"I Believe" Does That Mean I'm Saved?

[JLB]

JLB, I'm trying to make sense out of your posts. Who was you referring to by this statement "Here it what Peter says, in direct opposition to your words." Whose words?

Post # 183

I responded to Freegrace, and his words -

As to faithfulness, it is to those who have believed. And are already saved. And the purpose or goal of faithfulness is not salvation, but reward.

Here it what Peter says, in direct opposition to your words.

20 For if, after they have escaped the pollution's of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overcome, the latter end is worse for them than the beginning.
21 For it would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than having known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered to them. 22 But it has happened to them according to the true proverb: “A dog returns to his own vomit,” and, “a sow, having washed, to her wallowing in the mire.” 2 Peter 2:20-22`

One only has to read these words to know that people that have faith, are faithful.

They are faithful to not turn from the holy commandment, that was delivered to them.

Not holy commandments, [plural], but the holy commandment.

The holy commandment of the Gospel is Repent... for the kingdom of God is at hand.

Repent means to turn to God, and by default turn away from Satan as lord, to Jesus as Lord.

The term Repent is about changing kingdoms by changing the Lord you serve.

This is what Paul was sent to do by Jesus Christ.

17 I will deliver you from the Jewish people, as well as from the Gentiles, to whom I now send you, 18 to open their eyes, in order to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan to God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins and an inheritance among those who are sanctified by faith in Me.’ Acts 26:17-18



JLB

 

[FreeGrace]

What else does Paul say?

(God) “will render to each one according to his deeds”: eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality; but to those who are self-seeking and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness—indignation and wrath, tribulation and anguish, on every soul of man who does evil, of the Jew first and also of the Greek; but glory, honor, and peace to everyone who works what is good, to the Jew first and also to the Greek. (Ro 2:6-10 NKJV)

oh my! :shock

Are you actually suggesting that Paul contyradicted himself?? Why would anyone think that?

Grace is free. Salvation requires that your behavior identifies you as a child of God who was "created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do." (Eph 2: 10, Paul again, NIV [the forgotten verse])

Amazing! Even though Paul wrote that the FREE GIFT of God is eternal life in Rom 6:23, and then he wrote that God's gifts are IRREVOCABLE.

Seems you're rather comfortable with the idea that Paul contradicted himself.

 

[JLB]

Response to deleted post.

 

[JLB]

Response to deleted post.

 

[th1b.taylor]

A good way to illustrate this "bubble" that you speak of, is to envision that the whole room that you sit in is "eternity", where God resides, and when He created our universe (now hold up a pop bottle in the midst of the room, which represents our universe & time etc.,) it appeared and began. God is outside the bubble/bottle and not subject to the laws of time & physics, can even pluck a man out of the bottle and take him forward to see the future etc., then take him back (like John-Patmos...)

Easy smeezy to envision!
Good post Brother, thanks.

AMEN! And I'll say it again, Amen! This is a grand metaphor.

 

[th1b.taylor]

Very interesting Jim. I would say, knowledge and belief are two separate mind sets as far as demons go. As far as those who "believe" in Jesus, some believe because of wrong reasoning such as these in John 2:23. "many believed in his name, when they saw the miracles which he did." My thinking is that these ones here were thinking what Jesus might do for them. Believing in Jesus for selfish reasons other than Salvation is not true belief in my book.

Nor mine. From the moment of my salvation, some times, perhaps, misguided, has been for no other reason than to bring Glory to our LORD... my LORD!

 

[reba]

John 3:16 Amplified Bible (AMP)
16 “For God so [greatly] loved and dearly prized the world, that He [even] gave His [One and] only begotten Son, so that whoever believes and trusts in Him[as Savior] shall not perish, but have eternal life.

 

[FreeGrace]

Response to deleted post.

 

[FreeGrace]

Response to deleted post.

 

[Chopper]

amen to Reba and Bill.

 

[Chopper]

Post # 183

I responded to Freegrace, and his words -



Here it what Peter says, in direct opposition to your words.

20 For if, after they have escaped the pollution's of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overcome, the latter end is worse for them than the beginning.
21 For it would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than having known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered to them. 22 But it has happened to them according to the true proverb: “A dog returns to his own vomit,” and, “a sow, having washed, to her wallowing in the mire.” 2 Peter 2:20-22`

One only has to read these words to know that people that have faith, are faithful.

They are faithful to not turn from the holy commandment, that was delivered to them.

Not holy commandments, [plural], but the holy commandment.

The holy commandment of the Gospel is Repent... for the kingdom of God is at hand.

Repent means to turn to God, and by default turn away from Satan as lord, to Jesus as Lord.

The term Repent is about changing kingdoms by changing the Lord you serve.

This is what Paul was sent to do by Jesus Christ.

