MUSIC CAN BE EVIL

[PeterJens]

Well,.. you're definitely allowed to have your opinion but there was absolutely nothing wrong with that song I just posted so you have your opinion and Dan and I have ours and obviously he enjoys it as well otherwise he wouldn't have liked my post.

Infatuation, the development of young people to idolise young adults who appear on a glamorised stage and singing songs of strong emotions, leads to sexual indulgence and an emphasis on drug abuse and disregarding normal social boundaries.

It is ironic such bands even sing about this very behaviour as if it is something to aspire towards. So if I can sleep with lots of girls and have money to indulge carnal desires this is something to approve of?

 

[jasonc]

Skillet ,being local.they aren't usually, in,church worship,songs but I,have heard them .

You,confuse lyrics,styles of music .most old church music from Luther's day was old bar songs made into Gospel.

Lyrics are the key . not,the style or genre .

If any church is using concert like performances in stead of worship in a regular service they are wrong..

Its another if its just a concert of a local or national Christian band ,I have attended these. Yes these can go south ,but so can Christian schools ,nursery .which one also pays for .

 

[evenifigoalone]

StoveBolts is correct, Red, Skillet, Thousand Foot Krutch, etc are very soft compared to what most metalheads listen to. Me personally, I don't dig most of the super hard stuff. I'm not a real metalhead.

 

[evenifigoalone]

Infatuation, the development of young people to idolise young adults who appear on a glamorised stage and singing songs of strong emotions, leads to sexual indulgence and an emphasis on drug abuse and disregarding normal social boundaries.

It is ironic such bands even sing about this very behaviour as if it is something to aspire towards. So if I can sleep with lots of girls and have money to indulge carnal desires this is something to approve of?

That's the environment and culture they are in that allows for that, the music is not the cause. Art reflects the experiences of the artist, not the other way around. I can take a brush and some paint and use it to draw porn--it's not the fault of the brush and paints, it's mine for using them in that way.
And well I've heard plenty about how stardom in the secular music industry tends to lend itself to hedonism.

 

[PeterJens]

That's the environment and culture they are in that allows for that, the music is not the cause. Art reflects the experiences of the artist, not the other way around. I can take a brush and some paint and use it to draw porn--it's not the fault of the brush and paints, it's mine for using them in that way.
And well I've heard plenty about how stardom in the secular music industry tends to lend itself to hedonism.

I agree that music is about youthful celebration of life. The sad reality is often older people forget what it was like to be young and feel threatened to begin to engage. Equally christian groups can find the whole area too challenging based on maybe their own conservative and shy backgrounds.

This is where I find realistic assessments of how musical expression is made and why it is being made is important.

Is the form of some followings and concerts more like a religious exstatic worship of the band? Is the glory of the music to God or to the performer and their expression?

Music is powerful when it connects emotionally with ones heart.
It is not unrealistic to suggest some expressions can be praise to God while others can be sinful and evil. And this is what is being asked. Is there a form of expression and words and behaviour that is wrong? And the answer is yes, but to create a solid dividing line is probably not that simple.

I remember someone complaining about HillSong doing a scantily clad praise session as being not of the Lord, and probably it was culturally ok but not in a christian sense.

 

[jasonc]

I,would like to say I'm above the generational gap but I'm not.years from now ,will printed bibles be in use in,the chur h?i use my,phone .it's just free ,as a printed one with commentary is 80 bucks or more.

 

[Boaz]

I suppose the question is if you have personal bias against heavy metal or is it actually evil? I still believe that not all heavy metal is bad. There is some out there that is so awful. It is the lyrics and intention behind the song that makes the difference. I understand each person has their own likes and dislikes regarding music and that is okay. To some, country is displeasing and to others it's rock n roll or something else.

I find it interesting you mention kids here. Why only kids and not adults, I wonder?

Either way, we live in this world. We are called not to be of the world and not to follow the desires of the flesh, but to pursue the fruits of the Spirit and to please God. However, this does not mean we hide from the world or not be able to enjoy some things of this world.

You ask if there should be differences between what kids do in and out of church, but why? Should we hide the music we like outside of church? Or should it always be God honoring inside the church and out?

I will let you in on a little story. When I was younger, I had my own pop songs I liked. I had a tape of said music inside the car and would listen to it Monday-Saturday whenever we were in the car. Notice a day missing? Oh, Sunday mornings. On Sunday my music was shameful. My mother would say, "None of that music before church." And, "Don't talk about your favorite bands at church." I would lie when people asked me my favorite bands/songs. I was so confused how my parents let me listen to my music, even jokingly singing along and then the day church falls on it becomes shame. This is confusing to a child. So, where is the right in this scenario at all? Would it have been to disobey my parents and tell the truth? Would it be for my parents not to let me listen to music at all?

