Kundalini Warning To The Church Of Jesus Christ....True or False.

[Jethro Bodine]

Is this so called "Blessing" of God, or of the dark world of Satan. I want your honest opinion. not a place to insult each other.

True to form the Church in general seems to be only able to think in terms of black or white. In this matter of spiritual manifestations it seems that if there are false manifestations of the Spirit then there must be no manifestations of the Spirit. I see this kind of 'either or'-black or white' thinking in so many, if not all, of the doctrines in debate in the church today.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Thank you, Jethro. John says a lot very plainly at the end. Many people miss that.

Yes, what he said at the end. You caught it too, I see.

I hope to get some direct quotes out of that video for others to read so they can gain some godly discernment and education about this whole matter.

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

I saw no barking on that video where you called what they were doing, demonic. But I might have missed it.... where did it happen? The video time reference is fine.

 

[Jesse]

True to form the Church in general seems to be only able to think in terms of black or white. In this matter of spiritual manifestations it seems that if there are false manifestations of the Spirit then there must be no manifestations of the Spirit. I see this kind of 'either or'-black or white' thinking in so many, if not all, of the doctrines in debate in the church today.

There are probably those who think in black and white, in that if there are false manifestations than there are none. Yet, this is not the manifestations of the Spirit that I see in the Bible (the kind that I see in the video), it is so far removed from any Biblical account that it's unrecognizable, this is where I believe people are pulling up stops signs.

The Spirit DOES manifest Himself, in many, many ways but causing a man to convulse, roll on the floor like they are seizing, etc isn't one I can read about nor do I see a purpose for it. (as I've stated in several posts).

Can you give a reason why God would cause a man to convulse uncontrollably? What is the purpose for this?

 

[Karl]

Yeah, right. And what is that expensive piece of equipment you are communicating on right this minute? Not to mention the cost of being online. Sorry, that dog don't hunt.

Hey willie, did you read the part about about seeking the Kingdom of God and His righteousness and all these things shall be added unto you? And the part about now my cup is truly running over too?

Just for the gee whiz file, the Lord brought an American woman into my life that installed the Internet here in Tahiti for the French government, she's my computer guru, I've never paid more than $100 for one of her many spare 'puters that I can assure you is much more "hopped up" than anything you can bye from a store.

However, since you insist on talking about me rather than the subject of the thread, how about answering a few questions about yourself, in brotherly love?

1. Do you believe the Kundalini force is from the Eastern religions as stated in the video?
2. And if not, would you personally like to experience this force/control take possession of your body?
3. And would you recommend others to be controlled/possessed by the Kundalini force?

Please notice I'm NOT talking about any particular church or denomination, so let's just leave that out of the discussion, ...okay?

 

[Willie T]

At 32 seconds into the video, where does the woman say these theatrics are being played out?

BOSTON

As I thought I clearly pointed out, the Vineyard saw this kind of man-conjured thing happening, and denounced the direction people were taking this. But you went and hunted till you found this silliness. This is not the video you claimed was demonic. Is this the way you work? Hunt till you find what you want, and then claim this is what we have been discussing?

 

[Jethro Bodine]

There are probably those who think in black and white, in that if there are false manifestations than there are none. Yet, this is not the manifestations of the Spirit that I see in the Bible (the kind that I see in the video), it is so far removed from any Biblical account that it's unrecognizable, this is where I believe people are pulling up stops signs.

The Spirit DOES manifest Himself, in many, many ways but causing a man to convulse, roll on the floor like they are seizing, etc isn't one I can read about nor do I see a purpose for it. (as I've stated in several posts).

Can you give a reason why God would cause a man to convulse uncontrollably? What is the purpose for this?

I wish I had been able to follow this thread through from the beginning, and had the time to quote the video Willie posted, but anyway, I honestly think what you are seeing in some of the prayer sessions are exorcisms. You may not recognize them as that because of Hollywood, but I'm confident that's what's happening:

"Be quiet!" said Jesus sternly. "Come out of him!" The evil spirit shook the man violently and came out of him with a shriek. (Mark 1:25-26 NASB)

It is entirely Biblical that a person may convulse in response to the activity of the Holy Spirit in a person warring against the powers of darkness. Don't throw the baby out with the bathwater just because some people make merchandise of it, or act it out to an uncontrolled extreme when that's not really happening.

Now don't think that I'm explaining everything in all of these videos as being that, and if you watch Willie's video you'll know that neither does the founder of Vineyard. He's quite candid and honest about what was happening in HIS meetings.

My own testimony of shaking is not because a demon came out of me by the power of God, but because that is what would often happen to me after having a manifest encounter with the Holy Spirit. I could easily have let it be uncontrolled and put on a grand display of the Spirit at work in me, and I think that is the mistake many in the movement do. Spiritual manifestations do not automatically equate to being out of control. That's only true if you let it be that way.