17 I will deliver you from the Jewish people, as well as from the Gentiles, to whom I now send you, 18 to open their eyes, in order to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan to God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins and an inheritance among those who are sanctified by faith in Me.’ Acts 26:17-18



JLB

Ok my friend. I'm relieved that you weren't after something I said. Thanks for the answer.

 

[JLB]

John 3:16 Amplified Bible (AMP)
16 “For God so [greatly] loved and dearly prized the world, that He [even] gave His [One and] only begotten Son, so that whoever believes and trusts in Him[as Savior] shall not perish, but have eternal life.

:amen

I thank God everyday that He loves us.

I'm am so desperate for His grace and love everyday!




JLB

 

[Cathy Kane]

When I was attending Bible College, a Professor made this statement. "If anyone says that they believe in Jesus, they are saved." Later, I came across this portion of Scripture that made me question that statement. What do you think?

John 2:23 " Now when he was in Jerusalem at the passover, in the feast day, many believed in his name, when they saw the miracles which he did.
2:24 But Jesus did not commit himself unto them, because he knew all men,
2:25 And needed not that any should testify of man: for he knew what was in man."
Another passage of Scripture that goes along with my thinking is,
Matthew 7:21 "Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
Mat 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
Mat 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity."
At one time in the early years of my Salvation, I was involved in an evangelistic crusade of Billy Graham. It was probably around 1975. I was one of those who would counsel those who came forward for Salvation. Later, I became aware of a few of those who came forward to "believe", their life did not demonstrate a Christian lifestyle.
In the years following, these false professions really bothered me until I came across these two Scriptures and also,

Matthew 13:18 "Hear ye therefore the parable of the sower.
Mat 13:19When any one heareth the word of the kingdom, and understandethitnot, then cometh the wickedone,and catcheth away that which was sown in his heart. This is he which received seed by the way side.
Mat 13:20But he that received the seed into stony places, the same is he that heareth the word, and anon with joy receiveth it;
Mat 13:21Yet hath he not root in himself, but dureth for a while: for when tribulation or persecution ariseth because of the word, by and by he is offended.
Mat 13:22He also that received seed among the thorns is he that heareth the word; and the care of this world, and the deceitfulness of riches, choke the word, and he becometh unfruitful.
Mat 13:23But he that received seed into the good ground is he that heareth the word, and understandethit;which also beareth fruit, and bringeth forth, some an hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty."
As a result of studying these three Scripture portions, and questions in my mind about why these professions didn't last, it made sense to me and as a result, I don't just accept a persons testimony of Salvation until I know a little more about the person. I feel that way because as I come to know this person, if I see that he/she might fall into one of the "seed" stories, I hope to lead this person to the Truth.

Yes, we should believe in the God according to God's word not man's word. Especially on salvation, we also follow Jesus' word not man's word as well. So, Matthew 7:21 （part）"but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven" is very critical to us. However, many people will choose to follow man's word to cheat themselves in order to avoid truth practice. If we need to know what's the will of the Father in heaven and do as His will, then we will be easy to be after His will or satisfy He.
Thanks

 

[Chopper]

Yes, we should believe in the God according to God's word not man's word. Especially on salvation, we also follow Jesus' word not man's word as well. So, Matthew 7:21 （part）"but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven" is very critical to us. However, many people will choose to follow man's word to cheat themselves in order to avoid truth practice. If we need to know what's the will of the Father in heaven and do as His will, then we will be easy to be after His will or satisfy He.
Thanks

Good post Cathy. It's good to have you with us. It's especially good that you're my Sister in Christ Jesus. Soon, I believe, we'll all be going home to be with our wonderful Father and our Lord Jesus in the New Jerusalem because it says, "In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am,there ye may be also." (John 14:2,3 KJV)

 

[FreeGrace]

Yes, we should believe in the God according to God's word not man's word. Especially on salvation, we also follow Jesus' word not man's word as well. So, Matthew 7:21 （part）"but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven" is very critical to us. However, many people will choose to follow man's word to cheat themselves in order to avoid truth practice. If we need to know what's the will of the Father in heaven and do as His will, then we will be easy to be after His will or satisfy He.
Thanks

Would you agree that John 6:40 tells us what God's will is? “For this is the will of My Father, that everyone who beholds the Son and believes in Him will have eternal life, and I Myself will raise him up on the last day.”

And would you agree that John 6:40 is what Jesus was referring to in Matt 7:21?

 

[FreeGrace]

Good post Cathy. It's good to have you with us. It's especially good that you're my Sister in Christ Jesus. Soon, I believe, we'll all be going home to be with our wonderful Father and our Lord Jesus in the New Jerusalem because it says, "In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am,there ye may be also." (John 14:2,3 KJV)

Remember, the New Jerusalem won't come down from Heaven until the Millennium is ended and God replaces the heavens and earth with a new heaven and earth. Rev 21. So, it's at least 1007 years away.

