Daniel 9:27 and Daniel 12:11-12

[Sinthesis]

I'm pointing out an inconsistency.


for_his_glory said: ↑
Messiah is cut-off at the crucifixion which is the 69th week. God set aside the wrath that will come in the 70th week and revealed the revelation of the mystery to the apostle Paul and we will be in that gap until the rapture of the church and then God will pour out his wrath upon the earth.

The command to rebuild Jerusalem was in 457BC. Daniel 9:25 says it took 7 weeks (49 years) to rebuild. This brings us to 408BC.

Then Daniel says 62 weeks later (434 years) Messiah will arrive. This brings us to 27AD which is the end of week 69 and start of week 70. (408 – 343 = -26. Add 1 year for year “0” and you come to 27AD)

Then Daniel 9:26, 27 says Messiah is cut off and in the midst of week 70th Jesus shall confirm the covenant (grace) and that which is determined (judged) will be that of Gods judgment of those not found written in the Lamb’s book of life.. (31AD)
Click to expand...

 

[Sinthesis]

Yes Jesus defeated sin and death at the cross as in God making a new covenant of grace that we now through the grace of God can be saved, but only to those who will endure all things until the end, Matthew 24:13 as Christ will confirm the covenant in His coming when those who have endured that have been saved by grace will meet Christ in the air and forever more be with the Father forever, Daniel 9:27.

I see; so you believe He is confirming the covenant of Grace rather than the Messianic covenant.

 

[Deborah13]

From Genesis 4:26 when men started calling on the name of the Lord until that time of Christ return when he plants His feet on the Mt of Olives and makes an end to all abominations that causes desolations or in another word the end of sin here on earth.

I don't understand what you are saying here. Are you saying the Seth was one of Daniel's people? Are you saying that every person who has ever lived or will live are Daniel's people?

 

[for_his_glory]

Actually it's both in the same, but being a better covenant as all the other ones were always broken by Israel and Judah, Romans 7:4-12; Hebrews 7:19-22. Gentiles were grafted into the Messianic covenant to become a partaker of Israel's covenant blessings in a new way through that of Christ Jesus and this is what Christ will confirm when he returns.

 

[for_his_glory]

I don't understand what you are saying here. Are you saying the Seth was one of Daniel's people? Are you saying that every person who has ever lived or will live are Daniel's people?

you asked:
Where is "those written in the Lamb's book, mentioned in the prophecy?
Where is the Bride of Christ mentioned in the prophecy?

70wks for Daniel's people. Not all Daniel's people are written in the Book.

My answer was to reflect that from the time of Seth and his family calling on the Lord in Gen 4:26 that they like all of us who have called on His name are written in the Lambs book of life. When it comes to saying Daniel's people would be like us calling our relatives one of our people. Daniel's people were the Israelite. It's like saying my people are Pennsylvanians. I can't say if some of Daniel's people are or are not written down as only God knows who are His own.

 

[Deborah13]

you asked:
Where is "those written in the Lamb's book, mentioned in the prophecy?
Where is the Bride of Christ mentioned in the prophecy?

70wks for Daniel's people. Not all Daniel's people are written in the Book.

My answer was to reflect that from the time of Seth and his family calling on the Lord in Gen 4:26 that they like all of us who have called on His name are written in the Lambs book of life.

Hey glory, thanks for responding.
OK when I asked these questions I meant literally mentioned in the prophecy.
Where is "those written in the Lamb's book, mentioned in the prophecy?
It is not mentioned in the prophecy.

Where is the Bride of Christ mentioned in the prophecy?
It is not mentioned in the prophecy.

When it comes to saying Daniel's people would be like us calling our relatives one of our people. Daniel's people were the Israelite. It's like saying my people are Pennsylvanians.

No it's not the same. You do not have one common faith with all the people in PA or have common forefathers.

I can't say if some of Daniel's people are or are not written down as only God knows who are His own.

Paul says 'some have been/will be saved'. So we know that not all Israelites have been/will be saved but some are and will be.

Yes, anyone who belongs to God/Messiah are God's chosen people from Genesis to the time of His return.

