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Do you support OSAS(once saved always saved)?

allenwynne said:
2 Timothy 2:13;
"If we are faithless, he remains faithful".
Click to expand...
Why do people ignore what Paul said just before your quote?

12 If we deny Him, He also will deny us;
13 If we are faithless, He remains faithful...
(2 Timothy 2:12-13 NASB)

This shows us that God sees the difference between denying Christ, and being faithless. Being faithless is having a bad hair day in Christ...you know, the failures of the struggling, but sincere, Christian . Denying him altogether means abandoning the struggles of living for Christ, and abandoning the forgiveness of God in Christ and returning to the life you had.

"13 Those on the rocky soil are those who, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no firm root; they believe for a while, and in time of temptation fall away." (Luke 8:13 NASB)

"16 ...the ones on whom seed was sown on the rocky places, who, when they hear the word, immediately receive it with joy;17 and they have no firm root in themselves, but are only temporary; then, when affliction or persecution arises because of the word, immediately they fall away." (Mark 4:16-17 NASB)

You can not start out believing and then fall away and not produce the fruit of the kingdom and expect to still be saved on the Day of Wrath because you think OSAS. The scriptures simply do NOT defend this doctrine. Only overcomers will be saved on that Day, those who persevere in their faith and produce the fruit of the kingdom, not those who fell away but who think they're going to be saved because salvation in their minds is so utterly independent of anything they have to 'do'.

"10 ...many will fall away and will betray one another and hate one another. 12 ...most people’s love will grow cold.13 But the one who endures to the end, he will be saved." (Matthew 24:10,12-13 NASB)

It's time for another reformation to rid the church of this 'itching ears' doctrine once and for all.
 
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veryberry said:
Eph 2: 8-9
8. - For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9. - Not of works, lest any man should boast.
Click to expand...
We know that faith--the ability to know what you can't see is true--is a gracious gift from God. Faith is how we know the gospel is true. That's how every Christ rejecting person knows the gospel is true, but who then decide to turn their back to that truth.

It is by faith that we are able, if we so choose, to place our trust (aka 'believe') in that which we now know, through that gift of faith, to be true. Not everyone will do this. Most will reject the gracious testimony of the Holy Spirit instilling faith in the hearts of men and women so they can then trust in that truth and be saved.

The ability to know the gospel is true can not save a flea. You must place your trust in that which God has shown you through faith to be true about the gospel. This is the great deceit of mankind--thinking just knowing the gospel is true will save him, once and for all, not knowing that only those who believe and trust in what God graciously shows us to be true about the gospel through faith, and continue to believe and trust, will be saved through that gracious gift of faith.
 
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Psalm 23:6;
"And I will dwell in the house of the Lord forever".

There are some of us who know that we will dwell with the Lord forever.
There are others who doubt, period.

There is;
saving faith
the gift of faith
weak in faith
blind faith
a measure of faith.

It doesn't matter what faith you have, if you use it to believe in the one he has sent, he will save you.
What is so difficult about that?
God made the Gospel easy.
If not, then no one would be saved.
 
allenwynne said:
Psalm 23:6;
"And I will dwell in the house of the Lord forever".

There are some of us who know that we will dwell with the Lord forever.
There are others who doubt, period.

There is;
saving faith
the gift of faith
weak in faith
blind faith
a measure of faith.

It doesn't matter what faith you have, if you use it to believe in the one he has sent, he will save you.
What is so difficult about that?
God made the Gospel easy.
If not, then no one would be saved.
Click to expand...
The gospel is so simple. Salvation is so simple. Its the pride of man that gets in the way.

It is either you are saved or your not.
You either believe that Jesus Christ died for your sins, was buried, and rose again the third day or you don't. There is no in between. You were either persuaded of the truth or you weren't. If you say you believe, and then don't, you never believed in the first place and your belief was in vain. You were not persuaded of the truth.

If you rely on your way of life to ensure your salvation, then you are not believing. Jesus paid it all or he didn't. Jesus can keep you out of hell or he can't. So why worry about it? What can you do to keep yourself out of hell? Nothing!

Jesus Christ died for our sins, was buried, and rose again the third day. Believe it(be persuaded) and you have eternal life. It is that simple.
 
veryberry said:
The gospel is so simple. Salvation is so simple. Its the pride of man that gets in the way.

It is either you are saved or your not.
You either believe that Jesus Christ died for your sins, was buried, and rose again the third day or you don't. There is no in between. You were either persuaded of the truth or you weren't. If you say you believe, and then don't, you never believed in the first place and your belief was in vain. You were not persuaded of the truth.

If you rely on your way of life to ensure your salvation, then you are not believing. Jesus paid it all or he didn't. Jesus can keep you out of hell or he can't. So why worry about it? What can you do to keep yourself out of hell? Nothing!

Jesus Christ died for our sins, was buried, and rose again the third day. Believe it(be persuaded) and you have eternal life. It is that simple.
Click to expand...

