Jesus encountered many individuals who had demonic possession. What actually is root of the problem. Luke 11:24. When the unclean spirit is gone out of a man, he walks through dry places, seeking rest, and finding none . He says, I will return unto the house whence I came out. 11:25. And when he comes, he finds it swept and garnished. 11:26. Then goes he, and takes to him seven other spirits more wicked than him self, and they enter in and dwell there; and last state of that man is worst than the first. Messing with the occult. Or listening to traditions of men, false doctrine. They're inviting unclean spirit to enter. Your to fill your mind with sound doctrine, God's truth. I once dated a girl from old job, 1997.i was inexperienced and dopey young guy. I had bad experience with her. After some months, I stopped seeing her. In 2004, shel left message on the answering machine. It was 5 minutes long and vulgar and pure hatred. She divulged her hate and swearing at me. Halfway through, her voice changed to masculine voice. This scared heck out me. She admitted she was evil. I never heard from her since. I converted to christianity in year 2001.i did drift away for couple years. Then I got back into God's word. Ephesians chapter 2, prince of air does influence children of disobedience. Quick case. Old job. A girl who dated a guy I played tennis with, broke up with him. This is 23 years ago. She had such hatred towards me. She spent her time trying to get me fired. I did nothing to her. I even avoided her. Jesus told us about unclean spirit. Any connection ??. How about the girl who left vile message on answering machine, demonic possession ?
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IS DEMONIC POSSESSION REAL ?
- Thread starter Anaphora
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Dorothy Mae
Member
You are clearly talking demonic activity. But "possession" is a very bad translation. A better understanding is "demonized" or demonic powered. Unclean spirits do not "possess" a person as they still have some semblance of a free will. But they do empower or motivate them. Unclean spirits can be behind evil activity as they influence or even push people who otherwise willingly embrace their suggestions. Giving into hatred is a pleasure to many humans. So the unclean spirits offer them that temptation and as they give in, the unclean spirit(s) guide them. So yes, it was an unclean spirit talking on the phone. But we have authority over them.
I would argue that if a person has gone far enough over to demons, the demons may find that person a suitable host to cling to and feed off of like a parasite. How could one argue that people such as Dahmer were not acting under the influence of demonic activity? Yes, they were mentally ill, but it's more than that. It's a combination of a desire to do things contrary to society mixed with mental illness.
Not only that, it is my belief that demons "mark" people, and those people carry that mark like a sickness, spreading it to others who are vulnerable. It's a taint that stains the soul, and is contagious. This is why after a rash of serial murders, you'll see copycats and imitators. Those people are mentally ill and spiritually vulnerable, which invites attacks in the form of internal struggles. How else do you explain being able to just do the most horrific things imaginable? The human heart is corrupted through and through, and capable of great evil. Harming animals seems to be a common denominator. We are called upon to be caretakers, however.
"The righteous care for the needs of their animals,
but the kindest acts of the wicked are cruel."
Proverbs 12:10
Not only that, it is my belief that demons "mark" people, and those people carry that mark like a sickness, spreading it to others who are vulnerable. It's a taint that stains the soul, and is contagious. This is why after a rash of serial murders, you'll see copycats and imitators. Those people are mentally ill and spiritually vulnerable, which invites attacks in the form of internal struggles. How else do you explain being able to just do the most horrific things imaginable? The human heart is corrupted through and through, and capable of great evil. Harming animals seems to be a common denominator. We are called upon to be caretakers, however.
"The righteous care for the needs of their animals,
but the kindest acts of the wicked are cruel."
Proverbs 12:10
I'd say that acting under the influence of satan and being possessed are totally different.
I do believe either one is possible, although the second is unlikely.
Instead, many persons are influenced by satan and may not even be aware of it.
Ephesians 6:10-13
10Finally, be strong in the Lord and in the strength of His might.
11Put on the full armor of God, so that you will be able to stand firm against the schemes of the devil.
12For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the powers, against the world forces of this darkness, against the spiritual forces of wickedness in the heavenly places.
13Therefore, take up the full armor of God, so that you will be able to resist in the evil day, and having done everything, to stand firm.
Count that one in the blessing column .
Could be , but I would not try to verify by contact .
Well, we know possession will happen--there is the Antichrist, after all. Plus, there was the instance of demons being driven into pigs, who then immediately went and drown themselves. And the use of they/them pronouns cannot be coincidence, since we know that they called themselves Legion and used the we/they/them/us pronouns in their conversation with Jesus.
Perhaps we are so spiritually blinded that we cannot perceive things as they are, and what we term sociopathology and psychopathology is a form of demonic possession in which the host takes on the characteristics of the parasite, and it is reflected in the host's inability to empathize and tendency towards cruelty (think MacDonald Triad).
