumpet: the destroying angels
13-14 Then the sixth angel blew his trumpet, and I heard a solitary voice speaking from the four corners of the golden altar that stands in the presence of God. And it said to the sixth angel who held the trumpet, “Release the four angels who are bound at the great river Euphrates!”

15 Then these four angels who had been held ready for the hour, the day, the month and the year, were set free to kill a third-part of all mankind.

16-19 The number of their horsemen was two hundred million—I heard what their number was. In my vision I saw these horses and their riders, and their breastplates were fiery-red, blue and yellow. The horses’ heads looked to me like the heads of lions, and out of their mouths poured fire and smoke and sulphur. A third of all mankind died from the fearful effects of these three, the fire, the smoke and the sulphur which pours out of their mouths. For the power of these horses lies in their mouths and in their tails. Indeed their tails are like serpents with heads, and with these they inflict injury.

20-21 The rest of mankind, who did not die in this fearful destruction, neither repented of the works of their own hands nor ceased to worship evil powers and idols of gold, silver, brass, stone or wood, which can neither see nor hear nor move. Neither did they repent of their murders, their sorceries, their sexual sins, nor of their thieving.

Those are not the only biblical verses which divide a population into thirds.

 

[follower]

The problem with 'special' is it can lead to erroneous expectations of entitlement which, if not fulfilled by God, can lead to indignation, and in the case of Genesis 4, even murder.

true, but the special ones of Yhwh are also humble, so don't have to worry about what others think.

 

[follower]

Those are not the only biblical verses which divide a population into thirds.

so ?