AirDancer
Member
- Feb 14, 2012
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That's something you might want to ask about. I don't know of any person who has been chipped .... but I know of some pets (cats, dogs) who have been chipped.
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For the love of convenience, for the love of progress, for the love of...
- Thread starter john darling
- Start date
That's something you might want to ask about. I don't know of any person who has been chipped .... but I know of some pets (cats, dogs) who have been chipped.
- Mar 11, 2014
- 48,446
- 10,124
Cheyenne has.
I have nieces and nephews (under 5) and know they are not chipped, the topic has never been brought up with them, doesn't mean they weren't asked before the kids were born though.
It seems like most people who have pets here, they are chipped. I guess I didn't realize they were chipping babies - that's really disturbing.
AirDancer
Member
- Feb 14, 2012
- 18,907
- 3,819
Some states have already passed laws concerning microchips:
"Legislation
Following Wisconsin and North Dakota,[26] California issued Senate Bill 362 in 2007, which makes it illegal to force a person to have a microchip implanted, and provide for an assessment of civil penalties against violators of the bill.[26]
On April 5, 2010, the Georgia Senate passed Senate Bill 235 that prohibits forced microchip implants in humans and that would make it a misdemeanor for anyone to require them, including employers.[27] The bill would allow voluntary microchip implants, as long as they are performed by a physician and regulated by the Georgia Composite Medical Board. The House did not take up the measure. California, North Dakota and Wisconsin already ban mandatory microchip implant.[citation needed]
On February 10, 2010 Virginia's House of Delegates also passed a bill that forbids companies from forcing their employees to be implanted with tracking devices.[28]
Washington State House Bill 1142-2009-10 orders a study using implanted radio frequency identification or other similar technology to electronically monitor sex offenders and other felons. (29)"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microchip_implant_(human)
"Legislation
Following Wisconsin and North Dakota,[26] California issued Senate Bill 362 in 2007, which makes it illegal to force a person to have a microchip implanted, and provide for an assessment of civil penalties against violators of the bill.[26]
On April 5, 2010, the Georgia Senate passed Senate Bill 235 that prohibits forced microchip implants in humans and that would make it a misdemeanor for anyone to require them, including employers.[27] The bill would allow voluntary microchip implants, as long as they are performed by a physician and regulated by the Georgia Composite Medical Board. The House did not take up the measure. California, North Dakota and Wisconsin already ban mandatory microchip implant.[citation needed]
On February 10, 2010 Virginia's House of Delegates also passed a bill that forbids companies from forcing their employees to be implanted with tracking devices.[28]
Washington State House Bill 1142-2009-10 orders a study using implanted radio frequency identification or other similar technology to electronically monitor sex offenders and other felons. (29)"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microchip_implant_(human)
john darling
Member
- Jan 20, 2015
- 656
- 39
- Thread starter
- #66
Hi AirDancer,
Thanks for your response and I agree about the dangers of making assumptions. I don't think I made any. I didn't say that you have or have not been homeless. I made general observations on what you actually did say which could apply to anyone. I also feel that asking questions relevant to the topic is not the same as making assumptions. For example, if I ask, do you think your family is prepared to lose their job over refusing implants"? I'm not make any assumption one way or the other. Maybe they are. Maybe they aren't. I have no idea and their personal answer to that question isn't relevant to the point I'm trying to make anyway. The question is only meant to bring the concept of "counting the cost" into the discussion in a general way.
You are right that I know nothing about you outside of what you share on these forums and therefore I will make no comments about you personally or your personal life. My only interest here is the topic. While it's true that when responding to your posts, my comments will be based on what you actually say, I will not take the comments beyond what you say.
I actually think you made a good point by bringing up the topic of family because when it comes to money issues, family influence can be a huge factor in how we respond to circumstances around us. I think it's good to explore those issues in a non personal way. For example, what about in a marriage situation where one partner wants the chip while the other wants to reject it? I personally am not married but I still think that kind of situation is worth discussing in a general way because it presents a significant ethical dilemma. Something similar can happen in a large variety of family dynamics. So when I mention your family, in my response below, it is only in this manner of bringing out general concepts rather than anything personal.
No, not at all. Microchips for the purpose of electronic banking has nothing to do with dictatorships. It's all about progress. Money changes over time. Think back over the thousands of years since money was invented. Waaaaay back in the Babylonian days it was large gold bars. Then people started refining the money; making it smaller, easier to transport and trade.
Over the years it's progressed from gold coins, to coins of lesser metals, paper money, cheques, plastic cards, cards with microchips, online banking, phone banking, wrist band banking, and very soon, implant banking. There's nothing dictatorial about all this. It's happening all over the world and there are a myriad of advantages to this progress.
