Losing Salvation after getting saved?

[agua.]

I have done the posting and external links before and I had to get personal with the moderator, so I don't want to repeat it again. If you can get the permission from the moderators/admin then I'm ready to link the content

Ok no worries. Let's just assume I don't believe your claims made against Grace Preahers. You can PM me the quotes and site addresses if you want to change my mind.

I have asked this question several times and let me know if you can answer me

A businessman attends a grace preacher's prayer meeting and he receives Christ as his personal Saviour. Now the businessman has lot of business to do all the day and he doesn't have time for prayer or bible reading. Most is he will attend few prayer meetings at his will. My question is this business man sticks to this attitude till he dies. Now tell me if that businessman would get into heaven just only because he got believed in The Lord Jesus Christ but couldn't have any fellowship with the Saviour because of his worldly commitments. Please answer this question frankly to me.

If the man was Born Again he will be saved. I have a couple of questions for you.

1. Do you believe you need to pray and read the Bible to be saved ?
2. Do you believe a person can unrepentantly misrepresent people and still be saved ?

 

[chessman]

Smyrna who were warned ahead of time by Jesus that they would be tested by being put into prison, and that they were not to deny the name of Christ so that they would receive the crown of life:

10'Do not fear what you are about to suffer. Behold, the devil is about to cast some of you into prison, so that you will be tested, and you will have tribulation for ten days. Be faithful until death, and I will give you the crown of life." (Revelation 2:10 NASB)

A warning (a prophecy no doubt) that indeed He told them was about to happen. That is, that they would be tested by being put in prison. I believe that it did happen to them. Do you?

Not quite sure where you get out of this passage any pass/fail question as to whether they would "deny Christ", but whatever.

But as frequent with your posts, that's not all He prophecied to them. The rest of the story; it's short and sweet:

Revelation 2:8-11 “This is what the first and the last says, who was dead and came to life: ‘I know your affliction and poverty but you are rich, ...
​

Do you believe they were in poverty, yet "rich". What do you think that means? I say it means they had been given God's refined Gold (Jesus and the The Holy Spirit in their hearts). See Rev 3:17, 5:12

Revelation 5:12 saying with a loud voice,“Worthy is the Lamb who was slaughtered to receive power and riches and wisdom and strength and honor and glory and praise!”


Do not be afraid of the things which you are about to suffer.
​

Their suffering was a prophecy, not something they could necessarily avoid.

Behold, the devil is about to throw some of you into prison so that you may be tested, and you will experience affliction ten days.
​

Why do you think Jesus told them to behold their testing? I think it's because that meant God loved them as His Sons. As He loved Jesus (see Rev 5:12). They didn't have a Father that lacked love for them. Our strength to test them beyond what they could handle. Why do you think He told them only some would be tested for ten days? I think he knew some would preserver for 10 days (but some might not for 11), yet others wouldn't take even 5 days. Pretty smart father that Father, huh?

Be faithful until death, and I will give you the crown of life.
​

Do you think this is that same loving Father telling them that if they were not faithful until death, that He would take away their "richness"? I don't. It doesn't say that's the case. You'd need it to for this to be an anti-OSAS passage. So, you just imply it.

The one who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. The one who conquers will never be harmed by the second death.’ ​

Do you think that when Jesus says that He will never harm those that heard) (the ones He just said were rich and He sent this message to and they heard it) or will He not actually "never" harm them but "sometimes" will depending on how many days of affliction their Father tests them with?

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Please show me quotes from people ( anyone ) who suggest trusting in Christ to the very end is a "wonderful work". Here's that link describing logical fallacies again for your information. ( In particular straw man )

Your logic fallacy is Straw Man

"By exaggerating, misrepresenting, or just completely fabricating someone's argument, it's much easier to present your own position as being reasonable, but this kind of dishonesty serves to undermine honest rational debate."


It's also against the ToS to misrepresent another posters argument.

"....It is a violation to misquote or misrepresent another member."

