I will say this, I have had questions and during my quiet times over the years these thoughts are what have come to me. Did I hear voices no. Yet they are so clear as how God delivers us from evil by the indwelling.
There have been times when God came close and spoke to me on other subjects which revealed how the devil works and delivered me from hatred and being offended. I saw how the devil suggests these lies in first person and we own them as if they were our own thoughts and feelings arise which allows the demons to control us. It was like the film the Wizard of Oz when the curtain was pulled back and they could see the truth. The devil is the offended one who is filled with hate and we as puppets own it.... until the truth MAKES us free.
As to the circumstance in Eden. It seems very clear that something died.
1Tim 5:6 Those who live in pleasure are dead while they live.
Prov 8:36 "...he that sinneth against me wrongeth his own soul: all they that hate me love death.
Rom. 1 :6,7 "For to be carnally minded is death; ....Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
Therefore they were dead spiritually and at was with God.
So, how could they ever find their way back unless God initiated His plan to redeem. His Son laid down His life, just as a parent would lay down their life for their children. They will gladly sacrifice everything for the life of their children. Would not God do more than we can imagine?
You might call it speculation but it is far more beautiful and believable than the story we grew up with.
Well, the truth that there is a God is clearly seen in nature but that is not the truth that delivers the soul from captivity.
Without the Son to enlighten us from within no amount of information or natural complexity will convert the soul to the path of life. One must have God to see the light. Some might say, "Oh! It is the Holy Spirit that would do that. But the promise was the gift of the Son.
So true
Adam was unable to return to his Creator on his own for there was enmity in his heart. God had to give the Seed to overrule that with an enmity towards the serpent. Gen. 3:15
I have heard that before and it takes the power and love out of the gospel. As a parent He sacrificed all out of love to save us. It seems self evident that He gave all for us as soon as it was needed.
Any earthly father would do everything he could to save his family, rather than to say from the safety of the shore, to his drowning family, "The life guard will be here in a few thousand years, just hang on as long as you can."
I had to believe that the Son sacrificed all in the beginning.
From that time on there were sacrifices and symbolism in the sanctuary/temples and with Abraham. and finally the life of Jesus to clarify and help us understand what the Lover of our soul has done to redeem us. But it had to be that it began when sin entered.
He was faithful to what he knew and because he had a heart that was a heart single to God, it was counted to him for righteousness
What I believe about that is that the Son gave up all power and knowledge. Divested of all this to become equal to us. His strength and intelligence and knowledge is limited to each person he is in. He is completely helpless and dependent on the Father for those things. John 14:10 The Spirit is the agent who gives the power and wisdom to accomplish whatever the Father wills.
If you are speaking of Pentecost, it is clear that there are times that extra help is given. Sampson, Jesus walking on water or raising the dead. Philip transported to visit with the Ethiopian.
Resurrection power comes with the new birth. That is being redundant, they are the same thing. New birth, new creature, resurrection, all the same
If they did not have the Son mediating for them and in them they would have no desire for the Spirit
God is holy and God is spirit . I read in a favorite book of mine "the divine Spirit" and it was referring to the Son. So it depends upon the context. its semantics
I think that it's a thought that misses the point of Jesus coming to die in the flesh.
Also I was not clear on- why then receive the Holy spirit, rather Holyghost?
The key is to overcome the world,flesh, and Satin's power like Christ who is our life.
The son, correct me if Im wrong, you are saying is spirit. Then what would beThe need for Jesus to die. That simply does not add up to me.
Why because the way to defeat Satan had to be done in an actual body. You are saying He overcame the world before He enter the world
But most importantly is the reconcilating our whoselves to God. BODY, SOUL AND SPIRIT.
What I think is God used His prophets to speak through the people. And those people, things, and circumstances were shadows, and advise to us today. ......Since these last Days He spoke to us through His son..
Then it cant be both. I don't believe you can seperate God the son from His physical nature.
Because His Father was God His mother was Mary. How that happened Idk. What that looks like I can only finitely imagine.
The only thing I can give is that in symbol, people b4 hand could have heard the gospel.
Why did Abel present a reasonable sacrifice while cain did not. Why were Sacrifices even needed?
Anyway I think thats all I have for this discussion.
Interesting thought but it doesn't pass the scriptural test.
