BELIEVE.....God's Prophets !

[golfjack]

reply

The nature of Prophetic Ministry:

In the Old Testament, the prophetic ministry was essentially foretelling. In the New Testament, the emphasis is on forthtelling. When Adam and Eve were placed in the Garden of Eden, God conversed with them directly. That communication was broken by their disobedience. In a certain sense, the gift of prophesy restores that direct communion.

The prophetic gift has many variations. It may be exhortational; it may take the form of song or poetry as in the Psalms; or it may on occasion reveal future events. The gift has varied operations, and in some instances may be a vehicle for other gifts such as the word of wisdom, the word of knowledge or the discerning of spirits.

Prophecy relating to the future is of two distinct kinds. Some prophecies are unconditional; for example, the Abrahamic covenant or the Messianic prophesies. Others are conditional, such as Isaiah's warning of Hezekiah's impending death ( 2 Ki. 20:1-6) or Jonah's pronouncement of judgment on Nieveh ( Jon. 3:3-10). Fulfillment of unconditional prophesies are not not dependent upon man or his responses. Fulfillment of conditional prophesies, however, does depend on the responce, the obedience or disobedience, of the persons to whom they are addressed.

There is a difference between revelation prophecy and exhortational prophecy. In exhortational prophesy, the Spirit of God takes over the person's subconscious mind and from his storehouse selects, rearranges and anoints certain truths for the edification of the hearers. Revelation prophesy involves a greater yielding to the Spirit. Exhortational prophesy is more prevelent and usually is the kind manifested in public services ( 1 Cor. 14:26).

There is a hunger in the hearts of people for revelation prophesy. Nevertheless, because of the complexity of the gift, cerrtain safeguards are important in its operation. The gift of prophesy involves the merging of the human and the divine, the finite with the infinite, the imperfect with the perfect.

Next, let's explore True Prophesy.


May God bless, Golfjack

 

[Oscar3]

Golf
That post was good. Makes sense.

 

[golfjack]

reply

True Prophesy:

For the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophesy ( Rev. 19:10). True prophesy always points to Christ, His deity, His ministry, His purpose in coming into the world and His return to earth. Alleged prophetic gifts that engage in telling fortunes, divining mysteries, predicting the outcome of political events, locating lost articles, etc, betray the fact that they are something other than the Biblical gift. The true gift of prophesy is not to be confused with fortune-telling, extrasensory perception, clairvoyance and other psychic manifestations. It may, however, give guidance and counsel at times. People should first search the Scriptures before looking for guidance. Moreover, just as some people misinterpret Scripture, some misinterpret prophesy. Spiritual discernment is needed to undrerstand either.

Old Testament prophets on occasion assumed the time of fulfillment of their prophesies would be sooner than they were in actuality. Some make that mistake today. The Bible speaks of apocalyptic judgments taking place during the day of the Lord that is great and very terrible ( Joel 2:11). That time is not far off, but has not yet come. When people are given the impression that some catastrophic event is to happen immediately and it fails to take place, they are prone to lose in the gift altogether.

God gives certain kinds of guidance by means of the revelation gifts. The warning received by Paul when he was on his way to Jerusalem ( Acts 20:22, 23) came thusly. Even so, the prophesy had to be correctly interpreted. Paul interpreted the prophesy as a warning of what would happen to him if he went to Jerusalem; he did not see it as a prohibition. The Apostle went to his destination, apparently in the will of God, although events transpired just as they had been prophesied.

The gift is not intended as a vehicle to establish new doctrine. Peter warned of those who will come into the Church with destructive heresies ( 2 Pet. 2:1) which can lead to great confusion. Some of the most serious heresies owe their origen to the private interpretation of some self styled prophet.

Despite these problems, we sorely need the inspiration and revelation gifts in operation in the Church.I pray that God gives us discernment to distinguish between the true and the false. Paul commands, do not despise prophesies. Test all things; hold fast what is good ( 1 Thess. 5:20, 21). Folks, Paul is talking to this church, and if that is true, he is talking to us, ( the Church).