Snip ToS 2.4


When Jesus returns there will be many people who point to their own efforts and they seem to truly believe they were saved.
.
Mat 7:22-23 KJV Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? (23) And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

You have forgotten the arguments that have been made that to say that believers have the responsibility to continue to believe in order to be saved is a self righteous work because it means you're trusting in what you do. And I asked why when we first believed that was not a self righteous work, but continuing to do that same believing is.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

A warning (a prophecy no doubt) that indeed He told them was about to happen. That is, that they would be tested by being put in prison. I believe that it did happen to them. Do you?

Not quite sure where you get out of this passage any pass/fail question as to whether they would "deny Christ", but whatever.

But as frequent with your posts, that's not all He prophecied to them. The rest of the story; it's short and sweet:

Revelation 2:8-11 “This is what the first and the last says, who was dead and came to life: ‘I know your affliction and poverty but you are rich, ...
​

Do you believe they were in poverty, yet "rich". What do you think that means? I say it means they had been given God's refined Gold (Jesus and the The Holy Spirit in their hearts). See Rev 3:17, 5:12

Revelation 5:12 saying with a loud voice,“Worthy is the Lamb who was slaughtered to receive power and riches and wisdom and strength and honor and glory and praise!”


Do not be afraid of the things which you are about to suffer.
​

Their suffering was a prophecy, not something they could necessarily avoid.

Behold, the devil is about to throw some of you into prison so that you may be tested, and you will experience affliction ten days.
​

Why do you think Jesus told them to behold their testing? I think it's because that meant God loved them as His Sons. As He loved Jesus (see Rev 5:12). They didn't have a Father that lacked love for them. Our strength to test them beyond what they could handle. Why do you think He told them only some would be tested for ten days? I think he knew some would preserver for 10 days (but some might not for 11), yet others wouldn't take even 5 days. Pretty smart father that Father, huh?

Be faithful until death, and I will give you the crown of life.
​

Do you think this is that same loving Father telling them that if they were not faithful until death, that He would take away their "richness"? I don't. It doesn't say that's the case. You'd need it to for this to be an anti-OSAS passage. So, you just imply it.

The one who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. The one who conquers will never be harmed by the second death.’ ​

Do you think that when Jesus says that He will never harm those that heard) (the ones He just said were rich and He sent this message to and they heard it) or will He not actually "never" harm them but "sometimes" will depending on how many days of affliction their Father tests them with?

Lovely. Now I have to tell my friend who got saved, spoke in tongues, but who later made a conscious decision to leave the faith because of the responsibilities of the faith would not have failed and could be saved and at peace with God today if only God loved them and had not allowed them to be challenged by the demands of holy living.

Now, address how people sanctified by faith in Christ can walk away from Christ and no longer have a sacrifice for sin and have nothing left but the fearful expectation of the punishment of the damned (Hebrews 10:26-30 NASB):

"26 For if we go on sinning willfully after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, 27 but a terrifying expectation of judgment and THE FURY OF A FIRE WHICH WILL CONSUME THE ADVERSARIES. 28 Anyone who has set aside the Law of Moses dies without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses. 29 How much severer punishment do you think he will deserve who has trampled under foot the Son of God, and has regarded as unclean the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified, and has insulted the Spirit of grace? 30 For we know Him who said, "VENGEANCE IS MINE, I WILL REPAY." And again, "THE LORD WILL JUDGE HIS PEOPLE." " (Hebrews 10: NASB)

(emphasis in original)

 

[JLB]

A warning (a prophecy no doubt) that indeed He told them was about to happen. That is, that they would be tested by being put in prison. I believe that it did happen to them. Do you?

Not quite sure where you get out of this passage any pass/fail question as to whether they would "deny Christ", but whatever.

