Justification by Faith

[JLB]

Nathan.....WHY WOULD ONE LEAVE CHRIST?

Here you can ask these folks, who have left Christ.

http://www.ex-christian.net/forum/5-testimonies-of-former-christians/


Here are thousands of people and there reasons why they left Christ.

 

[Cygnus]

Do you believe you can deny Christ and still have His righteousness?

Yes. If it's been imputed to you. Do you think Chist de-imputes?

Does Christ give His righteousness to people who deny Him?

Of course not. You're describing someone who has never been saved. Once given Christ righteousness, it's yours.

 

[Cygnus]

Who is in control of you? Who is your Lord?

Will you ever answer ...why? or continue to play dodge ball?

 

[Cygnus]

Here you can ask these folks, who have left Christ.

http://www.ex-christian.net/forum/5-testimonies-of-former-christians/


Here are thousands of people and there reasons why they left Christ.

I've read several of them...seems like they were just playing a christian role. I'm not God so I don't know for sure...they didn't sound like they were ever saved. If they were saved, they still are.

 

[JLB]

I've read several of them...seems like they were just playing a christian role. I'm not God so I don't know for sure...they didn't sound like they were ever saved. If they were saved, they still are.

Ok, I agree with you at least on the part, we are not God and don't know for sure.

If they were saved, they still are.

If they were saved, and have renounced Jesus Christ as Messiah and Lord, then they no long believe, and are no longer believers.


Believers are promised eternal life.

A believer is someone who obeys the Gospel.

Those who believe for a while, then return to unbelieving, are not promised eternal life, but eternal death in the lake of fire, since they have no way to be forgiven their sins.

7 He who overcomes shall inherit all things,and I will be his God and he shall be My son. 8 But the cowardly, unbelieving, abominable, murderers, sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death.” Revelation 21:7-8



JLB

 

[Nathan]

Yes. If it's been imputed to you. Do you think Chist de-imputes?


Of course not. You're describing someone who has never been saved. Once given Christ righteousness, it's yours.

How can you deny Christ, and still have what He gives?

Mat 10:32-33
So everyone who acknowledges me before men, I also will acknowledge before my Father who is in heaven, but whoever denies me before men, I also will deny before my Father who is in heaven.

If Christ gives you righteousness, and its yours, is it like a ticket or something? Will you take your righteousness before God at the judgment? What is your righteousness?

 

[Cygnus]

Ok, I agree with you at least on the part, we are not God and don't know for sure.



If they were saved, and have renounced Jesus Christ as Messiah and Lord, then they no long believe, and are no longer believers.


Believers are promised eternal life.

A believer is someone who obeys the Gospel.

Those who believe for a while, then return to unbelieving, are not promised eternal life, but eternal death in the lake of fire, since they have no way to be forgiven their sins.

7 He who overcomes shall inherit all things,and I will be his God and he shall be My son. 8 But the cowardly, unbelieving, abominable, murderers, sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death.” Revelation 21:7-8



JLB

I also understand there are many "churchs" ....only playing church. Did those people remove themselves from a false church? Who knows. Reading some of the descriptions of the church's I would leave them.

Problem for you is you posted what you believe is a logical outcome. For example...stop believing and you lose eternal life.
But, no where does the bible say if you stop believing you lose your eternal life. This theory is something you assume to be...and...can't directly biblically support.

I would say most people who "stop believing" never really believed in the first place.
As John put it in 1 John 2:19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us. But they went out, that it might become plain that they all are not of us.

Of those remaining people that left the church...who were truly saved....they still are saved. Deceived, yet saved.

 

[Nathan]

Will you ever answer ...why? or continue to play dodge ball?

Who is your Lord? Who is your Master?

 

[Cygnus]

How can you deny Christ, and still have what He gives?

Does Jesus take back your righteousness? Where does the bible teach that?

 

[Cygnus]

Who is your Lord? Who is your Master?

Jesus and Jesus.....but I often forget that. When I do forget I lose my salvation.....then gain it back when I remember to put my trust in Jesus. ......then I lose it again the following day when I forget. This your in..your out...your in again theology of yours doesn't seem to be biblical.

 

[Cygnus]

If Christ gives you righteousness, and its yours, is it like a ticket or something? Will you take your righteousness before God at the judgment? What is your righteousness?

Will I take MY righteousness before the God at the judgement? No. I'll take the righteousness that Christ imputed to me. My righteousness is like a filthy rag.

 

[Nathan]

Does Jesus take back your righteousness? Where does the bible teach that?

I do not have any righteousness. I live and abide in His.

Phl 3:8-11
Indeed, I count everything as loss because of the surpassing worth of knowing Christ Jesus my Lord. For his sake I have suffered the loss of all things and count them as rubbish, in order that I may gain Christ and be found in him, not having a righteousness of my own that comes from the law, but that which comes through faith in Christ, the righteousness from God that depends on faith—that I may know him and the power of his resurrection, and may share his sufferings, becoming like him in his death, that by any means possible I may attain the resurrection from the dead.

 

[Nathan]

Jesus and Jesus.....but I often forget that. When I do forget I lose my salvation.....then gain it back when I remember to put my trust in Jesus. ......then I lose it again the following day when I forget. This your in..your out...your in again theology of yours doesn't seem to be biblical.

If Jesus is your Lord, why do you falsely accuse me?

How in one breath do you claim Him as your Master, then in the next speak evil against me?

I never said we were in and out, over and over.

 

[Nathan]

Will I take MY righteousness before the God at the judgement? No. I'll take the righteousness that Christ imputed to me. My righteousness is like a filthy rag.

Does the righteousness imputed on you come without being in Christ? Can you deny Christ and be in Him at the same time?

 

[Cygnus]

If Jesus is your Lord, why do you falsely accuse me?

I haven't. Your religion is incorrect concerning the ability to lose your salvation.

How in one breath do you claim Him as your Master, then in the next speak evil against me?

Where have I spoken evil against you? (keep in mind I've come close to reporting you)

I never said we were in and out, over and over.

It's what your religion would claim.....or will you now say once you're out, you stay out.

 

[Cygnus]

Does the righteousness imputed on you come without being in Christ? Can you deny Christ and be in Him at the same time?

Every time I sin I deny Christ.

 

[Cygnus]

I do not have any righteousness. I live and abide in His.

Does Jesus take back His righteousness? Where does the bible teach that?

 

[Nathan]

I haven't. Your religion is incorrect concerning the ability to lose your salvation.

Where have I spoken evil against you? (keep in mind I've come close to reporting you)


It's what your religion would claim.....or will you now say once you're out, you stay out.

Report if you wish. I have not done anything to you.

You are accusing me of saying something I am not. Is falsely accusing a work of good or evil?

It would be one thing if you said you felt like it was a religion would claim, but you insist that its "my" religion. I have never laid claim to that, and I keep telling you that, yet you persist.

 

[Nathan]

Every time I sin I deny Christ.

Interesting. Explain more.

I sin, but that does not mean I deny Christ. I have denied Christ, but that does not mean I have denied Him because I did not believe in Him.

There is a difference between sin(missing the mark when aiming at the mark), and sin(missing the mark because you are not aiming at the mark).

 

[Cygnus]

Report if you wish. I have not done anything to you.

You are accusing me of saying something I am not. Is falsely accusing a work of good or evil?

It would be one thing if you said you felt like it was a religion would claim, but you insist that its "my" religion. I have never laid claim to that, and I keep telling you that, yet you persist.

Your religion claim a person can lose their salvation...but when asked what is required to cause such a loss and why would a person turn to disbelief.....you shut up like a clam.

Your religion tells us to remain in salvation...it is what we do or believe.