I agree. But it's like that for all of us. Money is all about control. That's it's sole purpose for existing. We all use money to exert control over one another. If I need my plumbing fixed, the plumber won't do it just because I need the help, as an expression of love. So I exert some control over him by telling him I will give him money in place of his good will. Since I know he needs money to survive, I know he will come do the work.
If I were to explain this to him, I know he will still do the work. Even if becomes offended and he refuses to do the work for me, lets say the next person also explains the situation in this rude, yet true manner. He could refuse to work for them, too. He has his dignity, after all. But eventually, after each customer down the line explains this situation to him, he will be forced to make a choice; humble himself and do the work even though he knows it's because he's forced to by the money he needs, or decide his dignity is worth more than money and starve.
The fact that most customers are too polite to explain the situation in the same terms I have here does not change the fact that the situation I've described is true. We all exert control over one another in the same way, even though we are too polite (or perhaps afraid?) to tell it like it is. That's why it's called the rat race and it's exactly why the microchip implants will succeed.
I'm curious. How would you survive without buying or selling?
I believe this is the exact issue which people keep missing. In this modern day, you cannot take gold coins to the grocery store to pay for your food. You cannot use cash money from 500 years ago to pay for your food. I doubt you could use cash money from even 100 or 50 years ago to pay for your food. Is this some kind of dictatorial conspiracy? No. It's progress.
The only "mandate" you will have to face is a choice to stay behind in the dark ages or move ahead with human achievements. Progress will pass you by and it won't care how badly you think of it as you starve to death.
Humans can be so funny sometimes. We know we need to be brave and courageous. We see virtue in having integrity, backbone and conviction. We understand the value of opposition when it comes to important issues. But...
There is always a cost. All that bravery and conviction can be expensive and there's one thing I know that I know that I know about humanity; we don't like paying high prices. You are ready to resist. Your family is ready to resist. Your friends are ready to resist. But, resist what? The economic system? Technology? Progress? Money? Cause that's all the implant represents. Money. Just with a different shape, the same as has been happening all throughout history.
Just how much are your friends and family willing to lose over this normal process? Will they really view becoming jobless and homeless as an act of valor? As it is now, cash is still pretty easy to use. There's still a bit of room for fanciful optimism about strength of will. Microchip implants still have a ways to go before they become common, but that "ways to go" is steadily shrinking. When the pressure starts to bite; when the options start to narrow, what will they do?
Consider how much your family and friends have already accepted (assuming they have). Smart cards, online banking, phone banking; it's all part of the process. Have any of them expressed concern over these particular advances? Have any of them talked about slowing down? Have any of them talked about just not using any of these things anymore and only using cash? Have any of them talked about joining underground movements or starting some kind of resistance for when cash money becomes obsolete? Or, is it all a kind of vague, "when the microchip implants become mandatory then we'll do something about it"? These are questions which I'm addressing to AirDancer because I'm responding to his post, but I'm not expecting an answer to me so much as asking the questions for the sake of showing that the questions are important regardless of how any individual person would personally answer them. I think they can and should be applied to all family situations. We need to ask these kind of questions to ourselves about our friends and family and we need to be honest with ourselves about what we believe to be the most accurate answers.
Well, true enough, there will still be the option to use as much technology as you want right up to the point that it becomes necessary to take the implant or lose your job. But after all those years of acceptance, cooperating and participating, "just a little more" won't seem like such a big deal, especially in the face of homelessness. We like to imagine ourselves as brave, but when it comes right down to it, who really wants all the inconvenience and hassle of underground resistance especially when we ourselves are not quite sure exactly what it is we're meant to be resisting? Money? Why should we resist what we know we need to survive?
Go against life giving money? No, that would be counter productive to progress.
Thanks for your response and I agree about the dangers of making assumptions. I don't think I made any. I didn't say that you have or have not been homeless. I made general observations on what you actually did say which could apply to anyone. I also feel that asking questions relevant to the topic is not the same as making assumptions. For example, if I ask, do you think your family is prepared to lose their job over refusing implants"? I'm not make any assumption one way or the other. Maybe they are. Maybe they aren't. I have no idea and their personal answer to that question isn't relevant to the point I'm trying to make anyway. The question is only meant to bring the concept of "counting the cost" into the discussion in a general way.
You are right that I know nothing about you outside of what you share on these forums and therefore I will make no comments about you personally or your personal life. My only interest here is the topic. While it's true that when responding to your posts, my comments will be based on what you actually say, I will not take the comments beyond what you say.