May God bless, Golfjack

 

[jgredline]

Re: reply

The gift is not intended as a vehicle to establish new doctrine. Peter warned of those who will come into the Church with destructive heresies ( 2 Pet. 2:1) which can lead to great confusion. Some of the most serious heresies owe their origen to the private interpretation of some self styled prophet.





May God bless, Golfjack

Jack
While you entire post was good this is the part that stood out to me....as i Mentioned in my previous post....

 

[golfjack]

reply

Here is the problem as I see it: We do have false prophets and teachers today. Like, Mormans, SDA doctrine, JW doctrine, Some Epispocal doctrine, Catholic Doctrine, Some Church of Christ doctrine, some Prespyterian doctrine, some United Church of Christ doctrine, some United Methodist doctrine, and many more churches that really don't have a honest study of the Bible. Do I agree with all of John Calvin's Thelogy? No. Was he a false teacher? No. Then we have all the reformers. Do I call them false teachers? No. But I do disagree with some of their thelogy. Is John McArthur a false teacher? No. But I do disagree with some of his thelogy. We have great thelogians today. In my opinion, they are better than Old Thelogians from the 16th century on. Why, One thing sticks out to me. They never had a Bible that they could depend on because the Catholic Church locked it up for a long time. Do I consider Kenneth Copleland, Kenneth Hagin, Fredrick Price, and many others false teachers? No. I believe it is a matter of Thelogy. You see, I agree with their thelogy and you disagree. I don't believe any Born again Christian will agree on everything. Does that make us bad people? No. Jg., You have your favorite teachers and I have mine. I am not saved anymore than you are. In reality, the argument is all about Church Government, and I really don't think we should be arguing about that. That kind of divides us. We all have one purpose in common, and that is to try our best to snatch souls out of darkness, and bring them into the light of our Lord Jesus Christ.



May God bless, Golfjack

 

[mutzrein]

Golfjack

I agree in the main with your 'True Prophesy' post. It was good.

I have witnessed all of the apostolic gifts at work in a number of different churches / assemblies / fellowships over the years.

While prophecies come and go, being delivered by various individuals within this environment I also recognise the 'position' of a prophet, being that of a man that God has raised up for the purpose 'centering' and sometimes reining in the less than godly influences within the body. Such a man is also often an apostle.

 

[jgredline]

Re: reply

Here is the problem as I see it: We do have false prophets and teachers today. Like, Mormans, SDA doctrine, JW doctrine



May God bless, Golfjack

Jack
Again a good post, but I really don't want to discuss those other churches or denominations theology... Perhaps a little later in a differant thread. For now lets speak of these prophets..... Let me explain...

While it is very true in what you said that ''Some Epispocal doctrine, Catholic Doctrine, Some Church of Christ doctrine, some Prespyterian doctrine, some United Church of Christ doctrine, some United Methodist doctrine, and many more churches that really don't have a honest study of the Bible.''......Here is the differance....

Lets take a quick glance at this text....
2 pet 2:1 nkjv
2 But there were also false prophets among the people, even as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Lord who bought them, and bring on themselves swift destruction. 2 And many will follow their destructive ways, because of whom the way of truth will be blasphemed. 3 By covetousness they will exploit you with deceptive words; for a long time their judgment has not been idle, and their destruction does not slumber.


Here is where I believe the differance is.
Fasle teachers are really the ones who have brought false Doctrine to ''Some Epispocal, Catholic, Church of Christ doctrine, Prespyterian, United Church of Christ , United Methodist, and many more churches that really don't have a honest study of the Bible.''

Now in these particular church denominations while you do have some false teachers and false teaching, not all those folks are destined to Hell, because there are also some good teachers and good Godly people in them that are there providing some light. I should also say that these denominations are examples as false teachers are everyplace that Lord is working......

Now lets go look at a part of the text....
But there were also false prophets and then a little further is talks about destructive heresies.....
This is clearly where the Mormans, SDA doctrine, JW doctrine. fits in.....
What these CULTS have in common is they all had there ''Prophet"'
E.G. Ellen G white and Joseph Smith.....In these cults they teach such a destructive Heresy, that this people are bascially being trained to go to Hell....You have Joseph Smiths teachings that Jesus is the half brother of Satan and that ''good mormons'' will get their own planet like Adam, and then you have the Ellen G white sect that teaches you must keep the 10 commandments to be saved...among other things.....

