Do you support OSAS(once saved always saved)?

[Sailingflutist-SF]

Now that your team has done its job... I explained that I was talking about the originators who "came up with" this dispensat idea, NOT anyone in this or recent generations and apologized but it wasn't good enough for you all. Bye

 

[reba]

A good guy said.... This online communication leaves a LOT to be desired.... and it is very true...

 

[Chopper]

Now that your team has done its job... I explained that I was talking about the originators who "came up with" this dispensat idea, NOT anyone in this or recent generations and apologized but it wasn't good enough for you all. Bye

Jim, I forgive you my Brother. You and I have had a good relationship in the past, lets keep that going....God bless!

 

[n2thelight]

The two letter little word that those who support OSAS,seem to forget is.......".IF.".........In other words,God said He would do this,,,,,,IF...One of the most important words in scripture,seems to often ignored,and not just from the OSAS crowd.....................

 

[Sailingflutist-SF]

Snide/snarky remarks implying that ones beliefs come from unbelievers, is truly disrespectful. Please refrain. You know the rules.

Not necessarily directed at the last poster.

Well I did have an apology before this caution but since I noticed the offending statement had been removed I I saw no need anymore for the apology: any who had read the offending statement would have read the apology. Well, I forgot that JLB had "preserved" the comment so I will reiterate the apology and hopefully in a better way: I apologize to Chopper and anyone else who may embrace dispensationalism. I was unkind and not gentle in Spirit. Please forgive me. Now that I have read what this is according to this link http://www.theopedia.com/Dispensationalism this is nothing at all what my past buddy tried to relay to me. It was so complex and ubelievable according to the Scriptures. It was about differnt dimensions and heavens and so much more I can't remember.

 

[JLB]

Yes sir. And it has been pointed out "they shall NEVER perish". Somehow we have changed the meaning of Never. The Lord knew that this doctrine would be attacked vehemently that He even threw in the double negative of "Never", meaning no, not ever!
The doctrine of eternal security actually starts with John 5:24~~"Truly, truly, I say to you, he who hears My word, and believes Him who sent Me, has eternal life, and does not come into judgment, but has passed out of death into life.

The "truly truly" is a point of doctrine and means that the reader needs to pay very careful attention to what is being said.When the Lord says, “Truly, truly” in the Greek, this is known as a sentential participle, which emphasizes an important point of doctrine. These two words actually mean, for certain, without a doubt, or indeed.

The phrase, “Truly, truly” or “Amen, amen” is used 25 times in the Bible, all found in the Gospel of John. Each time the phrase is used, it introduces a truth that is of the greatest importance, i.e., something we need to pay particular attention to.

And if one studies these "truly,Truly" Statements, they are the most attacked parts or counterfeited parts of the truth.

These are beautiful promises, and are a great comfort to us.

I for one am truly grateful that we have promises such as these, from the Lord.

"Most assuredly, I say to you, he who hears My word and believes in Him who sent Me has everlasting life, and shall not come into judgment, but has passed from death into life. John 5:24

However, it is conditional on hearing the word, and believing in Him who sent Jesus, which is exactly what He taught His disciples in the parable of the Sower.


"Therefore hear the parable of the sower: 19 When anyone hears the word of the kingdom, and does not understand it, then the wicked one comes and snatches away what was sown in his heart. This is he who received seed by the wayside. Matthew 13:19


Here is a statement that Jesus made in Matthew 13, when He has just given the parable of the sower.

Verse 12 says - For whoever has, to him more will be given, and he will have abundance; but whoever does not have, even what he has will be taken away from him.


Gr8grace3, what is it that we must have in order for more to be given?


JLB

 

[Chopper]

Well I did have an apology before this caution but since I noticed the offending statement had been removed I I saw no need anymore for the apology: any who had read the offending statement would have read the apology. Well, I forgot that JLB had "preserved" the comment so I will reiterate the apology and hopefully in a better way: I apologize to Chopper and anyone else who may embrace dispensationalism. I was unkind and not gentle in Spirit. Please forgive me. Now that I have read what this is according to this link http://www.theopedia.com/Dispensationalism this is nothing at all what my past buddy tried to relay to me. It was so complex and ubelievable according to the Scriptures. It was about differnt dimensions and heavens and so much more I can't remember.

Jim, old Buddy, I receive your apology, and forgive you. If you would like too, you and I can go to the 1 on 1 debate forum and can discuss what I believe is a Biblical expression of believers in Christ Jesus who will never loose their Salvation, and those who could. I have been a student of John Calvin for years and his teachings in the "Institutes of the Christian Religion", one of the best presentations on the theology of Christianity IMO that there is. Although, I don't agree with one of his teachings, and I don't think you would either based on our previous and wonderful conversations....Love you my friend!

