Is the Ten Commandment Abolished?

[Ashua]

Noachide law 7 says to establish just laws and to set up a government for enforcement.

Are you saying that Moses' Law is unjust?

According to Noachide Law 7, there is a perfectly legitimate case for the Torah to lay claim.

 

[Theofilus]

What are they? They are the killing machine of the One World Government. The beast in Revelation. They will enforce the mark (denial of Christ). And if you are faithful to the Lord...it's bye bye head.....Hello Kingdom. Lubbly Jubbly.

20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was
given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded
for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had
not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received
his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and
reigned with Christ a thousand years.

First of all, Revelation 20 is talking about the millenial reign of Christ. The thrones in that verse are part of God's Kingdom, not that of the Antichrist. Secondly, Jesus was a Jew and the apostle John was also a Jew. Why would they be discussing a comign persecution of Gentiles? Isn't more likely that the Antichrist will persecute Jews? Jesus warned people about these things in the Gospels. All of them were Jews. Why would he warn them if this is going to be Jews persecuting Gentiles? It doesn't make sense.

I said I would answer your question if you answered mine.

Can I ask you guys. When you look at prophetic events happening in the real world, do you see a move of the nations of the Earth into whats known as a One World Government? Do you see the erosion of our basic rights as citizens occurring today.....in reality?

I do see a lot of prophesy being fulfilled in recent decades. I'm not so sure about the one world government though. I realize that that is one possible interpretation and a very popular one. I used to believe it myself, but now I I'm not so sure. I don't recall anything about a "king of the world" in the Bible, but I do recall something about 10 kings. I believe that there will be 10 or 11 unions of the current nation states. Besides the European union, there will probably also be such groups in North America, South America, Eastern Europe, Southe-East Asia, Africa and other places. I haven't done any in-depth studies of the end times though, since I think it's more important to study things that affect my life today than something that may very well not happen until after I die.

 

[Sinthesis]

I haven't done any in-depth studies of the end times though, since I think it's more important to study things that affect my life today than something that may very well not happen until after I die.

Quite sensible

Pro 17:24 - Wisdom [is] before him that hath understanding; but the eyes of a fool [are] in the ends of the earth.​

 

[Strangelove]

Noachide law 7 says to establish just laws and to set up a government for enforcement.

Are you saying that Moses' Law is unjust?

According to Noachide Law 7, there is a perfectly legitimate case for the Torah to lay claim.

1) It's not mosaic law. It's made up talmudic noahide law which forbids worship in Christ. Punishable by beheading.

2) As Christians were not bound by any religious law. So why should there be religious courts for us anyway?

Please do some homework on this.

 

[stovebolts]

StrangeLove,

I think we're getting a little off base here, but just for correction..

The first five books of the Bible, being credited to Moses as the author are known by the Jews as the written Torah. Along with the written Torah, you also have what is known as the Oral Torah... which the Talmud belongs. Thus, in the Jewish mind, you cannot seperate the Oral from the Written, and we even see evidence of this in our New Testament writtings.

As far as the Noahide laws, these are simply laws laid down by God before Moses was given the written law and apply to goyim (gentiles) since the written law was given to Israel, thus Israel was bound to the yoke of th Mosiac law while goyim were bound by the Nohide laws, seperate and apart from the Mosiac laws. It's really that simple.

Eve was guilty of idolatry as was Isreal. So I don't see you point. Ohh... and I have to wonder about this Christian beheading thingy you're talking about... I don't see that in modern day Jerusalem, but we do see that type of behavior with 'other' middle eastern extreemists religions.

If I may ask, why are you so against anyone reading the Old Testament?

 

[Strangelove]

First of all, Revelation 20 is talking about the millenial reign of Christ. The thrones in that verse are part of God's Kingdom, not that of the Antichrist. Secondly, Jesus was a Jew and the apostle John was also a Jew. Why would they be discussing a comign persecution of Gentiles? Isn't more likely that the Antichrist will persecute Jews? Jesus warned people about these things in the Gospels. All of them were Jews. Why would he warn them if this is going to be Jews persecuting Gentiles? It doesn't make sense.

My only point with that verse was that there WILL be Christians killed for the witness of Christ and for refusing the mark and so on. And specifically BEHEADED. John could have said killed or stabbed or hung or anything but he said beheaded. So we've got Christians beheaded for witnessing Christ and we've got the Noahide punishment for witnessing Christ as.......beheading. And the Noahides are in US law at the moment. They just need to be enforced.

