Does Demon Possession get confused with the Concurrent Resurrection of the Spirit Body within the Physical?

[JLB]

The new thread about knowing the power of the resurrection of Christ is made in the theology forum just now.

Why would I entertain another discussion with you when you refuse to answer simple question about the subject we are discussing.

I honestly don’t know where you stand or what you believe about the resurrection.


Please answer these simple questions, so our discussion can progress, and thereby become fruitful.



Do you believe the resurrection of the dead in Christ occurs at His coming?

Do you believe the resurrection of the dead in Christ occurs on the last day?



Thanks, JLB

 

[gordon777]

Resurrection is not confessed by those who have a form of godliness, as they deny the power thereof.

The resurrection of Jesus Christ is our resurrection, as He gave us that power to be the sons of God, ( to be born of Him in Spirit, not of blood or of the flesh, as flesh and blood does not inherit the kingdom of God which is the resurrection of Christ in us now. John 1:12-13. 1 Corinthians 15:50) to know the power of His resurrection.

False prophets in the days of the children of Israel, always spoke of things far off, never for the present time, that is why they were false, and Jesus said many false prophets rise to deceive many.

1 Corinthians 15 is denied by those many Jesus warned about, as denying that the entire chapter is in regards to the mystery of Christ in us ( as He is the resurrection and the life which occurs before those false prophets speak of, and we are quickened together with Christ already, as He does not come with observation. John 11;25-26. 1 Corinthians 15:26. Ephesians 2:1. 2:5.)




2 Timothy 3:5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.

Philippians 3:10 That I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings, being made conformable unto his death;




1 Corinthians 15:50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.

John 1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:
13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.


The false prophets who speak their own thing and always speak for future tense, as they have nothing but their own word to share.


Jeremiah 23:16 Thus saith the Lord of hosts, Hearken not unto the words of the prophets that prophesy unto you: they make you vain: they speak a vision of their own heart, and not out of the mouth of the Lord.
17 They say still unto them that despise me, The Lord hath said, Ye shall have peace; and they say unto every one that walketh after the imagination of his own heart, No evil shall come upon you.

Ezekiel 12:27 Son of man, behold, they of the house of Israel say, The vision that he seeth is for many days to come, and he prophesieth of the times that are far off.
28 Therefore say unto them, Thus saith the Lord God; There shall none of my words be prolonged any more, but the word which I have spoken shall be done, saith the Lord God.

Matthew 24:11 And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many.

1 John 4:1 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.

 

[gordon777]

John 3:8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.

Luke 17:20 And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation:
21 Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.

Colossians 1:27 To whom God would make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in you, the hope of glory:

 

[gordon777]

I know the false prophets cant be stopped, only exposed, but let everybody know, how much the resurrection of Jesus Christ is neither understood by them, nor confessed, but is denied for the power of God given to us to be risen with Christ. ( resurrected)


Colossians 2:12 Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.

 

[Free]

Luk 20:34 Jesus answered and said to them, "The sons of this age marry and are given in marriage.
Luk 20:35 But those who are counted worthy to attain that age, and the resurrection from the dead, neither marry nor are given in marriage;

The word "age" in v35 was my specific point of focus.
The quoted material was form Vine's Dictionary, Section 1 paragraph 3.
I should have said, "attain that world", rather than "unto that world".
The point is that the underlying meaning may be rendered as "age" or "world", depending on your theological framework. I am not the first person to transliterate this in this manner. I am not the only person who has or does understand scripture in this manner. There are pros and cons concerning the results of understanding either way. It is, however, necessary for my view to be promoted as well as your mainstream perspective. This is not a new debate.

But I don't see how any of this changes the meaning of what Jesus is saying. He is comparing this age with the age that is to come, that is, at the summation of all things, when he returns and the physically dead are resurrected and those believers who are alive are changed to become incorruptible.

Here is what Matthew and Mark have in the same account (all ESV):

Mat 22:30 For in the resurrection they neither marry nor are given in marriage, but are like angels in heaven.

Mar 12:25 For when they rise from the dead, they neither marry nor are given in marriage, but are like angels in heaven.

The whole discussion is plainly speaking of a future resurrection event and makes absolutely no sense in speaking of an ongoing resurrection. I see that you've once again argued to the "present tense" of Matthew 22:30, but, as I have pointed out before, the understanding being presented is that of the future. One can speak in present tense and still be referring the future; we do it all the time. Mark's account is of more clearly future, but it is consistently speaking of the future in all three accounts. Look at Matthew 22:28--"whose wife will she be?" is future.

Not to mention, again, that making it refer to a concurrent resurrection makes absolutely no sense in the context. How is it, exactly, that concurrent resurrection has any bearing whatsoever on marrying or not? The entire context is speaking of a future physical resurrection. It simply cannot be otherwise.

