Bible Study Faith in Christ

[GodsGrace]

Did anyone of you know God's will or what we were to be obedient in before you received God's free gift of grace through faith that is Christ Jesus in whom we began to believe in? I know I didn't. I had to learn that after being Spiritually born again.

1 Corinthians 2:11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God. 12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God. 13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual. 14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

I knew what was expected of me.
But was never told HOW to get this done.
I remember loving God from about the age of 10/11.
The reason I knew is because I went to religious instruction
every week and to Mass where priests back then spoke of
these things. Today they're afraid to.

 

[JLB]

Yet Eph 2:8 does NOT say salvation is by faith alone. The word "alone" is not even in the verse!!!!

Amen. Well said.

Of course “alone” is not in the verse, because that would be a total contradiction of what faith is, and how faith functions to produce the intended divine result.



James says it this way —


Thus also faith by itself, (alone) if it does not have works, is dead. James 2:17



JLB

 

[JLB]

I agree as there is faith of Christ as in His obedience to the Father who gave Him a commandments of what to speak and do while here on earth, and faith in Christ that we believe who He said He was as we develope that personal relationship with Him.

The main point of my post was to show that faith as a noun, Is something we receive from God when He speaks to us.

When we act upon what He says, then our faith, the substance of the thing we are hoping for is manifested.


JLB

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

What happens if I come to believe in God and next week I die unbaptized?

NT belief includes baptism, hence one does not have a NT belief until one repents, confesses and is baptized.

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

Seems there's a conflict in the New Testament.
Maybe James and Paul did not agree on doctrine?

Could you reconcile
Romans 5:1-2 faith justifies
James 2:24 faith does not justify

Which is it and why?

No.

Romans 5:1-2 says faith justifies
James 2:24 says faith alone does not justify

Since faith justifies and faith alone does not justify then faith and faith alone are not the same thing.

 

[GodsGrace]

NT belief includes baptism, hence one does not have a NT belief until one repents, confesses and is baptized.

So I could be a believer in God and still go to hell?

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

at no time did i ever say everyone will be saved..that is universalism .

the obedience that night was i stepped out by faith after the Holy spirit drawn me in. we come to him just as we are---LOST we ask him to save us he justifies us sanctifies us .He does the forgiving HE christ paid the price

You posted something about the "finish works of the Cross"

I simply pointed out that Christ died for everyone on the cross (Heb 2:9) but not everyone will be saved. This implies man has a role in his own salvation that role being obedient to Christ (Heb 5:9) Who requires belief (John 8:24) repentance (Luke 13:3) confession (Mt 10:32033) and baptism (Mk 16:16) to be saved.

 

[GodsGrace]

No.

Romans 5:1-2 says faith justifies
James 2:24 says faith alone does not justify

Since faith justifies and faith alone does not justify then faith and faith alone are not the same thing.

But I asked you which is right since there's a conflict.

They cannot both be right.

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

So I could be a believer in God and still go to hell?

Do you understand that belief is NOT just mental activity as acknowledging certain facts but that belief is an obedient work that includes repentance, confession and baptism?

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

But I asked you which is right since there's a conflict.

They cannot both be right.

You did not understand my post.

I pointed out there is a difference between "faith" and "faith alone"

 

[GodsGrace]

You did not understand my post.

I pointed out there is a difference between "faith" and "faith alone"

I understood your post.
You posted a conflict between two verses.

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

What do you think when it says by faith, not of works? Unless I am wrong you are trying to make faith a work in order to receive God's free gift of grace. Faith has to come first for us to believe in Christ Jesus, Hebrews 11:1, and then we begin the works of the Lord as we learn to walk in obedience to His commands and statures.

The "not of works" refers to works of merit and not obedience to God.

The NT does show that faith is a work and that work of faith is necessary to receive grace.

Free gifts often times comes with conditions and meeting the condition does not merit the free gift. I gave some examples from the Bible showing this as Naaman. God did not owe Naaman anything but due to grace God would heal his disease provided Naaman CONDITIONALLY obey by dipping in the river 7 times. The free gift (healing) came with a condition (dipping) and meeting the condition God place upon His free gift did not in anyway merit the free gift.