1+1=2?

I do see a lot of prophesy being fulfilled in recent decades. I'm not so sure about the one world government though. I realize that that is one possible interpretation and a very popular one. I used to believe it myself, but now I I'm not so sure. I don't recall anything about a "king of the world" in the Bible, but I do recall something about 10 kings. I believe that there will be 10 or 11 unions of the current nation states. Besides the European union, there will probably also be such groups in North America, South America, Eastern Europe, Southe-East Asia, Africa and other places. I haven't done any in-depth studies of the end times though, since I think it's more important to study things that affect my life today than something that may very well not happen until after I die.

Ok so you can kinda see how it would be possible that a totalitarian world leadership could spring up fairly easily....consolidating power from central locations making it easy for them to make sweeping worldwide enforcements.

Good. just wanted to make sure you wern't one of this people who completely dismiss it. Which is folly in my opinion. I mean....we can see it happening in front of our eyes and we also have this in Rev. >>>>

17:1 And there came one of the seven angels which had the seven vials,
and talked with me, saying unto me, Come hither; I will shew unto
thee the judgment of the great whore that sitteth upon many
waters:
17:2 With whom the kings of the earth have committed fornication, and the inhabitants of the earth have been made drunk with the wine of her fornication.

Which kinda points to Kings/Rulers of nations all partaking in the Whore. The Whore being the ultimate Satanic controller riding the beast which I see as the communist / fascist world system that is the enforcer.

Just my take o'course. If you see something different just let me know.

 

[Strangelove]

As far as the Noahide laws, these are simply laws laid down by God before Moses was given the written law and apply to goyim (gentiles) since the written law was given to Israel, thus Israel was bound to the yoke of th Mosiac law while goyim were bound by the Nohide laws, seperate and apart from the Mosiac laws. It's really that simple.

I'm sorry...Stove? Are you saying your giving legitimacy to made up Talmudic Laws that dont appear in our (Christians) written Word of God?

 

[Strangelove]

Quite sensible

Pro 17:24 - Wisdom [is] before him that hath understanding; but the eyes of a fool [are] in the ends of the earth.​

Yeah I'll see your proverbs and I'll raise you a Hebrews>>>

5:12 For when for the time ye ought to be teachers, ye have need tha tone teach you again which be the first principles of the oracles of God; and are become such as have need of milk, and not of strongmeat.
5:13 For every one that useth milk is unskilful in the word of
righteousness: for he is a babe.
5:14 But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, even those
who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both
good and evil.

 

[stovebolts]

I'm saying that Stephen wasn't making things up about Moses :nod

Where do you think Stephen learned so much about Moses that's not recorded in the OT?... Tell ya what, read Acts 7, then read the OT and tell me what Stephen says about Moses that isn't anywhere in the OT. BTW, with a little digging, how much you want to bet I could find it in the Talmud?

 

[Strangelove]

I'm saying that Stephen wasn't making things up about Moses :nod

Where do you think Stephen learned so much about Moses that's not recorded in the OT?... Tell ya what, read Acts 7, then read the OT and tell me what Stephen says about Moses that isn't anywhere in the OT. BTW, with a little digging, how much you want to bet I could find it in the Talmud?

Forgive me I'm not following. Are you saying the Talmud is a useful book? Are you saying that the talmud is truth?

 

[stovebolts]

I'm saying you need to read Acts 7 and compare what Stephen is saying about Moses and ask youreself where Stephen got his story from :yes

I'm finding that you know about stuff, but your not familiare with 'stuff'. When you've done your homework we can talk. Till then, catch ya on the flip side

 

[Strangelove]

I'm saying you need to read Acts 7 and compare what Stephen is saying about Moses and ask youreself where Stephen got his story from :yes

I'm finding that you know about stuff, but your not familiare with 'stuff'. When you've done your homework we can talk. Till then, catch ya on the flip side

If whatever Stephen said about moses isn't in the OT then why do I care where he got it from. He coulda got it from anywhere. Are you saying that if that info is in the talmud then it somehow legitamizes that book in Christian eyes??

You could just tell me what it is specifically that Stephen said that so interests you instead of making me read the entire Bible. Help a Brother out? :shocked!