But as frequent with your posts, that's not all He prophecied to them. The rest of the story; it's short and sweet:

Revelation 2:8-11 “This is what the first and the last says, who was dead and came to life: ‘I know your affliction and poverty but you are rich, ...
​

Do you believe they were in poverty, yet "rich". What do you think that means? I say it means they had been given God's refined Gold (Jesus and the The Holy Spirit in their hearts). See Rev 3:17, 5:12

Revelation 5:12 saying with a loud voice,“Worthy is the Lamb who was slaughtered to receive power and riches and wisdom and strength and honor and glory and praise!”


Do not be afraid of the things which you are about to suffer.
​

Their suffering was a prophecy, not something they could necessarily avoid.

Behold, the devil is about to throw some of you into prison so that you may be tested, and you will experience affliction ten days.
​

Why do you think Jesus told them to behold their testing? I think it's because that meant God loved them as His Sons. As He loved Jesus (see Rev 5:12). They didn't have a Father that lacked love for them. Our strength to test them beyond what they could handle. Why do you think He told them only some would be tested for ten days? I think he knew some would preserver for 10 days (but some might not for 11), yet others wouldn't take even 5 days. Pretty smart father that Father, huh?

Be faithful until death, and I will give you the crown of life.
​

Do you think this is that same loving Father telling them that if they were not faithful until death, that He would take away their "richness"? I don't. It doesn't say that's the case. You'd need it to for this to be an anti-OSAS passage. So, you just imply it.

The one who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. The one who conquers will never be harmed by the second death.’ ​

Do you think that when Jesus says that He will never harm those that heard) (the ones He just said were rich and He sent this message to and they heard it) or will He not actually "never" harm them but "sometimes" will depending on how many days of affliction their Father tests them with?

Thank Goodness we also have a loving Father that speaks to us and warns us of things to come.

8 "And to the angel of the church in Smyrna write,'These things says the First and the Last, who was dead, and came to life: 9 I know your works, tribulation, and poverty (but you are rich); and I know the blasphemy of those who say they are Jews and are not, but are a synagogue of Satan. 10 Do not fear any of those things which you are about to suffer. Indeed, the devil is about to throw some of you into prison, that you may be tested, and you will have tribulation ten days. Be faithful until death, and I will give you the crown of life. 11 He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. He who overcomes shall not be hurt by the second death." ' Revelation 2:8-11

He also warns us of things that will cause us to lose our Salvation.

This phrase is warning from a loving Father who wants all His Children to overcome and be with Him for all eternity.

He who overcomes shall not be hurt by the second death."

However, OSAS folks seem to have the idea that these who were warned, could not be saved if they were in danger of the second death.

What is your take on this phrase?

He who overcomes shall not be hurt by the second death."

Is the "he' in this phrase, a saved one or an unsaved one, when these words of warning were spoken to them.


JLB

 

[JLB]

Please show me quotes from people ( anyone ) who suggest trusting in Christ to the very end is a "wonderful work". Here's that link describing logical fallacies again for your information. ( In particular straw man )

Your logic fallacy is Straw Man

"By exaggerating, misrepresenting, or just completely fabricating someone's argument, it's much easier to present your own position as being reasonable, but this kind of dishonesty serves to undermine honest rational debate."


It's also against the ToS to misrepresent another posters argument.

"....It is a violation to misquote or misrepresent another member."

Snip ToS 2.4


When Jesus returns there will be many people who point to their own efforts and they seem to truly believe they were saved.
.
Mat 7:22-23 KJV Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? (23) And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Unfortunately, the scripture you quoted represents those whom Jesus never knew.

If we take the next logical step in understanding this, we can conclude that they never had the Spirit of Christ in them.

Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not His. Romans 8:9

So we must ask ourselves, by what Spirit were they "prophesying", and doing many wonderful works?


JLB

 

[chessman]

Lovely. Now I have to tell my friend who got saved, spoke in tongues, but who later made a conscious decision to leave the faith because of the responsibilities of the faith would not have failed and could be saved and at peace with God today if only God loved them and had not allowed them to be challenged by the demands of holy living.