 

[Chopper]

The two letter little word that those who support OSAS,seem to forget is.......".IF.".........In other words,God said He would do this,,,,,,IF...One of the most important words in scripture,seems to often ignored,and not just from the OSAS crowd.....................

I agree with you totally onelove. You can go to my post #611 and view the IF's from just the Book of Hebrews.

 

[veryberry]

These are beautiful promises, and are a great comfort to us.

I for one am truly grateful that we have promises such as these, from the Lord.

"Most assuredly, I say to you, he who hears My word and believes in Him who sent Me has everlasting life, and shall not come into judgment, but has passed from death into life. John 5:24

However, it is conditional on hearing the word, and believing in Him who sent Jesus, which is exactly what He taught His disciples in the parable of the Sower.


"Therefore hear the parable of the sower: 19 When anyone hears the word of the kingdom, and does not understand it, then the wicked one comes and snatches away what was sown in his heart. This is he who received seed by the wayside. Matthew 13:19


Here is a statement that Jesus made in Matthew 13, when He has just given the parable of the sower.

Verse 12 says - For whoever has, to him more will be given, and he will have abundance; but whoever does not have, even what he has will be taken away from him.


Gr8grace3, what is it that we must have in order for more to be given?


JLB

John 5:24 - Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, HATH everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.

Notice the word I have in bold. It is HATH, which is have or even has. Meaning, already in possession. I have everlasting life. Not, I might have everlasting life. I HAVE it. I done nothing for it. It was given to me as a gift from God because of what the Lord Jesus Christ did. If it is taken away from me, guess what? It is not EVERLASTING. If it is taken away, it had an ending. Everlasting means with out end, eternal. Once you are given everlasting life, It can not be conditional.

 

[reba]

when does ever lasting life begin?

 

[veryberry]

when does ever lasting life begin?

John 6:47 - Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me hath everlasting life.

When you believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, you have everlasting life.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

John 5:24 - Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, HATH everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.

Notice the word I have in bold. It is HATH, which is have or even has. Meaning, already in possession.

Nobody's claiming otherwise. When you believe you receive eternal life. But you must keep believing in order to keep the promise of eternal life.

I have everlasting life. Not, I might have everlasting life. I HAVE it. I done nothing for it. It was given to me as a gift from God because of what the Lord Jesus Christ did.

What do you mean you did nothing for it? You believed. That is how you received the promise of eternal life. Stop believing and you no longer have the promise that believing secures.

Once you are given everlasting life, It can not be conditional.

It was given on condition of you believing in God's forgiveness. It remains conditional on you believing in the word of God's forgiveness, the gospel:

"Now I make known to you, brethren, the gospel which I preached to you, which also you received, in which also you stand,2 by which also you are saved, if you hold fast the word which I preached to you, unless you believed in vain." (1 Corinthians 15:1-2 NASB)

"22 ...He has now reconciled you in His fleshly body through death, in order to present you before Him holy and blameless and beyond reproach—23 if indeed you continue in the faith firmly established and steadfast, and not moved away from the hope of the gospel that you have heard..." (Colossians 1:22-23 NASB)

Don't confuse the 'doing' of believing with the 'doing' of the things that Paul says can not justify. That's the mistake the church has made. They think that if we do the believing that makes it a works gospel. But Paul contrasts believing with the works that can not justify, not equates them:

28 For we maintain that a man is justified by faith apart from works of the Law." (Romans 3:28 NASB)

So how can we say justification is not conditioned on anything we do? Clearly, it's conditioned on our faith. A 'work' of faith (John 6:28-29 NASB) that must continue to the end to secure the bread from heaven that 'work' of believing secures, and which feeds us and gives us eternal life.

 

[veryberry]

Nobody's claiming otherwise. When you believe you receive eternal life. But you must keep believing in order to keep the promise of eternal life.



What do you mean you did nothing for it? You believed. That is how you received the promise of eternal life. Stop believing and you no longer have the promise that believing secures.



It was given on condition of you believing in God's forgiveness. It remains conditional on you believing in the word of God's forgiveness, the gospel:

"Now I make known to you, brethren, the gospel which I preached to you, which also you received, in which also you stand,2 by which also you are saved, if you hold fast the word which I preached to you, unless you believed in vain." (1 Corinthians 15:1-2 NASB)

"22 ...He has now reconciled you in His fleshly body through death, in order to present you before Him holy and blameless and beyond reproach—23 if indeed you continue in the faith firmly established and steadfast, and not moved away from the hope of the gospel that you have heard..." (Colossians 1:22-23 NASB)

Don't confuse the 'doing' of believing with the 'doing' of the things that Paul says can not justify. That's the mistake the church has made. They think that if we do the believing that makes it a works gospel. But Paul contrasts believing with the works that can not justify, not equates them:

28 For we maintain that a man is justified by faith apart from works of the Law." (Romans 3:28 NASB)

So how can we say justification is not conditioned on anything we do? Clearly, it's conditioned on our faith. A 'work' of faith (John 6:28-29 NASB) that must continue to the end to secure the bread from heaven that 'work' of believing secures, and which feeds us and gives us eternal life.