I made this clear enough, but as a reminder, your position that the general resurrection is all future tense mostly depends upon "the coming of the Lord" as being only an end-time phenomenon. The above proven fact that "the coming of the Lord" also refers to the His personal manifestation to individual believers throughout history, means that those passages concerning resurrection may rightly be interpreted as meaning a non-en-mass concurrent resurrection, as I contend.

Yes, Christ indwells all believers through the Holy Spirit--he is in us and we are in him--but both passages you cite refer to the second coming of Christ. You seem to be making unwarranted delineations between believers.

This is the obvious place for you to start, as none of the verses that you quoted are conclusive, and this one superficially seems so. The "man to die once" is here referring only to the physical body, as the rest of the verse concerns the soul or soul/spirit, which continues to live on after physical death. The part "after that comes judgement" is fairly conclusive as to an ongoing judgement, as there is no mention of a waiting period.

Throughout the entire Bible, it is consistently taught that we live, we die, then there is a resurrection for all and all are judged. The NT does add, or at least makes much more clear, that we live spiritually after physical death.

Looking again at Heb 9:27, I will include verse 28 also:

Heb 9:27 And just as it is appointed for man to die once, and after that comes judgment,
Heb 9:28 so Christ, having been offered once to bear the sins of many, will appear a second time, not to deal with sin but to save those who are eagerly waiting for him. (ESV)

Christ died once and will appear a second time "to save those who are eagerly waiting for him," that is, all believers. Notice that that is being compared to man being "appointed to die once, and after that comes judgement"--verse 27 starts with "And just as it is," and verse 28 begins with "so Christ." That is, the two are parallel thoughts--man dies once and Christ bore man's since once; then comes judgement for man and Christ comes a second time to save believers (and, by extension, to not save unbelievers).

As for transmigration being works based, due to it's association with karma; no, I've made it clear that my understanding of salvation is faith based. As for your concern about being categorized with new age, eastern, cults, liberals, or gnostic, such a categorization would be false. If I can not find support for a speculative interpretation based on a comprehensive interpretation of scripture, then I do not consider it to be worthwhile. Salvation, even incremental salvation, is not based on exalted knowledge, only on faith regarding simple knowledge. Even so, there is much benefit in pursuing a higher understanding of scripture, and the scripture itself does urge it. As for danger, I am no stranger to it. The reformation is ongoing, and dangerous. Even so, this is the work that my life, and my God, has led me to do. I will not live in this flesh forever. I will accomplish some thing for Him who has accomplished so much for me.

Be blessed, be well.

Yes, there is much more that can be gleaned from Scripture than English translations will allow, and those with expertise in Hebrew and Greek can understand, but that "higher understanding" will never contradict a plain meaning of the text. Transmigration of souls, or reincarnation, is categorically taught nowhere in Scripture and is not a Christian concept. As such, it is false, and all who claim to be Christian would do well to avoid it.

 

[for_his_glory]

The resurrection of Jesus Christ is our resurrection

The resurrection of Jesus was for us to repent and walk in newness of life to all who will by faith believe in Him and are indwelled with the Holy Spirit given us when we are Spiritually born again from above. This is a Spiritual resurrection unlike the resurrection in the last day when Christ returns.
John 3:5-7; 3:16-21; Romans 6:1-14; Colossians 3:1-4; John 5:28-29; 6:40

1 Corinthians 15 is denied by those many Jesus warned about, as denying that the entire chapter is in regards to the mystery of Christ in us ( as He is the resurrection and the life which occurs before those false prophets speak of, and we are quickened together with Christ already, as He does not come with observation. John 11;25-26. 1 Corinthians 15:26. Ephesians 2:1. 2:5.)

John 11:25 Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live:
John 11:26 And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?

Jesus is speaking about having Spiritual life in him that will be raised on the last day to eternal life with Him. Those who do not believe in Jesus are called Spiritually dead within while they are alive rejecting Jesus, but those who have died before Christ returns will be resurrected from their graves to damnation, John 5:28-29.

1Cor 15:26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.

This verse is talking about those who are Spiritually dead rejecting Christ who will be cast into the lake of fire after Jesus returns and final judgements are rendered after the one and only resurrection when Christ returns. Compare this with Matthew 25:31-34; 45-46; Rev 20:14-15 as again this is talking about the second death after the resurrection when Christ returns and final judgements are made as the first death is Spiritual death and the second death being physical death of the body.

Rev 20:14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
Rev 20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

 

[Free]

And incidentally, this second quote below supports another aspect of this debate; who are the just and unjust resurrected?
Act 24:15 I have hope in God, which they themselves also accept, that there will be a resurrection of the dead, both of the just and the unjust.

In the second quote, Christ suffered for the "unjust", who are equated with "us", who are being "quickened by the Spirit". That indicates that in the first quote the "unjust" are the faithful Christians, and the "just" are the faithful Jews of the first covenant.