Dorothy Mae
Member
It’s easy to pick out the obvious evildoers and attribute their acts to demons. But experience from observation shows me clearly that the acts of Christians can be demonized. History records this as well. It’s otherwise hard to explain the great evil believers in Christ hav done.
The heart is a liar indeed. It allows us to rationalize our actions as justified in the face of unjustifiable evil. I am reminded of the quote from Thomas Fuller in 1642:
"She begins at first with doing tricks rather strange then hurtfull: yea some of them are pretty and pleasing. But it is dangerous to gather floures that grow on the banks of the pit of hell, for fear of falling in; yea they which play with the devils rattles, will be brought by degrees to wield his sword, and from making of sport they come to doing of mischief."
Opening oneself up to demonic influence to more and more of a degree perhaps then doesn't create possession; instead, it creates an in-dwelling, like the Holy Spirit is supposed to do. Only, in the temple of that person's body, they have erected an abomination of desolation, and there is no longer a relevant difference at that point between being possessed, and becoming a demon yourself. After all, the fallen angels were, at one point, angels before the fall.
God's armor is heavy with duty; that I should even have to possess such knowledge is itself painful. The whole world groans under the weight of Adam's fatal decision.
"She begins at first with doing tricks rather strange then hurtfull: yea some of them are pretty and pleasing. But it is dangerous to gather floures that grow on the banks of the pit of hell, for fear of falling in; yea they which play with the devils rattles, will be brought by degrees to wield his sword, and from making of sport they come to doing of mischief."
Opening oneself up to demonic influence to more and more of a degree perhaps then doesn't create possession; instead, it creates an in-dwelling, like the Holy Spirit is supposed to do. Only, in the temple of that person's body, they have erected an abomination of desolation, and there is no longer a relevant difference at that point between being possessed, and becoming a demon yourself. After all, the fallen angels were, at one point, angels before the fall.
God's armor is heavy with duty; that I should even have to possess such knowledge is itself painful. The whole world groans under the weight of Adam's fatal decision.
Demons are attitudes, specifically bad, evil, or sinful attitudes.
When Christ dealt with such a person He had to first subdue their attitude.
Once subdued then He could minister.
When Christ dealt with such a person He had to first subdue their attitude.
Once subdued then He could minister.
So your saying that it was bad attitudes which asked to be cast into a herd of swine in Mark 5?
12 And they begged him, saying, “Send us into the pigs. Let us enter them.” 13 So He gave them permission. And the unclean spirits came out and entered the pigs, and the herd, numbering about two thousand, rushed down the steep bank into the sea and drowned in the sea.
No, it was the Legion who replied but that was his attitude.
Attitudes are powerful. You should know. I know you've walked into a room and felt a heaviness or oppression. I know I have. That's the power of the attitude which is very expressive.
And oppressive.
Or good attitudes which you find on the countenance of people who have good 'spirits' about them.
Demonic spirits are not attitudes. They are evil entities entirely distinct and separate from the human soul, and any attempt to convolute this flies directly in the face of early church teaching, and should be openly condemned.
You make a habit of doing so regularly.
I've never thought of them as attitudes. I've seen first-hand too many people that were completely inhuman. The attitude of wanting to dance around the pit of hell picking flowers, as Thomas Fuller put it, is what allows demons to take up residence in the temple of your body.
That we do not see Supernatural-style demonic possession as was described in the early church is likely a matter of Satan no longer needing to press so firmly into the world simply because the world has come to be under his sway entirely. Just as God does not work through the supernatural when there are more mundane ways He can direct us to achieve the same ends is likely the same for Satan--why expend the energy to use someone like a meat suit when you can just hitch a ride on them and feed off of their negativity like parasites? By the very presence of such a parasite, the host is still bent degree by degree to wielding Satan's sword.
Pretty sure humans learned laziness and sloth from demons, so like humans, demons will take the easiest route to achieve a goal.
That we do not see Supernatural-style demonic possession as was described in the early church is likely a matter of Satan no longer needing to press so firmly into the world simply because the world has come to be under his sway entirely. Just as God does not work through the supernatural when there are more mundane ways He can direct us to achieve the same ends is likely the same for Satan--why expend the energy to use someone like a meat suit when you can just hitch a ride on them and feed off of their negativity like parasites? By the very presence of such a parasite, the host is still bent degree by degree to wielding Satan's sword.
Pretty sure humans learned laziness and sloth from demons, so like humans, demons will take the easiest route to achieve a goal.
There are ONLY four spirits the gift of discerning of spirits discerns:
...to another discerning of spirits; 1 Cor. 12:10c
1. The spirit of elect angels
2. The spirit of fallen angels
3. The spirit of man
4. The Spirit of God
These four and no more.
And as an additional comment...