 

[for_his_glory]

The book of life is mentioned in Daniel 7:10, Daniel Chapter 12 as it is sealed to the end of time as this was prophecy given to Daniel of the great time of trouble.

Mark 4:11, 12 is a cross reference to Psalms 24:15; Isaiah 46:10 describing who the Bride of Christ are as it being a mystery to those who have no understanding being a mystery and a secret. The books were written before the creation of man with all the names in it, Rev 17:8; Rev 13:8. Hosea 6:7 speaks of breaking the covenant from the time of Adam on to even today as many covenants have been made by God, but have always been broken by man. Daniel 7:10 speaks of the books being opened at the end of this age.

Daniel's people were all those who had faith in God and kept His covenants just as even now we are also included with the people of Daniel as we the Gentile are grafted into that same nation of faith, but with a better covenant, Hebrews 8:6; 12:24.

 

[Sinthesis]

Daniel's people were all those who had faith in God and kept His covenants just as even now we are also included with the people of Daniel as we the Gentile are grafted into that same nation of faith, but with a better covenant, Hebrews 8:6; 12:24.

That is not how Daniel would have understood 'his people'. Daniel knew that 'his people' did not keep God's covenant.

Dan 9:20 - And whiles I was speaking, and praying, and confessing my sin and the sin of my people Israel, and presenting my supplication before the LORD my God for the holy mountain of my God;​

 

[Dave Watchman]

That is not how Daniel would have understood 'his people'. Daniel knew that 'his people' did not keep God's covenant.

Dan 9:20 - And whiles I was speaking, and praying, and confessing my sin and the sin of my people Israel, and presenting my supplication before the LORD my God for the holy mountain of my God;​

Hi Sinthesis

Daniel 12 English Standard Version (ESV)
The Time of the End

12 “At that time shall arise Michael, the great prince who has charge of your people. And there shall be a time of trouble, such as never has been since there was a nation till that time.
But at that time your people shall be delivered, everyone whose name shall be found written in the book.
And many of those who sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

Do you think that the identity of Daniel's people has changed in Daniel 12?
Is Daniel 12 still talking about the old time Jews from Daniel 9 and the DofJ or is this still in our future?

 

[Sinthesis]

Hi Sinthesis

Daniel 12 English Standard Version (ESV)
The Time of the End

12 “At that time shall arise Michael, the great prince who has charge of your people. And there shall be a time of trouble, such as never has been since there was a nation till that time.
But at that time your people shall be delivered, everyone whose name shall be found written in the book.
And many of those who sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

Do you think that the identity of Daniel's people has changed in Daniel 12?
Is Daniel 12 still talking about the old time Jews from Daniel 9 and the DofJ or is this still in our future?

Dan 12:1 ¶ And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nationeven to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.
Dan 12:2 - And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame andeverlasting contempt.​

Actually if you examine the various translations of Dan12:1-2 you will see that Michael stands for the children of Daniel's people. Who came out of, or were born of, Judaism? Christians! Grace doesn't discriminate between Jew and gentile, so those of Daniel's NT people(ethnic Jews) who choose Christ will be delivered, as well as those faithful OT Jews who had already died prior to the coming of the promised Messiah. Daniel's people have already faced their day of judgment, but the children of Daniel's people(we Christians) haven't yet.

 

[for_his_glory]

That is not how Daniel would have understood 'his people'. Daniel knew that 'his people' did not keep God's covenant.

Dan 9:20 - And whiles I was speaking, and praying, and confessing my sin and the sin of my people Israel, and presenting my supplication before the LORD my God for the holy mountain of my God;​

you are right that they did break covenants, but were still people of great faith

 

[Sinthesis]

you are right that they did break covenants, but were still people of great faith

Through whatever tribulation was set upon them for breaking covenants, there was always a remnant with great faith.

 

[Jack Spratt]

From what I understand the 69th week ended at the crucifixion or the time of the crucifixion. The 70th week will start at the beginning of the tribulation. The tribulation is 7years or the final week. The time between are the years of "grace" where there is non distinction between Jew and gentile.

