7th day adventist. Are they a cult?

[SputnikBoy]

You're obsessed with the cult thing, Solo. I responded to Oscar's post concerning coffee and tea drinking and how that has no bearing on my life. You will also note that in the last paragraph of my post I stated quite categorically that I DON'T LIVE MY LIFE BY A SET OF DENOMINATIONAL RULES.

By the way, are your derogatory and sarcastic remarks prompted by the Holy Spirit or are they intended to somehow make you look clever?

 

[guibox]

You're obsessed with the cult thing, Solo. I responded to Oscar's post concerning coffee and tea drinking and how that has no bearing on my life. You will also note that in the last paragraph of my post I stated quite categorically that I DON'T LIVE MY LIFE BY A SET OF DENOMINATIONAL RULES.

By the way, are your derogatory and sarcastic remarks prompted by the Holy Spirit or are they intended to somehow make you look clever?

SB, I'm telling you that the ignore button is a wonderful thing. I have been freed from looking at Solo's posts and it is quite wonderful. Try it.

 

[Solo]

By the way, are your derogatory and sarcastic remarks prompted by the Holy Spirit or are they intended to somehow make you look clever?

Humor sputnik, humor. Of course you SDA types do not have a clue, do ya?! By the way, were you an SDA in Chanute?

 

[Solo]

SB, I'm telling you that the ignore button is a wonderful thing. I have been freed from looking at Solo's posts and it is quite wonderful. Try it.

You are going to still be accountable for your cultic practices even though you put your head in the sand!

 

[Oscar3]

Hoja de Datos sobre Ellen G. White
Por Dan Corner

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

En los círculos Adventistas del Séptimo Día (ASD), una visión que Ellen G. White (EGW) tuvo en 1847 es importante para su exaltación del mandamiento del Sabbath: (EGW es considereda una profetisa inspirada entre los ASD.)

Sentimos un espíritu de oración fuera de lo común. Y mientras orábamos, el Espíritu Santo vino sobre nosotros. Estábamos tan felices. De repente, me perdí de las cosas terrenales y me envolvió una visión de la gloria de Dios. Vi un angel volando rápidamente hacia mí. Velozmente me cargó y me llevó de la tierra a la Santa Ciudad. En la ciudad vi un templo, al cual entré. Pasé por una puerta antes de Ilegar al primer velo. Este velo estaba levantado, y pasé al lugar santo. Allí vi el altar de incienso, el candelero con las siete lámparas, y la mesa en la que estaba el pan sin levadura. Después de ver la gloria del lugar santo, Jesús levantó el segundo velo y pasé al lugar santísimo.
En el lugar santísimo vi un arca; la tapa y los lados eran del más puro oro. En cada extremo del arca había un adorable querubín, con sus alas extendidas sobre el mismo. Sus rostros estaban de frente el uno del otro, y miraban hacia abajo. Entre los ángeles había un incensario dorado. Sobre el arca, en donde estaban los ángeles, había una extremadamente brillante gloria, que parecía como un trono en el que Dios habitaba. Jesús estaba parado al lado del arca, y según llegaban a El las oraciones de los santos, el incienso en el incensario echaba humo, y El ofrecía las oraciones con el humo del incienso a Su Padre. En el arca estaba la vasija dorada con el maná, la vara de Arón que había germinado, y las tablas de piedra dobladas y juntas, como un libro. Jesús las abrió, y vi los diez mandamientos escritos en ellas por el dedo de Dios. En una tabla había cuatro, y en la otra seis. Los cuatro de la primera tabla brillaban más que los otros seis. Pero el cuarto, el mandamiento del Sabbath, resplandecía sobre todos los demás; porque el Sabbath fue apartado para ser guardado en honor al sagrado nombre de Dios. El sagrado Sabbath se veía glorioso -- un halo de gloria lo rodeaba. Yo vi que el mandamiento del Sabbath no estaba clavado en la cruz. Si lo estuviera, los otros nueve mandamientos también; y nosotros estaríamos en la libertad de quebrantarlos todos, igual que quebrantamos el cuarto. Yo vi que Dios no había cambiado el Sabbath, porque El nunca cambia. Pero el Papa lo había cambiado del séptimo día al primer día de la semana; porque estaba para cambiar los tiempos y las leyes ....
Yo vi que el santo Sabbath es, y será, la pared divisoria entre el verdadero Israel de Dios y los no creyentes; y que el Sabbath es la gran pregunta para unir los corazones de los queridos santos de Dios que esperan. (Primeros Escritos, 1963, pp. 32,33).
El significado resumido de esta visión de EGW es el siguiente:
En esta revelación, la Sra. White fue llevada a los tiempos del fin y vio que el Sabbath era la gran prueba de la verdad sobre la cual los hombres deciden si le sirven a Dios o le sirven a un poder apóstata (Primeros Escritos, pp. XXI, XXII).
¡Pero Juan no vio ningún templo!
Varios puntos importantes deben mencionarse acerca de esta visión clave de EGW: (1) Ella tuvo esta visión de la Santa Ciudad y estableció que vio un templo allí. En contraste, el Apóstol Juan vio la Santa Ciudad y estableció que no había ningún templo:

Y no vi en ella templo, porque el Señor Todopoderoso es el templo de ella, y el Cordero (Apoc. 21:22).
¡El Apóstol Juan nos informa que no hay ningún templo en la Santa Ciudad, en donde EGW alega haber visto uno! Observe: aunque leemos acerca de un "templo" en Apocalipsis (7:15; 11:1; 11:19; 14:15,17; 15:5-8; 16:1,17) el mismo no se encuentra dentro de la Santa Ciudad, porque el Apóstol Juan dijo que no se necesitaba, porque el Cordero y Dios son su templo. Si no hay ningún templo en la Santa Ciudad, de acuerdo a las Escrituras, uno debe preguntarse: (1) ¿Tuvo EGW realmente esta visión? (2) Si en verdad tuvo esa visión, no pudo haber provenido de la misma fuente espiritual que la visión de Juan, ya que el Apóstol Juan dijo que allí no se necesitaba un templo. Esta sola contradicción, centrada alrrededor del templo en la Nueva Jerusalem, es suficiente para desacreditar el ministerio profético completo de EGW. Esto es verdad porque un verdadero profeta no puede contradecir la Palabra escrita de Dios. Pero aún hay otras cosas que observar en esa misma visión. EGW estableció en esa misma visión:
... el Sabbath fue apartado para guardarse en honor al santo nombre de Dios.
De nuevo, la Escritura declara algo diferente acerca del Sabbath:
Acuérdate que fuiste siervo en tierra de Egipto y que el Señor tu Dios te sacó de allá con mano fuerte y brazo extendido; por lo cual el Señor tu Dios te ha mandado que guardes el día de reposo (Sabbath) (Deut. 5:15).
La Escritura establece que el mandamiento del Sabbath fue dado a Misés como un día de fiesta para que Israel recordara su liberación de Egipto. No fue dado en honor del Santo nombre de Dios. También, EGW exaltó el mandamiento del Sabbath como el más importante:
Yo vi que el santo Sabbath es, y será, la pared divisoria entre el verdadero Israel de Dios y los no creyentes; y que el Sabbath es la gran pregunta para unir los corazones de los amados santos, siervos de Dios que esperan (Primeros Escritos, p. 33).
¿Cuál es el "Mayor" Mandamiento?
En una visión diferente, EGW estableció que el Sabbath es el "mayor" de los diez mandamientos:

El Papa ha cambiado el día de reposo del séptimo al primer día. El ha pensado en cambiar aún el mismo mandamiento que nos fue dado para hacer se acuerde de su Creador. El ha pensado cambiar el mayor mandamiento en el decálogo y así hacerse él mismo igual a Dios, o aún exaltarse por encima de Dios (Primeros Escritos, p. 65).
En contraste, el mismo Señor Jesús nos dice algo diferente acerca del "mayor" mandamiento:
"Maestro, ¿cuál es el gran mandamiento en la Ley?" Jesús le dijo: "Amarás al Señor tu Dios con todo tu corazón, y con toda tu alma, y con toda tu mente.' Este es el primero y grande mandamiento. Y el segundo es semejante: 'Amarás a tu prójimo como a ti mismo.' De estos dos mandamientos depende toda la Ley y los Profetas (Mt. 22:36-40).
Cuando a Jesús se le hizo la pregunta anterior, hubiera sido el momento perfecto para El establecer que el mandamiento del Sabbath era el mayor, si así lo fuera. ¡Sin embargo, no sólo no dijo eso, sino que el Señor claramente estableció que el (primero y) gran mandamiento era otro! Así que de nuevo, en contraste al mensaje de Dios, E. G. White ha declarado claramente algo diferente. Esto es exactamente lo opuesto a cómo sus visiones proféticas son presentadas:
... Ellen White recibió una luz que ha ayudado a explicar su dificultad y abrió el camino para que su estudio continúe. Las visiones también colocaron el sello de la aprobación de Dios sobre conclusiones correctas. Así, el don profético actuó como un corrector de error y un confirmador de la verdad (Primeros Escritos, pp. XXIII, XXIV).
Los que reciben lamarca de la Bestia

For the rest of the story click here.
http://www.evangelicaloutreach.org/whites.htm

 

[Jay T]

You're obsessed with the cult thing, Solo. I responded to Oscar's post concerning coffee and tea drinking and how that has no bearing on my life. You will also note that in the last paragraph of my post I stated quite categorically that I DON'T LIVE MY LIFE BY A SET OF DENOMINATIONAL RULES.

By the way, are your derogatory and sarcastic remarks prompted by the Holy Spirit or are they intended to somehow make you look clever?

Please realize that Solo and Oscar fall into those that hate God's people (Revelation 12:17).

Otherwise.....

 

[Judy]

Please realize that Solo and Oscar fall into those that hate God's people (Revelation 12:17).

Otherwise.....

Quite the contrary!! :-?

 

[SputnikBoy]

Humor sputnik, humor. Of course you SDA types do not have a clue, do ya?! By the way, were you an SDA in Chanute?

Hmmm . . .where did Chanute spring up from? I guess I must have mentioned that town in Kansas way back on the forum some place.

Anyway, no, I had no affiliation with any religion or Christian denomination while in Chanute. Common sense and logic had me always believing in a Creator but the Bible itself did nothing for me. While the wife and I DID express an interest in Christianity I also found the attitudes and the behavior of some Christians to be somewhat wanting. I still do, by the way.

 

[Solo]

Hmmm . . .where did Chanute spring up from? I guess I must have mentioned that town in Kansas way back on the forum some place.

Anyway, no, I had no affiliation with any religion or Christian denomination while in Chanute. Common sense and logic had me always believing in a Creator but the Bible itself did nothing for me. While the wife and I DID express an interest in Christianity I also found the attitudes and the behavior of some Christians to be somewhat wanting. I still do, by the way.

Did you and your wife become born again believers in the SDA church in Australia? How did you become acquainted with the Seventh-day Adventist church?

 

[SputnikBoy]

Did you and your wife become born again believers in the SDA church in Australia? How did you become acquainted with the Seventh-day Adventist church?

Sadly, my wife returned to the U.S. two years after our arrival in Australia. Long story. That was in 1982. I had no interest in Christianity until 1988 when I decided that I needed to make a change in my life. As well as being a solo parent to 11 year-old Charley I was also working then as a solo musician on Hamilton Island in the beautiful Whitsundays in Nth Queensland. I studied with an SDA pastor and found the SDA message to be pretty sound and consistent with the Bible.

I've questioned the Adventist doctrines a number of times and I still do at times if I find it necessary. Ellen White has never figured in my life at all though I'm sure she was a godly woman. She also appears to have been a human being with human failings ...just like me. In all fairness to other SDAs on the forum ...I must confess to being somewhat 'radical' and don't necessarily fit the Adventist image ...whatever some might perceive that to be. But then, I'm generally 'undisciplined' or unauthodox by nature.

 

[Lewis]

The Clear Word Bible: Is It the Word of God?

I must admity I am :o at what I am learning here.
Check out some comparisons of the SDA bible and a KJV

Genesis 2:2-3
KJV - And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made. And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

CW - Then on the seventh day of creation week, God stopped to enjoy what He had made and to rest in the beauty of it all. So He blessed the seventh day and set it apart as a day of spiritual refreshment and joy.

Note - The CW makes the seventh day part of "creation week" rather than the celebration of a finished creation.
Exodus 5:5
KJV -And Pharaoh said, Behold, the people of the land now are many, and ye make them rest from their burdens.

CW - You've created enough problems by making them rest every week on your Sabbath.

Note - The CW describes the rest as occurring every week on the Sabbath, whereas in reality Moses requested an isolated three day period in which the Israelites could worship God (see verse 3 in the KJV).
Exodus 16:5
KJV - And it shall come to pass, that on the sixth day they shall prepare that which they bring in; and it shall be twice as much as they gather daily.

CW - On the sixth day they should gather twice as much as on the other days so as to have enough for the seventh day, which is the Sabbath, the day I set aside for worship and rest.

Note - The addition "which is the Sabbath, the day I set aside for worship and rest," does not appear in any biblical manuscript.
Exodus 31:13-14, 16
KJV -Speak thou also unto the children of Israel, saying, Verily my sabbaths ye shall keep: for it is a sign between me and you throughout your generations; that ye may know that I am the LORD that doth sanctify you. Ye shall keep the sabbath therefore; for it is holy unto you: every one that defileth it shall surely be put to death: for whosoever doeth any work therein, that soul shall be cut off from among his people ...Wherefore the children of Israel shall keep the sabbath, to observe the sabbath throughout their generations, for a perpetual covenant.

CW - Say to the people, "Most importantly, remember to keep the Sabbath holy because it is a very special day for me, and it's a day of rest for you. It's a sign between you and me for all time to show that you are the people whom I have chosen and set apart. The Sabbath is holy and anyone who desecrates it by working on that day will be put to death, since that would be an act of treason against God's government. My people are to keep the Sabbath, celebrating it as a sign that they belong to me."

Note - The CW purposefully revises the text to make it appear that the Sabbath is intended for all people, not just for Israel, as the Bible teaches. In verse 13 it changes "children of Israel" to "people" and in verse 16 it changes "children of Israel" to "My people," and "a perpetual covenant" to "a sign that they belong to Me." To justify making the Sabbath observance a universal requirement it also adds, "Since that would be treason against God's government to verse 14.
Leviticus 23:3
KJV - Six days shall work be done: but the seventh day is the sabbath of rest, an holy convocation; ye shall do no work therein: it is the sabbath of the LORD in all your dwellings.

CW - There has always been the weekly Sabbath.

Note - The CW replaces the biblical institution of the Sabbath with the statement that the Sabbath has always existed.
Ezekiel 45:17
KJV - And it shall be the prince's part to give burnt offerings, and meat offerings, and drink offerings, in the feasts, and in the new moons, and in the sabbaths, in all solemnities of the house of Israel: he shall prepare the sin offering, and the meat offering, and the burnt offering, and the peace offerings, to make reconciliation for the house of Israel.

CW - It will be his duty to provide these national offerings on all appointed festivals with their special Sabbaths, including the monthly festival of the New Moon. He is to bring grain offerings, whole burnt offerings and peace offerings for an atonement for the nation as a whole.

Note - The "feasts," "new moons," and "sabbaths" respectively signify the yearly, monthly, and weekly celebrations. The phrase is a virtual formula used in numerous places in the Old Testament in both ascending and descending order. In order to prevent the weekly sabbath from being associated with the whole sacrificial system done away with by the New Covenant, the CW destroys the word order to make sabbaths refer to the yearly feasts instead of the weekly.
Acts 20:7
KJV -And upon the first day of the week, when the disciples came together to break bread, Paul preached unto them, ready to depart on the morrow; and continued his speech until midnight.

CW - After sundown on Saturday night, the believers got together for a fellowship meal and to say good-by to Paul. That evening he spoke to them until midnight, after which he hoped to get a few hours sleep before leaving early Sunday morning.

