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Is TULIP biblical?

JLB said:
God desires all men to be saved.

For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior, who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth. 1 Timothy 2:3-4
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The Natural man cannot receive the things of the Spirit. The natural man cannot please God Rom 8:8

8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.

No matter what the natural man is in the flesh, no matter how much natural affection he has.
 
brightfame52 said:
Nothing a man can do to get out of being in the flesh. We are born that way.
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We believe with our minds and our minds aren't made of flesh. God made us trainable.

That's why Jews who read the OT believed in a forgiving God as a loving Father,

It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned oft he Father, cometh unto me. Jn.6:45

The Holy Spirit directed just such people toward Jesus,

And, behold, there was a man in Jerusalem, whose name was Simeon; and the same man was just and devout, waiting for the consolation of Israel: and the Holy Ghost was upon him.....And there was one Anna, a prophetess, the daughter of Phanuel, of the tribe of Aser: she was of a great age, and had lived with an husband seven years from her virginity; And she was a widow of about fourscore and four years, which departed not from the temple, but served God with fastings and prayers night and day. Lk.2:25,37 KJV

So God comes to people who love Him. This is why when Judas (not Iscariot) asked why He doesn't reveal Himself to everyone,

Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him and make our abode with him.
Jn.14:23 KJV

You're not even looking at what the Messiah actually said. Interpret Paul from what the King actually said in both the Old and New Testaments. Not the other way around.
 
journeyman said:
We believe with our minds and our minds aren't made of flesh. God made us trainable.

That's why Jews who read the OT believed in a forgiving God as a loving Father,

It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned oft he Father, cometh unto me. Jn.6:45

The Holy Spirit directed just such people toward Jesus,

And, behold, there was a man in Jerusalem, whose name was Simeon; and the same man was just and devout, waiting for the consolation of Israel: and the Holy Ghost was upon him.....And there was one Anna, a prophetess, the daughter of Phanuel, of the tribe of Aser: she was of a great age, and had lived with an husband seven years from her virginity; And she was a widow of about fourscore and four years, which departed not from the temple, but served God with fastings and prayers night and day. Lk.2:25,37 KJV

So God comes to people who love Him. This is why when Judas (not Iscariot) asked why He doesn't reveal Himself to everyone,

Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him and make our abode with him.
Jn.14:23 KJV

You're not even looking at what the Messiah actually said. Interpret Paul from what the King actually said in both the Old and New Testaments. Not the other way around.
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Sorry, man in the flesh is dead to God, cant please God.
 
journeyman

We believe with our minds and our minds aren't made of flesh. God made us trainable.
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Man by nature, the way we are born, we are carnal, carnal minded, and the word of God says this of the carnal mind Rom 8:7

7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

That mind isnt subject to God, the law of God, and it cant be ! And mans will is but an extension of his mind.
 
brightfame52 said:
journeyman
Man by nature, the way we are born, we are carnal, carnal minded, and the word of God says this of the carnal mind Rom 8:7

7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

That mind isnt subject to God, the law of God, and it cant be ! And mans will is but an extension of his mind.
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Good and evil are learned, because they're concepts. Gods' concepts. His idea which is is also His law which is learned.

You're saying people can't realize they need Gods' help and ask him for it. That's not true,

For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.
Rom.10:12 KJV
 
journeyman said:
Good and evil are learned, because they're concepts. Gods' concepts. His idea which is is also His law which is learned.

You're saying people can't realize they need Gods' help and ask him for it. That's not true,

For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.
Rom.10:12 KJV
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Man by nature, the way we are born, we are carnal, carnal minded, and the word of God says this of the carnal mind Rom 8:7

7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

That mind isnt subject to God, the law of God, and it cant be ! And mans will is but an extension of his mind.
 
brightfame52 said:
Man by nature, the way we are born, we are carnal, carnal minded......
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No "carnal" doesn't mean "the human body."

Carnal is the way a human body can be seen or not, depending on how an individual perceives it.

It may be correctly, the way Godly influences say, or the adversarys way.

I've already posted enough scripture showing God wants people who hear and believe and you haven't commented on any of them. No sensible interpretation of what the NT says.
 
journeyman said:
No "carnal" doesn't mean "the human body."

Carnal is the way a human body can be seen or not, depending on how an individual perceives it.

It may be correctly, the way Godly influences say, or the adversarys way.

I've already posted enough scripture showing God wants people who hear and believe and you haven't commented on any of them. No sensible interpretation of what the NT says.
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The way we are by nature, carnal, our mind is enmity against God Rom 8:7

7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
 
journeyman said:
Our minds are trainable. That's why God wants us to teach our children. 😊
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Our mind by nature is enmity against God and not subject to God and cannot be.

Rom 8:7

7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
 
journeyman said:
It's stunning. Jesus mercifully holding back his own anger against people who are abusing him, got turned into "TULIP"...."I can't repent because I don't know how. I have to wait for God to sprinkle magic fairy dust on my head so I can turn to him. And after I turn to him, I'm so depraved I'll continue living in sin and God is OK with that because he knows I'm just a mindless robot. What?
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What is "TULIP" ?
 
journeyman said:
Our minds are trainable. That's why God wants us to teach our children. 😊
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journeyman said:
No the devils' mind is so listen to Jesus. 😊
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Are denying what Paul stated clearly?