Now in saying this Ibelieve it is only fair to point out something.

Disclaimer....Not all SDA folks are cults. For example...''I believe Guibox to be a man of God'' While I do not agree with his theology on Hell, I know he believes we are saved by Grace through Faith.....and does not deny jESUS His deity.....As God......

Jay T, I believe and I am judging by the outward appearance of his teaching is from the destructive SDA sect of Ellen G white....He IMO is far from being saved as he has bought into the whole false teaching of the SDA SECT OF ELLEN G WHITE......

 

[golfjack]

reply

I agree with you Jg. There are many fine people in these churches that I described as being false. But, the Institution is wrong, and many are being led astray in false doctrine. Especially when a church says we have to be water baptized to saved. This is false and will lead many to hell. The Bible says, from such turn away.



May God bless, Golfjack

 

[Radlad72]

Just as well you don't make the decisions in the long run, isn't it? God is the only one who is able to judge fairly and we will just have to wait and see what happens in the future.

As for placing the SDA beliefs alongside those of the JW's, Mormons and Muslims, that is going a little (indeed, a lot) far in my mind.

Oscar, you keep bringing up the Clear Word Bible (which it hasn't been called for a very long time now) as proof that SDA's are a cult. This is a very weak argument which shows a lack of proof of anything in particular and just an agenda against Sats. The BOOK is now called The Clear Word and is a paraphrase written by one man, with one man's ideas. I myself do not use it. I use a number of translations to make reading clearer. I have no need of flowery speech which a number of paraphrases (inc. the Message) give.

Rad.

 

[Gabbylittleangel]

....
In ephesians 4:11
11 And He Himself gave some to be apostles, some prophets, some evangelists, and some pastors and teachers, 12 for the equipping of the saints for the work of ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ, 13 till we all come to the unity of the faith and of the knowledge of the Son of God, to a perfect man, to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ; 14 that we should no longer be children, tossed to and fro and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the trickery of men, in the cunning craftiness of deceitful plotting, 15 but, speaking the truth in love, may grow up in all things into Him who is the headâ€â€Christ 16 from whom the whole body, joined and knit together by what every joint supplies, according to the effective working by which every part does its share, causes growth of the body for the edifying of itself in love.

Why the highlight?

It appears to me that the trickery of men, in the cunning craftiness of deceitful plotting, is they way that the devil has convinced people that there is no such thing as prophets.

What better way to keep Gods people from hearing what God has to say, than to make them believe that every prophet is a false prophet?

The type of Prophet that Paul is speaking about here is one that has a word of Knowledge for ''the Church'' To be more exact it means to prophecy, To teach, To exhort, To encourage the body of Christ....This gift may come when The church or body needs it..... ''to the person with the gift''. In other words. One who has the gift of teaching can teach all the time. One who has the gift of prophecy may not be able to teach all the time as teaching is a part of the overall gift.

The Prophets that came in the mold John The Baptist, Elijah, Jer etc.... came to preach repentance to the non believers.

Those prophets cam for those purposes. Not all prophets fit into that box.

Prophets are people that God uses to give a message to other people. To say that we do not need prophets because we have the Bible ~ well it reminded me a whole lot of this passage.


Num 12:2-9 And they said, Hath the LORD indeed spoken only by Moses? hath he not spoken also by us? And the LORD heard [it]. (Now the man Moses [was] very meek, above all the men which [were] upon the face of the earth.) And the LORD spake suddenly unto Moses, and unto Aaron, and unto Miriam, Come out ye three unto the tabernacle of the congregation. And they three came out. And the LORD came down in the pillar of the cloud, and stood [in] the door of the tabernacle, and called Aaron and Miriam: and they both came forth. And he said, Hear now my words: If there be a prophet among you, the LORD will make myself known unto him in a vision, [and] will speak unto him in a dream. My servant Moses [is] not so, who [is] faithful in all mine house. With him will I speak mouth to mouth, even apparently, and not in dark speeches; and the similitude of the LORD shall he behold: wherefore then were ye not afraid to speak against my servant Moses? And the anger of the LORD was kindled against them; and he departed.

