Jesus Is God: Part 1

[leroy]

Jesus was tempted like all of us, but never fell to the temptations for Jesus was without sin.

Heb 4:15 For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.


1Pe 2:21 For even hereunto were ye called: because Christ also suffered for us, leaving us an example, that ye should follow his steps:
1Pe 2:22 Who did no sin, neither was guile found in his mouth:
1Pe 2:23 Who, when he was reviled, reviled not again; when he suffered, he threatened not; but committed himself to him that judgeth righteously:

Hello again,
I believe Jesus had a fallen nature but that does not mean he was a sinner. why do I say that? He was born of the seed of David according to the flesh. Therefore he had the same nature as David.
After deceiving our first parents, Satan's claim the world as his own because he had brought humanity under his power and claimed that none could escape his grasp.
The Seed of the woman, the Son of God, bound Jesus' human nature to His divine nature in a marriage where the two became one and he was kept from falling. 2 Peter 1:4
In so doing God demonstrated that Satan's claim was false.
"Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy," Jude 24
If God can make this promise, don't you suppose He is willing to keep it.
"Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed [Seed of the woman] remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God." 1 John 3:9
Blind people by nature will trip over things and fall, but does that mean that falling is a requirement? Is it possible to avoid falling?
If they have someone with them constantly, one who is able to keep them from falling, then they are not a faller. They are without fall.
So also was Jesus.

1 John 5:11 "And this the record that God has given us eternal life and this life is in His Son." If we who are human can have the Son living in us, providing us with His eternal life, and able to keep us from falling. Is it reasonable then for us to believe that Jesus could have the Son living in him and keep him from falling?
The One who loves us has made made a way to redeem us. It is by us accepting and submitting to His Son who is incarnate in our humanity.

 

[Randy]

Tks for sharing your thoughts- Here is the Puritan board where " Fool for Christ" gives same understanding as EJ's Revelation and that amazing post just shared and others that have done research on it.

Around 7 years ago I'm sure I posted this on some Christian Forum. I'd have to find my old name..
Even Googling back then I only found 1 actual study and 1 Revelation.

It's ok if one does not agree but Now just sharing info for those who want to look further into it.

.............

https://search.app?link=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.puritanboard.com%2Fthreads%2Fwhat-is-the-significant-difference-between-the-nt-translation-holy-ghost-vs-holy-spirit.93141%2F&utm_campaign=aga&utm_source=agsadl2%2Csh%2Fx%2Fgs%2Fm2%2F4

"As far as the issue with the Holy Ghost translation, our Lord did say, "I will not leave you comfortless, I will come unto you." (Jn 14:18) What do we call a man who dies and comes back to life as a spirit? A ghost. But the spirit of Jesus Christ is a Holy Ghost, not a meddling ghost, always. The Spirit of life in Christ (Rom 8:2) is the Holy Ghost. When we come to Christ in faith, the Godhead takes up abode within us, by His spirit, and we become a holy temple of the Spirit of Christ. This does not deny the Trinity doctrine, it confirms it."

By Fool for Christ

I believe enough resources, scriptures, studies have been presented to at least open the mind to seeing that the KJV and other older versions use Holyghost for Particular reason and there is a difference in the terms.

As a limited example, my Grand daughter says PA instead of PAPA for a reason.
One refers to her Father most days, and the other refers to her Father on the Day He gets paid..lol

While I am not a king James only Reader, In my opinion it has shown differences and has made me rethink certain Ideals. One of my Favorites is in Galatians: either 2:16, or 3:16

"The faith of Jesus" instead of "faith in Jesus",
This Translation also may open eyes for those who seek truth and understanding.

interpretation really can change with a translation of a particulatmr verse. So I pray that God shines more light in cases like these. May the Lord have a blessing to those who seek a better understanding of His word. Amen!

Happy Thanksgiving Everyone

You didn't address anything just continue to state the same message. The Spirit Jesus sent, HE received from the Father. The Spirit of the living God is in me in Jesus's name. As is written of those in the faith your body is the temple of the Holy Spirit.

 

[leroy]

Your points here are:
Adam is not God because He was called a son of God.

Let's say that the demoniac's name, in Luke 8 , was Fred. When the demon spoke through him, did Jesus relpy to Fred? No, he spoke to Legion because he possesed Fred. After the demons were gone he could speak to Fred. In the same way Father could speak to Jesus as His Son because the two were one. Jesus identity was now the Son of God by the result of the Son incarnate. To grow up to the fullness of the stature of the Son of God would be impossible unless He lived within us...All of us. To be the Son does not make us something, we must decrease that He may increase it requires us to be nothing so that He can be all and in all.

Did Paul say Christ was in Jesus?
Or do we hear
That Jesus is the Christ?
When I hear the terms " The Christ" I think of the one who is to come, or the messiah.
Therefore Jesus is the Christ- the annoited one.

So I agree that Jesus is the word made flesh and hence human. But here I see Him as the Christ. The one that "Moses wrote" about.

You seem to be a scholarly man so I suspect that you know this. Christ is Greek and Messiah is Aramaic, but the meaning is identical . One who is anointed. Saul was anointed, David was anointed, Aaron was anointed king Cyrus a pagan was anointed. They were set apart to accomplish the will of God. I have used it in my postings so as to differentiate between Mary's son and the Son of God.
Jesus cannot live in us but the Son who is a spirit can. The Son can live in you and also in Mary's son as well.
Why do I make a distinction between the Son and Mary's son? Because it occurred to me that it ia the Son in us that qualifies us for eternity. The Father promised us His Son for redemption. John declares that eternal life is in the Son. Every one of the redeemed must have the Son. Jesus was an example of what it is to be redeemed. He laid down his life so that God could live out His life in him. The nature of Adam was destined to die for it was fallen and could not be fixed. So the cross shows us that the Son who had laid down His life to come into us, helped Jesus to give up his life, and the cross is a very serious demonstration of how real the death of the old man must be, and we should do the same. When Adam's life is gone we only have God's life. When God looks into the eyes of the redeemed He will see His Son for that is where He will live forever. A sacrifice so far beyond what I ever had considered before.

k

k

When you divide the son from the physical body of Jesus it gets confusing.