This is where the rubber meets the road. Are we Christians going to believe the Bible, or are we not? Dramatic manifestations of the Spirit at work in a person are entirely Biblical. But this is perhaps the primary example of how spiritless teachers and leaders of the church have suppressed the truth of the Bible and robbed the body of Christ of this valuable knowledge. So many of us don't even know this stuff is in our very own Bibles thanks to this ungodly suppression of truth. This is how indoctrinations work. You are told something over and over until you can't see the truth right under your own nose.

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

At 32 seconds into the video, where does the woman say these theatrics are being played out?

BOSTON

As I thought I clearly pointed out, the Vineyard saw this kind of man-conjured thing happening, and denounced the direction people were taking this. But you went and hunted till you found this silliness. This is not the video you claimed was demonic. Is this the way you work? Hunt till you find what you want, and then claim this is what we have been discussing?

Willie, these are all Toronto related people.
The man speaking is Mike Bickel, who has led the Toronto Blessing many times.
The woman, I forget her name, is given the title "Prophet" within the movement.
The fact that they mentioned Toronto should tell you something.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Hey willie, did you read the part about about seeking the Kingdom of God and His righteousness and all these things shall be added unto you? And the part about now my cup is truly running over too?

Just for the gee whiz file, the Lord brought an American woman into my life that installed the Internet here in Tahiti for the French government, she's my computer guru, I've never paid more than $100 for one of her many spare 'puters that I can assure you is much more "hopped up" than anything you can bye from a store.

However, since you insist on talking about me rather than the subject of the thread, how about answering a few questions about yourself, in brotherly love?

1. Do you believe the Kundalini force is from the Eastern religions as stated in the video?
2. And if not, would you personally like to experience this force/control take possession of your body?
3. And would you recommend others to be controlled/possessed by the Kundalini force?

Please notice I'm NOT talking about any particular church or denomination, so let's just leave that out of the discussion, ...okay?

You seem to be automatically equating Kundalini force with what's in the Bible as if they are, and have to be, one and the same thing. The question we have to ask here is, is there a difference between the two?' If you believe your Bible then the answer is obviously, 'yes'.

 

[Willie T]

I wish I had been able to follow this thread through from the beginning, and had the time to quote the video Willie posted, but anyway, I honestly think what you are seeing in some of the prayer sessions are exorcisms. You may not recognize them as that because of Hollywood, but I'm confident that's what's happening:

"Be quiet!" said Jesus sternly. "Come out of him!" The evil spirit shook the man violently and came out of him with a shriek. (Mark 1:25-26 NASB)

It is entirely Biblical that a person convulse in response to the activity of the Holy Spirit in a person warring against the powers of darkness. Don't throw the baby out with the bathwater just because some people make merchandise of it, or act it out to an uncontrolled extreme when that's not really happening.

Now don't think that I'm explaining everything in all of these videos as being that, and if you watch Willie's video you'll know that neither does the founder of Vineyard. He's quite candid and honest about what was happening in HIS meetings.

My own testimony of shaking is not because a demon came out of me by the power of God, but because that is what would often happen to me after having a manifest encounter with the Holy Spirit. I could easily have let it be uncontrolled and put on a grand display of the Spirit at work in me, and I think that is the mistake many in the movement do. Spiritual manifestations do not automatically equate to being out of control. That's only true if you let it be that way.

This is where the rubber meets the road. Are we Christians going to believe the Bible, or are we not? Dramatic manifestations of the Spirit at work in a person are entirely Biblical. But this is perhaps the primary example of how spiritless teachers and leaders of the church have suppressed the truth of the Bible and robbed the body of Christ of this valuable knowledge. So many of us don't even know this stuff is in our very own Bibles thanks to this ungodly suppression of truth. This is how indoctrinations work. You are told something over and over until you can't see the truth right under your own nose.

Thanks again, Jethro. I'm a little too disillusioned and disappointed with several people here to really have any desire to try to show them God right now. Maybe after some turkey and dressing.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Thanks again, Jethro. I'm a little too disillusioned and disappointed with several people here to really have any desire to try to show them God right now. Maybe after some turkey and dressing.

I understand completely. I really do.

Call me a fool, but something compels me inside to get to where people are at with the things of God that they reject so they can divide the lies and misrepresentations from the truth and then walk in that truth. The power of the Holy Spirit is perhaps the greatest thing that the devil has robbed the people of God of.

I'm hardly done here. Enjoy, but don't stay away too long.

 

[Willie T]

Willie, these are all Toronto related people.
The man speaking is Mike Bickel, who has led the Toronto Blessing many times.
The woman, I forget her name, is given the title "Prophet" within the movement.
The fact that they mentioned Toronto should tell you something.

Do I have to keep on repeating it? Or will you finally listen?