 

[Elijah674]

I agree with all of that. Perhaps I misunderstood you. I'm sorry.

Hi, this was the BEST posting that 'i' have read in awhile! If we LOVE CHRIST WE WILL SHOW IT, huh? 'If ye Love Me keep My Commandments' (Good post Nick)

--Elijah

 

[Theofilus]

Which kinda points to Kings/Rulers of nations all partaking in the Whore. The Whore being the ultimate Satanic controller riding the beast which I see as the communist / fascist world system that is the enforcer.

Just my take o'course. If you see something different just let me know.

I do see something different. Like I said before, I haven't done any in-depth study on this, so this is just my interpretation. I'm not claiming that it's anything more than that, but it is something I believe to be correct.

Women, when mentioned symbolically, represent worship or religions. Virtuous women, such as virgins, sybolize the true worship of God, while evil women, such as whores, represent false religions or incorrect worship. The harlot of Revelation therefore represents a false religious system, as do her daughters. I won't go into further detail, since it would be well outside the subject of this thread.

 

[Elijah674]

I'm sorry...Stove? Are you saying your giving legitimacy to made up Talmudic Laws that dont appear in our (Christians) written Word of God?

God told Isaac why He called Abe in Gen. 26 (BC 1804) long long before He gave the Jews the written Law, + giving it again verbally on Mt. Sinai to the then Jews! And if you [two] would go back into the Bible, you might get off the MILK of Heb. 5? What do you think that Cain was rejecting? or the preaching of CHRISTSs RIGHTOUS (Eternal Gospel of Rev. 14:6) by Noah withe the Holy Spirit's STRIVING for 120 years with the PRE/FLOOD ones if not the Law Of The Eternal Godhead??

No Eternal (Heb. 13:20) 10 Commandment Covenant finds one VOID of sin. 1 John 3:4 (Adam, Cain + satan in heaven!) if it was not ETERNAL! And sin started in heaven. And if you would study the Sanctuary of the Godhead, you would find that satan was one of the two covering cherubs over the Ark of God in the Most Holy Place of heaven.

But which of your two postings BELIEVE verse 5's [VOICE + LAWS?]
And we hear 'about satan's Tower of Babel's babbling ones postings today'???

--Elijah

Gen.26

[1] And there was a famine in the land, beside the first famine that was in the days of Abraham. And Isaac went unto Abimelech king of the Philistines unto Gerar.
[2] And the LORD appeared unto him, and said, Go not down into Egypt; dwell in the land which I shall tell thee of:
[3] Sojourn in this land, and I will be with thee, and will bless thee; for unto thee, and unto thy seed, I will give all these countries, and I will perform the oath which I sware unto Abraham thy father;
[4] And I will make thy seed to multiply as the stars of heaven, and will give unto thy seed all these countries; and in thy seed shall all the nations of the earth be blessed;

[5] Because that [Abraham obeyed my voice], and [kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws.]

[6] And Isaac dwelt in Gerar:

 

[zone]

Yeah I'll see your proverbs and I'll raise you a Hebrews>>>

ROTFLMHO!

 

[Strangelove]

God told Isaac why He called Abe in Gen. 26 (BC 1804) long long before He gave the Jews the written Law, + giving it again verbally on Mt. Sinai to the then Jews! And if you [two] would go back into the Bible, you might get off the MILK of Heb. 5? What do you think that Cain was rejecting? or the preaching of CHRISTSs RIGHTOUS (Eternal Gospel of Rev. 14:6) by Noah withe the Holy Spirit's STRIVING for 120 years with the PRE/FLOOD ones if not the Law Of The Eternal Godhead??

No Eternal (Heb. 13:20) 10 Commandment Covenant finds one VOID of sin. 1 John 3:4 (Adam, Cain + satan in heaven!) if it was not ETERNAL! And sin started in heaven. And if you would study the Sanctuary of the Godhead, you would find that satan was one of the two covering cherubs over the Ark of God in the Most Holy Place of heaven.

But which of your two postings BELIEVE verse 5's [VOICE + LAWS?]
And we hear 'about satan's Tower of Babel's babbling ones postings today'???