Or you could tell your friend he's going to be disciplined harshly (spewed out even, even to the point of death) if he doesn't truly get "at peace with God". If he ever was? You suggested (and I stipulated it to be true) that your friend was once at peace with God and saved (two different things). You are claiming you know that he/she was once "saved" due to his "fruit" of speaking in tongues, I suppose. Fine. I went with your claim even though I'm not sure Tongues is so much a "fruit" as it is a manifestation of the Holy Spirit Himself. I mean, God can make a donkey speak if it suits his purposes. So I'm not sure it's a 100% proof about your friend, to begin with. But maybe. Beats nothing (claims from people), that's for sure.

But anyway, you are doing it again, I never said or implied that your friend was now "at peace with God". You said that for me just then. I certainly don't think anyone knowingly in sinful lifestyle(s) is "at peace with God". They may be in "the desert" for a few days or years though. I never once implied it even. What you are doing (yet again) is called a misrepresentation of my argument (a stawman).

I don't mind it so much when you do it with my posts. I kind of laugh at it actually. It's funny to me.

But I'm wondering just how much The Word minds it when you throw out "This is the faith that saves..." and reference Rev 2:10's "be faithful until death and I will give you the crown of life", as if it was a Here's how to maintain salvation phrase from the Lord, to a group of people that are already saved in the first place (and richly blessed for it). Atrocious really, when you think about it. I'd be afraid to misrepresent The Word using Rev 2:10 that way.

Compared to:

Do not be afraid of the things (10 days in prison) which you are about to suffer.
​

They may have gotten off easy with their test, compared to the discipline a son receives for misrepresenting The Word. I try to avoid any misrepresentation of The Word (or his creatures) when I've been shown how I'm doing that.

Being afraid of prison is one thing.
Being afraid of death is another thing.

Being afraid of losing a crown is one thing.
Being afraid of losing Salvation is another Thing. (Capitalization intentional)

 

[chessman]

He who overcomes shall not be hurt by the second death."

What is your take on this phrase?

The same as yours. See, I answered you question honestly. But before I address your other question (and I will, if you answer mine).

What's your take on this phrase from the same passage:

those who call themselves Jews and are not, but are a synagogue of Satan.
​

You think they are saved people? And this phrase:

Do not be afraid of the things which you are about to suffer. Behold, the devil is about to throw some of you into prison so that you may be tested, and you will experience affliction ten days.
​

Why just some and not all?

 

[JLB]

The same as yours. See, I answered you question honestly. But before I address your other question (and I will, if you answer mine).

What's your take on this phrase from the same passage:

those who call themselves Jews and are not, but are a synagogue of Satan.
​

You think they are saved people? And this phrase:

Do not be afraid of the things which you are about to suffer. Behold, the devil is about to throw some of you into prison so that you may be tested, and you will experience affliction ten days.
​

Why just some and not all?

Answer:

I believe those who are of the Synagogue of Satan, are NOT SAVED.

I believe the Lord was warning His people, about those who were of the Synagogue of Satan.


Question:

... he who overcomes shall not be hurt by the second death."

Is the "he" in this phrase, a saved one or an unsaved one, when these words of warning were spoken to them.


JLB

 

[Gregg]

The reality of your Salvation will be realized way His Coming.

No longer will you have faith for Salvation, but you will in fact have received the Salvation of your soul, which is the redemption of your body.

so Christ was offered once to bear the sins of many. To those who eagerly wait for Him He will appear a second time, apart from sin, for salvation. Hebrews 9:28


For in this we groan, earnestly desiring to be clothed with our habitation which is from heaven, 3 if indeed, having been clothed, we shall not be found naked. 4 For we who are in this tent groan, being burdened, not because we want to be unclothed, but further clothed, that mortality may be swallowed up by life. 5 Now He who has prepared us for this very thing is God, who also has given us the Spirit as a guarantee. 2 Corinthians 5:3-5

...who also has given us the Spirit as a guarantee.

There is the word guarantee that you used earlier, in your statement in which you said, once we are born again, the outcome is guaranteed.