 

[reba]

Remember, the New Jerusalem won't come down from Heaven until the Millennium is ended and God replaces the heavens and earth with a new heaven and earth. Rev 21. So, it's at least 1007 years away.

I read this in The WOrd of God
Heb 12:22 But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels,
Heb 12:23 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,
Heb 12:24 And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.
I will wait to read why what is written is not really what is written..

 

[FreeGrace]

I read this in The WOrd of God
Heb 12:22 But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels,
Heb 12:23 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,
Heb 12:24 And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.
I will wait to read why what is written is not really what is written..

I never challenged or refuted any of these verses.

I did submit Rev 21 as evidence that the New Jerusalem is at least 1007 years away from now.

Before the New Jerusalem comes down from heaven, the present earth will experience the 7 year Tribulation, followed by the Second Coming of Christ, and His Millennial reign, then the Gog and Magog battle, followed by the Great White Throne judgment, and then the destruction of the present heavens and earth, and creation of the new heavens and earth.

 

[reba]

Rev 21:1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
Rev 21:2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
Rev 21:3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.
Rev 21:4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.
Rev 21:5 And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.
Rev 21:6 And he said unto me, It is done. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely.
Rev 21:7 He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.
Rev 21:8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.
Rev 21:9 And there came unto me one of the seven angels which had the seven vials full of the seven last plagues, and talked with me, saying, Come hither, I will shew thee the bride, the Lamb's wife.
Rev 21:10 And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and shewed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God,
Rev 21:11 Having the glory of God: and her light was like unto a stone most precious, even like a jasper stone, clear as crystal;
Rev 21:12 And had a wall great and high, and had twelve gates, and at the gates twelve angels, and names written thereon, which are the names of the twelve tribes of the children of Israel:
Rev 21:13 On the east three gates; on the north three gates; on the south three gates; and on the west three gates.
Rev 21:14 And the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and in them the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb.
Rev 21:15 And he that talked with me had a golden reed to measure the city, and the gates thereof, and the wall thereof.
Rev 21:16 And the city lieth foursquare, and the length is as large as the breadth: and he measured the city with the reed, twelve thousand furlongs. The length and the breadth and the height of it are equal.
Rev 21:17 And he measured the wall thereof, an hundred and forty and four cubits, according to the measure of a man, that is, of the angel.
Rev 21:18 And the building of the wall of it was of jasper: and the city was pure gold, like unto clear glass.
Rev 21:19 And the foundations of the wall of the city were garnished with all manner of precious stones. The first foundation was jasper; the second, sapphire; the third, a chalcedony; the fourth, an emerald;
Rev 21:20 The fifth, sardonyx; the sixth, sardius; the seventh, chrysolite; the eighth, beryl; the ninth, a topaz; the tenth, a chrysoprasus; the eleventh, a jacinth; the twelfth, an amethyst.
Rev 21:21 And the twelve gates were twelve pearls; every several gate was of one pearl: and the street of the city was pure gold, as it were transparent glass.
Rev 21:22 And I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it.
Rev 21:23 And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof.
Rev 21:24 And the nations of them which are saved shall walk in the light of it: and the kings of the earth do bring their glory and honour into it.
Rev 21:25 And the gates of it shall not be shut at all by day: for there shall be no night there.
Rev 21:26 And they shall bring the glory and honour of the nations into it.
Rev 21:27 And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth, neither whatsoever worketh abomination, or maketh a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life.

 

[reba]

in my view these verses are 'companion' to .

1Pe 2:4 To whom coming, as unto a living stone, disallowed indeed of men, but chosen of God, and precious,
1Pe 2:5 Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ.
1Pe 2:6 Wherefore also it is contained in the scripture, Behold, I lay in Sion a chief corner stone, elect, precious: and he that believeth on him shall not be confounded.
1Pe 2:7 Unto you therefore which believe he is precious: but unto them which be disobedient, the stone which the builders disallowed, the same is made the head of the corner,
1Pe 2:8 And a stone of stumbling, and a rock of offence, even to them which stumble at the word, being disobedient: whereunto also they were appointed.
1Pe 2:9 But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light:
1Pe 2:10 Which in time past were not a people, but are now the people of God: which had not obtained mercy, but now have obtained mercy.
Joh 2:19 Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.
Joh 2:20 Then said the Jews, Forty and six years was this temple in building, and wilt thou rear it up in three days?
Joh 2:21 But he spake of the temple of his body

Eph 2:19 Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God;
Eph 2:20 And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone;
Eph 2:21 In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord:
Eph 2:22 In whom ye also are builded together for an habitation of God through the Spirit.