It’s not biblical!

[Walpole]

Jesus gave instruction to the Apostles to teach.
Matthew 28:19
Not to every person He ever came across.
Those Apostles taught others, and so on.

We cannot be our own teachers.

Indeed.

 

[GodsGrace]

I'll tell you why it's not enough Jethro.

Because you and I believe in good deeds and some don't believe they're necessary and some go so far as to day that our good deeds are an insult to God.

We don't believe in OSAS and other Christian's do.

Some believe baptism is necessary and some don't.

Some believe God chooses the saved based on nothing that we can know of, and some believe we must reply to God's grace calling us.

Who's right?
How can we know?

Come on Jethro Bodine , you can answer to the above.
You know this is right.
You know we're in a mess.
Jesus said a house divided cannot stand -

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Come on Jethro Bodine , you can answer to the above.
You know this is right.
You know we're in a mess.
Jesus said a house divided cannot stand -

I can answer. I just haven't, lol.

There is no other authority besides the scriptures to understand direct spiritual truth. That is the argument.

Just because some people are still learning and growing up into that truth, and some don't even have the Spirit to hear the voice of God in the scriptures to begin with doesn't mean the scriptures are not the sole authority for spiritual truth.

 

[GodsGrace]

I can answer. I just haven't, lol.

There is no other authority besides the scriptures to understand direct spiritual truth. That is the argument.

Just because some people are still learning and growing up into that truth, and some don't even have the Spirit to hear the voice of God in the scriptures to begin with doesn't mean the scriptures are not the sole authority for spiritual truth.

Too easy!
How come we all believe something different.
If there is more than one truth,,,
There is NO truth.

What do you think of the teachings that were passed down by the Apostles but are found in different writings?

 

[donadams]

Walpole and donadams , you two need to stop beating around the bush and just come right out and tell us what we need to add to the scriptures since you say the scriptures we have are insufficient "for instruction, for conviction, for correction, and for training in righteousness, 17so that the man of God may be complete, fully equipped for every good work." (2 Timothy 3:16-17).

Who is this “man of God”?

The scriptures are materially sufficient but the church /apostles are required to teach and instruct

We must be taught or instructed:
Lk 1:4
Matt 28:19
Jn 20:21
Acts 8:31
Colossians 2:7
Rooted and built up in him, and stablished in the faith, as ye have been taught…

No Christian has the authority to read scripture for yourself and decide your own doctrines or beliefs! Eph 4:5 Jude 1:3

Truth must be revealed by God thru Christ to His church (the apostles Jude 1:3) then must be proposed by the church, (Matt 28:19 gal 3:23) without error by the Holy Spirit! (Jn 16:13)

Christ and His church are one! (Acts 9:4 eph 5:32 Jn 15:1-5)

The evidence of true faith is humble subjection and obedience to Christ & His holy church! Jn 15:1-5 Rom 16:26

The rule of faith for Christians is Jesus Christ Jn 14:6 and His church! Matt 18:17 acts 2:42 1 Tim 3:15

True Christians cannot listen to the errors of excommunicated heretics, but we listen faithfully to Christ, in the bosom of holy mother church, the only ark of salvation!
1 pet 3:20-21 matt 18:17 matt 16:18-19 matt 28:19-20 Jn 16:13 Jn 20:21-23

 

[Jethro Bodine]

The scriptures are materially sufficient but the church /apostles are required to teach and instruct

That does not make the scriptures insufficient. In fact, that supports sola scriptura. That is, as long as the scriptures themselves, and only the scriptures, are what is being taught.

I think what you want to say is the written scriptures are not enough and that we need the Catholic church's additions to scripture to be fully equipped.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

No Christian has the authority to read scripture for yourself and decide your own doctrines or beliefs! Eph 4:5 Jude 1:3

What every Christian has is the God given ability by the Holy Spirit to know when someone is teaching error and when someone is teaching truth. A truth that the Catholic church rejects, even though it's spelled out for us right in scripture, because it robs them of control.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Truth must be revealed by God thru Christ to His church (the apostles Jude 1:3) then must be proposed by the church, (Matt 28:19 gal 3:23) without error by the Holy Spirit! (Jn 16:13)

No, lol. God reveals to his people whether what they are hearing and being taught is truth or not directly through the Holy Spirit within them. Believers are not at the mercy of a few corrupt men who insist that only they can hear and discern the truth and allowed and enabled to give it to you. That's what the Scribes and Pharisees did to the people of God. God put that way to rest when he destroyed principalities and powers at the cross, delivering his people from the clutches of greedy, corrupt men selfishly grasping for power and control over people. Christ himself, through the Holy Spirit, is now the Head Shepherd of God's flock.

 

[GodsGrace]

That does not make the scriptures insufficient. In fact, that supports sola scriptura. That is, as long as the scriptures themselves, and only the scriptures, are what is being taught.

I think what you want to say is the written scriptures are not enough and that we need the Catholic church's additions to scripture to be fully equipped.

I want to say this....
You're an intelligent fellow -
Most persons are able to read the bible and discern what it all means if we, here on this forum, have a problem in that we all understand different concepts by reading the same bible.

Now, I've been complaining about this for a while now - even while you were away.
But I think it's a serious problem, but I don't have the solution for it.