Note - The CW calls this a Saturday night meeting, changes "break bread", a term used by the early church for communion, to a fellowship meal and to say good-by to Paul. Such revision of Scripture completely changes the focus of this verse to fit Adventist theology.

Colossians 2:16
KJV - Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days.

CW - Don't let anyone control you life by giving you a set of ceremonial rules about what to eat, what to drink and what monthly festivals or special Sabbaths to keep. All these rules were given as a shadow of the reality to come and that reality is Jesus Christ.

Note - Colossians 2:16 is a very important verse in that it shows clearly that the Seventh-day Sabbath is only a shadow of Christ. This verse should be studied in its context and also compared to its Old Testament parallel, Ezekiel 45:17 (above) When the terms "festival (or equivalent), new moons and Sabbaths are used together in the Old Testament the word Sabbath always refers to the seventh-day Sabbath. Also, these terms are usually used in either ascending or descending sequence: festival (yearly) new moons (monthly) Sabbaths (weekly) or Sabbaths (weekly), new moons (monthly), festivals (yearly).

These two well established patterns make it certain that the seventh-day Sabbath is in view in Colossians 2:16 and this fact undermines the whole SDA emphasis on the seventh-day Sabbath. Note how the CB alters both Colossians 2:16 as well as the Old Testament parallel text.
Hebrews 4:4
KJV -For he spake in a certain place of the seventh day on this wise, And God did rest the seventh day from all his works.

CW - That's why at creation He gave man the seventh-day Sabbath, not only as a reminder of creation week, but also as a symbol of spiritual rest. According to the Scriptures, God Himself rested on the seventh day and enjoyed this special time with man.

Note - The CW states "according to the Scriptures," but then adds to the Scriptures such phrases as the "symbol of spiritual rest" and the "special time with man."
Hebrews 4:9
KJV -There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God.

CW - So there still remains the offer of spiritual rest that God intends for each generation to have, of which the Sabbath is a symbol.

Note - The biblical manuscripts make no reference in this verse to spiritual rest or the Sabbath as a symbol.5
Revelation 1:10
KJV - I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day.

CW - On Sabbath morning when I had gone to the rocky island shore to meditate and worship.

Note - The CW adds the concluding clause to reinforce Adventist liturgical practices.

One can see by the examples listed above that The Clear Word Bible makes numerous deletions and additions, revising the Word of God to make the Bible teach what it does not teach: the Adventist doctrine of required universal observance of the seventh-day Sabbath for all peoples.
Death and Hell
Adventists, like Jehovah Witnesses, believe in soul sleep and do not believe in hell. Note how they have changed the word of God to fit their theology.

Isaiah 66:24
KJV - And they shall go forth, and look upon the carcases of the men that have transgressed against me: for their worm shall not die, neither shall their fire be quenched; and they shall be an abhorring unto all flesh.

CW - They will see the dead bodies of those who have rebelled against me lying outside the city. It will be an abhorrent sight. But just as worms don't stop until they devour the dead and fire doesn't stop until it destroys, so the fires of the Lord will destroy the wicked and consume them all.

Note - Christ quotes this verse on several occasions. Never, however, does He give this interpretation. Rather, He uses it as a description of hell.6 A similar change can be seen in Matthew 5:22, 29, 30, where the CW changes "hell fire" to "lose eternal life".
Matthew 10:28
KJV -And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

CW - Don't be afraid that you might be killed. They can kill your body but not your spirit or your loyalty to me. Now if there is some thing to be concerned about, it's that you don't lose your faith in God.

Note - The CW deletes the segment referring to eternal damnation, and instead alter the text to make it solely an exhortation to retain one's faith in God.
Matthew 18:9
KJV -And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: it is better for thee to enter into life with one eye, rather than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire.

CW - If, for example, your eye places a wrong value on things, be willing to lose your eye to keep your moral innocence. If you have to make a choice, it's better not to be great in this life and yet live forever than to lose your childlike innocence and have everything end with this life.

Note - Not only does this verse do away with "fiery hell" but it also inserts "moral innocence" and "childlike innocence," neither of which are mentioned in Scripture.
Luke 16:19-30


This is the familiar parable of Christ about the rich man and Lazarus. The CW introduces teaching with these words: "You keep telling people the Jewish fable about a rich man." The revision makes it appear that Christ is refuting a Jewish myth, when in reality is proclaiming the spiritual truth of the parable.

One can readily see how this "Bible" which proclaims by its title, Clear Word, to be an accurate rending of Scripture is perhaps, one of the most deceptive Bibles of recent times. For 150 years Seventh-day Adventists have called the Roman Catholic Church "the beast" for allegedly omitting 2 verses of the law against images. Yet they have now made hundreds of revisions in their Bible.7 Each addition is itself an admission to some part of their teaching that lacks Bible support. Each deletion and change likewise admits to some part of their teachings which the Bible refutes. These changes are made to uphold E.G. White's nonbiblical views. However, by committing this which God, they place themselves above God Himself. In Revelation 18:4 God calls His people to come out of Babylon, "That ye receive not of her plagues." "Babylon" pictures false religion and false religious practices. Any church that would alter God's word which He says is "forever settled in heaven", or promote a Bible which does, is thus part of Babylon the Great, which is fallen. If you love Jesus, obey His call to "come out of her"!

http://www.watchman.org/reltop/clearwordbible.htm

That is some bad stuff up there.

 

[SputnikBoy]

Why is the Clear Word Bible even being discussed here on this thread? The first time I heard of this publication was about 8 years ago. The (SDA) pastor of the day of my church warned his congregation that the CWB was bad news. Since that time I've heard nothing about it and I know of no one who uses it as a source for information or reproval. So, why is this publication being made to appear as an 'Adventist Bible' on this forum ...? 'Adventist' Bibles are generally the KJV, the NKJV or the NIV.

I want to nip this fallacy in the bud once and for all. Stop with the lying nonsense ...please! If you must question SDA doctrines do so fairly and legitimately.

 

[Jay T]

Sadly, my wife returned to the U.S. two years after our arrival in Australia. Long story. That was in 1982. I had no interest in Christianity until 1988 when I decided that I needed to make a change in my life. As well as being a solo parent to 11 year-old Charley I was also working then as a solo musician on Hamilton Island in the beautiful Whitsundays in Nth Queensland. I studied with an SDA pastor and found the SDA message to be pretty sound and consistent with the Bible.

I've questioned the Adventist doctrines a number of times and I still do at times if I find it necessary. Ellen White has never figured in my life at all though I'm sure she was a godly woman. She also appears to have been a human being with human failings ...just like me. In all fairness to other SDAs on the forum ...I must confess to being somewhat 'radical' and don't necessarily fit the Adventist image ...whatever some might perceive that to be. But then, I'm generally 'undisciplined' or unauthodox by nature.

Don't feel bad about that.
I, myself questioned E. White for some time also....until I studied it thru enough.

I don't go to a SDA church, and haven't for some years now.
John, the Baptist didn't attend any church of his day.....BUT, he was a messenger of God, dispite what the religious leaders thought of him.

Jesus Christ didn't subscribe to the religious teachings of HIS day either....and the religious leaders told the people, IF they acknowledged HIM, they would be put out of the churches !

Jesus Christ and John, the Baptist were 'cult' figures to the religious leaders of their time.

The truths of God's words are NOT readily received by the majority in religious circles.....THAT'S A BIBLICAL FACT !

To be persecuted for Christ's sake is proof.....that a person is doing the right thing......
5:10 "Blessed [are] they which are persecuted for righteousness' sake: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
5:11 Blessed are ye, when [men] shall revile you, and persecute [you], and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake.
5:12 Rejoice, and be exceeding glad: for great [is] your reward in heaven: for so persecuted they the prophets which were before you".


3:12 "Yea, and all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution".

 

[Oscar3]

Don't feel bad about that.
I, myself questioned E. White for some time also....until I studied it thru enough.

This is good evidence that at one time the Holy Spirit was indeed speaking to you, but you turned your back from him and choose her. :o

I don't go to a SDA church, and haven't for some years now.
John, the Baptist didn't attend any church of his day.....BUT, he was a messenger of God, dispite what the religious leaders thought of him.

