MATT 2:34 "This generation will not pass away" ... What did Jesus mean?

[Stormcrow]

Along this line of thinking, then I have to ask a couple of questions...

1) Why was it recorded at all? It does not concern any of us?

Did you come to faith in Christ? If so, how so?

Obviously it was recorded because Christ died for all of us living 2,000 years later, too. I'd say if there were no other reason than this, that would be sufficient, don't you?

2) What instruction is there in the Bible for us today? None of it is addressed to us specifically.

I'd start with "don't let your freedom in Christ be a stumbling block to others." Seems like pretty timeless advice, don't you think?

I'm pretty sure there are other, equally important lessons we can all take from it, even though not a single word of it was written to us, huh?

Seems like it might require some actual thought and study, though. Seems like there are few people willing to do that anymore, as evinced by threads like these.

 

[John 8:32]

Did you come to faith in Christ? If so, how so?

Obviously it was recorded because Christ died for all of us living 2,000 years later, too. I'd say if there were no other reason than this, that would be sufficient, don't you?

I'd start with "don't let your freedom in Christ be a stumbling block to others." Seems like pretty timeless advice, don't you think?

I'm pretty sure there are other, equally important lessons we can all take from it, even though not a single word of it was written to us, huh?

Seems like it might require some actual thought and study, though. Seems like there are few people willing to do that anymore, as evinced by threads like these.

How do we differentiate? How do we know what was written to a previous culture and what should be taken to heart by us? I just cannot understand this line of thinking, it seems so subjective to me. Again, honest questions.

 

[Drew]

From a brief skim of some posts, and previous interactions with Stormcrow, I am generally inclined to agree with him.

I appeal to my betheren and sisteren: Please do not get caught up in the idea that the Bible has to be simple - that there are Sunday School-like "rules" that relieve us of the responsibility of doing the hard work of understanding it.

Much Biblical text is clearly "context-specific" - statements and teachings are delivered to particular people in particular settings. A lot of people are uncomfortable with this since, I suggest, they expect the material to be "all about us".

Well, I suggest that clearly is not the case. However, the fact that much material cannot be violently wrenched from its context and applied directly to us today does not mean that we cannot make some sort of connection between that material and our lives.

 

[Elijah674]

From a brief skim of some posts, and previous interactions with Stormcrow, I am generally inclined to agree with him.

I appeal to my betheren and sisteren: Please do not get caught up in the idea that the Bible has to be simple - that there are Sunday School-like "rules" that relieve us of the responsibility of doing the hard work of understanding it.

Much Biblical text is clearly "context-specific" - statements and teachings are delivered to particular people in particular settings. A lot of people are uncomfortable with this since, I suggest, they expect the material to be "all about us".

Well, I suggest that clearly is not the case. However, the fact that much material cannot be violently wrenched from its context and applied directly to us today does not mean that we cannot make some sort of connection between that material and our lives.

1 Cor. 10:11
[11] Now all these things happened unto them for ensamples: and they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world are come.
[12] Wherefore let him that thinketh he standeth take heed lest he fall.

'i' heard that Lord!:yes

 

[Stormcrow]

Please do not get caught up in the idea that the Bible has to be simple - that there are Sunday School-like "rules" that relieve us of the responsibility of doing the hard work of understanding it.

And therein lies the problem. Most people in the church have an understanding of the Bible that goes no further than what they learned in Sunday School (or Catechism) as a 12 year-old; taught by people whose own knowledge of it amounts to little more than that.

I've been intensely studying these issues daily for almost 5 years now. I don't spend a lot of time reading modern commentaries, but have spent a great deal of time in both the Old and New Testaments as well as reading extra-biblical authors of that period. My grasp of all the details isn't complete, but what I've learned is that context is king when it comes to exegesis.

And I'm not just talking about literary context. I'm talking about social context, historical context, cultural context: all play critical roles in understanding what Christ was telling His disciples and what lessons we can take from His words.

And there is no greater lesson to be taken from Christ's words in the Olivet Discourse than this: Jesus Christ is God incarnate and eternal, the same yesterday, today, and forever. If some here don't believe that, compare what He said in Matthew 21-25 and Revelation with what is written in II Chronicles 36, Deuteronomy 28-32, and Leviticus 26, to name a few.

People miss the point of Christ's prophecy against Jerusalem because they don't understand the point of Israel's calling in the first place!

Until people are willing to committ to serious Bible study with a mind committed to following the evidence wherever it leads, these arguments will persist.

 

[Sinthesis]

How do we differentiate? How do we know what was written to a previous culture and what should be taken to heart by us? I just cannot understand this line of thinking, it seems so subjective to me. Again, honest questions.

