Can a Saved man choose to be Lost?

[glorydaz]

I'm well aware I'm in the minority. Galileo was in the minority too. So what? That is just MY experience. I don't know any OSASers that strive toward holiness, period. None. Believe me, I would be pleasantly surprised to find some (and it appears I have on this board, but I'd like to meet one in person).

Perhaps you are judging them on a false balance. Perhaps you believe everyone should walk according to your standard of holiness. Many believers readily admit they sin, others are under some delusion that they rarely, if ever, sin. Look at the Pharisees. They saw themselves as holy and righteous, and looked down on everyone else...even going so far as to stone the woman caught in adultery. What they failed to see was their own sin, and how the Lord saw it but they couldn't. I see you use the word "strive"...that tells me a great deal. The harder we try to be holy the farther away from holy we become because we do so by our own efforts. We're to "be" holy because He is holy. That can only come about as we allow the love of God in us to be manifest in our lives.

 

[jasoncran]

how can the promise of abraham be of none effect if he never swore to it. and you are wrong. isreal is on a seperate convenant and they will return to the lord.(as a nation)not as indivuals.

barachuba beshem adonai is what they will say when the lord saves them from thier enemies.

galeleo. actually well thats another topic.

we are in the times of the gentiles.

i dont see the hebrew nation as it should be yet. most of isreal isnt actually of the jewish faith.

there more orthodox jews in america( that practice it) then in isreal.

 

[DarcyLu]

I'm well aware I'm in the minority. Galileo was in the minority too. So what? That is just MY experience. I don't know any OSASers that strive toward holiness, period. None. Believe me, I would be pleasantly surprised to find some (and it appears I have on this board, but I'd like to meet one in person).

hey sista' i'm with you in the minority. just because more people believe in one particular idea, doesn't make it true.

 

[faithtransforms]

I understand that it is thought that those with the last name of Cohen may be descended from Aaron, directly or indirectly.

 

[faithtransforms]

I'm well aware I'm in the minority. Galileo was in the minority too. So what? That is just MY experience. I don't know any OSASers that strive toward holiness, period. None. Believe me, I would be pleasantly surprised to find some (and it appears I have on this board, but I'd like to meet one in person).

hey sista' i'm with you in the minority. just because more people believe in one particular idea, doesn't make it true.

Amen my friend!!!!

 

[DarcyLu]

how can the promise of abraham be of none effect if he never swore to it. and you are wrong. isreal is on a seperate convenant and they will return to the lord.(as a nation)not as indivuals.

barachuba beshem adonai is what they will say when the lord saves them from thier enemies.

galeleo. actually well thats another topic.

we are in the times of the gentiles.

i dont see the hebrew nation as it should be yet. most of isreal isnt actually of the jewish faith.

there more orthodox jews in america( that practice it) then in isreal.

oh, i did not know that was your belief, we do disagree on that it's a separate covenant, i believe when they speak of Israel, it is speaking of the entire church. i am pretty sure i know your beliefs in this though, so correct me if i am wrong, but you believe they will rebuild the temple? reinstate the sacrifices? Israel will return to their land? that pastor Hagee is spending alot of money moving jews back to Israel and i know they have the designs for the temple made up.
i believe the new covenant was given to everyone, right now Israel is blinded so the Gentiles who were not His people, can now become His people and one day many natural born Israelites will have their veils lifted and see we are all under the same new covenant. another thread perhaps though.....lol

 

[jasoncran]

the chruch isnt isreal, if it was why then the promises that isreal would be a nation agian?

what are the odds of a nation's culture being maintained despite having no homeland as its peopleand being persucted by christians for the murder of christ and having undergone two holocaust simultaneously.

Hitler killed many jews but not as much as stalin did. his purgers were far worse.

and still despite this the hebrew still look to the messiah return to the city jerusalem. what is the wailing wall in isreal for? they are crying out for the coming of the messiah.

they just dont realize that he came already the first time.

has the moon and the stars ceased yet there darcylu if so then isreal is forsaken as a nation.

i used to not believe that isreal would return and look it up in the bible and found out that he using you gentiles to provoke them to return.

 

[DarcyLu]

Perhaps you are judging them on a false balance. Perhaps you believe everyone should walk according to your standard of holiness.

we don't need to set the standard, Jesus did that for us, it's His Holiness we are to be conforming to and that's pretty Holy if you ask me.

 

[glorydaz]

but you aint dead yet and till you are then you aint perfected in the here and now. its a process.

when you die you will be perfected that is what i meant.

unless you think that upon salvation that we never sin again,or that we are more saved due to holiness.

holiness is the outward shining of what is inside.if it never occurs then maybe salvation wasnt there in the first place.

Exactly so, brother. Whatever is not faith is sin...falling short of the glory of God is with us until the day we die and are taken up into glory. The Spirit is willing but the flesh is weak, and until we're delivered from this body of death, we will never be perfect. That's why Christ's righteousness is imputed unto us. When our heart was circumcised, we were given a desire to love God and listen to His voice. The Comforter has come...... :amen

 

[jasoncran]

the jews are planning to reinstuate that sacrifice and want to the samaritans are already doing it on a small scale. the samtaritans are still around.

what of the 144,000?
no cohen aint from aaron(levitic line), no one knows.

it has been said that the celtic tribe may be of the line of manesseh. but that is a myth.

 

[glorydaz]

Perhaps you are judging them on a false balance. Perhaps you believe everyone should walk according to your standard of holiness.

we don't need to set the standard, Jesus did that for us, it's His Holiness we are to be conforming to and that's pretty Holy if you ask me.

I didn't say we needed to set the standard, did I?

It's only through His strength, not our own, that we show forth the love of God in us.