The unjust are unbelievers, the unrighteous. The Greek word for "unjust" is adikos, and is used 12 times in the NT. It is translated 8 times as "unrighteous," three times as "unjust," once as "wicked," and once as "unjustly."

https://www.biblestudytools.com/lexicons/greek/nas/adikos.html

There is absolutely nothing in 1 Pe 3:18 to suggest what you have stated.

1Pe 3:18 For Christ also suffered once for sins, the just for the unjust, that He might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh but made alive by the Spirit, (NKJV)

Peter is clearly calling Christ "the just" and those he died for "the unjust." Which is exactly what happened. Look at what Paul wrote in Romans 5:

Rom 5:6 For when we were still without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly.
Rom 5:7 For scarcely for a righteous man will one die; yet perhaps for a good man someone would even dare to die.
Rom 5:8 But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us.
Rom 5:9 Much more then, having now been justified by His blood, we shall be saved from wrath through Him.
Rom 5:10 For if when we were enemies we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, much more, having been reconciled, we shall be saved by His life. (NKJV)

This is exactly what Peter is saying with one sentence. Very clearly, and consistently throughout the NT, the unjust are the unrighteous, the ungodly, sinners, for whom Christ died, and it is only those who put their trust in Christ that are reconciled to God, "made alive by the Spirit," and will be saved.

Therefore, there is no support for a resurrection of the wicked, who are unjust but unsaved, as universalism, and partial universalism, is untrue.
Be blessed, be well.

You seem to be falsely equating resurrection with being saved. This is one of the errors your understanding is leading you to. Look at what Jesus says:

Joh 5:28 Do not marvel at this; for the hour is coming in which all who are in the graves will hear His voice
Joh 5:29 and come forth—those who have done good, to the resurrection of life, and those who have done evil, to the resurrection of condemnation. (NKJV)

As I have pointed out previously, Revelation says exactly that same thing:

Rev 20:11 Then I saw a great white throne and Him who sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away. And there was found no place for them.
Rev 20:12 And I saw the dead, small and great, standing before God, and books were opened. And another book was opened, which is the Book of Life. And the dead were judged according to their works, by the things which were written in the books.
Rev 20:13 The sea gave up the dead who were in it, and Death and Hades delivered up the dead who were in them. And they were judged, each one according to his works.
Rev 20:14 Then Death and Hades were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
Rev 20:15 And anyone not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire. (NKJV)

This is at the summation of all things, Christ having returned and now judges the dead. Notice that all the dead are there and those whose names are "not found written in the Book of Life" are "cast into the lake of fire." That means there are both believers and unbelievers present, which is precisely what Christ said in John 5.

 

[gordon777]

The Sedducees ( and Pharisees) did not have the Word of God abiding in them. The work of God ( for Israel questioning Jesus) was to believe in the Son, whom the Father had sent into the world.

The will of God was for all who saw the Son to believe on Him, to have everlasting life ( in them) to be risen up the last day. The Sedducees and Pharisees did not receive Christ ( to believe in Him) that Christ gave power to become the sons of God, tho those who believed on His name.





John 1;12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:

John 6:40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

John 5:38 And ye have not his word abiding in you: for whom he hath sent, him ye believe not.

John 6:29 Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.

John 6:40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.





Then came the same Sedducees which did not believe in a resurrection, they did not believe in Christ the Son of God, who is the resurrection and the life.( John 11:25 whosoever lives and believes in Christ shall never die.)



Mark 12:18 Then come unto him the Sadducees, which say there is no resurrection; and they asked him, saying,



Jesus immediately shows how the Sedducees ( who do not believe in the resurrection, do not believe in the name of Christ, who is the resurrection and the life.) err, for not knowing( believing) the scriptures and the power of God( as in the scriptures they describe how God gave power to become born of God)

That power of God is the resurrection of knowing Jesus Christ, and of rising from the dead in this life, as He is the light of life. (John 1:4 In him was life; and the life was the light of men.)

Then they neither marry nor are given in marriage, and are instead as the angels which are in heaven.





Mark 12:23 In the resurrection therefore, when they shall rise, whose wife shall she be of them? for the seven had her to wife.
24 And Jesus answering said unto them, Do ye not therefore err, because ye know not the scriptures, neither the power of God?
25 For when they shall rise from the dead, they neither marry, nor are given in marriage; but are as the angels which are in heaven.



The dead rise, God is the Gd of the living, and the Sedducees greatly err, not believing in Jesus Christ and that He is the resurrection.




Mark 12:26 And as touching the dead, that they rise: have ye not read in the book of Moses, how in the bush God spake unto him, saying, I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob?
27 He is not the God of the dead, but the God of the living: ye therefore do greatly err.



There are children of this world and there are children of God.

But they who are accounted worthy to obtain that world( of God) and the resurrection from the dead, neither marry nor are given in marriage. They cant die any more, are equal to the angels and are the children of God, the children of the resurrection.