 

[ezrider]

Gods wrath has been upon his people from the beginning of Adam and will not end until the time of Christ return when Gods wrath will be poured out on all those who have rejected His son Jesus. Scripture never defines a seven year tribulation as it say we are in times of tribulation until the end of this age. Have you ever studied Matthew 24. The parable of the marriage feast is that of being prepared to be part of the Bride of Christ as our wedding garment is that of the indwelling of Gods Holy Spirit of being heirs of God and joint heirs with Christ, Romans 8:17, that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.Again read Matthew 24 as generation is all generations as when Christ returns all things will then be fulfilled.

How long will you resist the truth? I have shown you the the scriptures from the parable of the marriage feast in Matthew 22 and how it aligns with Dan 9:26-17. In your attempts to disagree with or otherwise obfuscate what I have posted, this much is apparent to me, you have went from saying the 70th week hasn't happened yet, to including all the time from the fall of Adam until our present day in what was a specific prophecy concerning the coming of their Jewish Messiah. With the last breath of Jesus, knowing that all things had been accomplished that the scriptures might be fulfilled; He said it is finished. How long will you continue to deny the works of the Lord that you profess?

 

[for_his_glory]

Truth as only you believe to be truth. The parable of the marriage feast is all about us preparing ourselves to be the Bride of Christ he is returning for as our wedding garment is that of Gods righteousness found in us and not our own righteousness.

Yes, Jesus said it is finished in meaning the final offering for sin has now been made. To all those who think that all the laws have been fulfilled in Christ you are very wrong as below are the laws that are written upon our heart and can only be fulfilled when Christ returns and makes an end to sin by throwing it into the lake of fire with that of the beast and the false prophets. The only laws that Christ has fulfilled so far are that of the Temple and its sacrifices. Someone please show me in scripture where Jesus has fulfilled all the laws, because in Matthew 22:35-40 and Matthew 5:17, 18 Jesus does not say that he has already fulfilled all of them, but that love was the greatest of them all.

There are laws that were especially written just for the Hebrews pertaining to the rituals of the Temple, sacrifices, festivals, Torah, Kohanim and Levites, the King and the Nazarite and then there are the existing moral laws for all of us to still follow as in prayers and blessings, love and brotherhood, the poor and unfortunate, treatment of the Gentiles, Marriage, divorce and family, forbidden sexual relations, business practices, employees and servants, vows, oaths, swearing, Court and Judicial procedures, injuries and damages, property and property rights, Criminal laws, prophecy, idolatry and all its practices as the moral laws keep us in line with the will of God that we present ourselves a vessel of honor that God delights in as we allow the light of Christ shine in us and through us as a testimony of Gods grace and mercy as it is not ourselves that do any good thing, but Gods Spirit working in us and through us as we surrender our will to that of Gods will to be done.

 

[ezrider]

Truth as only you believe to be truth. The parable of the marriage feast is all about us preparing ourselves to be the Bride of Christ he is returning for as our wedding garment is that of Gods righteousness found in us and not our own righteousness.

Yes, Jesus said it is finished in meaning the final offering for sin has now been made. To all those who think that all the laws have been fulfilled in Christ you are very wrong as below are the laws that are written upon our heart and can only be fulfilled when Christ returns and makes an end to sin by throwing it into the lake of fire with that of the beast and the false prophets. The only laws that Christ has fulfilled so far are that of the Temple and its sacrifices. Someone please show me in scripture where Jesus has fulfilled all the laws, because in Matthew 22:35-40 and Matthew 5:17, 18 Jesus does not say that he has already fulfilled all of them, but that love was the greatest of them all.

There are laws that were especially written just for the Hebrews pertaining to the rituals of the Temple, sacrifices, festivals, Torah, Kohanim and Levites, the King and the Nazarite and then there are the existing moral laws for all of us to still follow as in prayers and blessings, love and brotherhood, the poor and unfortunate, treatment of the Gentiles, Marriage, divorce and family, forbidden sexual relations, business practices, employees and servants, vows, oaths, swearing, Court and Judicial procedures, injuries and damages, property and property rights, Criminal laws, prophecy, idolatry and all its practices as the moral laws keep us in line with the will of God that we present ourselves a vessel of honor that God delights in as we allow the light of Christ shine in us and through us as a testimony of Gods grace and mercy as it is not ourselves that do any good thing, but Gods Spirit working in us and through us as we surrender our will to that of Gods will to be done.

