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Eternal damnation

poetofparables said:
I'll tell you what it does say, MAN THE BIBLES CONFUSING.
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You've identified yourself as not a Christian. That means that you do not have the indwelling Holy Spirit to guide you in understanding the Word of God. Those who havent been born again cannot understand the Bible, so says the Bible.

1 Cor 2:14 - But a natural man does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually appraised. NASB
 
FreeGrace said:
You've identified yourself as not a Christian. That means that you do not have the indwelling Holy Spirit to guide you in understanding the Word of God. Those who havent been born again cannot understand the Bible, so says the Bible.

1 Cor 2:14 - But a natural man does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually appraised. NASB
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And you all identify with the holy spirit and are born again, but are still confused.
 
FreeGrace said:
People don't accept God for a lot of reasons. But none of the reasons excuse them either.
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(Edited, ToS 2.1: "This is a Christian site, therefore, any attempt to put down Christianity (or declare that it is false) and the basic tenets of our Faith will be considered a hostile act." Obadiah)
 
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poetofparables said:
Actually I think you are correct, the bible must have a view. Sorry for that statement, you're post woke me out of that faulty thinking.

Thanks
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I am very concerned that you've identified yourself as not a Christian. Until you become one, through faith in Jesus Christ as your personal Savior, you will never be able to discern what God's Word means. Unfortunately, because the devil (satan) deceives the whole world (1 Jn 5:19), even believers can be deceived, which is why there are so many debates about so many things, such as this thread here.

But I am glad that my post was helpful to you. Please read through the gospel of John completely. I think it will be helpful to you as well.
 
FreeGrace said:
I am very concerned that you've identified yourself as not a Christian. Until you become one, through faith in Jesus Christ as your personal Savior, you will never be able to discern what God's Word means. Unfortunately, because the devil (satan) deceives the whole world (1 Jn 5:19), even believers can be deceived, which is why there are so many debates about so many things, such as this thread here.

But I am glad that my post was helpful to you. Please read through the gospel of John completely. I think it will be helpful to you as well.
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I might read the bible through again, when I'm up to it.
 
TimothyW said:
I'm sorry Chopper. You know that I love you, but you and I also know that "thanatos" does not and has never meant "separation". The Greek word for "separate" is aphorizo. Thanatos means death.
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I think you're confusing the meaning. James tells us precisely what physical death IS: James 2:26 - For just as the body without the spirit is dead, so also faith without works is dead. NASB

The phrase "body without the spirit" IS a separation; no doubt about it. When the spirit leaves the body (separates from the body), we call that state "death".

The same for spiritual death; separation. This time, being separated from God. That describes the Lake of Fire, also known as the "second death". First death being physical.
 
TimothyW said:
John 3:16 says
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.
Who will not perish? Who will perish? Who will not have eternal life? Who will have eternal life? Does this say that ANYONE will have eternal life in hell being tormented alive forever?
Please answer each of these questions.
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I'd love to answer the last one (Edited, Obadiah). Those in hell are experiencing eternal death, or more precisely, the second death. Which will last, oh, about forever and ever. If you believe Rev 20:10. I do.

Those in the Lake of Fire (forever and ever) are separated from God forever and ever. And it ain't gonna be comfortable for them during their forever and ever.

I'm at a loss of understanding as to how any believer cannot accept the plain words of Rev 20:10.
 
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poetofparables said:
I might read the bible through again, when I'm up to it.
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At the church I recently worked at for a while this is emphasized a lot. The pastor is always telling people to read the Bible for what it actually says and not reading into it what other people say it says. There's a big difference. It's one thing to ask (or read material from) those more educated about things like history, context, etc., but the important thing is to focus mainly on what the actual Bible actually says and weigh everything you hear against that. He even takes it so far as to admit when the Bible contradicts their own church policies or doctrines and as far as it depends on him doesn't hesitate to work to change things to align with the Bible when he recognizes that.
 
poetofparables said:
John 3:16New International Version (NIV)
16 For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.

Jesus is wrong, we all have eternal life, it's up to you how far you go with it.
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(Edited, ToS 2.14: "Please do not use the message board to air your grievances against other fellow members. If you have observed a violation of the Terms of Service please let a Moderator or Administrator know." The best way to do this is with the "Report" function at the bottom of the post. Obadiah)

You have the free will to accept or reject what Jesus said. But the truth remains that what He said in Jn 3:16 is truth.
 
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Obadiah said:
At the church I recently worked at for a while this is emphasized a lot. The pastor is always telling people to read the Bible for what it actually says and not reading into it what other people say it says. There's a big difference. It's one thing to ask (or read material from) those more educated about things like history, context, etc., but the important thing is to focus mainly on what the actual Bible actually says and weigh everything you hear against that. He even takes it so far as to admit when the Bible contradicts their own church policies or doctrines and as far as it depends on him doesn't hesitate to work to change things to align with the Bible when he recognizes that.
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I have read the bible many times, and I will read it again when I'm ready.
 
poetofparables said:
It only works if you accept contradictory ideas and themes in the bible.
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I don't accept this. (Edited, personal insult. Obadiah). If the Bible is contradictory, then God isn't really God. Perfection cannot contradict itself. And the Bible does not contradict itself. Those who claim it does misunderstand either one part of the equation, or both parts. But they sure don't understand both parts correctly. Which is why there are such debates.
 
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(Post removed. Response to a deleted post. Obadiah)
 
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