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Do you support OSAS(once saved always saved)?

Does someone actually think that if someone who is saved and won't loose his Salvation, doesn't have to repent?

Listen, for the man who is part of the elect, predetermined by God to be saved, there must be a point in time whereby he comes to Christ the same as anyone else. That is to believe the Gospel, and put his faith and trust in Jesus Christ. As he continues to live out his life, he will sin. He needs to seek forgiveness, repent, and be forgiven just like anyone else.
 
It is because of Salvation that anyone repents. Here is what OSAS looks like as an equation. Salvation = repentance = the Christian life = everlasting life.
 
Mike S said:
Exactly as onelove stated in answer to your question, if one believes he is eternally saved, he has no reason to repent. Eternally saved without repentance is exactly what unconditional election means.
Click to expand...

Ok now I see what you are saying. The statement by onelove is all about Calvinism! not just eternally security.
That there is no need to repent because you were saved from the foundations of the world.

From what I can tell you could tie the Calvin back to back with Arminius, and have a tug of war and end up in exactly the same place.
 
Eph 1:9 making known to us the mystery of his will, according to his purpose, which he set forth in Christ
Eph 1:10 as a plan for the fullness of time, to unite all things in him, things in heaven and things on earth.
Eph 1:11 In him we have obtained an inheritance, having been predestined according to the purpose of him who works all things according to the counsel of his will,
Eph 1:12 so that we who were the first to hope in Christ might be to the praise of his glory.
Eph 1:13 In him you also, when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and believed in him, were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit,
Eph 1:14 who is the guarantee of our inheritance until we acquire possession of it, to the praise of his glory.

This my friends is God's promise to save those that He has foreordained to be saved, and to keep them saved until the resurrection. To say that person can loose that Salvation is to reject the power of the Holy Spirit, who is our guarantee, to keep us saved.
 
Chopper said:
Does someone actually think that if someone who is saved and won't loose his Salvation, doesn't have to repent?

Listen, for the man who is part of the elect, predetermined by God to be saved, there must be a point in time whereby he comes to Christ the same as anyone else. That is to believe the Gospel, and put his faith and trust in Jesus Christ. As he continues to live out his life, he will sin. He needs to seek forgiveness, repent, and be forgiven just like anyone else.
Click to expand...

I agree we continue to repent. So I understood the question as, why would someone need to repent if they are saved and cannot loose their salvation?
 
Deborah13 said:
Ok now I see what you are saying. The statement by onelove is all about Calvinism! not just eternally security.
That there is no need to repent because you were saved from the foundations of the world.

From what I can tell you could tie the Calvin back to back with Arminius, and have a tug of war and end up in exactly the same place.
Click to expand...


Yes, yes, yes...exactly right! It's why I've always believed it's a difference without a distinction...and as a Methodist I have an Arminian theology. Either way, repentance is required, we just don't know if we're doing it of our own free will or if we're predestined to do it. Since it makes no difference how we approach our salvation, why should we care?
 
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reba said:
Where does this appear in scripture, that we accept Christ as our Savior?

Thanks JLB

One reason to repent is so we can know God.

JLB

JLB where does this appear in scripture?
Click to expand...



As I said before to Deb, in answer to her question - So are you saying that the only reason to repent is so you won't go to hell?

She asked me that question because I said that Repent is linked to Salvation.

In the context of our discussion, I answered to her that - One reason to repent is so we can know God.

Meaning, it is not necessarily the only reason for Salvation, to avoid hell.


1 Jesus spoke these words, lifted up His eyes to heaven, and said: "Father, the hour has come. Glorify Your Son, that Your Son also may glorify You, 2 as You have given Him authority over all flesh, that He should give eternal life to as many as You have given Him. 3 And this is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent. John 17:1-3


Jesus' message to the lost was - Repent for the kingdom of God is at hand.

Turn to God. Repent!



JLB
 
Deborah13 said:
Ok now I see what you are saying. The statement by onelove is all about Calvinism! not just eternally security.
That there is no need to repent because you were saved from the foundations of the world.

From what I can tell you could tie the Calvin back to back with Arminius, and have a tug of war and end up in exactly the same place.
Click to expand...
:yes
 
Perhaps if I present Calvin's TULIP theory, and the problem I had with it, you might be able to see more clearly why I believe what I do.

Total depravity (no one is capable of saving oneself);
Unconditional election (God's choosing of the saved isn't conditioned by anything in them);
Limited atonement (Christ's atonement is adequate to save all people but it is efficient for God's elect only);
Irresistible grace (the sovereignly given gift of faith cannot be rejected by the elect);
Perseverance of the saints (those who are regenerated and justified will persevere in the faith).

Now I believe the T, U, I, P. I have a serious problem with the "Limited atonement", basically because of John 3:9 "Not wishing that any perish , but that all should reach repentance". (ESV) There are other verses that say pretty much the same thing. So as a teacher of the Word of God, I was not comfortable in my spirit to go along with limited atonement. There had to be an answer to the people who were not considered "elect".