19 For the earnest expectation of the creation eagerly waits for the revealing of the sons of God. 20 For the creation was subjected to futility, not willingly, but because of Him who subjected it in hope; 21 because the creation itself also will be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God. 22 For we know that the whole creation groans and labors with birth pangs together until now. 23 Not only that, but we also who have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, eagerly waiting for the adoption, the redemption of our body. 24 For we were saved in this hope, but hope that is seen is not hope; for why does one still hope for what he sees? 25 But if we hope for what we do not see, we eagerly wait for it with perseverance.
Romans 8:19-25

We are hoping for the Salvation that will be a reality at His Coming.

JLB

Today you get milk, and I will pour it for you and set the glass before you.

Read and understand the full text.

Paul addresses those who are already sons of God.
"For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God. For you did not receive a spirit of slavery again to fear, but you received a Spirit of adoption by which we cry, Abba! Father! The Spirit Himself witnesses with our spirit that we are children of God.
(Rom 8:14-16), "for we were saved by hope" (Rom 8:24).

Rom 8:23 is talking about our physical bodies, that part of our being that has been severed from us (Rom 8:9-10, Rom 8:12), as that part of our being which has a [guaranteed] future resurrection at Christ's Second Coming. "But if the Spirit of the One having raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, the One having raised the Christ from the dead will also make your mortal bodies live through the indwelling of His Spirit in you" (Rom 8:11, see 1Cor 15:53).

1) Our spirit is saved, born again.
2) Our soul is being saved, kept by Christ and sustained by His indwelling Spirit.
3) Our body will be transformed, and saved.

If (1) has began, then (2) is occurring, and (3) will occur - and we have the guarantee as the Spirit of God has sealed us (Eph 1:13-14).

- - -

To understand these things, you must also understand this:

"And may the God of peace Himself fully sanctify you, and may your whole spirit and soul and body be kept blameless at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. He who calls you is faithful, who also will perform it" (1Thes 5:23-24).

 

[Jethro Bodine]

You are claiming you know that he/she was once "saved" due to his "fruit" of speaking in tongues, I suppose. Fine. I went with your claim even though I'm not sure Tongues is so much a "fruit" as it is a manifestation of the Holy Spirit Himself. I mean, God can make a donkey speak if it suits his purposes. So I'm not sure it's a 100% proof about your friend, to begin with. But maybe. Beats nothing (claims from people), that's for sure.

Tongues is how Peter knew that God had received the gentiles in salvation. He didn't shag it off as God just making donkeys speak for some purpose of his own.

"17 "Therefore if God gave to them the same gift as He gave to us also after believing in the Lord Jesus Christ, who was I that I could stand in God's way?" 18 When they heard this, they quieted down and glorified God,saying, "Well then, God has granted to the Gentiles also the repentance that leads to life."" (Acts 11:17-18 NASB)

But anyway, you are doing it again, I never said or implied that your friend was now "at peace with God". You said that for me just then. I certainly don't think anyone knowingly in sinful lifestyle(s) is "at peace with God". They may be in "the desert" for a few days or years though. I never once implied it even. What you are doing (yet again) is called a misrepresentation of my argument (a stawman).

I don't mind it so much when you do it with my posts. I kind of laugh at it actually. It's funny to me.

Good grief, chessman! Slow down and reread my post. I never said you said or implied my friend was now at peace with God! Sheesh! Where do you get this stuff?

But I'm wondering just how much The Word minds it when you throw out "This is the faith that saves..." and reference Rev 2:10's "be faithful until death and I will give you the crown of life", as if it was a Here's how to maintain salvation phrase from the Lord, to a group of people that are already saved in the first place (and richly blessed for it). Atrocious really, when you think about it. I'd be afraid to misrepresent The Word using Rev 2:10 that way.

Compared to:

Do not be afraid of the things (10 days in prison) which you are about to suffer.
​

They may have gotten off easy with their test, compared to the discipline a son receives for misrepresenting The Word. I try to avoid any misrepresentation of The Word (or his creatures) when I've been shown how I'm doing that.