I know it is. I believe it is because of Catholicism making every prominent person a saint or a pathway to God. Go through Mary to get to Jesus to get to God. He has been made an Icon, way up there far away. No, He is within you and will accomplish in you a life of continual obedience. He will keep you from Falling and present you faultless. He will bring you to the place where you are the fullness of His very stature as the Son of God. Christ in you the hope of glory. The reformation is not over, more light was to come. The Son in you makes it all clear. it is not a son in you but the Son in you. The same Son who was in Jesus. God does not get turned into flesh He inhabits it.
Jesus was just like you or I. He was sentient with a personality. He had feelings about life he has desires, but he put it all on the cross daily.

For scripture says the word was made flesh and dwelt among us

It is called the incarnation, God in human flesh. When a man is so possessed that we might call him the devil incarnate. That does not make him the devil.

You mentioned the above to prove?



All I would interpret here is- that one is born of the Spirit, seeing that God is Spirit.

Yes we were all born of the flesh but if we accept Father's declaration that we have been crucified and are dead and our life is hidden with the Son in the bosom of the Father we have been born of His spirit. That is what is meant by being born again. We were born again out of the tomb with Jesus. Adam's human nature died on the cross and was buried in that tomb never to see the light of day again.
Romans 6:6 declares that our fallen nature was destroyed. If we believe what God believes it will be made manifest. He has made it so simple and easy. however, most are unwilling to accept that death. We have things we want to do. Not thy will be done but MY will. Such a sad testimony.

14 Now the Word became flesh and took up residence among us. We saw his glory – the glory of the one and only, full of grace and truth, who came from the Father. 15 John testified about him and shouted out, “This one was the one about whom I said, ‘He who comes after me is greater than I am, because he existed before me.’” 16For we have all received from his fullness one gracious gift after aanother.17 
For the law was given through Moses, but grace and truth came about through Jesus Christ. 18 No one has ever seen God. The only one, himself God, who is in closest fellowship with the Father, has made God known.


I don't think Adam had Eternal life yet, because it never says He ate off the tree of life.

You are correct. Only God has immortality 1 Timothy 6

Yes but the Spirit is not quickened together with Christ, regenerated until one comes to believe who Jesus is.

It has to be more than believing who Jesus because the devils believe. We must believe that we are dear and He is living within keeping us from falling.

I'm not agreeing here. Because scripture says Jesus was always obedient to His father and because of that His father never left Him alone.

Not sure what you are referring to here. But yes the Father was there even when He was on the cross in His darkest hour. Perhaps this is it... As the souls life and advocate He could feel the souls separation just as Jesus felt it. Yet Father is always there.

If you didn't seperate Jesus then you might be ok

This is a misunderstanding the two were one just as you and the Son are one. Taking a human with a fallen nature and keeping him from falling and presenting him faultless should strengthen our faith to believe that He can do that for us too. This is what gives us hope.

Scrips say:
For all who are led by the Spirit of God are the sons of God.

anyone confesses that Jesus is the Son of God, God resides in him and he in God.
And because you are sons, God sent the Spirit of his Son into our hearts, who calls “Abba! Father!”Galatians

You use a lot of scripture- however I just can't see it that Jesus is divided...He obeyed the Father through His own Spirit. I read John but not sure what you wanted me to see

Was the human born of Mary present at creation?

Jesus is the Christ, son of the Living God according to Peter's own testamony.

Christ the Annoited one who would come into the world and came



If you read John as you told Me: Eternal life is that they may know you the only true God and Jesus Christ whom He has sent.

And by being perfected in this way, he became the source of eternal salvation to all who obey him,

yes yes that is it. By perfecting Jesus who was of the seed of David, we see the way to life. We need not be deceived and follow all kinds of ways to be saved. Adam could only pass on to us what he had...Death. The last Adam passes on to us a life of continual obedience. He also gives us a total submissiveness of death to every inherited traits of evil, that is to say he never gave them expression and completed that death on Calvary. Finally being resurrected by the Life of the Son Himself. This is our new birth. For a divine person to do this the devil would only say, " So what. can Corinth77777 do that?" But now God can point to Mary's son and say, " You don't own my children." But For the divine Son divested of all power living within the limitations of a descendent of Adam, Abraham and David as he carried all the hereditary baggage handed down from them, and by depending on a power outside of himself but only by the Father alone, he showed that the devil had lost the war.

Scripture are true but Just cant see why you have the need to seperate Jesus physically from being His son....

Jesus always referred to the Father Speaking through Him. And scriptures show it is the Father who had to be obeyed. The Faith of Jesus Christ is that God is in control!

Also God gave Is only begotton son..

 

[leroy]

Please study this as hopefully it will open your eyes to what the Trinity and Deity of Christ is.

1. God is Spirit, John 4:24, not flesh and blood and in the OT either spoke directly to the prophets or by angels and also various objects like a burning bush or an ass for example. Between the OT and NT God was silent towards Israel as when they returned to Israel from the Babylonian captivity they came back as merchants and not shepherds as they were disobedient to God going after other gods, Book of Malachi.

2. Jesus being the very Spirit of God before the foundation of the world as He and the Father are one was prophesied by the Prophets in the OT and spoken of by John the Baptist in the NT as John being the forerunner of Christ calling all to repent. As foretold Christ did come as the word of God made flesh (skin, bone, blood) to be that light that shines in darkness. He came as redeemer Savior through Gods grace as Christ is our faith that all can repent of their sins and have eternal life with the Father to all who will believe in Him as Lord and Savior. John 1:1-4; 1 Peter 1:13-21h the

Even though scripture said you shall call his name Immanuel she called him Yeshuah (Joshauh) the Greek is Iesous and a few hundred years back someone changed the 'I' to a 'J'and dropped the 'o'. So to eliminate some confusion I will suggest was the person who came from Mary's uterus present at creation? the one of who it is said he was of the seed of Abraham and David. Was the Son of the seed of David? No, He has always been. this human was a descendent of humans. Yes the Son of God was manifest in him.