I had even started on thread on why we need a Protestant Pope...
I guess then all the forums would closes down!
: (

 

[jaybo]

Jesus gave instruction to the Apostles to teach.
Matthew 28:19
Not to every person He ever came across.
Those Apostles taught others, and so on.

We cannot be our own teachers.

Yes we can. We Christians all have the best teacher there is: the Holy Spirit. He will guide us into all truth! All we have to do is clear our minds and pay attention.

 

[GodsGrace]

Yes we can. We Christians all have the best teacher there is: the Holy Spirit. He will guide us into all truth! All we have to do is clear our minds and pay attention.

What is the truth?

1. OSAS
2. NECESSITY OF BAPTISM
3. PREDESTINATION OF SAVED AND UNSAVED
4. DOES MAN HAVE FREE WILL
5. DID GOD KILL INNOCENT CHILDREN IN THE O.T.
6. DID JESUS DIE FOR EVERYONE OR ONLY BELIEVERS

ETC.

 

[donadams]

That does not make the scriptures insufficient. In fact, that supports sola scriptura. That is, as long as the scriptures themselves, and only the scriptures, are what is being taught.

I think what you want to say is the written scriptures are not enough and that we need the Catholic church's additions to scripture to be fully equipped.

No personal interpretation or meaning of scripture, the church having and exercising the authority of Christ who wrote the New Testament is the only interpreter,
For example: I wrote this statement and I alone can say what it means.

A fat sandwich man:

Is it a fat man who makes sandwiches or a man who makes fat sandwiches?

And the church alone has authority to declare the books of scripture
Thanks

 

[donadams]

L

What every Christian has is the God given ability by the Holy Spirit to know when someone is teaching error and when someone is teaching truth. A truth that the Catholic church rejects, even though it's spelled out for us right in scripture, because it robs them of control.

that’s you’re bias
The HS leads the apostles and their successors into all truth Jn 8:32 & 16:13 they must teach and instruct us
We can only believe what Christ has revealed eph 4:5 Jude 1:3 and what the church of Christ teaches
Lk 1:4
Matt 28:19
Jn 20:21
Acts 8:31
Colossians 2:7
Rooted and built up in him, and stablished in the faith, as ye have been taught…

Why believe the tradition of men who are called reformers but have no authority from Christ?
Thanks

 

[GodsGrace]

No personal interpretation or meaning of scripture, the church having and exercising the authority of Christ who wrote the New Testament is the only interpreter,
For example: I wrote this statement and I alone can say what it means.

A fat sandwich man:

Is it a fat man who makes sandwiches or a man who makes fat sandwiches?

And the church alone has authority to declare the books of scripture
Thanks

OK
But Christ did not write the NT.
Please stop saying that?

 

[donadams]

No, lol. God reveals to his people whether what they are hearing and being taught is truth or not directly through the Holy Spirit within them. Believers are not at the mercy of a few corrupt men who insist that only they can hear and discern the truth and allowed and enabled to give it to you. That's what the Scribes and Pharisees did to the people of God. God put that way to rest when he destroyed principalities and powers at the cross, delivering his people from the clutches of greedy, corrupt men selfishly grasping for power and control over people. Christ himself, through the Holy Spirit, is now the Head Shepherd of God's flock.

And what does Christ say of these successors of Moses? They MUST be obeyed!

Most people until the 20th century were illiterate and could never read scripture and many still are in rural areas

 

[Jethro Bodine]

I want to say this....
You're an intelligent fellow -
Most persons are able to read the bible and discern what it all means if we, here on this forum, have a problem in that we all understand different concepts by reading the same bible.

Now, I've been complaining about this for a while now - even while you were away.
But I think it's a serious problem, but I don't have the solution for it.

I had even started on thread on why we need a Protestant Pope...
I guess then all the forums would closes down!
: (

Maybe not a Protestant pope but rather a Protestant Twelve in the pattern set by Jesus in the appointing of the Twelve to establish and govern the New Testament church.

That can't happen though because there is too much preconceived bias among Protestants today. IOW, there's so much error that has to be undone for people to have enough clear unbiased vision to come to a concensus of what the actual truth of the scriptures is. But I'm with you. It would be great if that could happen.

 

[GodsGrace]

Maybe not a Protestant pope but rather a Protestant Twelve in the pattern set by Jesus in the appointing of the Twelve to establish and govern the New Testament church.

That can't happen though because there is too much preconceived bias among Protestants today. IOW, there's so much error that has to be undone for people to have enough clear unbiased vision to come to a concensus of what the actual truth of the scriptures is. But I'm with you. It would be great if that could happen.

Yeah.
Amen to that!

But would this be ecumenism, which many are against?
No, I think that's different.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

And what does Christ say of these successors of Moses? They MUST be obeyed!

Not anymore. Their authority was removed at the cross - Colossians 2:15-23.

The Catholic church seems to think that authority still exists and that they have it!

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Yeah.
Amen to that!

But would this be ecumenism, which many are against?
No, I think that's different.

No, it wouldn't be ecumenism because our Twelve would not be lobbying for a particular belief or theology but only for the one true theology as it was in the time of the Twelve.

 

[GodsGrace]

No, it wouldn't be ecumenism because our Twelve would not be lobbying for a particular belief or theology but only for the one true theology as it was in the time of the Twelve.

Right. And I think ecumenism is the idea that there should be only one religion.
That's comical.