dirtfarmer here

[Jim Parker]

How do you get them to understand that Faith doesn't lead you to the cross, but rather leads you on forward from the cross?

I like that.
Mat 16:24 Then Jesus said to His disciples, “If anyone desires to come after Me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow Me."

How do you present the case so they begin to understand that their reliance on the written word for their relationship with the Lord is no different than that of the Pharisees and is akin to the children of Israel's rejection of the Spirit of the Lord insisting they will be obedient to the word given Moses instead.

Or; how do you explain to them that, without knowing the written word, you will be easily deceived by various spirits pretending to be God's Spirit.
It's not either-or. It's both the word and the spirit.

 

[ezrider]

Or; how do you explain to them that, without knowing the written word, you will be easily deceived by various spirits pretending to be God's Spirit.
It's not either-or. It's both the word and the spirit.

It's seems to be in moving beyond that schoolmaster thing.

 

[Conqueror]

How do you present the case so they begin to understand that their reliance on the written word for their relationship with the Lord is no different than that of the Pharisees ....................

You search the Scriptures, for in them you think you have eternal life;
and these are they which testify of Me. But you are
not willing to come to Me that you may have life (Jn 5:39-40).

Calvinists are prevented from receiving life,
as they have been deceived into having a lack of volition.

All those who worship a false Christ in the wafer-god
are also hindered from receiving life,
for they too are deceived
into having a fleeting experience with life already.

Like Nicodemus they aren't able to see the Kingdom of God (John 3:3).

Despite that fact Jesus tells them
to seek the Kingdom as a priority (Mat 6:33),
which makes many scramble to learn about God,
but turning to Jesus that they may have life (Jn 5:39-40)
becomes increasingly difficult,
when the unregenerate already claim to know everything.

One of my tasks is to sow seeds.




.

 

[Jim Parker]

It's seems to be in moving beyond that schoolmaster thing.

???

 

[ezrider]

Despite that fact Jesus tells them
to seek the Kingdom as a priority (Mat 6:33),
which makes many scramble to learn about God,
but turning to Jesus that they may have life (Jn 5:39-40)
becomes increasingly difficult,
when the unregenerate already claim to know everything.

One of my tasks is to sow seeds.

Does the master of the vineyard send his sevents into the fields to sow seed in the time of harvest?

 

[ezrider]

???

The written word, like the law, is our schoolmaster that leads us to Christ and the cross. From there Faith must begin to lead us on forward from the cross.

Paul speaks on Faith this wise:

Deuteronomy 30:10-14
If thou shalt hearken unto the voice of the Lord thy God, to keep his commandments and his statutes which are written in this book of the law, and if thou turn unto the Lord thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul.
For this commandment which I command thee this day, it is not hidden from thee, neither is it far off. It is not in heaven, that thou shouldest say, Who shall go up for us to heaven, and bring it unto us, that we may hear it, and do it? Neither is it beyond the sea, that thou shouldest say, Who shall go over the sea for us, and bring it unto us, that we may hear it, and do it? But the word is very nigh unto thee, in thy mouth, and in thy heart, that thou mayest do it.


Romans 10:5-8
For Moses describeth the righteousness which is of the law, That the man which doeth those things shall live by them. But the righteousness which is of faith speaketh on this wise, Say not in thine heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ down from above; Or, Who shall descend into the deep? (that is, to bring up Christ again from the dead.) But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach;

 

[Conqueror]

Does the master of the vineyard send his sevents into the fields to sow seed in the time of harvest?

Jesus chose twelve disciples and called them; apostles (Mat 10:2-4, John 6:70).

At the end of time there are still only twelve apostles
(minus Judas, who didn't follow Jesus plus untimely born Paul (1 Cor 15:8)
whose names are written on the foundations
of the new Jerusalem (Rev 21:9).

Luke manages to add seventy in his first work,
Matthias and Barnabas in his second work
to thereby minimise the influence of the apostolic witness (1 Cor 12:28, Eph 2:20)
However the apostolic word of God
binds on earth as it does in heaven (Mat 16:19).


.

 

[ezrider]

Jesus chose twelve disciples and called them; apostles (Mat 10:2-4, John 6:70).

At the end of time there are still only twelve apostles
(minus Judas, who didn't follow Jesus plus untimely born Paul (1 Cor 15:8)
whose names are written on the foundations
of the new Jerusalem (Rev 21:9).

Luke manages to add seventy in his first work,
Matthias and Barnabas in his second work
to thereby minimise the influence of the apostolic witness (1 Cor 12:28, Eph 2:20)
However the apostolic word of God
binds on earth as it does in heaven (Mat 16:19).


.

Yes, one furrows the soil and another cometh along and sows some seed. Another yet watereth, but it is God that giveth the increase.

But you did not answer my question. Does the master of the vineyard send his servants into the field to sow seed in the time of harvest? (I do not wish to think that you do not understand this question).

 

[Jim Parker]

The written word, like the law, is our schoolmaster that leads us to Christ and the cross. From there Faith must begin to lead us on forward from the cross.

Ah so des ka! Thanks for clarifying.

 

[Conqueror]

Jesus chose twelve disciples and called them; apostles (Mat 10:2-4, John 6:70).

At the end of time there are still only twelve apostles
(minus Judas, who didn't follow Jesus plus untimely born Paul (1 Cor 15:8)
whose names are written on the foundations
of the new Jerusalem (Rev 21:9).

Luke manages to add seventy in his first work,
Matthias and Barnabas in his second work
to thereby minimise the influence of the apostolic witness (1 Cor 12:28, Eph 2:20)
However the apostolic word of God
binds on earth as it does in heaven (Mat 16:19).
.