Comment deleted You go and list the scriptures of the parable of the marriage feast in Matthew 22:1-10, and explain how these passages in any way tell you how to prepare yourself to be the bride. The parable of the marriage feast is about the Lord sending his servants to call his people to the wedding feast, and his people rejecting him.

 

[Deborah13]

Comment deleted You go and list the scriptures of the parable of the marriage feast in Matthew 22:1-10, and explain how these passages in any way tell you how to prepare yourself to be the bride. The parable of the marriage feast is about the Lord sending his servants to call his people to the wedding feast, and his people rejecting him.

I think ....
Verses 1-8 are definitely speaking of the Jews that would not receive Jesus as their Messiah and those slain were the prophets of both the OT and NT including Christ Himself and Stephen.
Verses 9-10 are when the Gospel message is taken to the gentile nations.
Verses 11-13 are the unbelievers

 

[for_his_glory]

Comment deleted You go and list the scriptures of the parable of the marriage feast in Matthew 22:1-10, and explain how these passages in any way tell you how to prepare yourself to be the bride. The parable of the marriage feast is about the Lord sending his servants to call his people to the wedding feast, and his people rejecting him.

vs. 2 starts out by saying the kingdom of heaven is like unto a certain king (God) which made a marriage (reconciliation through the blood of Christ) for his son (us). Does not one prepare (being Spiritually born-again) by making themselves ready for the marriage by learning what is involved with the preperation before the time of the marriage begins. This is why the one without the wedding garment was cast out. God sends out His servants who have been Spiritually prepared to help those who need to make themselves ready. In a sense it's kinda like a wedding planner who helps with the preperation. The wedding garment (Gods righteousness) is now made ready for the marriage (kingdom of heaven).

BTW I do not appreciate your rudeness in talking down to others like you are so superior in the word thinking you hold all truths. I do not speak nonsense, but give what I believe to be truth by what I read just as everyone does.

 

[Deborah13]

vs. 2 starts out by saying the kingdom of heaven is like unto a certain king (God) which made a marriage (reconciliation through the blood of Christ) for his son (us). Does not one prepare (being Spiritually born-again) by making themselves ready for the marriage by learning what is involved with the preperation before the time of the marriage begins. This is why the one without the wedding garment was cast out. God sends out His servants who have been Spiritually prepared to help those who need to make themselves ready. In a sense it's kinda like a wedding planner who helps with the preperation. The wedding garment (Gods righteousness) is now made ready for the marriage (kingdom of heaven).

BTW I do not appreciate your rudeness in talking down to others like you are so superior in the word thinking you hold all truths. I do not speak nonsense, but give what I believe to be truth by what I read just as everyone does.

imo
I agree with what you have said here in addressing that the king is the Father. However, the marriage is for His Son, Jesus, we are the bride of the the Son, not the son.
I also agree with you that the one thrown out, having no wedding garment was not a saved person. He did not wear the garment of righteousness in Christ.
Who are the servants who were killed and who killed them? Remember Jesus came to instruct His fellow Jews about Himself as their long awaited Messiah. He clearly says in other scripture that He came first for the lost sheep of natural Israel. But that He had another fold that must be brought in. Two folds to make one.
It's not until verses 9-10 that we see servants sent out to all people after the invitation was given to the ones that were found to be unworthy.
We see the same type of analogy used in the husbandman who plants a vineyard. I actually prefer that one because it makes it very clear who the son is and that he is killed by that first group of people.

 

[Sinthesis]

It sometimes helps to understand various parables if one thinks of the 'people' in them as collective cultures, or corporate 'men', rather than individuals. Then in the Matt 22:1-13 parable we would have those cultures that don't acknowledge and honor the union of Christ with His church ultimately being condemned.