....
So Folks
There are no more prophets like these guys in the days of old.

True, nothing is like the days of John the Baptist. However, there are indeed prophets. Reference Scriptures in previous posts.

....

There will only be two more sent by God and they are the two witnesses ''foretold'' in Revelation, I believe in Chapter 11......

what kind of cars to you think they will drive?

....



So when I hear people on TV calling themselves prophets and then asking for Money, it makes you wonder who is their master.

Here is the problem. Many have claimed to have come in the mold of a ''biblical'' prophet....Mohammed, Joseph Smith, Mary Baker Eddy, Ellen G white, the JW... just to name a few. This list could get very long but I believe you get the point.

The problem: The baby has been thrown out with the bathwater. There are also many false religions. Many believe that therefore there must not be a true one. Really bad reasoning.

....

Now if there is a modern day prophet, please give the name.

Why?

If you are in the path of an earthquake, a hurricane, or some other such disaster, and God sends a true prophet to warn His people, there will be with the prophet witnesses that testify that the prophet is true. If someone were to come to you claiming to be a prophet with a word from God especially for you, then the thing to do is to pray and ask God if He is indeed trying to get your attention.


Rev 11:7 ¶ And when they shall have finished their testimony, the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them. Rev 11:8 And their dead bodies [shall lie] in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.

Lets not offer up any sacrifices.

 

[Gabbylittleangel]

Just to make things a bit clearer:

Is the intention of this thread to discuss true prophets, to reestablish the existence of false ones, or both?

 

[mutzrein]

If you are in the path of an earthquake, a hurricane, or some other such disaster, and God sends a true prophet to warn His people, there will be with the prophet witnesses that testify that the prophet is true.

Amen Gabby

1 Corinthians 14
Let the prophets speak two or three, and let the other judge.
If any thing be revealed to another that sitteth by, let the first hold his peace. For ye may all prophesy one by one, that all may learn, and all may be comforted.
And the spirits of the prophets are subject to the prophets.
For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.

 

[jgredline]

Little Angel
Have you read all of my post in this thread?

 

[Jay T]

Here is how vines defines a prophet

You let a 'man' define what a prophet is ?

Why didn't you let the Bible define a prophet ?

 

[Oscar3]

So Gabby
You seem to offer alot on prophets and so forth, but you have not come up with any modern day prophets. Not that I don't believe you, but your strange encounters are suspect sometimes.

So come on. Give us some names :-?

 

[Oscar3]

You let a 'man' define what a prophet is ?

Why didn't you let the Bible define a prophet ?

Jay T
Define a prophet for us. Afterall your SDA doctrine got squewred.

 

[Gabbylittleangel]

Little Angel
Have you read all of my post in this thread?

Nah.I skimmed past the SDA / Ellen White stuff. It was the blanket statements of there being no prophets at all...well except for the two mentioned in Rev. 11.

I did read this stuff.

When I hear of people or see people who call themselves prophets, I know they are false teachers.....

The next time God is going to send a prophet in the mold of the prophets from biblical times will be when the two witnesses are here....IMO

Did you read through any of the Scriptures that I posted? I agree with you on the statement that guys like John the Baptist are not walking the streets. To the best of my knowledge, God only needed one, and he fulfilled his ministry. You don't see evangelist like Peter James John and Paul either. And there are a bunch of liars running around claiming to be something that they are not.

To say that there are no prophets contradicts Scripture.

 

[Gabbylittleangel]

So come on. Give us some names :-?

Nope.

Oscar, you tend to bash things. Use something else for target practice.

As far as my credibility, well I suppose if I were trying to impress you, I would feel like a failure. Just put me on that list of everyone else that you have bashed.

 

[Jay T]

Just to make things a bit clearer:

Is the intention of this thread to discuss true prophets, to reestablish the existence of false ones, or both?

Actually, I started this thread to establish what the Bible defines as a true prophet.

 

[Gabbylittleangel]

Actually, I started this thread to establish what the Bible defines as a true prophet.

And how is that working out for you? :-D