All live unto God as God is not of the dead but of the living( the Sedducees err by not believing that Jesus Christ is the living God is the resurrection and the life, came to give man power to become the sons of God.)



Luke 20:34 And Jesus answering said unto them, The children of this world marry, and are given in marriage:
35 But they which shall be accounted worthy to obtain that world, and the resurrection from the dead, neither marry, nor are given in marriage:
36 Neither can they die any more: for they are equal unto the angels; and are the children of God, being the children of the resurrection.

Luke 20:38 For he is not a God of the dead, but of the living: for all live unto him.




The children of this world do continue to marry and be given in marriage, and they continue to dispute, not knowing the scriptures or the power of God ( that belief in Jesus Christ is the resurrection and the life)

Also the distinction is made between those ( children of this world) and the children of light ( as the Son of God is the light of life, and is the light of men. John 1:4)

The children according to the course of this world, are the children of disobedience, which work through the spirit of the prince of the air, the god of this world. 2 Corinthians 4:4. ( faith is the obedience of Christ. Romans 16:26, which is for the children of God.)

Those spirits, of the children of this world, do not confess that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh and are NOT OF GOD. ( of children of God) they are the spirit of antichrist come into the world.

But we are of God ( children of God) and have overcome them, for greater is He that is in us ( little children of God) than he that is in the world( the spirit of antichrist)




John 1:4 In him was life; and the life was the light of men.

Luke 16:8 And the lord commended the unjust steward, because he had done wisely: for the children of this world are in their generation wiser than the children of light.

Ephesians 2:2 Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:

1 John 4:3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.
4 Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.
5 They are of the world: therefore speak they of the world, and the world heareth them.





Matthew 19 shows how not marrying or being given in marriage began by belief in Jesus Christ.

Also we are the angels of the Lord that excel in strength( the power God gave to become the sons of God and children of God, and not of this world) and are the elect angels, and are equal and as the angels of God as all reveals now.)







Psalm 103:20 Bless the Lord, ye his angels, that excel in strength, that do his commandments, hearkening unto the voice of his word.

1 Timothy 5:21 I charge thee before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, and the elect angels, that thou observe these things without preferring one before another, doing nothing by partiality.

Matthew 19:12 For there are some eunuchs, which were so born from their mother's womb: and there are some eunuchs, which were made eunuchs of men: and there be eunuchs, which have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven's sake. He that is able to receive it, let him receive it.




The days of Noah are the same as the day of Christ.

All ( the children of this world marrying and giving in marriage) eating and drinking marrying and being given in marriage, and they did not know of the end. So shall the day of Christ be ( the children of this world all eating and drinking, marrying and being given in marriage, as the children of this world marry and are given in marriage.)




Matthew 24:37 But as the days of Noah were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
38 For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,
39 And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

 

[gordon777]

Then the way the disciples followed, is simple to know now, it is to have left all.

To have left house, brothers, sisters, or father, or mother, or children or lands, for the sake of Jesus Christ and the gospel, to receive in this time, houses and brothers and sisters and mothers and children and lands with persecutions, and in the world to come eternal life.

Because to know the power of the resurrection of Jesus Christ, is to leave all as also Apostle Paul now shares, and this is to have eternal life.



Mark 10:28 Then Peter began to say unto him, Lo, we have left all, and have followed thee.
29 And Jesus answered and said, Verily I say unto you, There is no man that hath left house, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my sake, and the gospel's,
30 But he shall receive an hundredfold now in this time, houses, and brethren, and sisters, and mothers, and children, and lands, with persecutions; and in the world to come eternal life.

Philippians 3:8 Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ,

Philippians 3:10 That I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings, being made conformable unto his death;
11 If by any means I might attain unto the resurrection of the dead.

1 John 5:13 These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.

1 John 5:20 And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

 

[gordon777]

Heb 9:27 And just as it is appointed for man to die once, and after that comes judgment,
Heb 9:28 so Christ, having been offered once to bear the sins of many, will appear a second time, not to deal with sin but to save those who are eagerly waiting for him. (ESV)

Christ died once and will appear a second time "to save those who are eagerly waiting for him," that is, all believers. Notice that that is being compared to man being "appointed to die once, and after that comes judgement"--verse 27 starts with "And just as it is," and verse 28 begins with "so Christ." That is, the two are parallel thoughts--man dies once and Christ bore man's since once; then comes judgement for man and Christ comes a second time to save believers (and, by extension, to not save unbelievers).

God has not appointed us to wrath ( death) but to obtain salvation ( eternal life) by our Lord Jesus Christ, WHO DIED FOR US, so we live together with Him. ( not die)

Through death Jesus destroyed him that had the power of death ( the devil) and delivered us who had fear of death and all of our lifetime were subject to bondage ( fear of death and appointed to die.)

So Christ was offered to bear those sins of many ( who previously died in our sins) and we look to Christ ( in heaven which is in us) for Christ to appear without sin in us, to salvation.