Being afraid of prison is one thing.
Being afraid of death is another thing.

Being afraid of losing a crown is one thing.
Being afraid of losing Salvation is another Thing. (Capitalization intentional)

May I ask, "What is it about the second death that you don't understand?"

"Be faithful until death, and I will give you the crown of life. 11 'He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. He who overcomes will not be hurt by the second death.'" (Revelation 2: NASB)

Why do you take away the part about the second death in this passage?

 

[JLB]

Today you get milk, and I will pour it for you and set the glass before you.

Read and understand the full text.

Paul addresses those who are already sons of God.
"For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God. For you did not receive a spirit of slavery again to fear, but you received a Spirit of adoption by which we cry, Abba! Father! The Spirit Himself witnesses with our spirit that we are children of God.
(Rom 8:14-16), "for we were saved by hope" (Rom 8:24).

Rom 8:23 is talking about our physical bodies, that part of our being that has been severed from us (Rom 8:9-10, Rom 8:12), as that part of our being which has a [guaranteed] future resurrection at Christ's Second Coming. "But if the Spirit of the One having raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, the One having raised the Christ from the dead will also make your mortal bodies live through the indwelling of His Spirit in you" (Rom 8:11, see 1Cor 15:53).

1) Our spirit is saved, born again.
2) Our soul is being saved, kept by Christ and sustained by His indwelling Spirit.
3) Our body will be transformed, and saved.

If (1) has began, then (2) is occurring, and (3) will occur - and we have the guarantee as the Spirit of God has sealed us (Eph 1:13-14).

- - -

To understand these things, you must also understand this:

"And may the God of peace Himself fully sanctify you, and may your whole spirit and soul and body be kept blameless at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. He who calls you is faithful, who also will perform it" (1Thes 5:23-24).

Thank you Brother, for that milk.

That is what someone needs to hear growing up in Christ.

It is milk.

And as long as you know its milk, then Ive done my job.

However, because there is milk, please don't try and deny that there is meat.


This is the message I have given.

This is the Balance I have tried to show.


MILK is for Babes..

Strong meat is for the mature.



Here is a nice piece of steak, I will cut it a set it on a plate for you.

12 Beware, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief in departing from the living God; 13 but exhort one another daily, while it is called "Today," lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin. 14 For we have become partakers of Christ if we hold the beginning of our confidence steadfast to the end, Hebrews 3:12-14


If you are able to chew this and swallow, it will determine if you are mature or immature. Swallowing and allowing this to become a part of your life and understanding.


JLB

 

[JLB]

Jethro said -

May I ask, "What is it about the second death that you don't understand?"

It couldn't be any clearer!

We will see what his answer is to this very question that I asked him in my post.

Question:

... he who overcomes shall not be hurt by the second death."

Is the "he" in this phrase, a saved one or an unsaved one, when these words of warning were spoken to them.

JLB

 

[Gregg]

Thank you Brother, for that milk.

That is what someone needs to hear growing up in Christ.

It is milk.

And as long as you know its milk, then Ive done my job.

However, because there is milk, please don't try and deny that there is meat.


This is the message I have given.

This is the Balance I have tried to show.


MILK is for Babes..

Strong meat is for the mature.



Here is a nice piece of steak, I will cut it a set it on a plate for you.

12 Beware, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief in departing from the living God; 13 but exhort one another daily, while it is called "Today," lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin. 14 For we have become partakers of Christ if we hold the beginning of our confidence steadfast to the end, Hebrews 3:12-14


If you are able to chew this and swallow, it will determine if you are mature or immature. Swallowing and allowing this to become a part of your life and understanding.


JLB

Your interpretation of Heb 3:12-14 is not Scriptural. As I have already responded to it in other posts, you are fully aware of my position. When you are able to understand this Scripture, we can return to it and build upon it.