God controls the light each and every generation is allowed to possess. The Doctrine of Christ was not known when this prophecy was given by God in Genesis 3:15...He also rules how much light each and every child of God receives at any given point in their new lives.
And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel. Gen. 3:15.
When this prophecy was given by God it was not immediately known or understood that the Promised One was to be BOTH God and man as this prophecy declares. But with the Advent of the "Jewish" Messiah (Yeshua bar Joseph) we know more about the Son of God. NOR was it understood with the Advent of Christ what and WHO the Son of God was.
Need more proof of what I just posted? Here:
But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased. Dan. 12:4.
And
Now to him that is of power to stablish you according to my gospel, and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery, which was kept secret since the world began, 26 But now is made manifest, and by the scriptures of the prophets, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, made known to all nations for the obedience of faith Rom. 16:25–26.
Tell me, do YOU fully understand the prophecies of the Book of Revelation? Do YOU fully understand that God is Sovereign over ALL He has created? Do YOU fully understand the doctrine of demonology or angelology? Do YOU fully understand that there was no Greek word to translate the Hebrew word for 'demon' and that a new Greek word had to be coined? Do YOU know and understand that Lucifer, (Satan) is STILL an obedient servant of God? Do YOU know and understand that angels CANNOT possess humans?
I notice many here and in Christendom in general who disagree with another member's theological position they are quick to cry "heresy!" or "you're wrong!" and don't have the wisdom nor the knowledge to consider the Scripture that does indeed support their comments but instead hold on tightly to their own false teaching and error EVEN when a Scripture passage directly contradicts their belief and statements. Not only is the Scripture ignored and outright rejected by Christians because they never heard of a theological position another member posts, but they blindly accuse another of teaching a wrong thing and impugn the character of the one who posts it such as you have done just now. But don't worry, your offense is not going to make me to put up iron bars like a prison, I just know and understand that your faith is weak and small and there is not enough light in you to receive the things I post. I recognize the spirit of EVERYONE I interact with because after forty-six years of Christian study I know and understand that it's the words that come from one's mouth, or in this case, one's keyboard that, which reveal to me what's in one's heart and so I see the lack in one's belief-system. I'll leave my additional comment right here.
To the law and to the testimony: If they speak not according to this word, It is because there is no light in them. Isaiah 8:20.
Then Jesus said unto them, Yet a little while is the light with you. Walk while ye have the light, lest darkness come upon you: for he that walketh in darkness knoweth not whither he goeth. 36 While ye have light, believe in the light, that ye may be the children of light. These things spake Jesus, and departed, and did hide himself from them. John 12:35–36.
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And they come to Jesus, and see him that was possessed with the devil, and had the legion, sitting, and clothed, and in his right mind: and they were afraid. Mark 5:15.
(For the weapons of our warfare are not carnal, but mighty through God to the pulling down of strong holds;) 5 Casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ; 2 Cor. 10:4–5.
Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. Matt. 22:37.
Yes, its real.
We deal with it regularly.
Casting out devils is something every believer should be doing.
However, possession may not mean what you think it means.
JLB
I cannot speak for anyone else, but I seek validation in scientific discovery and inquiry. I want to know the physical reasons in the physical universe for why the spiritual world interacts with it in the way it does.
Does not Paul command us to test the spirits and take only that which is profitable? Mathematics do not lie or have bias unless it is put there by the operator. Mathematics show us the universe is a near-infinitely complex mechanism that operates in ways we still do not understand in any but the simplest terms.
So for me, the search is as rewarding as the answer will eventually be because during the search, I learn yet more ancillary things that only add to the majesty of God and His creation.
Does not Paul command us to test the spirits and take only that which is profitable? Mathematics do not lie or have bias unless it is put there by the operator. Mathematics show us the universe is a near-infinitely complex mechanism that operates in ways we still do not understand in any but the simplest terms.
So for me, the search is as rewarding as the answer will eventually be because during the search, I learn yet more ancillary things that only add to the majesty of God and His creation.
Riven
Member
Hmm... tell me, how do you think a spirit, such as a ghost, is able to move?
You are operating under delusions, and your testimony bears witness against you that you recognize nothing but have simply been deluded into thinking you do.
Be on guard against the spirits that are using you, Jeremiah. They will be your tormentors if you do not free yourself from them, and I can assure you you will eventually find out that they were far more than merely "attitudes."
Teaching that Satan is an obedient servant of God is yet another proof that you actually teach doctrines of demons. The spirits within you would likely now attempt to justify this with another lengthy "defense" from scripture, but consistently downplaying the enemy is a telltale sign that someone is actually serving the enemy not God, no matter how well-intended or "informed" you might presume yourself to be.
Ask for deliverance while you have time, and still have a window of opportunity.