3. After the sacrifice of Christ God raised Him from the grave and as He had to ascend back up to heaven the promise was that He would never leave us or forsake us as when He ascended He sent down the Holy Spirit (Spirit of God) to indwell all who will believe in Christ and His finished works on the cross. In the OT Gods Spirit fell on them for a time and purpose under heaven. Now we are indwelled with that power and authority through Gods grace that the Holy Spirit now works in us and through us teaching all things God wants us to learn. All three are Spiritual and Spiritual awaking's in us to know the will of God and walk in His statures. John 16:7-15

I keep coming back this: The gift of John 3:16 is the Son. 1 John 5:11 ,12 God gave us eternal life and this life is in His Son. He that has the Son has life.... Jesus has the Son but he is physically in heaven. The Son is spirit and He is in YOU.

Ephesians 4: 5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism, 6 One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.

Absolutly, in us all. Jesus will not fit in any of us, but the Son does.

1 John 5:6 This is he that came by water and blood, even Jesus Christ; not by water only, but by water and blood. And it is the Spirit that beareth witness, because the Spirit is truth. 7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word (Jesus), and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one. 8 And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one.

My view may be wrong but since the Son gave all His prerogatives as God and had no power or knowledge no wisdom. All He had was the ability to hear and obey the Father in Love. the Holy Spirit gave Him the power to follow His instructions.

God the Father, God the Son, God the Holy Spirit as all three coequal Gods Spirit.

Jesus being the right arm of God. Isaiah 53:1 Who hath believed our report? and to whom is the arm of the LORD revealed? 2 For he shall grow up before him as a tender plant, and as a root out of a dry ground: he hath no form nor comeliness; and when we shall see him, there is no beauty that we should desire him. 3 He is despised and rejected of men; a man of sorrows, and acquainted with grief: and we hid as it were our faces from him; he was despised, and we esteemed him not.

Jesus is the word of God. John 12:49 For I have not spoken of myself; but the Father which sent me, he gave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak. 50 And I know that his commandment is life everlasting: whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto me, so I speak.

Jesus is word, light and life that is God come in the flesh. John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 The same was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made. 4 In him was life; and the life was the light of men.

If Jesus was the light that lighteth every man that came into the world how did he do that since he was born some 4000 years after creation.

Gods Holy Spirit has come to indwell us and teach us. John 14: 26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

A few verses later says that the father and the Son will dwell in us too.

Scriptures that reference Jesus being referred to as God:
John 1:1-14; John 10:30; Romans 9:5; Colossians 2:9; Hebrews 1:8, 9; 1 John 5:7, 8, 20; 1 Corinthians 8:6; 2 Corinthians 3:17; 13:14; Isaiah 9:6; 44:6; Luke 1:35; Matthew 1:23; 28:19; John 14:16, 17; Genesis 1:1, 2 (cross reference John 1:1-14); 1 Corinthians 12:4-6; Ephesians 4:4-6; Colossians 1:15-17; John 14:9-11; Philippians 2:5-8; Rev 1:8

Revelation says he will be my son and I will be his God. These are all wonderful and I don't have a quick answer to every thing but knowing that Jesus was a descendent of Adam gives me hope that if God can do what He did in Jesus He can do it in me. If a man who is responsive to the voice within and comes and finds me and leads me out of life threatening danger to a place of safety he is a savior. He may not be God but God dwelling in him saved me.

Scriptures that refer the Holy Spirit as being God:
Psalms 139:7, 8; John 14:17; 16:13; Isaiah 40:13; 1 Corinthians 2:10, 11; Zechariah 4:6; Luke 1:35; Ephesians 4:4-6; Romans 5:5; 1 Corinthians 6:19; Ephesians 1:13; 1 Thessalonians 1:5; Titus 3:5; 2 Peter 1:21; Jude 1:20

 

[Corinth77777]

You didn't address anything just continue to state the same message. The Spirit Jesus sent, HE received from the Father. The Spirit of the living God is in me in Jesus's name. As is written of those in the faith your body is the temple of the Holy Spirit.

I did not need to, what I shared had enough arguments, studies, and views that anyone with an open mind could look into.

 

[for_his_glory]

Hello again,
I believe Jesus had a fallen nature but that does not mean he was a sinner. why do I say that? He was born of the seed of David according to the flesh. Therefore he had the same nature as David.
After deceiving our first parents, Satan's claim the world as his own because he had brought humanity under his power and claimed that none could escape his grasp.
The Seed of the woman, the Son of God, bound Jesus' human nature to His divine nature in a marriage where the two became one and he was kept from falling. 2 Peter 1:4
In so doing God demonstrated that Satan's claim was false.
"Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy," Jude 24
If God can make this promise, don't you suppose He is willing to keep it.
"Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed [Seed of the woman] remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God." 1 John 3:9
Blind people by nature will trip over things and fall, but does that mean that falling is a requirement? Is it possible to avoid falling?
If they have someone with them constantly, one who is able to keep them from falling, then they are not a faller. They are without fall.
So also was Jesus.

1 John 5:11 "And this the record that God has given us eternal life and this life is in His Son." If we who are human can have the Son living in us, providing us with His eternal life, and able to keep us from falling. Is it reasonable then for us to believe that Jesus could have the Son living in him and keep him from falling?
The One who loves us has made made a way to redeem us. It is by us accepting and submitting to His Son who is incarnate in our humanity.