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

I understood your post.
You posted a conflict between two verses.

No, here is what you earlier posted to me in blue below:

Could you reconcile
Romans 5:1-2 faith justifies
James 2:24 faith does not justify

You left out the word "alone" in James 2:24.

It is this:
Romans 3:1-2 faith justifies
James 2:24 faith ALONE does not justify

Therefore "faith" and "faith alone" are not the same thing.

 

[GodsGrace]

No, here is what you earlier posted to me in blue below:

Could you reconcile
Romans 5:1-2 faith justifies
James 2:24 faith does not justify

You left out the word "alone" in James 2:24.

It is this:
Romans 3:1-2 faith justifies
James 2:24 faith ALONE does not justify

Therefore "faith" and "faith alone" are not the same thing.

In Romans could we add the word alone?
I'm on a phone,,,,sorry for being curt.

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

I beg to differ as the jailer was told what to believe. Then they spoke to him the word of God.

Acts 16:30 And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved?
Acts 16:31 And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.
Acts 16:32 And they spake unto him the word of the Lord, and to all that were in his house.

Again, they did not tell him what to believe until v32, After telling him the "word of the Lord" the jailer repented and was baptized just as those in Acts 2:38 were commanded to be baptized by the Lord.

Secondly, the jailer was told to believe NOT told to 'believe only'. NT belief includes repentance and baptism. All the belief only in the world can never save an impenitent person.


verse 33 And he took them the same hour of the night, and washed their stripes; and was baptized, he and all his, immediately.
verse 34 " And he brought them up into his house, and set food before them, and rejoiced greatly, with all his house, having believed in God.

"Having believed" sums all the jailer had just done in repenting and be being baptized

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

In Romans could we add the word alone?
I'm on a phone,,,,sorry for being curt.

No, adding the word "alone" (adding or subtracting any words) changes God's word. Martin Luther added the word "alone" into Romans to force his 'faith only' his idea into it.

 

[GodsGrace]

No, adding the word "alone" (adding or subtracting any words) changes God's word. Martin Luther added the word "alone" into Romans to force his 'faith only' his idea into it.

Sorry,,,,this has to wait till I can get to my computer.
?

 

[for_his_glory]

The "not of works" refers to works of merit and not obedience to God.

The NT does show that faith is a work and that work of faith is necessary to receive grace.

Free gifts often times comes with conditions and meeting the condition does not merit the free gift. I gave some examples from the Bible showing this as Naaman. God did not owe Naaman anything but due to grace God would heal his disease provided Naaman CONDITIONALLY obey by dipping in the river 7 times. The free gift (healing) came with a condition (dipping) and meeting the condition God place upon His free gift did not in anyway merit the free gift.

What are the works of merit and how do you describe what merit is as none of us are worthy of God's grace nor do we deserve it?

Hebrews 11:1 clearly states what faith is and mentions nothing about it being a work of any kind.

 

[for_his_glory]

Do you understand that belief is NOT just mental activity as acknowledging certain facts but that belief is an obedient work that includes repentance, confession and baptism?

Faith can not stand alone as works have to follow after we first believe. Faith, belief have to come first and the works are what justifies our faith and makes it complete.

James 2:17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.
James 2:18 Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.
James 2:19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.
James 2:20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?
James 2:21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?
James 2:22 Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?

 

[for_his_glory]

Again, they did not tell him what to believe until v32, After telling him the "word of the Lord" the jailer repented and was baptized just as those in Acts 2:38 were commanded to be baptized by the Lord.

Secondly, the jailer was told to believe NOT told to 'believe only'. NT belief includes repentance and baptism. All the belief only in the world can never save an impenitent person.


verse 33 And he took them the same hour of the night, and washed their stripes; and was baptized, he and all his, immediately.
verse 34 " And he brought them up into his house, and set food before them, and rejoiced greatly, with all his house, having believed in God.

"Having believed" sums all the jailer had just done in repenting and be being baptized

So you are just going to skip over vs. 31 which clearly states what the jailer had to do to be saved.