1 Thessalonians 5:9 For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,
10 Who died for us, that, whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with him.

Hebrews 2:14 Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil;
15 And deliver them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage.

Hebrews 9:27 And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:
28 So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation.



Now instead of being subject to fear of death ( being appointed to die) through being dead in our sins, we were dead in our sins, now we are quickened together with Christ ( that is knowing the power of His resurrection) and through Christ are dead to sin, and alive to God through Jesus Christ our Lord, now we yield ourselves as those who are alive from the dead, as we live through the only begotten Son sent in to the world( and we know the antichrist does not confess that Christ has come in the flesh.)





Romans 6:11 Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Romans 6:13 Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God.

Ephesians 2:5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;)

1 John 4:9 In this was manifested the love of God toward us, because that God sent his only begotten Son into the world, that we might live through him.

 

[gordon777]

The resurrection of Jesus was for us to repent and walk in newness of life to all who will by faith believe in Him and are indwelled with the Holy Spirit given us when we are Spiritually born again from above. This is a Spiritual resurrection unlike the resurrection in the last day when Christ returns.
John 3:5-7; 3:16-21; Romans 6:1-14; Colossians 3:1-4; John 5:28-29; 6:40

The Spiritual resurrection is to be Spirit and not flesh, and it is the kingdom of God entering us now, and we entering the kingdom of God.

Neither will that come with observation ( not now, not ever, and not after) as the kingdom of God does not come with observation, not to say here, or there, as the kingdom of God is within us.



John 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

Luke 17:20 And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation:
21 Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.



Read the words, that like Jesus was raised up from the dead ( resurrected) even so we ( resurrected.) walk in newness, of life.

We were planted inn the likeness of his death ( sown in weakness. 1 Corinthians 15:43.)

We are also ( planted) in the likeness of His resurrection. ( raised in power. 1 Corinthians 15:43.)

Our old man is crucified with Him, the body of sin is destroyed. ( it was sown a natural body/planted in the likeness of his death.)

Now if we be dead with Christ ( planted together in the likeness of His death/sown in weakness.) we believe that we shall also live with Him ( raised in power. ) knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dies no more, death has no more dominion.




Romans 6:4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:
6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.

Romans 6:8 Now if we be dead with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with him:
9 Knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dieth no more; death hath no more dominion over him.

1 Corinthians 15:42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:
43 It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power:
44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.




If we are risen with Christ we seek what is above, where Christ sits on the right hand of God.

Setting the affections on above, not on the earth, as we are dead, and our life is hid with Christ, Christ is our life, when Christ shall appear ( who is above and not on the earth) then we also shall appear with Him in glory. ( that is the resurrection of the dead, we are raised in glory, after we were sown in weakness and dishonour, as we are crucified with Christ, Romans 6:6, who was crucified through weakness, we also are weak in Him, but we live with Him by the power of God ( 2 Corinthians 13:4)/ knowing the power of His resurrection. Philippians 3;10.)





2 Corinthians 13:4 For though he was crucified through weakness, yet he liveth by the power of God. For we also are weak in him, but we shall live with him by the power of God toward you.

Romans 6:6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.


Colossians 3:1 If ye then be risen with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ sitteth on the right hand of God.
2 Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth.
3 For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God.
4 When Christ, who is our life, shall appear, then shall ye also appear with him in glory.



That is the glory, 9 to appear with Him in glory) to be justified and glorified, that the name of Jesus Christ may be glorified in us and we ( glorified) in Him, according to the grace of our God and the Lord Jesus Christ.




1 Corinthians 15:43 It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power:

Romans 8:30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

2 Thessalonians 1:12 That the name of our Lord Jesus Christ may be glorified in you, and ye in him, according to the grace of our God and the Lord Jesus Christ.

1 Peter 4:14 If ye be reproached for the name of Christ, happy are ye; for the spirit of glory and of God resteth upon you: on their part he is evil spoken of, but on your part he is glorified.





All in the graves heard the voice of Jesus Christ, they who did good come to the resurrection of life ( come to the resurrection of Jesus Christ) and they that have done evil, to the resurrection of damnation ( the resurrection of the devil)

Every one that does evil ( of the resurrection of damnation) hates the light neither comes to the light.

He that does truth comes to the light ( the resurrection, of knowing the power, of the resurrection of Jesus Christ.)

That is the resurrection of the just and the unjust, ( to know the power of the resurrection of Jesus Christ, or to know the power of satan and the resurrection of damnation. Acts 26:18.) and therefore we exercise ourselves, to have ALWAYS, a conscience, void of offence, toward God and toward man.




John 3:20 For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved.

John 3:21 BUT HE THAT DOETH TRUTH COMETH TO THE LIGHT, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God.