God said, that his Son, the Lord Jesus Christ, died for my sins. When he died, his blood was the payment and cleansed me of all sins. God said, it was done and that their was nothing that I needed to do. No works or anything and that the eternal life given to me was a gift. Jesus Christ was also buried and 3 days later, he rose from the dead, and has a glorified body. God said, that I will also be given a glorified body and be like his Son. To show his seriousness, God placed his holy spirit in me and one day, hopefully soon, Jesus will redeem me and give me my glorified body and I will live with him for eternity.

You say, I need to make sure I do something. God said, It has already been done.

 

[JLB]

John 5:24 - Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, HATH everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.

Notice the word I have in bold. It is HATH, which is have or even has. Meaning, already in possession. I have everlasting life. Not, I might have everlasting life. I HAVE it. I done nothing for it. It was given to me as a gift from God because of what the Lord Jesus Christ did. If it is taken away from me, guess what? It is not EVERLASTING. If it is taken away, it had an ending. Everlasting means with out end, eternal. Once you are given everlasting life, It can not be conditional.

I believe what Jesus said.

This is what Jesus said, however this is not the ONLY thing Jesus said.

"Most assuredly, I say to you, he who hears My word and believes in Him who sent Me has everlasting life, and shall not come into judgment, but has passed from death into life. John 5:24


This is what veryberry said - These words do not appear in John Chapter 5.

If it is taken away from me, guess what? It is not EVERLASTING. If it is taken away, it had an ending. Everlasting means with out end, eternal. Once you are given everlasting life, It can not be conditional.


If everlasting life stops residing in you, because you stop believing, it DOES NOT stop being everlasting life.

You have everlasting life as a result of: hearing His word and believing on Him who sent Jesus Christ.



I believe you have everlasting life.

I believe and hope you will continue in this until the end.


JLB


What must you have, in order for more to be given you? Matthew 13:12

 

[Jethro Bodine]

God said, it was done and that their was nothing that I needed to do. No works or anything and that the eternal life given to me was a gift.

How are you are missing the fact that you had to place your trust in that which God was giving as a free gift? That is what you are required to do to have the grace of salvation.

You say, I need to make sure I do something. God said, It has already been done.

You need to keep believing and trusting in what God has freely given. Stop doing that and you no longer have access to the gracious and merciful ministry of Christ to keep you blameless before God the Father.

"...we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ,2 through whom we have gained access by faith into this grace in which we now stand." (Romans 5: 1-2 NIV)

Faith is how you access God's grace. Abandon that faith and you no longer have access to God's grace.

 

[Butch5]

God said, that his Son, the Lord Jesus Christ, died for my sins. When he died, his blood was the payment and cleansed me of all sins. God said, it was done and that their was nothing that I needed to do. No works or anything and that the eternal life given to me was a gift. Jesus Christ was also buried and 3 days later, he rose from the dead, and has a glorified body. God said, that I will also be given a glorified body and be like his Son. To show his seriousness, God placed his holy spirit in me and one day, hopefully soon, Jesus will redeem me and give me my glorified body and I will live with him for eternity.

You say, I need to make sure I do something. God said, It has already been done.

Where did God say there was nothing you had to do?

Also, glorified means praised, what is a praised body?

 

[Deborah13]

I believe what Jesus said.

This is what Jesus said, however this is not the ONLY thing Jesus said.

"Most assuredly, I say to you, he who hears My word and believes in Him who sent Me has everlasting life, and shall not come into judgment, but has passed from death into life. John 5:24

In order for this verse to be reversed, one would have to die again.

"Most assuredly, I say to you, he who hears My word and believes in Him who sent Me has everlasting life, and shall not come into judgment, but has passed from death into life. John 5:24

This is what veryberry said - These words do not appear in John Chapter 5.

If it is taken away from me, guess what? It is not EVERLASTING. If it is taken away, it had an ending. Everlasting means with out end, eternal. Once you are given everlasting life, It can not be conditional.


If everlasting life stops residing in you, because you stop believing, it DOES NOT stop being everlasting life.

You have everlasting life as a result of: hearing His word and believing on Him who sent Jesus Christ.



I believe you have everlasting life.

I believe and hope you will continue in this until the end.


JLB


What must you have, in order for more to be given you? Matthew 13:12

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

2 Timothy 2:13;
"If we are faithless, he remains faithful".

 

[reba]

Hey guys this thread is the other never ending battle ....OSAS not WORKS

 

[veryberry]

Where did God say there was nothing you had to do?

Also, glorified means praised, what is a praised body?

Eph 2: 8-9
8. - For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9. - Not of works, lest any man should boast.

Romans 11: 6 - And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.