[ok my keyvoard is 'missing' a letter...I am using V instead 'cause it rhymes with ___the missing letter}
Main provlem with these devates: done as if there are only two positions, _ut there are three...here I go to copy and paste:[and this is not something over which Christians should _rake/leave fellowship]
Its good intention lies in giving assurance to those who
struggle with their sense of being saved. Today, many seasoned
Christians will tell those who make a profession of
faith (whether by a prayer or by going forward at a church
or crusade) that they have eternal security. A popular slogan
rings out: “Once saved, always saved.â€
And other Christians will assure those who have been
baptized and confirmed that they are heaven bound no matter
what may follow. Though many of these converts might
never live by faith, this assurance will again be affirmed at
their funerals.
But a new idea enters here. By leaving out New
Testament essentials, these teachings depart from the historic
Christian faith. This new idea leaves behind the holy
conjunction; it fails to hold essentials together. Faith and
obedience are sundered; forgiveness and repentance divided.
While some differences arise among great saints of the
past, like Martin Luther, John Calvin, and John Wesley, they
all agreed that we are saved by faith alone through God’s
unmerited grace. On this point, Wesley said of Calvin, “I do
not differ from him an hair’s breadth.â€4
So, too, the seasoned Christians mentioned above affirm
this. But where is the difference?
Martin Luther observed that “the world and the masses
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are and always will be unchristian, although they are all baptized
and nominally Christians. Christians, however, are few
and far between . . .â€5
Luther pointed to “the divine promise which says: ‘He
that believeth and is baptized shall be saved’ [Mark 16:16].â€6
(Note the holy conjunction.) But he also warned, “Unless
faith is present or comes to life in baptism, the ceremony is
of no avail; indeed it is a stumbling-block not only at the
moment we receive baptism but for all our life thereafter.â€7
John Calvin affirmed, “Only if we walk in the beauty of
God’s law do we become sure of our adoption as children of
the Father.â€8 (What a contrast that is with the assurances
given by those who march under another banner.)
Furthermore, he wrote:
The apostle denies that anyone actually knows
Christ who has not learned to put off the old man,
corrupt with deceitful lusts, and to put on Christ.
External knowledge of Christ is found to be
only a false and dangerous make-believe, however
eloquently and freely lip servants may talk about
the gospel.
The gospel is not a doctrine of the tongue, but
of life.9
The key point here is succinctly summed up by J. I.
Packer: “Scripture holds out no hope of salvation for any
who, whatever their profession of faith, do not seek to turn
from sin to righteousness (1 Cor. 6:9-11; Rev. 21:8).â€10
We need to read and hear Jesus’ parable of the sower.
(Christians ought to read and know God’s word.) Here,
Jesus speaks of the different types of soil upon which the
seed of the gospel falls. The seed falls on the footpath, on
shallow, rocky soil, on ground infested with thorns, and on
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good ground (Mat. 13). The hard footpath will not even
grow a plant, but on the shallow, stony soil, the plants spring
up immediately, but because of the shallowness, they have
no deep root and wither away in the sun.
Jesus tells us, “He who received the seed on the stony
places, this is he who hears the word and immediately
receives it with joy, [he may readily run forward at an altar
call] yet he has no root in himself, but endures only for a
while. For when tribulation or persecution arises because of
the word, immediately he stumbles “ (Mat. 13:20-21).
About the ground with thorns, Jesus says, “He who
received the seed among the thorns is he who hears the
word, and the cares of this world and the deceitfulness of
riches choke the word, and he becomes unfruitful†(Mat
13:22). The thorns choke out life. (We remember what Jesus
said about dead branches on the vine: they are cut off and
gathered to be burned.)
Here, confusion rushes in when those in this modern,
once-saved-always-saved camp assure these sad cases of
people that they have eternal security. (Just as the evangelical
churches of Joy and Mary did for them.)
Right here lies the critical point of difference between
the historic doctrine of the perseverance of the saints and
this modern notion, which reigns under the banner of “once
saved, always saved.†Both will agree that God’s elect cannot
be lost; but those with this new notion will assure someone,
anyone, who makes an initial profession of faith that
they have eternal security. And their positive assessment
regarding the salvation of these hearers will never change,
not even when the roots shrivel and the thorns choke the life
out. The initial response (profession) rather than the life of
endurance (perseverance) stands as their criteria. (As a
result, they often fail in exhortation, and they often remain
silent, except to assure Christians like Joy and Mary that
they are heaven bound.)
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But Jesus said, “He who endures to the end will be
saved†(Mat. 10:22).
Calvin, one unflinching champion of the perseverance of
the saints, clearly taught this. Expositing this parable of the
sower, he speaks of the “temporary faith†of the one who
receives the word with joy:
They lack a living feeling (affectus) to confirm
them in steadfastness. . . . For unless the Word
penetrates the whole heart and puts down deep
roots there will be no steady flow of moisture to
make faith persevere. . . . let us realize that nothing
is done until faith has gained a firm strength. . . .
these are called ‘temporary’, not only because they
fall away in temptation after being professed disciples
of Christ for a time, but also because they
themselves think that they have a true faith. . . . But
we must know that they are not truly born again of
incorruptible seed, which does not fade away, as
Peter says (1 Pet. 1.4).11
As F. F. Bruce has pointed out, “The perseverance of the
saints is a biblical doctrine, but it is not a doctrine designed
to lull the indifferent into a sense of false security; it means
that perseverance is an essential token of sanctity.â€12...
J. I. Packer affirms, “Only those who show themselves
to be regenerate by pursuing heart-holiness and true
neighbor-love as they pass through this world are entitled to
believe themselves secure in Christ.
[Two faithful witnesses]