--Elijah

Gen.26

[1] And there was a famine in the land, beside the first famine that was in the days of Abraham. And Isaac went unto Abimelech king of the Philistines unto Gerar.
[2] And the LORD appeared unto him, and said, Go not down into Egypt; dwell in the land which I shall tell thee of:
[3] Sojourn in this land, and I will be with thee, and will bless thee; for unto thee, and unto thy seed, I will give all these countries, and I will perform the oath which I sware unto Abraham thy father;
[4] And I will make thy seed to multiply as the stars of heaven, and will give unto thy seed all these countries; and in thy seed shall all the nations of the earth be blessed;

[5] Because that [Abraham obeyed my voice], and [kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws.]

[6] And Isaac dwelt in Gerar:

? Whats that got to do with the legitamacy of the talmud?

 

[Strangelove]

I do see something different. Like I said before, I haven't done any in-depth study on this, so this is just my interpretation. I'm not claiming that it's anything more than that, but it is something I believe to be correct.

Women, when mentioned symbolically, represent worship or religions. Virtuous women, such as virgins, sybolize the true worship of God, while evil women, such as whores, represent false religions or incorrect worship. The harlot of Revelation therefore represents a false religious system, as do her daughters. I won't go into further detail, since it would be well outside the subject of this thread.

Thats no different to what I see at all. Were in agreement.

Except you've left out the beast.

 

[JLG]

I have heard many Christians say we're no longer under the law, yet I wonder if some of them understand what the law of God is all about. Below is some scripture speaking about the law, and since Jesus fulfilled the law, then we should look at him to understand the law. (I will be commenting through these scriptures).

I know that many Christians will say nobody is able to keep the law, but I have some good news for them. (We can and Jesus expects us to.) I believe it will help to understand what the law is all about.

The law is about L-O-V-E. Loving the Lord your God with all your heart, soul, and mind, and loving your neighbor as yourself, for these two things does the whole law hang upon.(Matthew 22:37-40) The law is about God telling us to L-O-V-E.

When Jesus gave us those two laws in Matthew 22:37-40 he was quoting from the law in Deut. 6:5 and Lev.19:18., and Jesus expects us to keep them.

Notice in Matthew 7:12 below that Jesus refers to the golden rule and said this is the law and the prophets (Loving your neighbor is fulfilling the law), but then he goes on in verse 13,14 speaking about the wide and narrow gates in the same context. which would indicate that keeping his two commandments is walking the narrow path.

Matthew 7:12 Therefore all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them: for this is the law and the prophets.
13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

Paul said In Romans 13: 8 that he who loves another fulfills the law

Jas 2:8 If ye fulfil the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself, ye do well:


So keeping the law is about loving the Lord our God, and loving our neighbor as ourselves. So for a Christian to say we're not under law is like saying we're not under love.

Then how can we keep the law? Answer: By trusting the Holy Spirit to work righteouness in our hearts, because it's the fruits of the Holy Spirit listed in Galatians 5:22,23 that we need to fulfil the law. It's God himself who works within us to "will" and to "do". Philippians 2:13.

It's the Holy Spirit who does the work through us, and it's the Holy Spirit who will conform us to the image of Jesus Christ. Romans 8:29

My faith isn't in myself, but in all Jesus Christ can do through me. He's the Author & Finisher of my faith. Hebrews 12:2.

God said in Hebrews 8:10 and 10:16 below that he will put his laws in our minds and hearts. So why would God do that, if we're not under the law?

Hebrews 8:10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:

Hebrews 10:16 This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;

Matthew 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.
19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
20 For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.

I'm going to break up Matthew 5:17-20, which I posted above, but this time I'm going to break it up, so I can comment on each aspect of it, so we all see everything Jesus said about it.

Matthew 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.

(Notice above that Jesus said that he didn't come to destroy the law.)


18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

(Notice in verse 18, that Jesus said that until earth pass away not one jot or tittle of the law will pass from the law. Heaven and earth haven't passed yet, so the law is still in effect.)


19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

(Notice in verse 19 Jesus said whosoever shall teach men to break the least of these laws shall be considered the least in the Kingdom of Heaven.)


20 For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.

(Notice in verse 20 ,that Jesus requires righteousness to enter into the Kingdom of Heaven, which wiil be the theme of what Jesus taught.)

 

[Theofilus]

? Whats that got to do with the legitamacy of the talmud?

Strangelove, you're the only one here who wants to discuss the "legitimacy of the Talmud". The rest of us are talking about the written Torah.