There is absolutely no reason why that which was written to a previous culture can't be taken to heart by us. We just have to remove ourselves from the center of attention.

Think about how selfish it is to believe particular things in the Bible are about our generation only. Does that mean that your great-grandmother could not take the Bible to heart? What about her great-grandmother? For thousands of years generations of different cultures have taken the Bible to heart. If it is really about our generation, then were all our ancestors just deceived?

 

[Stormcrow]

they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world are come.

Perfect example: "our" doesn't mean "us" living 2,000 years later. The "ends of the world" Paul is referencing here is not referring to the end of the world as we know it 2,000 years later!

Until this very simple principle of exegesis sinks in, people will continue to wrongly interpret the Bible.

Begin with the assumption that it's really not "all about you" and work from there.

 

[Stormcrow]

If it is really about our generation, then were all our ancestors just deceived?

Put another way, if it really is all about our generation, were the apostles deceived?

If so, who is the deceiver?

 

[Stormcrow]

snarky snarkysnarky

A couple of snarks got loose here but I managed to wrangle them back into the corral before they did too much damage.

Them snarks are always up to something. :o

 

[Sinthesis]

1 Cor. 10:11
[11] Now all these things happened unto them for ensamples: and they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world are come.
[12] Wherefore let him that thinketh he standeth take heed lest he fall.

'i' heard that Lord!:yes

Really?
Everyone who has believed that theirs was the last generation from the futurist perspective has been proved wrong. Yet I would like to believe that the writers of the new testament were not in error, for they believed they were those upon "whom the ends of the world are come". I've studied enough to now understand that the first century Jewish perspective on the world and end-times is not the same as that dreamed up by those who desire that their generation be the center of attention.

 

[Sinthesis]

Begin with the assumption that it's really not "all about you" and work from there.

Psa 25:9 - The meek will he guide in judgment: and the meek will he teach his way.​

 

[Elijah674]

Really?
Everyone who has believed that theirs was the last generation from the futurist perspective has been proved wrong. Yet I would like to believe that the writers of the new testament were not in error, for they believed they were those upon "whom the ends of the world are come". I've studied enough to now understand that the first century Jewish perspective on the world and end-times is not the same as that dreamed up by those who desire that their generation be the center of attention.

Lovingly, why not reread the verse for what is say's??

 

[Stormcrow]

why not reread the verse for what is say's??

Because what it says wasn't said to us.

 

[smaller]

Because what it says wasn't said to us.

What an absurd view.

Using that logic you can claim that Luke and Acts were only for Theophilus. edited

 

[Stormcrow]

What an absurd view.

Using that logic you can claim that Luke and Acts were only for Theophilus. But hey, you do it all the time.

Your link has nothing whatsoever to do with the question as to whom Jesus was addressing in the Olivet Discourse, or whom Paul was addressing when he wrote "...they were written for our instruction, upon whom the ends of the ages have come." 1 Corinthians 10:11 (NASB)

But, hey, making these passages all about today is what you do all the time.

 

[smaller]

Your link has nothing whatsoever to do with the question as to whom Jesus was addressing in the Olivet Discourse, or whom Paul was addressing when he wrote "...they were written for our instruction, upon whom the ends of the ages have come." 1 Corinthians 10:11 (NASB)

If you bothered to read the couple posts I put up on the subject matter they had zero to do 'with me. edited

Paul said this about scripture:

Acts 24:14
But this I confess unto thee, that after the way which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the law and in the prophets:

The entire notion that scripture is limited to those unto whom it was written is patently false. Matthew references O.T. scripture nearly 200 times. Paul references O.T. scripture over 100 times in Romans alone.

And yes, Paul's epistles are also what? SCRIPTURE.

2 Peter 3:
3 This second epistle, beloved, I now write unto you; in both which I stir up your pure minds by way of remembrance:
2 That ye may be mindful of the words which were spoken before by the holy prophets, and of the commandment of us the apostles of the Lord and Saviour:


s

 

[Stormcrow]

This is what many Futurists sound like to me:
Why isn't the Bible all about me!

Bless me, Lord! Help me, Lord! Get me out of debt, Lord! Give me a new car, Lord! Give me new clothes, Lord! I need a new house, Lord!

What's taking you so long to return for me, Lord! Why haven't you come back for me, Lord??? Show yourself to me, Lord! Reveal yourself to me, Lord!

edited

How do I know?

Because I used to be one and prayed just like this.

If the shoe fits...

 

[Stormcrow]

I missed this one.....reba

 

[smaller]

Do you have anything remotely useful to add to this discussion, or are you here just trolling for a fight?

Already stated. And of course counter views to yours are always in order. :yes

 

[Stormcrow]

Job security. reba.