You have to remember that Jesus was fully God and fully man while here on earth. Jesus was not born of God nor was He created as He has always been, even before the foundation of the world. In Deity there is no way that Jesus could have ever sinned as He and God were one. You really need to study the Trinity. The scriptures you give are about sinners that need to repent of their sin and become Spiritually born again from above, John 3:5-7.

 

[for_his_glory]

Absolutly, in us all. Jesus will not fit in any of us, but the Son does.

Once again, the Son of God and Jesus are the same. Jesus has always been even before the foundation of the world as being the second person of the Trinity. Until you study the Trinity I have nothing more to give you then what I have already given with many scriptures.

 

[Corinth77777]

Let's say that the demoniac's name, in Luke 8 , was Fred.

Hi,
But here is the issue Fred is not said to be the word that was God in the beginning that became flesh.

When the demon spoke through him, did Jesus relpy to Fred? No, he spoke to Legion because

To grow up to the fullness of the stature of the Son of God would be impossible unless He lived within us

Well He gave His Spirit when man believed
that's why it's possible.

...All of us. To be the Son does not make us something, we must decrease that He may increase it requires us to be nothing so that He can be all and in all.


You seem to be a scholarly man

lol I'm not

so I suspect that you know this. Christ is Greek a

True But Jesus who was annoited was already The son of the living God. He came from above.
Peter answered: you are the Christ the son of the Living God. Peter was talking to Jesus, He did not seperate His body from the Spirit of Christ, the annoited one. B4 something is declared on earth its already happened in Heaven. His kingdom come, His will be done on earth as it is in heaven

postings so as to differentiate between Mary's son and the Son of God.

hard to phantom they are any different

Jesus cannot live in us but the Son who is a spirit can.

Jesus can live in us in another form...I believe as the living word we hear, eat receive, and obey.
It's after He resurrection does He or His Father send the Holyghost, which I believe is the power of the resurrected body of Christ.

As I am answering I'll try some things *on*

Yes, we are to grow up to the full measure of Christ. And that sounds like purpose that will allow us to work the works of the Kingdom.

grow up to the full measre of your annoiting/ the power within by submitting ourselves daily to the will of the father. The conquering power of Christ is the Holyghost..

The Son can live in you and also in Mary's son as well.
Why do I make a distinction between the Son and Mary's son? Because it occurred to me that it ia the Son in us that qualifies us for eternity.

Yes/no not until you have first heard the Gospel. Sense the Gospel is the power of God unto Salvation for everyone that believes.

Let's not forget that it is God who draws man...lets substitute God For Spirit
 

The good news of Jesus the Messiah

( When I say yes, Im speaking as both Christ/son and His body are one)

The Father promised us His Son for redemption. John declares that eternal life is in the Son.

The Father is in the Son

Every one of the redeemed must have the Son.

There is no way to the Father but through the son, Jesus..

The way I see it is Jesus is the Bridge because He is both God And Man...

John 3:13

except the one who came from heaven—the Son of Man. 14 Just as Moses lifted up the snake in the wilderness, so the Son of Man must be lifted up, 15 that everyone who believes may have eternal life in him.”

Jesus was an example of what it is to be redeemed. He laid down his life so that God could live out His life in him.

 yes

The nature of Adam was destined to die for it was fallen and could not be fixed. So the cross shows us that the Son who had laid down His life to come into us,

helped Jesus to give up his life, and the cross is a very serious demonstration of how real the death of the old man must be, and we should do the same

WHAT HELPED JESUS WAS He was strengthen by His Father through prayer, fasting, and obedience

. When Adam's life is gone we only have God's life. When God looks into the eyes of the redeemed He will

JESUS IS NOT adam..Adam could not bring Life because He was not God's only begotton son.

see His Son for that is where He will live forever. A sacrifice so far beyond what I ever had considered before.

How about Jesus paid the penalty for sin

I know it is. I believe it is because of Catholicism

I believe its because you shouldn't

making every prominent person a saint or a pathway to God. Go through Mary to get to Jesus to get to God. He has been made an Icon, way up there far away. No, He is within you and will accomplish in you a life of continual obedience. He will keep you from Falling and present you faultless. He will bring you to the place where you are the fullness of His very stature as the Son of God. Christ in you the hope of glory. The reformation is not over, more light was to come. The Son in you makes it all clear. it is not a son in you but the Son in you. The same Son who was in Jesus. God does not get turned into flesh He inhabits it.
Jesus was just like you or I. He was sentient with a personality. He had feelings about life he has desires, but he put it all on the cross daily.

That is your opinion- scripture says the word was made flesh,

It is called the incarnation, God in human flesh. When a man is so possessed that we might call him the devil incarnate. That does not make him the devil.

Yes we were all born of the flesh but if we accept Father's declaration that we have been crucified and are dead and our life is hidden with the Son in the bosom of the Father we have been born of His spirit.

The father testimony is this is my son in whom I am well pleased.

That is what is meant by being born again. We were born again out of the tomb with Jesus. Adam's human nature died on the cross and was buried in that tomb never to see the light of day again.

K

Romans 6:6 declares that our fallen nature was destroyed. If we believe what God believes it will be made manifest.

He has made it so simple and easy. however, most are unwilling to accept that death. We have things we want to do. Not thy will be done but MY will. Such a sad testimony.

True

You are correct. Only God has immortality 1 Timothy 6

It has to be more than believing who Jesus because the devils believe.

It is believing with intent to follow

We must believe that we are dear and He is living within keeping us from falling.

Not sure what you are referring to here. But yes the Father was there even when He was on the cross in His darkest hour. Perhaps this is it... As the souls life and advocate He could feel the souls separation just as Jesus felt it. Yet Father is always there.

This is a misunderstanding the two were one just as you and the Son are one.

YOU CANT DIVIDE Jesus from who He is.
One thing He said after His resurrection was: restore to me the Glory whilie I was yet with you..dont quote me off my head

Taking a human with a fallen nature and keeping him from falling and presenting him faultless should strengthen our faith to believe that He can do that for us too. This is what gives us hope.