 

[DarcyLu]

but you aint dead yet and till you are then you aint perfected in the here and now. its a process.

when you die you will be perfected that is what i meant.

unless you think that upon salvation that we never sin again,or that we are more saved due to holiness.

holiness is the outward shining of what is inside.if it never occurs then maybe salvation wasnt there in the first place.

Exactly so, brother. Whatever is not faith is sin...falling short of the glory of God is with us until the day we die and are taken up into glory. The Spirit is willing but the flesh is weak, and until we're delivered from this body of death, we will never be perfect. That's why Christ's righteousness is imputed unto us. When our heart was circumcised, we were given a desire to love God and listen to His voice. The Comforter has come...... :amen

i would so love to take this bait, glory......yet you will continue to ignore every single scripture that tells us otherwise.

 

[DarcyLu]

Perhaps you are judging them on a false balance. Perhaps you believe everyone should walk according to your standard of holiness.

we don't need to set the standard, Jesus did that for us, it's His Holiness we are to be conforming to and that's pretty Holy if you ask me.

I didn't say we needed to set the standard, did I?

It's only through His strength, not our own, that we show forth the love of God in us.

you were referring to faithtransformers that she was setting the standard for Holiness - Jesus' standards are higher than what we could ever set for ourselves, but now we have HE living IN us, and through Him we can walk in His standards of Holiness because we have died to ourselves and it is no longer I who lives, but it is He living in me. AMEN!!

 

[jasoncran]

let me clarify this, the jewish nation will be in the tribulation and when the messiah returns to deliver them from the anti christ and his army they will then see him and accept him.

they will then be under the same promises that we are, but the nation is promised to return, and what of the 144,000 male jews who are virgins?

that is what i meant by a seperate convenant.

the jews will return to the lord as a nation.

i'm gonna to have to look that up

 

[DarcyLu]

the jews are planning to reinstuate that sacrifice and want to the samaritans are already doing it on a small scale. the samtaritans are still around.

what of the 144,000?
no cohen aint from aaron(levitic line), no one knows.

it has been said that the celtic tribe may be of the line of manesseh. but that is a myth.

that's interesting, i did not realize the samaritans were doing that.
i don't understand why you believe there is a separate covenant? when i read the Word, i do not see that at all, are you looking at the OT or what verses do you use to justify your belief?

what do you mean, what of the 144,000? it seems there are 2 sets of 144,000 - do you see that, also?

 

[jasoncran]

romans 10 and 11 talk about what i wrote that isreal will return.

 

[DarcyLu]

let me clarify this, the jewish nation will be in the tribulation and when the messiah returns to deliver them from the anti christ and his army they will then see him and accept him.

they will then be under the same promises that we are, but the nation is promised to return, and what of the 144,000 male jews who are virgins?

that is what i meant by a seperate convenant.

the jews will return to the lord as a nation.

i'm gonna to have to look that up

i posted my last post before i saw this one. where does it say the 144,000 will be only jews? it seems they will part of the Church.

thanks for the versus.

 

[jasoncran]

the jews are planning to reinstuate that sacrifice and want to the samaritans are already doing it on a small scale. the samtaritans are still around.

what of the 144,000?
no cohen aint from aaron(levitic line), no one knows.

it has been said that the celtic tribe may be of the line of manesseh. but that is a myth.

that's interesting, i did not realize the samaritans were doing that.
i don't understand why you believe there is a separate covenant? when i read the Word, i do not see that at all, are you looking at the OT or what verses do you use to justify your belief?

what do you mean, what of the 144,000? it seems there are 2 sets of 144,000 - do you see that, also?

no, the same, 12,000 from each tribe.
the 24 elders are also from isreal. 2 elders from each tribe.

look at the promises of to isreal about in the last days that all men shall sacrifice in jerusalem in the last days. i think that means to worship not neccesary the ot type that if the nations dont they will be cursed as in drought. i believe that to happen in the millenium not in the tribulation.

odd all male and from each tribe listed, how is that the church?
look at what they do. witness and tell all of isreal that the lord is real. you believe that the chruch will go through the trib then

 

[DarcyLu]

the chruch isnt isreal, if it was why then the promises that isreal would be a nation agian?

what are the odds of a nation's culture being maintained despite having no homeland as its peopleand being persucted by christians for the murder of christ and having undergone two holocaust simultaneously.

Hitler killed many jews but not as much as stalin did. his purgers were far worse.

and still despite this the hebrew still look to the messiah return to the city jerusalem. what is the wailing wall in isreal for? they are crying out for the coming of the messiah.

they just dont realize that he came already the first time.

has the moon and the stars ceased yet there darcylu if so then isreal is forsaken as a nation.

i used to not believe that isreal would return and look it up in the bible and found out that he using you gentiles to provoke them to return.

yes, it is a miracle in itself the nation of Israel has lasted and they were given the land back in the 40's i think. i do know that when Israel's prime minister and Obama got together awhile back and Obama does not want to support Israel......at the time, i didn't think that was too good of an idea on Obama's part, and it left a bad feeling for me. did you read the article on that? i think i saved it.

 

[DarcyLu]

no, the same, 12,000 from each tribe.
the 24 elders are also from isreal. 2 elders from each tribe.

look at the promises of to isreal about in the last days that all men shall sacrifice in jerusalem in the last days. i think that means to worship not neccesary the ot type that if the nations dont they will be cursed as in drought. i believe that to happen in the millenium not in the tribulation.

odd all male and from each tribe listed, how is that the church?
look at what they do. witness and tell all of isreal that the lord is real. you believe that the chruch will go through the trib then

lol, yes you are right completely forgot it does mention the tribes and God knows who they are from each tribe, even if you all don't.

i do believe the Church will go through tribulation.

i do believe we can lose our salvation.