 

[JLB]

Your interpretation of Heb 3:12-14 is not Scriptural. As I have already responded to it in other posts, you are fully aware of my position. When you are able to understand this Scripture, we can return to it and build upon it.

When you can understand what the plain and clear scripture states, then you will be ready for solid food.


Please show me from this post, where I have interjected "my interpretation".

Here is a nice piece of steak, I will cut it a set it on a plate for you.

12 Beware, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief in departing from the living God; 13 but exhort one another daily, while it is called "Today," lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin. 14 For we have become partakers of Christ if we hold the beginning of our confidence steadfast to the end, Hebrews 3:12-14

If you are able to chew this and swallow, it will determine if you are mature or immature. Swallowing and allowing this to become a part of your life and understanding.

Brother I honestly and sincerely ask you to consider what was written here.

Please point out the phrase whereby I have "interpreted" this scripture.


JLB

 

[Gregg]

When you can understand what the plain and clear scripture states, then you will be ready for solid food.

Please show me from this post, where I have interjected "my interpretation".

Brother I honestly and sincerely ask you to consider what was written here.

Please point out the phrase whereby I have "interpreted" this scripture.


JLB

You are asking me to run in circles, to repeat again what has already been said; to get caught up in your endless cycle of misinterpretation. I am not willing to do that.

 

[JLB]

You are asking me to run in circles, to repeat again what has already been said; to get caught up in your endless cycle of misinterpretation. I am not willing to do that.

Please be reasonable.

Please stop saying my interpretation.

All I did was quote a scripture.

I did not interpret it, only quote.

You sent me milk, and I thanked you and agreed with you that is was milk.

12 Beware, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief in departing from the living God; 13 but exhort one another daily, while it is called "Today," lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin. 14 For we have become partakers of Christ if we hold the beginning of our confidence steadfast to the end, Hebrews 3:12-14


Is this scripture meat or milk?


JLB

 

[gr8grace3]

Heb 3:12-13~~12 Take care, brethren, that there not be in any one of you an evil, unbelieving heart that falls away from the living God.13But encourage one another day after day, as long as it is still called “Today,” so that none of you will be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin. 14 For we have become partakers of Christ, if we hold fast the beginning of our assurance firm until the end,

For we have become partners or associates of Christ IF we hold fast to the what? The/our assurance.

The very same people who try to teach that we have no assurance are in fact the ones who are being described in these very passages.

If we do not hold fast our assurance or confidence in Christ, we WILL be hardened by sin......because sin becomes our focus if we lose our assurance or confidence in Christ.

Still saved if they have been deceived into losing their confidence or assurance, Just no longer an associate or partner with Christs doctrine.

If one believes you can lose salvation, that person has lost their confidence and assurance. And are no longer partakers in Christs doctrines.

 

[Gregg]

Please show me from this post, where I have interjected "my interpretation".

Please point out the phrase whereby I have "interpreted" this scripture.

JLB

In your post #750, you said the following along with quoting Heb 3:12, 14: [I have bolded your interpretation]

'Are you under the impression that faith for Salvation is a one time event? Please go back and read the 700 posts that were posted here with all the scriptures that have been presented about... Continuing in the faith to the end...

12 Beware, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief in departing from the living God; For we have become partakers of Christ if we hold the beginning of our confidence steadfast to the end, Hebrews 3:12,14

What does: departing from the living God... Mean to you?'

 

[gr8grace3]

In your post #750, you said the following along with quoting Heb 3:12, 14: [I have bolded your interpretation]

'Are you under the impression that faith for Salvation is a one time event? Please go back and read the 700 posts that were posted here with all the scriptures that have been presented about... Continuing in the faith to the end...

12 Beware, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief in departing from the living God; For we have become partakers of Christ if we hold the beginning of our confidence steadfast to the end, Hebrews 3:12,14

What does: departing from the living God... Mean to you?'

reversionism - a heart/mind minus divine viewpoint/doctrine......someone who has lost their confidence or assurance in Christ.