Join For His Glory for a discussion on how
https://christianforums.net/threads/a-vessel-of-honor.110278/
https://christianforums.net/threads/psalm-70-1-save-me-o-god-lord-help-me-now.108509/
Read through the following study by Tenchi for more on this topic
https://christianforums.net/threads/without-the-holy-spirit-we-can-do-nothing.109419/
Join Sola Scriptura for a discussion on the subject
https://christianforums.net/threads/anointed-preaching-teaching.109331/#post-1912042
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ou saying it HAS TO BE either and can’t be both
Is just your opinion.
What do you mean by a "work"?John 6:29
Jesus said “this is the work of God - that you believe in him whom he hath sent”
Work - ERGON - believe (from PISTIS, the word for faith)
Looks like our head honcho says faith is a work
Look Who’s talking in John 6:29
That should settle it - but men’s traditions (theology) gets in the way
Bible says faith is a work; believing is a work
Know it. Live it.
Paul never even implied sinners are incapable of repentance.
Then that's a mixture of works and grace. See for it to be all of Grace the Believing must be all of God which caused it.The “of ourselves” is a little tricky - God’s prevenient grace enables one to believe - it is a synergy of God’s grace enabling one to believe, and the believer accepting that grace and making a decision. So I see God and the believer BOTH involved in the WORK.
Well that's exactly what one is saying if their believing in Christ was a synergism !But of course we ourselves don’t do any of the work, lest we could say “look at me -aren’t I terrific? I have a part in my salvation!
I believe the poster gave you a good explanation, did you understand it ? The principle of law is that you do or die. Its a law covenant principle from the OT, if you do, you live, so living is rewarded for your doingiow, no scripture about this “making it a law” idea
A major problem you're having is neglecting how Paul was sent to gentiles.journey
Off the wall statement, of course he did. Read Rom 3; Eph 2
Listen! If what you believe is true, it wouldn't matter how Timothy (or anyone else) presented the gospel.Paul understood that we by nature are captive by the devil by his will, and that we need God to grant us repentance in order to recover ourselves.
2 Tim 2:24-26
24 And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient,
25 In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth;
26 And that they may recover themselves out of the snare of the devil, who are taken captive by him at his will.
Paul certainly implies here that without God graciously and sovereignly giving one repentance from the captivity of the devil, that one cannot repent unto the acknowledging of the Truth !
After all that, your comment was still off the wall ! I showed you why. Eph 2:1,5 showed us that Paul understood that before quickening man is dead. How can a dead person repent ? Cant, dont have the ability because he dead in sin.A major problem you're having is neglecting how Paul was sent to gentiles.
In Eph1:1-12, Paul begins by telling the Ephesians how God has blessed the Jews. Then in vs.13 onward, he tells them Jews and gentiles are one in Christ.
In Eph.2, Paul says both Jews and gentiles have sinned are saved by Gods' grace alone, not by works. Then he says,
remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision Eph.2:11
This was the problem. In their time, some Jewish believers (and some Judaizers mixed in) thought gentiles needed to be circumcised in their flesh to be saved. Rom.3 built on Rom.2 and 1 is about the same problem.
Paul never implied repentance is a work mankind is unable to acknowledge.
Being saved by Gods' mercy alone does not mean people are unable to see the injustice done to the Son of God and be truly sorry for it.
Listen! If what you believe is true, it wouldn't matter how Timothy (or anyone else) presented the gospel.
It wouldn't matter whether we were gentle,
patient and meek in sharing the gospel, or we tell people Jesus loves them and then spit in their face.
Do you understand Paul is saying God working through a gentle patient meek servant may soften an unbelievers heart?
I have a question for you. Before you were saved, before you came to the.knowledge of Christ, how would you feel if someone who was innocent was lied about, tortured and executed?
Your conscience.Hopeful,
What defines righteousness and unrighteousness?
So different for everyone?Your conscience.
The works in question are of the Law, ie., circumcision, dietary rules, feast keeping , tithing, and the like.What do you think these verses mean? It has to be EITHER of grace or of works, cannot be of both. And it can't
be that it is of works, so, that leaves only by grace with works eliminated.
[Rom 4:4 KJV] 4 Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt.
[Rom 11:6 KJV] 6 And if by grace, then [is it] no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if [it be] of works, then is it no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.
Why can't one dead in trespasses and sins change their mind about doing those killing things?After all that, your comment was still off the wall ! I showed you why. Eph 2:1,5 showed us that Paul understood that before quickening man is dead. How can a dead person repent ? Cant, dont have the ability because he dead in sin.
No, the works in question are those necessary for salvation. No one would care about those that aren'tThe works in question are of the Law, ie., circumcision, dietary rules, feast keeping , tithing, and the like.
Sure.So different for everyone?
Then everyone faces judgment on different criteria?Sure.
The Jewish think eating ham is a sin.
The converted don't.
To the Judaizers, keeping the Law and circumcision was necessary for salvation.No, the works in question are those necessary for salvation. No one would care about those that aren't
because have no eternal effect upon them.
So, regarding salvation, some works for it are okay and some aren't?To the Judaizers, keeping the Law and circumcision was necessary for salvation.
That is the kind of "works" Paul wrote against.
We will be judged by our consciences.Then everyone faces judgment on different criteria?
So, if each person's conscience is different, then each person will be judged differently with noWe will be judged by our consciences.
1 Tim 1:5..."Now the end of the commandment is charity out of a pure heart, and of a good conscience, and of faith unfeigned:"
Titus 1:15..."Unto the pure all things are pure: but unto them that are defiled and unbelieving is nothing pure; but even their mind and conscience is defiled."