If we are doing something that we are hiding from our brothers and sisters in Christ, we need to evaluate ourselves carefully.

About the story you shared. Obviously it was confusing to you as a child but I have a couple of questions. We're your parents ashamed of listening to or liking the music? Is it something they were hiding from the members of the Church? Or was it just that Sunday was reserved for purely spiritual things. Was it a way of honoring the Lord on the Lord's day? I'm not trying to read anything into it, I don't know your parents and I wasn't there. Certainly your perception which is the one that counts, was that they were hiding it.
I'm just saying that the scenario I asked about, would be perfectly legitimate, as long as it was clearly explained to the children.
The other scenario that you presented would be a flaw in the church. Of being so legalistic and judgemental and controlling that the congregants are always feeling guilty just from being normal beings, and needing to hide their real selves, and always feeling less than the self righteous holier than thows.
About the music. I like rock and metal, and hard driving beats, screaming guitars and crying violins. But not in church. It is not worship. It is something else, and Christian lyrics don't change that. It is nice and I like it, but it is worship.

 

[Boaz]

I agree that music is about youthful celebration of life. The sad reality is often older people forget what it was like to be young and feel threatened to begin to engage. Equally christian groups can find the whole area too challenging based on maybe their own conservative and shy backgrounds.

This is where I find realistic assessments of how musical expression is made and why it is being made is important.

Is the form of some followings and concerts more like a religious exstatic worship of the band? Is the glory of the music to God or to the performer and their expression?

Music is powerful when it connects emotionally with ones heart.
It is not unrealistic to suggest some expressions can be praise to God while others can be sinful and evil. And this is what is being asked. Is there a form of expression and words and behaviour that is wrong? And the answer is yes, but to create a solid dividing line is probably not that simple.

I remember someone complaining about HillSong doing a scantily clad praise session as being not of the Lord, and probably it was culturally ok but not in a christian sense.

Are you n older person or are you a young person who presume to speak for us?
I doubt seriously if very many "older" people forget what it was like to be young. We generally are quite aware of the foolishness and arrogance of the young. How we also thought life was for and about the young, and condescended towards the fundy duddy, stuffy elderly. How it was us, the young, who would change the world and make it a more fun place.
And now we understand things better, we have treasure troves of experience, we realize church is meant to be at least one place where people worship God in spirit and in truth. Where He is approached with awe and respect, and where everything about Him, not us. Instead of a big party with a great band, where we the young people make a spectacle of themselves and a mockery of the Most High God.

 

[Luminous_Rose]

About the story you shared. Obviously it was confusing to you as a child but I have a couple of questions. We're your parents ashamed of listening to or liking the music? Is it something they were hiding from the members of the Church? Or was it just that Sunday was reserved for purely spiritual things. Was it a way of honoring the Lord on the Lord's day? I'm not trying to read anything into it, I don't know your parents and I wasn't there. Certainly your perception which is the one that counts, was that they were hiding it.
I'm just saying that the scenario I asked about, would be perfectly legitimate, as long as it was clearly explained to the children.
The other scenario that you presented would be a flaw in the church. Of being so legalistic and judgemental and controlling that the congregants are always feeling guilty just from being normal beings, and needing to hide their real selves, and always feeling less than the self righteous holier than thows.
About the music. I like rock and metal, and hard driving beats, screaming guitars and crying violins. But not in church. It is not worship. It is something else, and Christian lyrics don't change that. It is nice and I like it, but it is worship.

I wouldn't be able to answer that as I am not my parents. I don't know what exactly they were thinking.

I never said that rock or heavy metal sounding music was or wasn't worship. Worship music needs to praise God and should be an encouragement for us all to hear. It depends on how the music is used and presented as well as the intentions of it.

 

[stovebolts]

StoveBolts is correct, Red, Skillet, Thousand Foot Krutch, etc are very soft compared to what most metalheads listen to. Me personally, I don't dig most of the super hard stuff. I'm not a real metalhead.

I don't listen to at as often as i used to. Actually, i have little to no desire as i prefer more worship style music like Hillsong United. I'm actually learning how to play this song.

When i was younger, i was a troubled child and that drew me to heavy metal like Iron Maiden, Judas Priest, Ozzy etc. In the same way, I can relate to bands like Red and it helps me to reflect back to my troubled youth with a Christ centered perspective, so it's a healthy alternative for me. This was especially true five years ago when i lost my daughter.