Yes, one furrows the soil and another cometh along and sows some seed. Another yet watereth, but it is God that giveth the increase.

But you did not answer my question. Does the master of the vineyard send his servants into the field to sow seed in the time of harvest? (I do not wish to think that you do not understand this question).

Yes, I did answer for Jesus only sent 12 into the field - Kingdom (Mat 13:24).
However that doesn't stop you and I sowing seeds well into the imminent harvest,
when the Roman Canon will be shaken to remove the poisonous darnel (Mat 13:25).



.

angels ... will gather out of His kingdom all things that offend (Mt 13:41).

 

[netchaplain]

Works have no part in justification, that is all by grace. It is sanctification that has works. After we are justified by grace we are a new creation and were created in Christ Jesus unto good works.
There are no works that can justify, but without works, one cannot be sanctified.

Hi DF! Just wanted to add that justification, righteousness, holiness and sanctification are all one package that precedes works, because no good works can can be done apart from them. The understanding of Jam 2:24 is in the word "justified," which has two meanings: to make one righteous (which we know is only by Christ); to manifest or show one is righteous (which applies in this passage). There's no way one who is reborn will not show it, and there's no way one who is not reborn can truly show it.

Blessings!

 

[Conqueror]

Hi DF! Just wanted to add that justification, righteousness, holiness and sanctification are all one package that precedes works, because no good works can can be done apart from them. The understanding of Jam 2:24 is in the word "justified," which has two meanings: to make one righteous (which we know is only by Christ); to manifest or show one is righteous (which applies in this passage). There's no way one who is reborn will not show it, and there's no way one who is not reborn can truly show it.

Blessings!

Are you able to tell me if one is justified by faith until works follow?

Or does that "dead faith" eventually leads to works?

Think carefully !!!!!

 

[ezra]

Hi DF! Just wanted to add that justification, righteousness, holiness and sanctification are all one package that precedes works, because no good works can can be done apart from them. The understanding of Jam 2:24 is in the word "justified," which has two meanings: to make one righteous (which we know is only by Christ); to manifest or show one is righteous (which applies in this passage). There's no way one who is reborn will not show it, and there's no way one who is not reborn can truly show it.

Blessings!

amen

 

[ezra]

Are you able to tell me if one is justified by faith until works follow?

Or does that "dead faith" eventually leads to works?

Think carefully !!!!!

the Bible says we are justified by faith AND GRACE
Romans 3:24 King James Version (KJV)
24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:

how soon we forget who justifies !!!! through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus: who paid the price? us or Christ ??? how about you explaining what dead faith is?

 

[stovebolts]

Thanks.

Not a problem.
Now that you understand that I comprehend your principals exactly, will you provide a supporting biblical example please.

 

[stovebolts]

Pretty much every religion on this planet pushes these principles. The mormons are good to go and have eternal life? They are the epitome of your list of fruits for eternal life.

OR is there a way for Christians to produce these fruits that are DIVINE and mormons are just plumb full of HUMAN good?

Is it wrong for them to bear fruits of the spirit?

 

[ezra]

Pretty much every religion on this planet pushes these principles.

there is a difference between religion and salvation Religion is a type of Godliness salvation is a relationship ..personally i fail to see how we can be a christian and not bear fruits.. jesus said we are be bear much fruit bring forth much fruit and more fruit.my point is we ar be bear fruit not be fruit inspectors..which we are all famous for

 

[LovethroughDove]

John 6:28-29 Then they asked him, "What must we do to do the works God requires?"
Jesus answered, "The work of God is this: to believe in the one he has sent."

John 3:18-19 "Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because he has not believed in the name of God's one and only Son."

John 3:21 "But whoever lives by the truth comes into the light, so that it may be seen plainly that what he has done has been done through God."

I think we can all agree on here that what "we" believe matters. That would be the "doing" on our end of things.
So, when we are given the Spirit of truth after we have believed in the one God has sent..........then we live by the truth.
Living by the truth means walking in the Spirit of truth. I don't know if that means doing good works or if it doesn't mean doing good works? It means living out your life in holiness......it means knowing right from wrong.........it means not wanting to disappoint Our Father in Heaven.......it means not wanting to make it look like Jesus didn't go to the cross for us.......it means we have the Holy Spirit in us

Our lives should reflect Christ
Bottom line is that there are a lot of wolves trying to be sheep, but fangs can't stay hidden forever

 

[netchaplain]

Are you able to tell me if one is justified by faith until works follow?

Or does that "dead faith" eventually leads to works?

Think carefully !!!!!

Hi and God bless! When the Spirit comes into a soul for rebirth, one is completely "perfected forever" (Heb 10:14) because he is "justified by the Blood of Christ" (Rom 5:9), and inevitably there will be the "fruit (works) of the Spirit justified (manifest or show) by the soul.

To me, "dead faith" is a phrase that describes having no faith, e.g. nonexistent faith, because their is no kind of faith that does not manifest (justify) works of the Spirit within.

 

[jasonc]

hello jasonc, dirtfarmer here

While I agree with your premise, there is the life that is changed that is the witness to the world. When a person that used to "cuss" and run with the ungodly suddenly changes because of salvation, questions begin to be ask about the change in that person and their attitude.

What is the best way to confess with words or with a changed life?

Which just negated your idea of we dont works.

Are you perfect ,do you have sins thar God says repent of,renewing your mind,an unction to help the poor,the sick, the widows,orphanns,etc.a calling ?

Thats all in the commands we are to do one of these,son are called into ministries excusevely for

But if you don't confess and show a changed life,neither expect to see heaven.that's what Matthew 7 says