 True

Was the human born of Mary present at creation?

The Word was with God

yes yes that is it. By perfecting Jesus who was of the seed of David, we see the way to life. We need not be deceived and follow all kinds of ways to be saved. Adam could only pass on to us what he had...Death. The last Adam passes on to us a life of continual obedience. He also gives us a total submissiveness of death to every inherited traits of evil, that is to say he never gave them expression and completed that death on Calvary.

Agree

Finally being resurrected by the Life of the Son Himself.

Death cant hold life..that's for sure and its the victory we have in submitting ourselves to God by the faithfulness of the son.

For the will of the Father is everyone that looks to the son and believes will have life and be raised on the last Day.

Recall Moses lifting up the snake and those who looked at it stoppped perishing?

It was God He was obeying

This is our new birth.

Being quickened together with Christ
It's believing who Jesus is. I believe you looking to Him for life.

Ephesians 1:13

In him, when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and in him, when you also believed, you were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit.

For a divine person to do this the devil would only say, "

And he that sent me is with me: the Father hath not left me alone; for I do always those things that please him. John 8:29

 

[Corinth77777]

You have to remember that Jesus was fully God and fully man while here on earth. Jesus was not born of God nor was He created as He has always been, even before the foundation of the world. In Deity there is no way that Jesus could have ever sinned as He and God were one. You really need to study the Trinity. The scriptures you give are about sinners that need to repent of their sin and become Spiritually born again from above, John 3:5-7.

Now I do believe He has the ability to sin, but because of His nature, heart He had no reason to.

 

[for_his_glory]

Now I do believe He has the ability to sin, but because of His nature, heart He had no reason to.

Does God have the ability to Sin? No, as God and His Son Christ Jesus as Jesus being the second person of the Godhead can not sin, nor has there ever been sin found in Him.

 

[Corinth77777]

Does God have the ability to Sin? No, as God and His Son Christ Jesus as Jesus being the second person of the Godhead can not sin, nor has there ever been sin found in Him.

Then Jesus did not need to be tempted

 

[for_his_glory]

Then Jesus did not need to be tempted

You just don't get it. Jesus coming in the form of man had to relate to humanity as He was baptized by John and empowered by God's Spirit for the works He had to do for the saving grace of God through Him, Ephesians 2:8-10. He was tempted like all of us, but could not fall to Satan's temptation as He is fully God and fully man while here on earth.

 

[Corinth77777]

You just don't get it.

Right! Because I get this :

"Jesus Christ, though capable of sinning in his human nature, possessed a divine nature that made such a thing unquestionable. Not because he could not sin, but because he would not sin."

Was Christ Capable of Sin?

Tonight’s question for the Question Box is, “Was Christ capable of sinning?” The issue is this – if Christ was not able to sin then he was not really human as we are. In this case, Jesus does not really know what it is to be in our situation, and his perfect obedience before the Father was not a...

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Jesus coming in the form of man had to relate to humanity as He was baptized by John and empowered by God's Spirit for the works He had to do for the saving grace of God through Him, Ephesians 2:8-10. He was tempted like all of us, but could not fall to Satan's temptation as He is fully God and fully man while here on earth.

Can God Create a Morally Perfect Creature? (Part Two) | Free Thinking Ministries

Got a question for you guys after reading a recent article from Tim Stratton. It’s titled Can God Create a Morally Perfect Creature. Here goes… If God is free in the libertarian sense…

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This is wonderfully written as well

 

[leroy]

You have to remember that Jesus was fully God and fully man while here on earth. Jesus was not born of God nor was He created as He has always been, even before the foundation of the world. In Deity there is no way that Jesus could have ever sinned as He and God were one. You really need to study the Trinity. The scriptures you give are about sinners that need to repent of their sin and become Spiritually born again from above, John 3:5-7.

I expect that you may be tempted to only skim throu this long post but I promise, there are some sweet things here.
Fully God and fully man, I agree. That is what I have been saying. There is an eternally 'fully divine' God, who expressed His Son in and through a 'fully mortal human' man. God cannot die or be killed but Jesus a mortal man who was killed on the cross.
So where was the Son during this time?
There were times when He spoke of death as a sleep, and if one believes in Christ he can never die. Why? Because he has the eternal life of the Son in him. The Son waits in submissive quiet until a soul is called forth in his resurrection. It is the Life of the Son within the soul that brings the redeemed soul forth in resurrection power. For the two are one.
Once Jesus' mortal life, which came from Adam was destroyed, he was resurrected with immortality, or the everlasting life of the Son which was in Him. The beauty of this truth is that Adam's nature is what the devil could possibly gain a foot hold on by temptation, was no longer there. It was destroyed. (Rom. 6:6). Therefore sin and the devil were conquered and there was no way for Satan to even try to tempt him. That is what we are given in the born again resurrection life. 1 John 3:9. It is ours if we believe it. If we believe we will fall then according as our faith that is what we will have.
Yes the Son who is spirit, has always been but the "fully human" had only begun 2000 years ago. The Son cannot sin or disobey the Father, that would be impossible. But Jesus with Adam's nature could sin. He could have failed. Satan knew the Son was beyond his reach and if it was only God with a human coat on what purpose would there be in trying to do so. But since Satan knew Jesus had that could have that weakness, he was fair game. It was because he kept his soul fixed on Father and His word that he overcame.