1 "I am the true vine, and My Father is the vinedresser. 2 Every branch in Me that does not bear fruit He takes away; and every branch that bears fruit He prunes, that it may bear more fruit. 3 You are already clean because of the word which I have spoken to you. 4 Abide in Me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, unless it abides in the vine, neither can you, unless you abide in Me. 5 I am the vine, you are the branches. He who abides in Me, and I in him, bears much fruit; for without Me you can do nothing. 6 If anyone does not abide in Me, he is cast out as a branch and is withered; and they gather them and throw them into the fire, and they are burned. John 15:1-5

You are already clean because of the word which I have spoken to you.

If anyone does not abide in Me, he is cast out as a branch and is withered; and they gather them and throw them into the fire, and they are burned.


JLB
 
allenwynne said:
Romans 14:4;
"And they will stand, for the Lord is able to make them stand".
Click to expand...
If that's what you want to do, he is able to do that. Promise.

36 But keep on the alert at all times, praying that you may have strength to escape all these things that are about to take place, and to stand before the Son of Man.” (Luke 21:36 NASB)
 
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allenwynne said:
Psalm 23:6;
"And I will dwell in the house of the Lord forever".
Click to expand...
As long as you keep believing.


allenwynne said:
There are some of us who know that we will dwell with the Lord forever.
There are others who doubt, period.
Click to expand...
This is what I've been trying to say to you.

We need to stop projecting the surety of our own strong faith onto others who have weaker faith and stop misleading them by saying to them, "weak faith that can't overcome is good enough, so accept it and don't worry, be happy."



allenwynne said:
There is;
saving faith
the gift of faith
weak in faith
blind faith
a measure of faith.

It doesn't matter what faith you have, if you use it to believe in the one he has sent, he will save you.
What is so difficult about that?
God made the Gospel easy.
If not, then no one would be saved.
Click to expand...
Only faith that overcomes, and overcomes to the very end will save:

13 But the one who endures to the end, he will be saved." (Matthew 24:13 NASB)

But OSAS says your weak faith is good enough.
 
If a salvation is conditional on the bases of whether a believer believes they are forgiven, then OSAS people should not be a concerned brother's focus. They truly believe they are totally, absolutely forgiven, forever, and nothing can change that.
 
veryberry said:
You either believe that Jesus Christ died for your sins, was buried, and rose again the third day or you don't. There is no in between.
Click to expand...
But how does that mean you can't go from one to the other?


veryberry said:
If you say you believe, and then don't, you never believed in the first place and your belief was in vain. You were not persuaded of the truth.
Click to expand...
No, what it means is your faith is weak and can not endure to the end.

"...they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no firm root; they believe for a while, and in time of temptation fall away." (Luke 8:13 NASB)


veryberry said:
If you rely on your way of life to ensure your salvation, then you are not believing. Jesus paid it all or he didn't. Jesus can keep you out of hell or he can't. So why worry about it? What can you do to keep yourself out of hell? Nothing!
Click to expand...
What can you do? Believe. And believe to the very end. That is how you keep yourself out of hell.


veryberry said:
Jesus Christ died for our sins, was buried, and rose again the third day. Believe it(be persuaded) and you have eternal life.
Click to expand...
And keep believing it to the very end...

22...He has now reconciled you in His fleshly body through death, in order to present you before Him holy and blameless and beyond reproach—23 if indeed you continue in the faith firmly established and steadfast, and not moved away from the hope of the gospel..." (Colossians 1:22-23 NASB)

Why is this not plain and simple enough for some?
 
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Deborah13 said:
If a salvation is conditional on the bases of whether a believer believes they are forgiven, then OSAS people should not be a concerned brother's focus. They truly believe they are totally, absolutely forgiven, forever, and nothing can change that.
Click to expand...
And what they need to do is stop telling others who don't have that surety of faith that they do.
 
Jethro Bodine said:
Yes, I do.

What I've stopped doing is telling those who don't have the surety of faith that they do.

And I've stopped telling those who fail that it shows they were never saved to begin with.
Click to expand...


People need to be taught correctly, what the Bible says about this precious Salvation we have.

A baby Christian needs to be encouraged that God will never leave them nor forsake them.

A strong foundation should be within each believer, built upon the Rock of God's unfailing love for each of us.

As they progress and mature more and more can be given.

Strong meat is for the mature.

Those that are weak in faith should not be beat over the head with scriptures about being severed from Christ.

It takes Wisdom to bring a babe to maturity.

Never the less, what Jethro has presented is straight from the Apostles Doctrine.



JLB
 
Matthew 7:21-23 "Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven...
I'm sure the verse has already been brought to this discussion but to me it is saying that there will be people that think they are saved but find out at the time of judgment that they aren't.
 
jeff77 said:
Matthew 7:21-23 "Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven...
I'm sure the verse has already been brought to this discussion but to me it is saying that there will be people that think they are saved but find out at the time of judgment that they aren't.
Click to expand...
Finish the verse...

21. Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
22. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
23. And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Look at these verses carefully. Why is it that these people believe that they should enter the kingdom? Because they are trusting in what they have done. I am here to tell you, if you are trusting in anything that you do for salvation, you will not make it and be cast into the fiery pits of hell.
 
It is not the "surety of OUR faith" that saves the Christian. It is the Surety of the grace/mercy from the object(Christ) of our faith that saves us and keeps us secure.
 
Salvation and eternal security of the believer IS the milk of the word. If the believer is not going to get past salvation and eternal security, meat will never be metabolized and applied in the believers life.
 
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