The Vineyard sponsored this meeting at The Airport Vineyard.... and it was fantastic for quite awhile. Till men started trying to direct things to suit their own agendas. Any Vineyard that continued with all these theatrics was disavowed. (no longer of our denomination... none of these men or churches are any longer, Vineyard.)

 

[Jesse]

I wish I had been able to follow this thread through from the beginning, and had the time to quote the video Willie posted, but anyway, I honestly think what you are seeing in some of the prayer sessions are exorcisms. You may not recognize them as that because of Hollywood, but I'm confident that's what's happening:

"Be quiet!" said Jesus sternly. "Come out of him!" The evil spirit shook the man violently and came out of him with a shriek. (Mark 1:25-26 NASB)

It is entirely Biblical that a person may convulse in response to the activity of the Holy Spirit in a person warring against the powers of darkness. Don't throw the baby out with the bathwater just because some people make merchandise of it, or act it out to an uncontrolled extreme when that's not really happening.

Now don't think that I'm explaining everything in all of these videos as being that, and if you watch Willie's video you'll know that neither does the founder of Vineyard. He's quite candid and honest about what was happening in HIS meetings.

My own testimony of shaking is not because a demon came out of me by the power of God, but because that is what would often happen to me after having a manifest encounter with the Holy Spirit. I could easily have let it be uncontrolled and put on a grand display of the Spirit at work in me, and I think that is the mistake many in the movement do. Spiritual manifestations do not automatically equate to being out of control. That's only true if you let it be that way.

This is where the rubber meets the road. Are we Christians going to believe the Bible, or are we not? Dramatic manifestations of the Spirit at work in a person are entirely Biblical. But this is perhaps the primary example of how spiritless teachers and leaders of the church have suppressed the truth of the Bible and robbed the body of Christ of this valuable knowledge. So many of us don't even know this stuff is in our very own Bibles thanks to this ungodly suppression of truth. This is how indoctrinations work. You are told something over and over until you can't see the truth right under your own nose.

To clarify, you believe what is going on in the video are people who are possessed with a demon and the demon is leaving? If so, then it is not God causing these convulsions but the demon who is leaving? I have other questions but I want to clarify this part first.

Thanks.

 

[turnorburn]

I'm waiting for Chopper to respond, I've already been through this when Todd Bentley had center stage, they said he was the real deal as well..

tob

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

Do I have to keep on repeating it? Or will you finally listen?

The Vineyard sponsored this meeting at The Airport Vineyard.... and it was fantastic for quite awhile. Till men started trying to direct things to suit their own agendas. Any Vineyard that continued with all these theatrics was disavowed. (no longer of our denomination... none of these men or churches are any longer, Vineyard.)

[QUOTE="Willie, let's have an understanding here.
I am the one that said the Vineyard left all this behind them (post # 17).
You are the one that continually sees what I say about the Toronto Blessing as a continual attack against the Vineyard.
I've never said it or implied it.

 

[Willie T]

[QUOTE="Willie, let's have an understanding here.
I am the one that said the Vineyard left all this behind them (post # 17).
You are the one that continually sees what I say about the Toronto Blessing as a continual attack against the Vineyard.
I've never said it or implied it.

Apologies.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

To clarify, you believe what is going on in the video are people who are possessed with a demon and the demon is leaving? If so, then it is not God causing these convulsions but the demon who is leaving? I have other questions but I want to clarify this part first.

Thanks.

I expected you to ONLY get that out of my post, so I tried to address it before you went there.

A person convulsing while being prayed over is ENTIRELY Biblical (please, watch and listen carefully to what's going on and being said in Willie's video!). It is evil spirits that cause this when that's the cause. On the other hand, it is my own personal experience that I sometimes start shaking (like when you get chilled--nothing more) when I've been experiencing the presence and ministry of the Holy Spirit. But I also get heated and flushed when I have been persuasively presenting the gospel. My wife could tell if I had been witnessing at work because I'd come home red and flushed. The point being, just because evil spirits can cause manifestations doesn't automatically make any and all manifestations (shaking, flushing, crumbling in weakness, drunkenness, etc.) of the devil.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Maybe the biggest problem for many--besides not knowing and believing what the Bible says--is they simply have not experienced the Holy Spirit to know about these things. Generally speaking, you really do have to go to a church that believes in the manifest power of the Spirit to have those things happening in your meetings. All the things of God are laid hold of through faith. If you do not believe that they happen they probably won't.

 

[Willie T]

Some people sound like.... "Well, Satan knows scripture, and quotes it..... therefore we are following Satan if we also quote scripture." How ridiculous.

 

[Willie T]

Maybe the biggest problem for many--besides not knowing and believing what the Bible says--is they simply have not experienced the Holy Spirit to know about these things. Generally speaking, you really do have to go to a church that believes in the manifest power of the Spirit to have those things happening in your meetings. All the things of God are laid hold of through faith. If you do not believe that they happen they probably won't.

Jesus wouldn't even operate in His own unbelieving hometown.