An object lesson might help. I believe that the marriage union and procreation are the premier symbols of the plan of redemption.
The procreative aspect: Scripture says that two become one when they join together in that intimate act. However, I have come to see that there is a greater reality to this symbology, as it shows us God at work in the soul to save us.
The husband provides a seed that is fully daddy. The wife supplies a seed that is fully mommy. When the two unite they are no longer fully daddy and fully mommy, they are daddy and mommy combined. There is a blending of genetic information from both and a new creature is born. The two have actually become one in that child. Some parts of each seed are used and other parts are recessive or what they call junk DNA which is dormant or not used at all.
We as the bride are fully human, The Son or Seed of the woman is fully divine or fully God. When we see our emptiness and need of the life of God. Our heavenly Husband brings about a very intimate epiphany or a spiritual consummative act where our humanity becomes impregnated with divine power and the Seed within us springs our humanity into new life. A new creature is born. Not fully God and fully man. No, it is humanity and divinity combined in that one new creature. This I have come to see how we are actually saved. "...Christ who is our life.." "..this Life is in His Son, he who Has the Son has Life."
It the abortion argument the big question is, When does life begin? The correct answer is at conception.
This is how the Son who is fully God partakes in our humanity and our humanity puts on Christ. The believer become a partaker of the divine nature. A new creature.
Why is this not understood in the case of Mary's Son? He had a fully human nature, and his human personhood, with a mind like any of us who had its genetic roots in David, Abraham and by necessity Adam. He could be killed and he could be tempted to sin. It was in his nature. He was kept from from falling as promised to us all in Jude 24.

 

[Corinth77777]

I expect that you may be tempted to only skim throu this long post but I promise, there are some sweet things here.
Fully God and fully man, I agree. That is what I have been saying. There is an eternally 'fully divine' God, who expressed His Son in and through a 'fully mortal human' man. God cannot die or be killed but Jesus a mortal man who was killed on the cross.
So where was the Son during this time?
There were times when He spoke of death as a sleep, and if one believes in Christ he can never die. Why? Because he has the eternal life of the Son in him. The Son waits in submissive quiet until a soul is called forth in his resurrection. It is the Life of the Son within the soul that brings the redeemed soul forth in resurrection power. For the two are one.
Once Jesus' mortal life, which came from Adam was destroyed, he was resurrected with immortality, or the everlasting life of the Son which was in Him. The beauty of this truth is that Adam's nature is what the devil could possibly gain a foot hold on by temptation, was no longer there. It was destroyed. (Rom. 6:6). Therefore sin and the devil were conquered and there was no way for Satan to even try to tempt him. That is what we are given in the born again resurrection life. 1 John 3:9. It is ours if we believe it. If we believe we will fall then according as our faith that is what we will have.
Yes the Son who is spirit, has always been but the "fully human" had only begun 2000 years ago. The Son cannot sin or disobey the Father, that would be impossible. But Jesus with Adam's nature could sin. He could have failed. Satan knew the Son was beyond his reach and if it was only God with a human coat on what purpose would there be in trying to do so. But since Satan knew Jesus had that could have that weakness, he was fair game. It was because he kept his soul fixed on Father and His word that he overcame.

An object lesson might help. I believe that the marriage union and procreation are the premier symbols of the plan of redemption.
The procreative aspect: Scripture says that two become one when they join together in that intimate act. However, I have come to see that there is a greater reality to this symbology, as it shows us God at work in the soul to save us.
The husband provides a seed that is fully daddy. The wife supplies a seed that is fully mommy. When the two unite they are no longer fully daddy and fully mommy, they are daddy and mommy combined. There is a blending of genetic information from both and a new creature is born. The two have actually become one in that child. Some parts of each seed are used and other parts are recessive or what they call junk DNA which is dormant or not used at all.
We as the bride are fully human, The Son or Seed of the woman is fully divine or fully God. When we see our emptiness and need of the life of God. Our heavenly Husband brings about a very intimate epiphany or a spiritual consummative act where our humanity becomes impregnated with divine power and the Seed within us springs our humanity into new life. A new creature is born. Not fully God and fully man. No, it is humanity and divinity combined in that one new creature. This I have come to see how we are actually saved. "...Christ who is our life.." "..this Life is in His Son, he who Has the Son has Life."
It the abortion argument the big question is, When does life begin? The correct answer is at conception.
This is how the Son who is fully God partakes in our humanity and our humanity puts on Christ. The believer become a partaker of the divine nature. A new creature.
Why is this not understood in the case of Mary's Son? He had a fully human nature, and his human personhood, with a mind like any of us who had its genetic roots in David, Abraham and by necessity Adam. He could be killed and he could be tempted to sin. It was in his nature. He was kept from from falling as promised to us all in Jude 24.

So let's try to get this down.

You believe:

Do you believe the physical body of Christ is
God and Human- As the physical Body did not have a Human father, but a Human mother.

Now lets bring Adam into play sense Adam father was not Human ? But Adam Himself was Human. HE CAME FROM THE EARTH AND WAS MADE FROM THE EARTH

Adam is the First Adam who had a spirit of His own. Adam needed to obey God the Father...DID HE NOT?

THE Father seems to be His word

SO It seems to me Jesus the word made Flesh had to obey the Father God. This gets a bit complicated sense I don't really understand the soul from Spirit etc.

The first Adam is not the only begotton son
So your thoughts lead to- Adam could have been the only begotton son?

Which then no sin in the world

So God instead makes Jesus in the likeness of Adam. And Jesus obeys His Father . And He does.... I don't see a "son", I see Jesus as Adam created with a spirit/heart.

Jesus obeys God, because it is Jesus that is the only begotton son. Does the Father call Adam His only begotton?

My thoughts:
God blew the breath into Adam, while Jesus is the breath of God in the Flesh.

Lamentations 4:20​

​

Niv​

​

​

20 The Lord’s anointed, our very life breath,
was caught in their traps.
We thought that under his shadow
we would live among the nations

By this same notion I can see our king Jesus is the breath of life.

King James Version​

​

​

45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.
46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.
47 The first man is of the earth, earthy; the second man is the Lord from heaven.