John 5:28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,
29 AND SHALL COME FORTH, THEY THAT HAVE DONE GOOD UNTO THE RESURRECTION OF LIFE; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

Acts 24:15 And have hope toward God, which they themselves also allow, that there shall be a resurrection of the dead, both of the just and unjust.
16 And herein do I exercise myself, to have always a conscience void to offence toward God, and toward men.




Marvel not that all in the graves heard the voice of the Son of man, because the sound went into all the earth, and their words to the ends of the world. ( even though they have not heard with ears to hear with, as faith comes by hearing and hearing by the Word of God.) The gospel ( the voice of the Son of man) was preached to every creature which is under heaven. ( I am also made a minister.)




Romans 10:17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
18 But I say, Have they not heard? Yes verily, their sound went into all the earth, and their words unto the ends of the world.

Colossians 1:23 If ye continue in the faith grounded and settled, and be not moved away from the hope of the gospel, which ye have heard, and which was preached to every creature which is under heaven; whereof I Paul am made a minister;





Nothing should be lost, but should be risen up again at the last day. And the will of God who sent the Son, is for us to see the Son, for us to believe on Him, to have everlasting life, and He will risen us up at the last day.

That is knowing the resurrection of Jesus Christ ( seeing Him and believing on Him.) and the last day is for those who do not have everlasting life. ( who are not risen up the last day, are not risen with Christ, do not believe.)





John 6:39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.
40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

John 8:23 And he said unto them, Ye are from beneath; I am from above: ye are of this world; I am not of this world.
24 I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.

 

[gordon777]

for his glory:

"John 11:25 Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live:
John 11:26 And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?

Jesus is speaking about having Spiritual life in him that will be raised on the last day to eternal life with Him. Those who do not believe in Jesus are called Spiritually dead within while they are alive rejecting Jesus, but those who have died before Christ returns will be resurrected from their graves to damnation, John 5:28-29."



We have eternal life already now, ( within us in the Spirit of life) and we know this ( if we believe in Jesus being eternal life and is in us) and that is why Jesus Christ is the resurrection and the life, and why we who live and believe in Him shall never die ( as the life is in us, and that IS THE RESURRECTION AND THE LIFE.)





Romans 8:10 And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.

1 John 1:2 (For the life was manifested, and we have seen it, and bear witness, and shew unto you that eternal life, which was with the Father, and was manifested unto us;)

1 John 5:13 These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.

1 John 5:20 And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

 

[gordon777]

Joh 5:28 Do not marvel at this; for the hour is coming in which all who are in the graves will hear His voice
Joh 5:29 and come forth—those who have done good, to the resurrection of life, and those who have done evil, to the resurrection of condemnation. (NKJV)


Rev 20:11 Then I saw a great white throne and Him who sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away. And there was found no place for them.
Rev 20:12 And I saw the dead, small and great, standing before God, and books were opened. And another book was opened, which is the Book of Life. And the dead were judged according to their works, by the things which were written in the books.
Rev 20:13 The sea gave up the dead who were in it, and Death and Hades delivered up the dead who were in them. And they were judged, each one according to his works.
Rev 20:14 Then Death and Hades were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
Rev 20:15 And anyone not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire. (NKJV)

This is at the summation of all things, Christ having returned and now judges the dead. Notice that all the dead are there and those whose names are "not found written in the Book of Life" are "cast into the lake of fire." That means there are both believers and unbelievers present, which is precisely what Christ said in John 5.

Christ coming to earth ( in the flesh which the antichrist spirit denies) has judged the quick and the dead, and the condemnation ( judgement) is that men loved darkness rather than light, and men did not come to the light. John 3;19.



All on earth heard the voice of the Son of God ( witness is given to all nations) then the end comes.



It is preached to the world that Christ that the Son of God was ordained to be the judge of the quick and the dead.

The Son of God came into the world for judgement, ( to die to judge the prince of this world, who had the power over death, so we can believe in life/ the resurrection power of Jesus Christ in us.) and that was Christ judging the world in righteousness, ministering judgement to the people in uprightness.




Psalm 9:8 And he shall judge the world in righteousness, he shall minister judgment to the people in uprightness.

John 12:31 Now is the judgment of this world: now shall the prince of this world be cast out.



The Comforter/ Holy Ghost in the Apostles of the Lord, reprove ( judge) the world of sin, because the world heard but did not believe on Christ ( on Him and His resurrection, instead they believed the god of this world and the resurrection of damnation.)

The world is reproved ( judged) of righteousness, because we see Jesus no more ( the kingdom of God is within us and we see Jesus no more but in us in Spirit. Luke 17:20-21. 2 Corinthians 5:16.)

The world is reproved of judgment, because the prince of this world ( and the resurrection of damnation followers) are judged with him.




John 16:8 And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment:
9 Of sin, because they believe not on me;
10 Of righteousness, because I go to my Father, and ye see me no more;
11 Of judgment, because the prince of this world is judged.

