Daniel 9:27 and Daniel 12:11-12

[Deborah13]

It sometimes helps to understand various parables if one thinks of the 'people' in them as collective cultures, or corporate 'men', rather than individuals. Then in the Matt 22:1-13 parable we would have those cultures that don't acknowledge and honor the union of Christ with His church ultimately being condemned.

I think your 2 cents, makes sense.

 

[for_his_glory]

I agree this is speaking of Jesus who was sent to the lost sheep of Israel in this verse and that also he gave charge to His disciples to go and teach others. Yes the culture at that time was a Jewish nation, but did it end with the Jews only accepting or rejecting Messiah or was it a parable for all of Gods servants. The importance of this parable is that we have the wedding garment on when Christ returns so that we have Gods righteousness found in us.

 

[Dave Watchman]

Dan 12:1 ¶ And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nationeven to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.
Dan 12:2 - And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame andeverlasting contempt.​

Actually if you examine the various translations of Dan12:1-2 you will see that Michael stands for the children of Daniel's people. Who came out of, or were born of, Judaism? Christians! Grace doesn't discriminate between Jew and gentile, so those of Daniel's NT people(ethnic Jews) who choose Christ will be delivered, as well as those faithful OT Jews who had already died prior to the coming of the promised Messiah. Daniel's people have already faced their day of judgment, but the children of Daniel's people(we Christians) haven't yet.

Thank you for the reply

It sounds like you are saying Daniel's people have changed from 9 to 12, with 12 talking not about the old time Jews but guys like you and me. I was talking to a preterist who insisted that Dan 12 was about the destruction of Jerusalem.

"there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation"

"And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt"

Verses like these read to me like they are still future.

 

[Deborah13]

Thank you for the reply

It sounds like you are saying Daniel's people have changed from 9 to 12, with 12 talking not about the old time Jews but guys like you and me. I was talking to a preterist who insisted that Dan 12 was about the destruction of Jerusalem.

"there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation"

"And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt"

Verses like these read to me like they are still future.

I think sometimes we have a problem when we see a verse like the second above we think that the whole prophecy refers to us. Just because we also will awaken that does not mean the prophecy is about anyone but Daniel's people.

"Susie and her sisters went to the store and bought milk. On the way home their car broke down."
"Deborah went to the store and bought milk." Does that mean her car broke down, too or just Susie and her sisters car?

 

[Dave Watchman]

I think sometimes we have a problem when we see a verse like the second above we think that the whole prophecy refers to us. Just because we also will awaken that does not mean the prophecy is about anyone but Daniel's people.

"Susie and her sisters went to the store and bought milk. On the way home their car broke down."
"Deborah went to the store and bought milk." Does that mean her car broke down, too or just Susie and her sisters car?

You post reminded me of Susie Sells Seashells by the Seashore.

So it sounds to me like you are saying Daniel 12 is about Daniel's people only but has nothing to do with Christians now or in the future. Am I understanding you correctly? Or do you mean Daniel's people will have a different plan of salvation than Christians? Is this called dispensationalism? I know that preterists also believe Daniel 12 is past because I was talking to one and he gave me a headache. I also know that the SDA general conference is translating the 3 prophetic time periods in Daniel 12 from days into years. I also know what I know about Daniel 12 but I still enjoy hearing what others have to say about it and I respect their beliefs.

 

[Deborah13]

You post reminded me of Susie Sells Seashells by the Seashore.

So it sounds to me like you are saying Daniel 12 is about Daniel's people only but has nothing to do with Christians now or in the future. Am I understanding you correctly? Or do you mean Daniel's people will have a different plan of salvation than Christians? Is this called dispensationalism? I know that preterists also believe Daniel 12 is past because I was talking to one and he gave me a headache. I also know that the SDA general conference is translating the 3 prophetic time periods in Daniel 12 from days into years. I also know what I know about Daniel 12 but I still enjoy hearing what others have to say about it and I respect their beliefs.

All I was saying is that when it says 'Daniel's people' it means what it says. You see in other prophecies about the Church/Body of Christ, we are called different things, a nation that was not a nation, people who were not a people, God's people, even 'the Israel of God' by Paul. However, the vision was in response to Daniel's prayers for his people the Jews as a nation.
All people were/are saved by grace through faith from the beginning to the end. There is no difference between the people of God, Jew and non-Jew, we are all one in Christ, Paul is very clear about that.
I have to let others speak about Daniel 12 in particular, I haven't studied it well enough.

 

[Sinthesis]

I think sometimes we have a problem when we see a verse like the second above we think that the whole prophecy refers to us. Just because we also will awaken that does not mean the prophecy is about anyone but Daniel's people.

"Susie and her sisters went to the store and bought milk. On the way home their car broke down."
"Deborah went to the store and bought milk." Does that mean her car broke down, too or just Susie and her sisters car?

If Deborah's mechanic is Jesus, then she would have made it home.

 

[Deborah13]

If Deborah's mechanic is Jesus, then she would have made it home.

You get an A+ for that answer. :yes

 

[ezrider]

Dan 9:26-27 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined. And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week:and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

Matt 22:6-7 And the remnant took his servants, and entreated them spitefully, and slew them. But when the king heard thereof, he was wroth: and he sent forth his armies, and destroyed those murderers, and burned up their city.

Matt 23:34-39 Wherefore, behold, I send unto you prophets, and wise men, and scribes:and some of them ye shall kill and crucify; and some of them shall ye scourge in your synagogues, and persecute them from city to city: That upon you may come all the righteous blood shed upon the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel unto the blood of Zacharias son of Barachias, whom ye slew between the temple and the altar. Verily I say unto you, All these things shall come upon this generation. O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not! Behold, your house is left unto you desolate. For I say unto you, Ye shall not see me henceforth, till ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord.