Is believing/faith a work ?

[brightfame52]

What verse says that?

Any verse that forbids salvation by works.

 

[brightfame52]

What verse says I am justified before I have faith?

Any verse that says one is Justified by the Blood of Christ Rom 5:9

9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Any verse that says one is Justified by the Blood of Christ Rom 5:9

9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.

Yes. We are justified by his blood...through faith in his blood:

25God presented Him as the atoning sacrifice through faith in His blood Romans 3:25

You have to look at all of the scriptures concerning a subject to form a doctrine about that subject. You have un-rightly divided Romans 5:9 away from Romans 3:25.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Any verse that forbids salvation by works.

Let's look at one:

5However, to the one who does not work, but believes in Him who justifies the wicked, his faith is credited as righteousness. Romans 4:5

Now, explain how 'believes' is the very same thing as the 'work' it is being compared to.

 

[Highway54]

Do you condition salvation on your act of obeying ? Yes or No

Isn't that what those passages indicate 52? What Christian does not work? Are you saying a Christian does not have to work? If you want salvation, obedience is a requirement.

 

[brightfame52]

Yes. We are justified by his blood...through faith in his blood:

25God presented Him as the atoning sacrifice through faith in His blood Romans 3:25

You have to look at all of the scriptures concerning a subject to form a doctrine about that subject. You have un-rightly divided Romans 5:9 away from Romans 3:25.

Nope Rom 5:9 says being Justified by His Blood, nothing about Faith in Vs 9

 

[brightfame52]

Let's look at one:

5However, to the one who does not work, but believes in Him who justifies the wicked, his faith is credited as righteousness. Romans 4:5

Now, explain how 'believes' is the very same thing as the 'work' it is being compared to.

That is one, so if you condition your salvation on what you do, its works and that very verse condemns you.

 

[brightfame52]

Isn't that what those passages indicate 52? What Christian does not work? Are you saying a Christian does not have to work? If you want salvation, obedience is a requirement.

Do you condition salvation on your act of obeying ? Yes or No

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Now, if one believes the Faith comes via your FREE WILL ... now you have an issue as your faith is a work you must do to merit salvation.

Paul plainly says there is no boast of merit in being justified by faith:

8For it is by grace you have been saved through faith, and this not from yourselves; it is the gift of God, 9not by works, so that no one can boast. Ephesians 2:8-9

27Where, then, is boasting? It is excluded. On what principle? On that of works? No, but on that of faith. Romans 3:27

If you want to insist this is talking about faith from God impressed on a person without consideration of what they want versus faith from man's free will you'll see from these passages that it is incumbent on the believer whether or not they receive, retain, or reject God's free gift of faith, not God. God in his grace simply makes it available:

1 John 2:24-25
1 Timothy 1:19
Hebrews 4:14
Hebrews 10:23

 

[Jethro Bodine]

That is one, so if you condition your salvation on what you do, its works and that very verse condemns you.

"to the one who does not work BUT BELIEVES" Romans 4:5

I'm not working. I'M BELIEVING. They are different from each other. Read the verse!

 

[brightfame52]

Paul plainly says there is no boast of merit in being justified by faith:

8For it is by grace you have been saved through faith, and this not from yourselves; it is the gift of God, 9not by works, so that no one can boast. Ephesians 2:8-9

27Where, then, is boasting? It is excluded. On what principle? On that of works? No, but on that of faith. Romans 3:27

If you want to insist this is talking about faith from God impressed on a person without consideration of what they want versus faith from man's free will you'll see from these passages that it is incumbent on the believer whether or not they receive, retain, or reject God's free gift of faith, not God. God in his grace simply makes it available:

1 John 2:24-25
1 Timothy 1:19
Hebrews 4:14
Hebrews 10:23

If you condition salvation on your act of believing, thats works, it denies Christ !

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Nope Rom 5:9 says being Justified by His Blood, nothing about Faith in Vs 9

Romans 3:25 explains more and shows us how it is through faith in his blood that we are justified by his blood.

Stop un-rightly dividing the word of God. You must consider all that the Bible says about something when forming doctrine.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

If you condition salvation on your act of believing, thats works, it denies Christ !

"to the one who does not work BUT BELIEVES" Romans 4:5

Let it sink in. 'Believing' is not works. Read the verse.

 

[brightfame52]

"to the one who does not work BUT BELIEVES" Romans 4:5

I'm not working. I'M BELIEVING. They are different from each other. Read the verse!

If you condition your Justification before God on your act of believing, that denies Rom 4:5 and its your work !

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Isn't that what those passages indicate 52? What Christian does not work? Are you saying a Christian does not have to work? If you want salvation, obedience is a requirement.

You are made righteous in God's sight entirely on the basis of receiving God's forgiveness by having faith in that forgiveness. It is impossible to made righteous in God's sight by doing righteous work. The only way to become righteous (be justified) is to have your unrighteousness forgiven and it replaced with an imputation of God's righteousness. You will never become righteous by doing righteous works. Never. That's why justification is by faith, all by itself, apart from works.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

If you condition your Justification before God on your act of believing, that denies Rom 4:5 and its your work !

I'm doing the 'but believes' part to be justified and you're calling that the very works part that I'm not supposed to do to be justified.

 

[brightfame52]

You are made righteous in God's sight entirely on the basis of receiving God's forgiveness by having faith in that forgiveness. It is impossible to made righteous in God's sight by doing righteous work. The only way to become righteous (be justified) is to have your unrighteousness forgiven and it replaced with an imputation of God's righteousness. You will never become righteous by doing righteous works. Never. That's why justification is by faith, all by itself, apart from works.

Thats works. Thats basing righteousness on something you did.

 

[brightfame52]

I'm doing the 'but believes' part to be justified and you're calling that the very works part that I'm not supposed to do to be justified.

Correct, you condition Justification before God on what you do, thats works

 

[Highway54]

Do you condition salvation on your act of obeying ? Yes or No

Yes, salvation is given based on our obedience to God through accurate faith.

 

[brightfame52]

Yes, salvation is given based on our obedience to God through accurate faith.

Now thanks for your frankness, so you condition salvation on your works, thats a denial of Grace.

My Salvation/Justification was conditioned solely by Christs One Obedience Rom 5:19

19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.