I actually think you made a good point by bringing up the topic of family because when it comes to money issues, family influence can be a huge factor in how we respond to circumstances around us. I think it's good to explore those issues in a non personal way. For example, what about in a marriage situation where one partner wants the chip while the other wants to reject it? I personally am not married but I still think that kind of situation is worth discussing in a general way because it presents a significant ethical dilemma. Something similar can happen in a large variety of family dynamics. So when I mention your family, in my response below, it is only in this manner of bringing out general concepts rather than anything personal.
No, not at all. Microchips for the purpose of electronic banking has nothing to do with dictatorships. It's all about progress. Money changes over time. Think back over the thousands of years since money was invented. Waaaaay back in the Babylonian days it was large gold bars. Then people started refining the money; making it smaller, easier to transport and trade.
Over the years it's progressed from gold coins, to coins of lesser metals, paper money, cheques, plastic cards, cards with microchips, online banking, phone banking, wrist band banking, and very soon, implant banking. There's nothing dictatorial about all this. It's happening all over the world and there are a myriad of advantages to this progress.
I agree. But it's like that for all of us. Money is all about control. That's it's sole purpose for existing. We all use money to exert control over one another. If I need my plumbing fixed, the plumber won't do it just because I need the help, as an expression of love. So I exert some control over him by telling him I will give him money in place of his good will. Since I know he needs money to survive, I know he will come do the work.
If I were to explain this to him, I know he will still do the work. Even if becomes offended and he refuses to do the work for me, lets say the next person also explains the situation in this rude, yet true manner. He could refuse to work for them, too. He has his dignity, after all. But eventually, after each customer down the line explains this situation to him, he will be forced to make a choice; humble himself and do the work even though he knows it's because he's forced to by the money he needs, or decide his dignity is worth more than money and starve.
The fact that most customers are too polite to explain the situation in the same terms I have here does not change the fact that the situation I've described is true. We all exert control over one another in the same way, even though we are too polite (or perhaps afraid?) to tell it like it is. That's why it's called the rat race and it's exactly why the microchip implants will succeed.
I'm curious. How would you survive without buying or selling?
I believe this is the exact issue which people keep missing. In this modern day, you cannot take gold coins to the grocery store to pay for your food. You cannot use cash money from 500 years ago to pay for your food. I doubt you could use cash money from even 100 or 50 years ago to pay for your food. Is this some kind of dictatorial conspiracy? No. It's progress.
The only "mandate" you will have to face is a choice to stay behind in the dark ages or move ahead with human achievements. Progress will pass you by and it won't care how badly you think of it as you starve to death.
Humans can be so funny sometimes. We know we need to be brave and courageous. We see virtue in having integrity, backbone and conviction. We understand the value of opposition when it comes to important issues. But...
There is always a cost. All that bravery and conviction can be expensive and there's one thing I know that I know that I know about humanity; we don't like paying high prices. You are ready to resist. Your family is ready to resist. Your friends are ready to resist. But, resist what? The economic system? Technology? Progress? Money? Cause that's all the implant represents. Money. Just with a different shape, the same as has been happening all throughout history.
Just how much are your friends and family willing to lose over this normal process? Will they really view becoming jobless and homeless as an act of valor? As it is now, cash is still pretty easy to use. There's still a bit of room for fanciful optimism about strength of will. Microchip implants still have a ways to go before they become common, but that "ways to go" is steadily shrinking. When the pressure starts to bite; when the options start to narrow, what will they do?
Consider how much your family and friends have already accepted (assuming they have). Smart cards, online banking, phone banking; it's all part of the process. Have any of them expressed concern over these particular advances? Have any of them talked about slowing down? Have any of them talked about just not using any of these things anymore and only using cash? Have any of them talked about joining underground movements or starting some kind of resistance for when cash money becomes obsolete? Or, is it all a kind of vague, "when the microchip implants become mandatory then we'll do something about it"? These are questions which I'm addressing to AirDancer because I'm responding to his post, but I'm not expecting an answer to me so much as asking the questions for the sake of showing that the questions are important regardless of how any individual person would personally answer them. I think they can and should be applied to all family situations. We need to ask these kind of questions to ourselves about our friends and family and we need to be honest with ourselves about what we believe to be the most accurate answers.
Well, true enough, there will still be the option to use as much technology as you want right up to the point that it becomes necessary to take the implant or lose your job. But after all those years of acceptance, cooperating and participating, "just a little more" won't seem like such a big deal, especially in the face of homelessness. We like to imagine ourselves as brave, but when it comes right down to it, who really wants all the inconvenience and hassle of underground resistance especially when we ourselves are not quite sure exactly what it is we're meant to be resisting? Money? Why should we resist what we know we need to survive?