Corinthians

 

[for_his_glory]

I expect that you may be tempted to only skim throu this long post but I promise, there are some sweet things here.
Fully God and fully man, I agree. That is what I have been saying. There is an eternally 'fully divine' God, who expressed His Son in and through a 'fully mortal human' man. God cannot die or be killed but Jesus a mortal man who was killed on the cross.
So where was the Son during this time?
There were times when He spoke of death as a sleep, and if one believes in Christ he can never die. Why? Because he has the eternal life of the Son in him. The Son waits in submissive quiet until a soul is called forth in his resurrection. It is the Life of the Son within the soul that brings the redeemed soul forth in resurrection power. For the two are one.
Once Jesus' mortal life, which came from Adam was destroyed, he was resurrected with immortality, or the everlasting life of the Son which was in Him. The beauty of this truth is that Adam's nature is what the devil could possibly gain a foot hold on by temptation, was no longer there. It was destroyed. (Rom. 6:6). Therefore sin and the devil were conquered and there was no way for Satan to even try to tempt him. That is what we are given in the born again resurrection life. 1 John 3:9. It is ours if we believe it. If we believe we will fall then according as our faith that is what we will have.
Yes the Son who is spirit, has always been but the "fully human" had only begun 2000 years ago. The Son cannot sin or disobey the Father, that would be impossible. But Jesus with Adam's nature could sin. He could have failed. Satan knew the Son was beyond his reach and if it was only God with a human coat on what purpose would there be in trying to do so. But since Satan knew Jesus had that could have that weakness, he was fair game. It was because he kept his soul fixed on Father and His word that he overcame.

An object lesson might help. I believe that the marriage union and procreation are the premier symbols of the plan of redemption.
The procreative aspect: Scripture says that two become one when they join together in that intimate act. However, I have come to see that there is a greater reality to this symbology, as it shows us God at work in the soul to save us.
The husband provides a seed that is fully daddy. The wife supplies a seed that is fully mommy. When the two unite they are no longer fully daddy and fully mommy, they are daddy and mommy combined. There is a blending of genetic information from both and a new creature is born. The two have actually become one in that child. Some parts of each seed are used and other parts are recessive or what they call junk DNA which is dormant or not used at all.
We as the bride are fully human, The Son or Seed of the woman is fully divine or fully God. When we see our emptiness and need of the life of God. Our heavenly Husband brings about a very intimate epiphany or a spiritual consummative act where our humanity becomes impregnated with divine power and the Seed within us springs our humanity into new life. A new creature is born. Not fully God and fully man. No, it is humanity and divinity combined in that one new creature. This I have come to see how we are actually saved. "...Christ who is our life.." "..this Life is in His Son, he who Has the Son has Life."
It the abortion argument the big question is, When does life begin? The correct answer is at conception.
This is how the Son who is fully God partakes in our humanity and our humanity puts on Christ. The believer become a partaker of the divine nature. A new creature.
Why is this not understood in the case of Mary's Son? He had a fully human nature, and his human personhood, with a mind like any of us who had its genetic roots in David, Abraham and by necessity Adam. He could be killed and he could be tempted to sin. It was in his nature. He was kept from from falling as promised to us all in Jude 24.

For the last time, Jesus and the Son of God are the same as being the second person of the Trinity. It's apparent you know nothing about the Trinity, even though it has been shown to you, but you ignore those scriptures. So with that I bid you a good day and moving on. You have a good day.

 

[leroy]

Do you believe the physical body of Christ is
God and Human- As the physical Body did not have a Human father, but a Human mother.

The same Son (not a different one) lives in you and me, is that true?
We are the physical body of Christ, of His flesh and bones and He is the Spirit is that true?
When humanity and divinity are combined into one new creature, is that God and human? I'm sure you know the texts I have in mind.
If the Son is willing and doing in any human body and the human is in total submission as Mary's son was, is this incarnation, God in human flesh?
Did the virgin birth make his humanity different from Mary's or David's humanity?
I would like you to understand that I'm in no way trying to lessen or diminish the work of God for us through His Son. He was given to all of us.
Jesus spoke in parables to ferret out those who will not believe. I believe that the life, death and resurrection of Jesus is a living parable. When the Father reveals to us individually we will be drawn into the mystery of Godliness. Matt. 16:17
Those who will bring discredit to the plans and work of God are kept in the dark on these matters on purpose, yet is their own fault.

Now lets bring Adam into play sense Adam father was not Human ? But Adam Himself was Human. HE CAME FROM THE EARTH AND WAS MADE FROM THE EARTH

Adam is the First Adam who had a spirit of His own. Adam needed to obey God the Father...DID HE NOT?

yes

THE Father seems to be His word

??? Are you saying that the Word is (the Son) and is God? If so, Yes

SO It seems to me Jesus the word made Flesh had to obey the Father God. This gets a bit complicated sense I don't really understand the soul from Spirit etc.

When God formed man, there was a lifeless body laying there. Then God breathed life into him and he became a living 'soul' or a living being. So it seems that if I were to define 'soul' It would be the same as 'being'
I suppose it is confusing because I believe that the Son was given to our first parents and every child of theirs, including you and me.
I believe that the Word or Son made flesh is God in human flesh, even our flesh.
We are unable to obey continually but the Son brings that gift into us so that we can have a life of continual obedience.
In us He is God willing and doing. yet He incorporates our will or consent.and He provides the ability to obey.

The first Adam is not the only begotton son
So your thoughts lead to- Adam could have been the only begotton son?

Sorry if I left that impression. The bible says he was the son of God.
Psalm 2:7 "...thou art my son this day I have begotton thee.
Paul says that was a prophecy which was fulfilled at the resurrection. Acts 13:30-33
This also refers to us all as we are born again from the dead.
He was the first begotten from the dead Rev. 1:5
"...to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren." Rom. 8:9
"...God sent his only begotten Son into the world, that we might live through him." 1john 4:9
Every redeemed being is begotten of God, Jesus was the first human to be begotten from the dead. You cannot kill God. The Son was called forth from the tomb, Jesus was born again.
"That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world. John 1:9
Our first parents and everyone from that time until Jesus had to have these as well as we do. Therefore theSon had to have been given after the fall.