Whoa, hold on a second here. Let me get this straight. You are all over this board preaching about keeping the 10 commandments and ''keeping the sabbath'' when you don't even attend church. ''hypocrite''

Jesus Christ didn't subscribe to the religious teachings of HIS day either....and the religious leaders told the people, IF they acknowledged HIM, they would be put out of the churches !

Jay T
Have you ever looked at another women with lust? Did you pluck an eye out?

Jesus Christ and John, the Baptist were 'cult' figures to the religious leaders of their time

I can't believe you are attempting to Use Jesus and john the Baptist to justify your false teaching.

The truths of God's words are NOT readily received by the majority in religious circles.....THAT'S A BIBLICAL FACT !

Jay T.
I must say I agree with you here. When are you going to start to recieve the truth of Gods word instead of ellen g white.

To be persecuted for Christ's sake is proof.....that a person is doing the right thing......
5:10 "Blessed [are] they which are persecuted for righteousness' sake: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
5:11 Blessed are ye, when [men] shall revile you, and persecute [you], and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake.
5:12 Rejoice, and be exceeding glad: for great [is] your reward in heaven: for so persecuted they the prophets which were before you".


3:12 "Yea, and all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution".

Jay T
As I browse the differant threads through out this website, I must say this.
you and sputnik are a great example as to why the 7th day church is a cult.
with one fellow you have that one must keep the 10 commandments and keep the sabbath to recieve eternal life,
Then the other fellow says that it is not Important to believe in Jesus Christ and that he hates God.

Then to top it off not making it to heaven comes with out consequences, because at worse one will seek to exhist, that God will simply zap this person away into nothing.

 

[Judy]

MODS:

Why was my previous "Amen mutz!" deleted ...? That's all my post said.

I'm getting rather sick of having posts deleted for no good reason simply because they might somehow affect Oscar's feelings. I agreed with mutz and gave his post a resounding Amen.

Please don't try to play innocent with me, you know the only reason for your post was to agree with the cheap shot mutz took. And that is why I deleted it and should have deleted mutz post as well. It had nothing to do with Oscar's feelings.
Now if you have anything to contribute to the topic then by all means post away.

By the way just so you know the next time you have a problem with a mod of admin question it by PM, and not in the public forum.

• 6 - No Bashing of other members. Give other members the respect you would want them to give yourself

• Editing and deleting of posts is at the discretion of the Mods and Admins. Refusal of membership and suspension or termination of existing members is at the discretion of the Administrators. Openly challenging a Mod or Admin is frowned upon

 

[Jay T]

Cheap shots? No bashing? Respecting other members? I agree with those principles. Sadly, however, there seem to be rules for some and no rules for others. Thanks for your post anyway.

I wrote an article some time ago......
Satan Sets the Rules For Christianity ?
(2 Corinthians 11:13-15)

I'm seeing more and more where Christian forums will not permit certain scriptures to be used.
Why ?
Because it might offend someone.

2 Timothy 3:16 says.........
3:16 All scripture [is] given by inspiration of God, and [is] profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness"

But, Satan has rendered this Bible verse null and void.
(Note: This is just one, of many Bible verses)

The prophets (and disciples) of God were killed because they delivered messages sent from God, to the erring.
Even Jesus Christ Himself was delivered up to the cross, to be killed by the religious leaders of his day, because Jesus used scripture verses that offended(?) those religious leaders....scripture verses that revealed their errors.
Christ's only crime was that he was trying to save them, from themselves.

I myself have been expelled from so many Christian(?) forums, I've lost count, because I've presented Bible verses that the 'religious leaders' of those forums did not want their people to know, because it revealed the errors those leaders were teaching.
And pride, in being the Leaders, would not allow them to admit that they might be wrong.

The Religious leaders of Christ's day could not admit that they were wrong, when Jesus sowed them their errors.....they decided to kill Christ for daring to show them their errors:
Galations 4:16 "Am I therefore become your enemy, because I tell you the truth ?"