I really don't know where I came up with the phrase "General Call of the Gospel". I had never heard of it before. It seemed to me that the Spirit of God wanted me to teach that, and over about 25 years I have taught the General Call of the Gospel. I firmly believe that everyone on the planet has an opportunity to hear, and respond to the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

I know that a lot of folk have a problem with Irrestible Grace of those who are predetermined by God to be saved. I like John 10:27-29 "
Joh 10:27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me.
Joh 10:28 I give them eternal life, and they will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of my hand.
Joh 10:29 My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all, and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father's hand.

Well, that's it in a nutshell....I was going to stop posting in this thread because I was getting frustrated, and that is no time to respond. I have settled down and after looking at a few posts, the teacher in me just couldn't stay away.
 
Chopper said:
Perhaps if I present Calvin's TULIP theory, and the problem I had with it, you might be able to see more clearly why I believe what I do.

Total depravity (no one is capable of saving oneself);
Unconditional election (God's choosing of the saved isn't conditioned by anything in them);
Limited atonement (Christ's atonement is adequate to save all people but it is efficient for God's elect only);
Irresistible grace (the sovereignly given gift of faith cannot be rejected by the elect);
Perseverance of the saints (those who are regenerated and justified will persevere in the faith).

Now I believe the T, U, I, P. I have a serious problem with the "Limited atonement", basically because of John 3:9 "Not wishing that any perish , but that all should reach repentance". (ESV) There are other verses that say pretty much the same thing. So as a teacher of the Word of God, I was not comfortable in my spirit to go along with limited atonement. There had to be an answer to the people who were not considered "elect".

I really don't know where I came up with the phrase "General Call of the Gospel". I had never heard of it before. It seemed to me that the Spirit of God wanted me to teach that, and over about 25 years I have taught the General Call of the Gospel. I firmly believe that everyone on the planet has an opportunity to hear, and respond to the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

I know that a lot of folk have a problem with Irrestible Grace of those who are predetermined by God to be saved. I like John 10:27-29 "
Joh 10:27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me.
Joh 10:28 I give them eternal life, and they will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of my hand.
Joh 10:29 My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all, and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father's hand.

Well, that's it in a nutshell....I was going to stop posting in this thread because I was getting frustrated, and that is no time to respond. I have settled down and after looking at a few posts, the teacher in me just couldn't stay away.
Click to expand...


I think we believe the same. The differences between Calvinism and Arminianism are not the easiest to untangle.
 
Chopper said:
Eph 1:9 making known to us the mystery of his will, according to his purpose, which he set forth in Christ
Eph 1:10 as a plan for the fullness of time, to unite all things in him, things in heaven and things on earth.
Eph 1:11 In him we have obtained an inheritance, having been predestined according to the purpose of him who works all things according to the counsel of his will,
Eph 1:12 so that we who were the first to hope in Christ might be to the praise of his glory.
Eph 1:13 In him you also, when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and believed in him, were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit,
Eph 1:14 who is the guarantee of our inheritance until we acquire possession of it, to the praise of his glory.

This my friends is God's promise to save those that He has foreordained to be saved, and to keep them saved until the resurrection. To say that person can loose that Salvation is to reject the power of the Holy Spirit, who is our guarantee, to keep us saved.
Click to expand...

Hi Chopper,

Actually, it's not. That's what were discussing in the Ephesians 1 thread.
 
Chopper said:
AND, you end up with beautiful children like those in your avatar that receive what God is presenting to them, the gift of Salvation. Suffer the children to come unto Me! Says Jesus....God bless the children.
Click to expand...


Thank you, they are beautiful children...and wonderful families. God is Good.
 
Mike S said:
Yes, yes, yes...exactly right! It's why I've always believed it's a difference without a distinction...and as a Methodist I have an Arminian theology. Either way, repentance is required, we just don't know if we're doing it of our own free will or if we're predestined to do it. Since it makes no difference how we approach our salvation, why should we care?
Click to expand...

If you're doing it of your own free will, you're responsible, if not you're not.
 
Butch5 said:
If you're doing it of your own free will, you're responsible, if not you're not.
Click to expand...


Yeah, a difference without a distinction, since I repent either way and never know if it's because I'm predestined to repent or if I repent of my own free will. It simply doesn't...make...a...difference. It's a nonsense theological issue, but has this consequence. If you believe in predestination, it's only a tiny step to "If evrything is predestined, it doesn't matter what I do since I have no control over it. So I might as well do whatever I want."



I actually started a thread on this very subject a while ago. The difference between Calvinism and Arminianism is the source of the disagreements between our early Methodist founders, John Wesley and George Whitefield. The vast majority of Methodists today are Arminianists.
 
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