Rom 8:7 For the mind that is set on the flesh is hostile to God, for it does not submit to God's law; indeed, it cannot.
Rom 8:8 Those who are in the flesh cannot please God. (ESV)
2Co 4:3 And even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled to those who are perishing.
2Co 4:4 In their case the god of this world has blinded the minds of the unbelievers, to keep them from seeing the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God. (ESV)
 
Free said:
Are denying what Paul stated clearly?
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I was agreeing with Paul and disagreeing with brightflame.
Free said:
Rom 8:7 For the mind that is set on the flesh
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Yes exactly. God pleases others. Jesus pleased His Father by thinking of others before Himself. So if a persons' mind is set on "the flesh" he can't please God.
Free said:
is hostile to God, for it does not submit to God's law; indeed, it cannot.
Rom 8:8 Those who are in the flesh cannot please God. (ESV)
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That's why Paul instructs us to set our minds on things above "where Christ is."
Free said:
2Co 4:3 And even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled to those who are perishing.
2Co 4:4 In their case the god of this world has blinded the minds of the unbelievers, to keep them from seeing the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God. (ESV)
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Indeed, the devil tempts through the "desire" of the flesh, which can't do anything without a mind. 🙂
 
Consecrated Life said:
What is "TULIP" ?
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Its an acronym men have given to what is the Gospel of Gods Grace, T for Total Depravity or Inability of man by nature U for Unconditional Election L for limited or particular atonement I for Irresistible, effectual Grace and P for preservation or perseverance of the saints.
 
journeyman said:
No the devils' mind is so listen to Jesus. 😊

And I will put enmitybetween thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel. Gen.3:15
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This is everyone's mind by nature towards God, enmity Rom 8:7

7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

That word enmity means hatred, by nature we hate the True God of the Bible
 
journeyman said:
It's a belief that once Adam and Eve sinned, they became unsaved and all their offspring would be born unsaved. People can only become saved if God picks them to be saved.
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Thank You Journyman & Happy + Blessed New Year to you .
For me one of the most tragic Sentences and at the same time one of the most comforting contained in the scripture is:
Gen 3:9
And the LORD God called unto Adam, and said unto him, Where art thou?

The Lord God calling for a guilty Adam.

Seeking him to tell reveal to him the coming Salvation for him and for all future humanity.
That he might ponder so great a Salvation in his heart.
 
brightfame52 said:
This is everyone's mind by nature towards God, enmity
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No it's the mind of the devil towards our 1st mother Eve and the entire human race and One of Eves' children would wound his head,

I will put enmity between you and the woman and between your seed and her seed; he shall bruise your head, and you shall bruise his heel." Gen.3:15 RSV
brightfame52 said:
That word enmity means hatred, by nature we hate the True God of the Bible
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Adam and Eve didn't hate God.
 
Consecrated Life said:
Thank You Journyman & Happy + Blessed New Year to you .
For me one of the most tragic Sentences and at the same time one of the most comforting contained in the scripture is:
Gen 3:9
And the LORD God called unto Adam, and said unto him, Where art thou?

The Lord God calling for a guilty Adam.
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It's funny when God asks a question. 😊 I think that's why a rabbinic way of teaching is to answer a question with a question which is simple to answer., because the answer is plain...if we are honest,

He who covers his sins will not prosper, But whoever confesses and forsakes them will have mercy. Pro.28:13 NKJV

Adam admitted his sin and I believe he turned from it and Eve did the same.
Consecrated Life said:
Seeking him to tell reveal to him the coming Salvation for him and for all future humanity.
That he might ponder so great a Salvation in his heart.
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It's a beautiful picture of a loving Father showing our parents how winning souls would be very painful,

My little children, of whom I travail in birth again until Christ be formed in you,
Gal.4:19 KJV

Paul previously taught the Galatians,

Ye know how through infirmity of the flesh I preached the gospel unto you at the first. Gal.4:13 KJV

It's likely Paul was in bad shape from a previous beating.

Then Adam being instructed about farming,

Sow righteousness for yourselves, reap the fruit of unfailing love, and break up your unplowed ground; for it is time to seek the LORD, until he comes and showers his righteousness on you. Hos.10:12 NIV

“Listen! A farmer went out to sow his seed.".....Then Jesus said to them, “Don’t you understand this parable? How then will you understand any parable? " Mk.4:3,13 NIV

God tells us not to curse our fathers or our mothers,

Anyone who curses their father or mother is to be put to death. Exo.21:17 NIV

Moses meant to disgrace or shame our parents, but that is exactly what TULIP does.

Adam and Eve were like children, not knowing good and evil. They didn't even know disobeying God was "sin" until after they listened to an evil spirit who attacked through reasoning.

Satan the unrepentant spirit is cursed Gen.3:14

The ground we were created from, the "dust" that composes our physical bodies would die. Gen.3:17

So our physical make up was doomed to decay, but not our minds or spirits. I think this is the saddest verse in the Bible,

All is pure to those who are pure. But to those who are corrupt and unbelieving, nothing is pure, but both their minds and consciences are corrupted. Tit.1:15 NET

One thing we can do as believers is point unbelievers toward God because of the goodness they see around them everyday.
😊
 
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