Go against life giving money? No, that would be counter productive to progress.
john darling
Member
- Jan 20, 2015
- 656
- 39
- Thread starter
- #69
Hi AirDancer, can you provide the information on these states?
Also, I think your comment still misses the point. It won't need to be forced on you. You will take it because you don't want to lose your job, because you want to pay the bills, and because you want to eat. You seem to confuse "mandated microchips" with "progress". They are different issues.
You may decline progress all you like. No one will force you to take the chip. When you're ready to eat, you'll take it. It's that simple.
Again, this logic misses the point entirely. Security concerns do not stop progress. Despite security issues, people keep making more advanced computers and phones. Despite counterfeiting, people kept printing cash money. The updating of this security along the way is just part of the process. You are kidding yourself if you think implants will not happen because of security concerns.
And that's what I see so much of; people kidding themselves that they will never have to deal with choosing the implants or choosing to starve. They hide cash under rocks or shield themselves with misinterpretations of law. This is why so many people will take the chip, despite all their good intentions about head chopping or fantasies of resistance groups, (presumably driving around in old jeeps with machines guns mounted on the back, ready to defend themselves from hoards of implant bots).
Also, I think your comment still misses the point. It won't need to be forced on you. You will take it because you don't want to lose your job, because you want to pay the bills, and because you want to eat. You seem to confuse "mandated microchips" with "progress". They are different issues.
You may decline progress all you like. No one will force you to take the chip. When you're ready to eat, you'll take it. It's that simple.
Again, this logic misses the point entirely. Security concerns do not stop progress. Despite security issues, people keep making more advanced computers and phones. Despite counterfeiting, people kept printing cash money. The updating of this security along the way is just part of the process. You are kidding yourself if you think implants will not happen because of security concerns.
And that's what I see so much of; people kidding themselves that they will never have to deal with choosing the implants or choosing to starve. They hide cash under rocks or shield themselves with misinterpretations of law. This is why so many people will take the chip, despite all their good intentions about head chopping or fantasies of resistance groups, (presumably driving around in old jeeps with machines guns mounted on the back, ready to defend themselves from hoards of implant bots).
Gary
Member
- Apr 19, 2013
- 5,372
- 1,257
I don't believe there's a doubt in anyone's mind that implants will become a reality. Some of us just choose not to participate in that reality.
Convert or die.
Sound like anyone you know?
.
- Mar 11, 2014
- 48,446
- 10,124
no I will steal your money. and you wont be able to get it back, I remove the chip from your person. you will starve I wont.
j/k
the banks wont charge a fee? they wont charge you to move your cash? what about airdancers situation? some cant have money in that manner. do your really think they will do that to them?
I personally know people that don't have banks. 20% of americans don't. why not argue for the
"love of convience" for a camera and security in your home and car where they can watch YOU 24/7. yet get robbed you don't have to call 911 they already know. they have that chip scanning your vitals. increase in bp they call you on the cell phone, no response, cops a coming. but we both know that the nsa cant be trusted to use that honeslty.
after all you HAVE nothing to hide if they do that and you aren't a criminal.
- Mar 11, 2014
- 48,446
- 10,124
we already have the technology to use biometrics in that manner. mandate a law where ONE cant
work without having your retinal scan, photo, and fingerprints in the system. commit a crime and bam they already know the person that was there. they then can connect the dots and bam your done.
we have been doing that to haji for a decade.
work without having your retinal scan, photo, and fingerprints in the system. commit a crime and bam they already know the person that was there. they then can connect the dots and bam your done.
we have been doing that to haji for a decade.
turnorburn
Member
- Nov 21, 2007
- 8,713
- 462
I don't believe there's a doubt in anyone's mind that implants will become a reality. Some of us just choose not to participate in that reality.
Convert or die.
Sound like anyone you know?
.
convert or die.. i can think of a couple..
tob
AirDancer
Member
- Feb 14, 2012
- 18,907
- 3,819
Convert or die.
Sound like anyone you know?
.
Sounds rather familiar, doesn't it.
I agree, we're already # by SS, it's difficult to do anything without that number.
The only thing a chip is progressing towards is control of the people by the gov't.
Edward
2024 Supporter
- Sep 18, 2012
- 16,152
- 6,574
Now this is a very good question. There is no "bonus" with a microchip no matter where it is.
There's talk that the implants will actually change ones DNA. This is presumably why those who get the mark of the beast are non redeemable. We all have corrupted DNA right now, but there is a fix for it. The fix is communion.
(Oh, btw, "Like" posts #25-26-30)
- Mar 11, 2014
- 48,446
- 10,124
the social security number is for tax purposes. I really don't see that as an issue per se. one can argue pro or con in another thread on that. one could go to back to a levy, but that is another thread.