I do realize that it is human nature to blame the messenger, instead of receiving the message in humility and honesty.

Adam and Eve placed blame immediately somewhere else other than themselves, at the time of their sin:
Adam blamed Eve.....Eve blamed the serpent(Satan)....both in reality placed blame on God !

Sin results in guilt, which in turn the sinner wants to place blame on anything, but themselves !

If a person, who claims to be a Christian, cannot stand being corrected.....they have absolutely NO HOPE of making it to heaven !


Because God says you don't know anything:

Isaiah 55:8 "For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD.
55:9 For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts".

He also says that to have eternal life....'requires'...attention, to 'EVERY WORD' of God:
Matthew 4:4 " But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by [every word] that proceedeth out of the mouth of God".

To reject one Bible verse.....to reject one commandment....results in disaster.

When someone present a Bible verse to someone else...it is not the messenger, that is saying anything !
It is God speaking !

The very fact that a person get blamed for showing them a Bible verse that GOD....wants them so see, is wrong !

Had they read their Bibles....they would have already seen what God wanted them to see.

How many Christians ask God, to show them what HE wants them to see and understand from scripture....today ?

Did you, today ?

Then, Remember this:
"My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge ....because thou hast rejected knowledge, I will also reject thee....that thou shalt be no priest to me: seeing thou hast [forgotten the law] of thy God, I will also forget thy children".


PS........ANYONE who declares the truths of the Bible WILL be persecuted !
The Bible says so...and it be come to pass, as Bible prophecy says.
BUT remember....those who are persecuted get into heaven , while the persecutors DO NOT.
Matthew 5:10 Blessed [are] they which are persecuted for righteousness' sake: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
5:11 Blessed are ye, when [men] shall revile you, and persecute [you], and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake.
5:12 Rejoice, and be exceeding glad: for great [is] your reward in heaven: for so persecuted they the prophets which were before you.

 

[Oscar3]

Seventh-day Adventist Anti-Trinitarians

"Trinity?" (p.5) tells that in recent years a number of anti-Trinitarian publications have appeared in the SDA church, contending that "the church as a whole rejected the doctrine of the Trinity, and it was not until many years after the death of Ellen G. White that the Adventist church changed their position in regards to the Trinity". By the evidence above it was at least 15 years after she died before a Trinity statement of faith is seen. Yet the SDA denomination upholds Arian members, and has been heavily promoting their reversion to Arianism, by two means in these last 2 decades.

They've been strongly advocating Ellen White as their 'canonical' and 'divinely inspired' interpreter of the Bible. Thus, her views have become more authoritative than Scripture itself. This was more subtly effected in their 1958 Bible Commentary which upheld her positions and gave her quotes that established them. So they defended Jesus being Michael the Archangel, and upheld him as the angel of Rev 1, 8, & 10; etc.

Also their Clear Word Bible, has been heavily promoted since 1994. In America today, nearly half of the Adventist homes are already using this so-called Bible, for regular reading and Bible study-many even for Sabbath School lesson study! The church has promoted this Bible because SDA's unorthodox positions have been translated right into the text, most of which came from Ellen White's endorsements. But the sweet scroll that becomes bitter in the stomach, is that this 'Bible' upholds and promotes her Arianism as well

 

[Radlad72]

Is the Seventh-day Adventist Church a cult? In a word - NO!!!!

They follow God first, last and only and cannot be placed in the same class as JW's, Mormons and Christian Scientists, etc. like some people on this thread have intimated

 

[destiny]

As long as Oscar is under the protection of the mods, the ignore button looks very tempting. Cheap shots? Posts deleted because of an 'Amen'? This guy must be a relative.

At any rate, oscar is a troll, and you guys shouldn't be feeding the troll. Everyone should have him on ignore by now.

 

[Oscar3]

At any rate, oscar is a troll, and you guys shouldn't be feeding the troll. Everyone should have him on ignore by now.

Destiny
Why are you being so judgemental? Atleast I recognize Jesus as God and am not ashamed of the Gospel like you are. You can't even stand up for the truth of the deity of Christ and I am guessing its because you too are not saved. IMO