Acts 10:42 And he commanded us to preach unto the people, and to testify that it is he which was ordained of God to be the Judge of quick and dead.

Matthew 24:14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.

 

[JLB]

Resurrection is not confessed by those who have a form of godliness, as they deny the power thereof.

The resurrection of Jesus Christ is our resurrection, as He gave us that power to be the sons of God, ( to be born of Him in Spirit, not of blood or of the flesh, as flesh and blood does not inherit the kingdom of God which is the resurrection of Christ in us now. John 1:12-13. 1 Corinthians 15:50) to know the power of His resurrection.

False prophets in the days of the children of Israel, always spoke of things far off, never for the present time, that is why they were false, and Jesus said many false prophets rise to deceive many.

1 Corinthians 15 is denied by those many Jesus warned about, as denying that the entire chapter is in regards to the mystery of Christ in us ( as He is the resurrection and the life which occurs before those false prophets speak of, and we are quickened together with Christ already, as He does not come with observation. John 11;25-26. 1 Corinthians 15:26. Ephesians 2:1. 2:5.)




2 Timothy 3:5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.

Philippians 3:10 That I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings, being made conformable unto his death;




1 Corinthians 15:50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.

John 1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:
13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.


The false prophets who speak their own thing and always speak for future tense, as they have nothing but their own word to share.


Jeremiah 23:16 Thus saith the Lord of hosts, Hearken not unto the words of the prophets that prophesy unto you: they make you vain: they speak a vision of their own heart, and not out of the mouth of the Lord.
17 They say still unto them that despise me, The Lord hath said, Ye shall have peace; and they say unto every one that walketh after the imagination of his own heart, No evil shall come upon you.

Ezekiel 12:27 Son of man, behold, they of the house of Israel say, The vision that he seeth is for many days to come, and he prophesieth of the times that are far off.
28 Therefore say unto them, Thus saith the Lord God; There shall none of my words be prolonged any more, but the word which I have spoken shall be done, saith the Lord God.

Matthew 24:11 And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many.

1 John 4:1 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.

Do you believe the resurrection of the dead in Christ occurs at His coming?

Do you believe the resurrection of the dead in Christ occurs on the last day?



Thanks, JLB

 

[Free]

God has not appointed us to wrath ( death) but to obtain salvation ( eternal life) by our Lord Jesus Christ, WHO DIED FOR US, so we live together with Him. ( not die)

Through death Jesus destroyed him that had the power of death ( the devil) and delivered us who had fear of death and all of our lifetime were subject to bondage ( fear of death and appointed to die.)

So Christ was offered to bear those sins of many ( who previously died in our sins) and we look to Christ ( in heaven which is in us) for Christ to appear without sin in us, to salvation.




1 Thessalonians 5:9 For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,
10 Who died for us, that, whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with him.

Hebrews 2:14 Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil;
15 And deliver them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage.

Hebrews 9:27 And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:
28 So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation.



Now instead of being subject to fear of death ( being appointed to die) through being dead in our sins, we were dead in our sins, now we are quickened together with Christ ( that is knowing the power of His resurrection) and through Christ are dead to sin, and alive to God through Jesus Christ our Lord, now we yield ourselves as those who are alive from the dead, as we live through the only begotten Son sent in to the world( and we know the antichrist does not confess that Christ has come in the flesh.)





Romans 6:11 Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Romans 6:13 Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God.

Ephesians 2:5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;)

1 John 4:9 In this was manifested the love of God toward us, because that God sent his only begotten Son into the world, that we might live through him.

Death is quite clearly referring to physical death. Not all will physically die before Christ returns but many have and many will.

 

[for_his_glory]

The Spiritual resurrection is to be Spirit and not flesh, and it is the kingdom of God entering us now, and we entering the kingdom of God.

Neither will that come with observation ( not now, not ever, and not after) as the kingdom of God does not come with observation, not to say here, or there, as the kingdom of God is within us.

First, I have asked you to keep your postings shorter as there is way to much to read through and to try an address.

The kingdom of God is within us as we are made kings and priest of God as we reign with Christ here on earth until the seventh trumpet sounds and then the nations (kingdoms) of this world become the nations (kingdoms) of God and of Christ and He will be our God and we His people forever.

Daniel 7:27 And the kingdom and dominion, and the greatness of the kingdom under the whole heaven, shall be given to the people of the saints of the most High, whose kingdom is an everlasting kingdom, and all dominions shall serve and obey him.

Luke 17:20 And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation: 21 Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.

Rev 3:10 Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth. 11 Behold, I come quickly: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown. 12 Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name. 13 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches.

Rev 5:10 10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth. (We are the Spiritual Kingdom of God on earth)

Read the words, that like Jesus was raised up from the dead ( resurrected) even so we ( resurrected.) walk in newness, of life.

We were planted inn the likeness of his death ( sown in weakness. 1 Corinthians 15:43.)

