How many verses are required to prove a false doctrine?

[Corinth77777]

The identification with Christ is not merely in His death...but with Life.

And immersed in Life, what He is doing now on earth
Is key in those who are alive in the kingdom
Being reconciled by His death how much more will we be saved by His life.

If baptism is who we identify with then we must be alive...
Because our God is alive.

So the true baptism is life, for life conquers death
But to know this is to walk in faith. To move in what we say we believe.

CHRIST IN US IS THE HOPE OF GLORY
THE Question is are we in Christ

So receiving Christ may be one thing, but being in Christ may be another.

So what does it mean to be in christ, it means to me, to live by the faith/ faithfulness of Christ.
And the faithfulness of Christ is knowledge of God
Knowledge has to do with an intimate relationship, being caught up with what Jesus is doing now on earth.
God is His actions, I am that I am, God is unbodily personal power.

God is not the God of the dead but the living. What do the living look like. Those that are acting with the kingdom to help bring the kingdom in.

So when you are acting with the kingdom, ruled under God you are definitely in Christ and identified as one of His own.
Therefore it's faith, moving in what you say you believe by which you are baptized, identified with Christ.

Is this why After paul was delivered (saved) from being blind He was told to be baptized "calling" upon the name of the lord.
For praying and worship are acts of faith.
The recognizing then that you are in the one that is in you is through faith, moving in what we believe.

John 10:9

I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture.

My thoughts , and I could be wrong, been wrong many times so test the spirit by the spirit.

wondering

Just some more to think about and discuss.

Note:
So knowing that the term bapize is referring to who /what one Identifies with Helps put so much in perspective.

 

[Corinth77777]

Yep. Gotta keep the oil replenished and the fire burning.

I like that, probably will borrow it. Makes me think of
Matthew 25

 

[Carry_Your_Name]

I like that, probably will borrow it. Makes me think of
Matthew 25

Yep, that's what this is referring to.

 

[donadams]

Nope, I mean any work that multiplies our talents and brings glory to God. Mankind has one job, described in Gen. 1:28. Also, it’s about bearing spiritual fruits, bring humble and kind, developing a closer relationship with God through Christ.

When was Saul saved?

 

[donadams]

Two or three witnesses. Paul even alludes to his epistles to the Corinthian congregation of teaching them twice before about professing to be a follower of Jesus and openly living an immoral life,

This is the third time I am coming to you. In the mouth of two or three witnesses shall every word be established. I told you before and foretell you as if I were present the second time and being absent now I write to them which heretofore have sinned and to all other, that if I come again I will not spare:
2Cor.13:1-2 KJV

In 1Corinthians, Paul was shocked by a report of condoned adultery within the congregation. It's funny how when you read what Paul said to them about it, he sounds very angry., like a man scolding a bad child. But Paul said,

For out of much affliction and anguish of heart I wrote unto you with many tears; not that ye should be grieved, but that ye might know the love which I have more abundantly unto you. 2Cor.2:4 KJV

Paul was grieved because Gods' people are called away from adultery, so Paul told the elders of Corinth if that sin wasn't repented of then excommunicate the unrepentant. He said this with sadness in hopes of restoring the sinner to fellowship and it did,


Now I rejoice not that ye were made sorry, but that ye sorrowed to repentance: for ye were made sorry after a godly manner that ye might receive damage by us in nothing.
2Cor.7:9 KJV

So when Paul says two or three witnesses, he's citing what Moses' law says is necessary to have someone put to death.

So what is Paul saying? He's saying tell new congrgation members what God expects of them, because Paul didn't want to ever testify of their unfaithfulness again.

being absent now I write to them which heretofore have sinned and to all other, that if I come again I will not spare:

A living sinner can be restored to the Church, but their is no forgivness for unrepentance,

If any man see his brother sin a sin which is not unto death, he shall ask and he shall give him life for them that sin not unto death. There is a sin unto death: I do not say that he shall pray for it. 1Jn.5:16 KJV

Does this make Paul a spiritual father?

 

[donadams]

Now the Bereans were more noble-minded than the Thessalonians, for they received the message with great eagerness and examined the Scriptures every day to see if these teachings were true

They were called Noble, they weren't condemn for examining the scriptures to see if what Paul said was true.

According to the evidence in scripture on this site TIMOTHY was not an apostle.

And who says your people are apostles? ? ? YOUR MISS UNDERSTANDING OF ONE PASSAGE- ABOUT THE ROCK...

Were Others, Apart from the Twelve, Called Apostles? by Don Stewart

Don Stewart :: Were Others, Apart from the Twelve, Called Apostles?

www.blueletterbible.org

""Today, we do not need people, such as apostles, to lead us. We find that even they failed. This is illustrated with the failing of Peter at Antioch. Paul wrote.


As Peter himself stated, what we need to today is the certain prophetic Word – that will never let us down. We read.