Which then no sin in the world

So God instead makes Jesus in the likeness of Adam. And Jesus obeys His Father . And He does.... I don't see a "son", I see Jesus as Adam created with a spirit/heart.

Not sure I understand this

Jesus obeys God, because it is Jesus that is the only begotton son. Does the Father call Adam His only begotton?

Jesus was begotten in a stable and begotten again out of the garden tomb. He was obedient because he was surrendered to the Father by the facility of the Son within, and empowered by the Holy Spirit. Obedience is accessible to all humans. Sin is not an option when God has made provision for victory and continual obedience.

My thoughts:
God blew the breath into Adam, while Jesus is the breath of God in the Flesh.

Jesus flesh is just as dependent on life from God as all of us.

Lamentations 4:20​

​

Niv​

​

​

20 The Lord’s anointed, our very life breath,
was caught in their traps.
We thought that under his shadow
we would live among the nations

By this same notion I can see our king Jesus is the breath of life.

King James Version​

​

​

45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.

Is it saying Jesus was made a quickening spirit "made" I may be misunderstanding the use of the word 'made' but the Son was not made or created. It seems that Jesus became the second Adam when his mission was complete. When he was begotten again (born again) from the tomb He was the progenitor of a new race. Begotten from the dead, the first begotten among many. the many are his children.
Rev. 21:6 "He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son."
As the second Adam we are his children. The Son within is so inseparably blended with the human form that he is our God our head our Father.
Isaiah 9:6 "For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.

46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.
47 The first man is of the earth, earthy; the second man is the Lord from heaven.

Corinthians

 

[leroy]

For the last time, Jesus and the Son of God are the same as being the second person of the Trinity. It's apparent you know nothing about the Trinity, even though it has been shown to you, but you ignore those scriptures. So with that I bid you a good day and moving on. You have a good day.

The words of your farewell reveal that you have not understood my thoughts but I do thank you for trying.

 

[Corinth77777]

The same Son (not a different one) lives in you and me, is that true?
We are the physical body of Christ, of His flesh and bones and He is the Spirit is that true?
When humanity and divinity are combined into one new creature, is that God and human? I'm sure you know the texts I have in mind.
If the Son is willing and doing in any human body and the human is in total submission as Mary's son was, is this incarnation, God in human flesh?
Did the virgin birth make his humanity different from Mary's or David's humanity?
I would like you to understand that I'm in no way trying to lessen or diminish the work of God for us through His Son. He was given to all of us.
Jesus spoke in parables to ferret out those who will not believe. I believe that the life, death and resurrection of Jesus is a living parable. When the Father reveals to us individually we will be drawn into the mystery of Godliness. Matt. 16:17
Those who will bring discredit to the plans and work of God are kept in the dark on these matters on purpose, yet is their own fault.

yes

??? Are you saying that the Word is (the Son) and is God? If so, Yes

When God formed man, there was a lifeless body laying there. Then God breathed life into him and he became a living 'soul' or a living being. So it seems that if I were to define 'soul' It would be the same as 'being'
I suppose it is confusing because I believe that the Son was given to our first parents and every child of theirs, including you and me.
I believe that the Word or Son made flesh is God in human flesh, even our flesh.
We are unable to obey continually but the Son brings that gift into us so that we can have a life of continual obedience.
In us He is God willing and doing. yet He incorporates our will or consent.and He provides the ability to obey.

Sorry if I left that impression. The bible says he was the son of God.
Psalm 2:7 "...thou art my son this day I have begotton thee.
Paul says that was a prophecy which was fulfilled at the resurrection. Acts 13:30-33
This also refers to us all as we are born again from the dead.
He was the first begotten from the dead Rev. 1:5
"...to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren." Rom. 8:9
"...God sent his only begotten Son into the world, that we might live through him." 1john 4:9
Every redeemed being is begotten of God, Jesus was the first human to be begotten from the dead. You cannot kill God. The Son was called forth from the tomb, Jesus was born again.
"That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world. John 1:9
Our first parents and everyone from that time until Jesus had to have these as well as we do. Therefore theSon had to have been given after the fall.

Not sure I understand this

Jesus was begotten in a stable and begotten again out of the garden tomb. He was obedient because he was surrendered to the Father by the facility of the Son within, and empowered by the Holy Spirit. Obedience is accessible to all humans. Sin is not an option when God has made provision for victory and continual obedience.

Jesus flesh is just as dependent on life from God as all of us.

Is it saying Jesus was made a quickening spirit "made" I may be misunderstanding the use of the word 'made' but the Son was not made or created. It seems that Jesus became the second Adam when his mission was complete. When he was begotten again (born again) from the tomb He was the progenitor of a new race. Begotten from the dead, the first begotten among many. the many are his children.
Rev. 21:6 "He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son."
As the second Adam we are his children. The Son within is so inseparably blended with the human form that he is our God our head our Father.
Isaiah 9:6 "For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.

46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.
47 The first man is of the earth, earthy; the second man is the Lord from heaven.

 

[Corinth77777]

The words of your farewell reveal that you have not understood my thoughts but I do thank you for trying.

Leyroy I am really going to be dwelving into
Your thought.

But I have a feeling it's going to take some time

Its not that I dont see what you are saying, you are maybe tring to explain the "how" But you will have to explain it by showing scripture references and not implications.

I will start over from the very beginning. And really listen. Why, because after reading another post of yours from another thread I like your calm spirit. Plus it may shed some light to a topic im looking into. I'm just a learner, and been called a thinker. Which the latter has it's bad aspects as well as its good, For without knowledge in other areas I only can speak/think from the knowledge I have rather it was good, bad or limited.

But start slow, too much to fast might be too much.

Maybe start with this scripture below-


46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.
47 The first man is of the earth, earthy; the second man is the Lord from heaven.