We are also ( planted) in the likeness of His resurrection. ( raised in power. 1 Corinthians 15:43.)

Our old man is crucified with Him, the body of sin is destroyed. ( it was sown a natural body/planted in the likeness of his death.)

Now if we be dead with Christ ( planted together in the likeness of His death/sown in weakness.) we believe that we shall also live with Him ( raised in power. ) knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dies no more, death has no more dominion.

When citing 1 Corinthians 14:43 you need the full context to know that 1 Corinthians 15:35-49 is giving answers to the two questions that were asked in vs 35 about the resurrection of the dead and has nothing to do with the resurrection of Christ.

1Cor 15:35 But some man will say, How are the dead raised up? and with what body do they come?

Jesus was perfect and had no sin so in His physical body there was no sin to be destroyed even in His death. He had no need to walk in newness of life as He is our life that we walk in newness by the indwelling of the Holy Spirit. Jesus was not buried in weakness as He has all power and authority given Him by God even before He died.

 

[for_his_glory]

We have eternal life already now, ( within us in the Spirit of life) and we know this ( if we believe in Jesus being eternal life and is in us) and that is why Jesus Christ is the resurrection and the life, and why we who live and believe in Him shall never die ( as the life is in us, and that IS THE RESURRECTION AND THE LIFE.)

Heb 9:27 And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:
Heb 9:28 So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation.

We only have the promise of eternal life as long as we remain obedient to His commands. We who are Christ own will physically die just like those who are not Christ own. But the difference is that we are raised to life eternal with Jesus in new glorified bodies that we do not know what we will be, but will be like Christ in His glorified body, 1John 3:2 and those who rejected Him will be resurrected to damnation and cast into the lake of fire.

John 5:28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,
John 5:29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

 

[for_his_glory]

The Son of God came into the world for judgement,

Jesus did not come into the world to judge anyone as man has already condemned themselves by not believing in Him.

Joh 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
John 3:17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
John 3:18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

 

[for_his_glory]

Christ coming to earth ( in the flesh which the antichrist spirit denies) has judged the quick and the dead, and the condemnation ( judgement) is that men loved darkness rather than light, and men did not come to the light. John 3;19.



All on earth heard the voice of the Son of God ( witness is given to all nations) then the end comes.



It is preached to the world that Christ that the Son of God was ordained to be the judge of the quick and the dead.

The Son of God came into the world for judgement, ( to die to judge the prince of this world, who had the power over death, so we can believe in life/ the resurrection power of Jesus Christ in us.) and that was Christ judging the world in righteousness, ministering judgement to the people in uprightness.




Psalm 9:8 And he shall judge the world in righteousness, he shall minister judgment to the people in uprightness.

John 12:31 Now is the judgment of this world: now shall the prince of this world be cast out.



The Comforter/ Holy Ghost in the Apostles of the Lord, reprove ( judge) the world of sin, because the world heard but did not believe on Christ ( on Him and His resurrection, instead they believed the god of this world and the resurrection of damnation.)

The world is reproved ( judged) of righteousness, because we see Jesus no more ( the kingdom of God is within us and we see Jesus no more but in us in Spirit. Luke 17:20-21. 2 Corinthians 5:16.)

The world is reproved of judgment, because the prince of this world ( and the resurrection of damnation followers) are judged with him.




John 16:8 And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment:
9 Of sin, because they believe not on me;
10 Of righteousness, because I go to my Father, and ye see me no more;
11 Of judgment, because the prince of this world is judged.

Acts 10:42 And he commanded us to preach unto the people, and to testify that it is he which was ordained of God to be the Judge of quick and dead.

Matthew 24:14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.

Key words, "And when he is come". Christ has not returned yet so judgement is yet future in the resurrection. Judgement only comes in the end of days after Christ returns when He separates the sheep from the goats and final judgement is made, Matthew 25:31-46; Rev 20:11-15.

 

[gordon777]

Key words, "And when he is come". Christ has not returned yet so judgement is yet future in the resurrection. Judgement only comes in the end of days after Christ returns when He separates the sheep from the goats and final judgement is made, Matthew 25:31-46; Rev 20:11-15.

Christ has come in the flesh, and did come to us and this is the resurrection. ( the antichrist denies Christ has come in the flesh and all was complete, God was manifest in the flesh and believed on in the world ( believed in His resurrection and then He came to us in Spirit/ risen/resurrected with Him inside of us.)




John 14:18 I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you.

John 14:23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.

1 John 4:2 Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:

1 John 4:3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.

2 John 1:7 For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.


1 Timothy 3:16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.



I made a thread just now, regarding the last day/ last trump resurrection, it is a complete testimony so nobody has to remain in doubt/damned/resurrection of damnation. Instead we can believe that Jesus Christ is the resurrection and the life, to know the power of His resurrection, so we can attain to the resurrection of the dead through knowing Jesus Christ in us, the life in us.