Believers need to read and obey what God has already revealed – they do not need to listen to fallible human beings to get their direction.

Thus, there are obvious contrasts between the present age and the age of the apostles. While the gospel has not changed, God’s methods have changed. Consequently, the office of apostle is no longer with us.

Colossians 3
Let the message of Christ dwell among you richly as you teach and admonish one another with all wisdom through psalms, hymns, and songs from the Spirit, singing to God with gratitude in your hearts. ""

Were Others, Apart from the Twelve, Called Apostles? by Don Stewart

Don Stewart :: Were Others, Apart from the Twelve, Called Apostles?

www.blueletterbible.org

Identification with Christ shows one is baptized
But how can you Identify with Christ when He obeyed God.
And we who believe do the will (obey) of God who believe on His son.

But you believe as from your statement above that only the apostles have the right to interpret scripture. Well even Peter was corrected. AND I BET YOU ANYTHING THOSE BREANS WOULD HAVE REJECTED PAUL IF HE WAS NOT SPEAKING TRUTH found in the word.

You're showing that you obey men rather than God. And Sorry the church is not built off people you call apostles in your church. Those apostle in the early church already layed the foundation.

Anyway as said before you are not ready to receive the truth.
So no point in discussing when we can't agree to go to the word as the final authority. And when I take you to a passage
You interpret through your box..

Even the Spirit of the prophets are subject to the prophets.


32The spirits of prophets are subject to prophets. 33For God is not a God of disorder, but of peace—as in all the churches of the...

Well I must dust off my pants...and leave you to your own beliefs. Peace

I hope you feel better!

 

[donadams]

I gave, an interpretation of confess with mouth and believe with the heart passage. AND I DONT TAKE ON THE VIEW YOU THINK MOST OF US DO.

But honestly none of this MATTERS BECAUSE YOU ARE TRYING TO ARGUE FROM THE MEAT WHEN YOU HAVE NEVER GOTTON THE MILK.

FOR CAN'T SAY FROM SCRIPTURE THAT YOU HAVE BELIEVED IN YOUR HEART JESUS IS THE CHRIST THE SON OF THE LIVING GOD - THE EFFECT THERE CAN BE SHOWN AS YOU CALLING UPON HIM IN BAPTISM- HOWEVER YOU SEEM TO WORSHIP (call on) MEN RATHER THAN GOD.

REPENT THEREFORE AND BELIEVE THE GOSPEL.

Like I said before dusting off my pants. And will not be back to argue with you anymore...Peace

The requirement of water and the spirit (baptism don’t read vs 22) is included in the gospel!

 

[Carry_Your_Name]

When was Saul saved?

When God knocked him off of his high horse, literally.

 

[journeymanisnothing]

Does this make Paul a spiritual father?

Yes,

in Christ Jesus I became your father through the gospel. 1Cor.4:15 KJV

 

[donadams]

When God knocked him off of his high horse, literally.

Are you sure?

Philippians 1:19
For I know that this shall turn to my salvation through your prayer, and the supply of the Spirit of Jesus Christ,

Sound like faith alone to you?

 

[donadams]

Yes,

in Christ Jesus I became your father through the gospel. 1Cor.4:15 KJV

What happened to Matt 23:9

 

[Tenchi]

But some say only faith is required?

It is not the exertion of my faith that saves me but the object of my faith: Jesus Christ. He is my Savior, alone; not Jesus plus baptism, not Jesus plus my good deeds, not Jesus plus my depth of sincerity, not Jesus plus the Church, only Jesus.

Acts 4:12
12 "And there is salvation in no one else; for there is no other name under heaven that has been given among men by which we must be saved."

1 Timothy 2:5
5 For there is one God, and one mediator also between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,

Titus 3:4-7
4 But when the kindness of God our Savior and His love for mankind appeared,
5 He saved us, not on the basis of deeds which we have done in righteousness, but according to His mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewing by the Holy Spirit,
6 whom He poured out upon us richly through Jesus Christ our Savior,
7 so that being justified by His grace we would be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.

No one is saved except by faith in the right "Object," the One and Only Savior, Jesus Christ the Righteous. He alone saves.

 

[donadams]

It is not the exertion of my faith that saves me but the object of my faith: Jesus Christ. He is my Savior, alone; not Jesus plus baptism, not Jesus plus my good deeds, not Jesus plus my depth of sincerity, not Jesus plus the Church, only Jesus.

Acts 4:12
12 "And there is salvation in no one else; for there is no other name under heaven that has been given among men by which we must be saved."

1 Timothy 2:5
5 For there is one God, and one mediator also between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,

Titus 3:4-7
4 But when the kindness of God our Savior and His love for mankind appeared,
5 He saved us, not on the basis of deeds which we have done in righteousness, but according to His mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewing by the Holy Spirit,
6 whom He poured out upon us richly through Jesus Christ our Savior,
7 so that being justified by His grace we would be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.