Many teens have struggles, and young males have a lot of testosterone with no way to channel it. I believe Christian bands like Red play a crucial role in keeping Christian teens engaged in the faith instead of the anti Christian metal bands like Suicide Silence or Bring me the Horizon. Ironically, Red travels with these bands and for many Disturbed teens, Red is their first taste of Christianity and for them, it isn't fake.

 

[Boaz]

I wouldn't be able to answer that as I am not my parents. I don't know what exactly they were thinking.

I never said that rock or heavy metal sounding music was or wasn't worship. Worship music needs to praise God and should be an encouragement for us all to hear. It depends on how the music is used and presented as well as the intentions of it.

And I'm saying, it isn't worship music no matter what the words are. Some SOUNDS are not worshipful. A hard driving rock beat, screaming guitars, crying violins, a referee whistle, a child banging on pots and pans etc. But I'm not the lawmaker or the judge of other people's ideas, so it is no more than how I feel about it.
I wasn't really asking what your parents were thinking. Or criticizing your story or the effect it had on you. Just coming up with a different perspective, and not doing it very well. Sorry if I offended you. Wasn't my intent.

 

[evenifigoalone]

That's the environment and culture they are in that allows for that, the music is not the cause. Art reflects the experiences of the artist, not the other way around. I can take a brush and some paint and use it to draw porn--it's not the fault of the brush and paints, it's mine for using them in that way.
And well I've heard plenty about how stardom in the secular music industry tends to lend itself to hedonism.

I have to make this quick because I have to get back to my register in a second, but I would also suggest that high emotion is a symptom rather than a cause. As someone who has/had a mental illness, emotions naturally run high because my body/brain is literally wired that way. Mental illness, trauma, etc, all things associated with high emotions, tend to lead to chasing after intense experiences, chasing after that high, which can easily in addiction (drug, chemical, sexual, etc)

 

[evenifigoalone]

I agree that music is about youthful celebration of life. The sad reality is often older people forget what it was like to be young and feel threatened to begin to engage. Equally christian groups can find the whole area too challenging based on maybe their own conservative and shy backgrounds.

This is where I find realistic assessments of how musical expression is made and why it is being made is important.

Is the form of some followings and concerts more like a religious exstatic worship of the band? Is the glory of the music to God or to the performer and their expression?

Music is powerful when it connects emotionally with ones heart.
It is not unrealistic to suggest some expressions can be praise to God while others can be sinful and evil. And this is what is being asked. Is there a form of expression and words and behaviour that is wrong? And the answer is yes, but to create a solid dividing line is probably not that simple.

I remember someone complaining about HillSong doing a scantily clad praise session as being not of the Lord, and probably it was culturally ok but not in a christian sense.

I would put forward that something isn't evil or sinful simply because it isn't praise. To repeat what I said in an earlier post, I'm an artist--I draw a lot of things, most of them not specifically Christian. Some things are simply neutral.

I do believe you can worship God while listening to a metal song, as I definitely have. (Forever by Red is basically my testimony song.) Metal can be used to express emotion just like other music can, and it's not all negative. (Not that I think art that expresses negative emotion is inherently bad.)

 

[HeIsRisen2018]

Since BSB was brought up,.. I don't really know how any Christian would have to feel like they would have to hide the fact that they enjoy them. Especially since a of them (Brian Littrell and AJ Mclean is one as well those are the only two that I know for sure of but I believe that Nick Carter is one too although he hasn't made the smartest choices.) is a born again Christian and makes Christian music. They also have really catchy songs and the second song they wrote for the appreciation of their fans.

 

[Corn Pop]

I miss Chester, he gave up and went out, it's sad. The interviewer had no idea what he was talking about even laughed and thought he was crazy. Only someone who knows depression and anxiety can actually understand what he was talking about. The beast inside, that dirty creature, that other self, the one who constantly tries to drag you down.

My faith in Christ gets me though. That's what keeps me going.

I always get attacked by the other me in my head consistently trying to drag me down if im not focused on something and in my own head. Consistent spiritual battle.

He was not a coward, if anyone out there does suffer always remember there are people who do relate, do care, and there is support, just find it.

 

[Corn Pop]

Some people think they know what depression is but they don't, it's not like when someone close you you dies and your depressed and sad and grieving, and it's like "yea I know what it's like to be down", that is also a downer, but different.

Only those who know the dirty creature can relate. This is not general ups and downs in life. This is the dirty creature.