No one is saved except by faith in the right "Object," the One and Only Savior, Jesus Christ the Righteous. He alone saves.

There is I suppose no requirement that says we must believe his eternal words?

 

[donadams]

Sound like faith alone to you?

Philippians 1:19
For I know that this shall turn to my salvation through your prayer, and the supply of the Spirit of Jesus Christ,

 

[Tenchi]

There is I suppose no requirement that says we must believe his eternal words?

Does the sick man who reads of a doctor able to cure him save himself when he believes what he's read and seeks out the doctor? No. Only if the man receives the curative work of the doctor will he be saved. No amount of knowing and believing the doctor can save him is sufficient to cure the sick man of his sickness. The doctor must do his healing work upon the sick man and only then is the man saved from his sickness.

 

[donadams]

Does the sick man who reads of a doctor able to cure him save himself when he believes what he's read and seeks out the doctor? No. Only if the man receives the curative work of the doctor will he be saved. No amount of knowing and believing the doctor can save him is sufficient to cure the sick man of his sickness. The doctor must do his healing work upon the sick man and only then is the man saved from his sickness.

That’s an answer?

 

[Tenchi]

Sound like faith alone to you?

Philippians 1:19
For I know that this shall turn to my salvation through your prayer, and the supply of the Spirit of Jesus Christ,

Take the verse in its immediate context, if you want to understand it properly.

Philippians 1:12-20
12 Now I want you to know, brethren, that my circumstances have turned out for the greater progress of the gospel,
13 so that my imprisonment in the cause of Christ has become well known throughout the whole praetorian guard and to everyone else,
14 and that most of the brethren, trusting in the Lord because of my imprisonment, have far more courage to speak the word of God without fear.
15 Some, to be sure, are preaching Christ even from envy and strife, but some also from good will;
16 the latter do it out of love, knowing that I am appointed for the defense of the gospel;
17 the former proclaim Christ out of selfish ambition rather than from pure motives, thinking to cause me distress in my imprisonment.
18 What then? Only that in every way, whether in pretense or in truth, Christ is proclaimed; and in this I rejoice. Yes, and I will rejoice,
19 for I know that this will turn out for my deliverance through your prayers and the provision of the Spirit of Jesus Christ,
20 according to my earnest expectation and hope, that I will not be put to shame in anything, but that with all boldness, Christ will even now, as always, be exalted in my body, whether by life or by death.

In context, it is plainly evident that Paul in verse 19 was NOT talking about the salvation of his eternal soul, which had already been accomplished, but his "salvation" or, better, deliverance from prison. So, then, verse 19 is not at all scriptural ground for the idea that the prayers of others obtain our eternal salvation for us. Such a notion is, in fact, quite blasphemous since it makes the person praying a sort of co-Savior with Christ. Yikes! What a foul idea!

 

[Tenchi]

That’s an answer?

Only to those who can, or are willing, to understand it.

 

[journeymanisnothing]

What happened to Matt 23:9

Obvious from the text Jesus meant above our Father in Heaven. Like,

Nor are you to be called instructors, for you have one Instructor, the Messiah.
Mt.23.10 NIV

He means above Christ , or apart from Him.

 

[donadams]

Take the verse in its immediate context, if you want to understand it properly.

Philippians 1:12-20
12 Now I want you to know, brethren, that my circumstances have turned out for the greater progress of the gospel,
13 so that my imprisonment in the cause of Christ has become well known throughout the whole praetorian guard and to everyone else,
14 and that most of the brethren, trusting in the Lord because of my imprisonment, have far more courage to speak the word of God without fear.
15 Some, to be sure, are preaching Christ even from envy and strife, but some also from good will;
16 the latter do it out of love, knowing that I am appointed for the defense of the gospel;
17 the former proclaim Christ out of selfish ambition rather than from pure motives, thinking to cause me distress in my imprisonment.
18 What then? Only that in every way, whether in pretense or in truth, Christ is proclaimed; and in this I rejoice. Yes, and I will rejoice,
19 for I know that this will turn out for my deliverance through your prayers and the provision of the Spirit of Jesus Christ,
20 according to my earnest expectation and hope, that I will not be put to shame in anything, but that with all boldness, Christ will even now, as always, be exalted in my body, whether by life or by death.

In context, it is plainly evident that Paul in verse 19 was NOT talking about the salvation of his eternal soul, which had already been accomplished, but his "salvation" or, better, deliverance from prison. So, then, verse 19 is not at all scriptural ground for the idea that the prayers of others obtain our eternal salvation for us. Such a notion is, in fact, quite blasphemous since it makes the person praying a sort of co-Savior with Christ. Yikes! What a foul idea!

Mine says salvation so it means salvation