[_ Old Earth _] Old Earth Vs. Literal Reading of the Bible.

[VaultZero4Me]

Re: Old Earth and literal reading of the Bible.

Can you put forth a example from revelation?

Trumpets blowing, a multi-headed beast, and so on... ...these are images meant to represent other things

Did you read my last couple posts? Do you believe there was a global flood?

I'm sure there was a flood. Now, whether Noah collected every animal on earth into a boat, well, I'm open to hearing interpretations of that.

I think the real literal reading begins with Abraham.

It could be literal, but then again its hard to know whats going to happen in the future.

I think you contradict your self, If you Believe in the great flood and Noah but not what the Bible says about the Animals. why would we have animals today? how did they survive the flood, if Noah did not save them.

Did you watch the video?

1. Local flood. Otherwise you break more physical laws than we have time to list.

2. Revelations can be very well supported to be talking about the church of that current time period during Roman persecution, and not a future prophecy. Many, many Biblical scholars view it as a coded letter to discuss things of that time.

 

[John]

Re: Old Earth and literal reading of the Bible.

Noah's local flood.. sorry you fail.

 

[VaultZero4Me]

Re: Old Earth and literal reading of the Bible.

And another thing, why does the Bible talk about dinosaurs? 8-)

Where does the Bible talk about dinosaurs? If the Bible says man lived with dinosaurs, then it must be talking about another planet, because they certainly didn't on this one.

Maybe on Flinstone world, but not Earth.

Cite some scriptures please.

 

[VaultZero4Me]

Re: Old Earth and literal reading of the Bible.

Noah's local flood.. sorry you fail.

If irony was worth a penny, you'd be rich

 

[John]

Re: Old Earth and literal reading of the Bible.

I think. therefore we have nothing in common.

 

[VaultZero4Me]

Re: Old Earth and literal reading of the Bible.

I think. therefore we have nothing in common.

:-D

 

[John]

Re: Old Earth and literal reading of the Bible.

And another thing, why does the Bible talk about dinosaurs? 8-)

Where does the Bible talk about dinosaurs? If the Bible says man lived with dinosaurs, then it must be talking about another planet, because they certainly didn't on this one.

Maybe on Flinstone world, but not Earth.

Cite some scriptures please.

Actually the word dinosaur is a new one, invented around the 1840's. before that they called them dragons. And almost every culture today has reference to dragons, look at the Chinese for one example. The Bible mentions dinos 35 times,Mostly in the book of Job.

Actually there could be dragons (dinos) alive today, of course that's in the field of cryptozoology.

 

[VaultZero4Me]

Re: Old Earth and literal reading of the Bible.

Noah's local flood.. sorry you fail.

btw, the irony in that picture is that if the local flood looked like that, it would actually be LESS of a miracle than a world wide flood would be. Less physical laws are being broken in that picture than a global flood.

 

[John]

Re: Old Earth and literal reading of the Bible.

Noah's local flood.. sorry you fail.

btw, the irony in that picture is that if the local flood looked like that, it would actually be LESS of a miracle than a world wide flood would be. Less physical laws are being broken in that picture than a global flood.

What laws? earlier i posted a video of Dr. Walt browns theory and i think he explains it more or less exactly as it happened.

 

[VaultZero4Me]

Re: Old Earth and literal reading of the Bible.

And another thing, why does the Bible talk about dinosaurs? 8-)

Where does the Bible talk about dinosaurs? If the Bible says man lived with dinosaurs, then it must be talking about another planet, because they certainly didn't on this one.

Maybe on Flinstone world, but not Earth.

Cite some scriptures please.

Actually the word dinosaur is a new one, invented around the 1840's. before that they called them dragons. And almost every culture today has reference to dragons, look at the Chinese for one example. The Bible mentions dinos 35 times,Mostly in the book of Job.

Actually there could be dragons (dinos) alive today, of course that's in the field of cryptozoology.

1. there are a whole host of mystical creatures in every culture, from frogmen, to bigfoot, to mermaids, to loch ness, to batmen, etc. That doesn't mean they actually exist.

2. Please cite each verse and we will go through how modern animals actually fit the descriptions much better than linking them to dinos. Not to mention the fact that all physical evidence we have today supports that man NEVER lived with the dinosaurs.

 

[John]

Re: Old Earth and literal reading of the Bible.

Behemoth has the following attributes according to Job 40:15-24

* It “eats grass like an ox.â€Â
* It “moves his tail like a cedar.†(In Hebrew, this literally reads, “he lets hang his tail like a cedar.â€Â)
* Its “bones are like beams of bronze,
His ribs like bars of iron.â€Â
* “He is the first of the ways of God.â€Â
* “He lies under the lotus trees,
In a covert of reeds and marsh.â€Â


Leviathan has the following attributes according to Job chapter 41, Psalm 104:25,26 and Isaiah 27:1. This is only a partial listingâ€â€just enough to make the point.

* “No one is so fierce that he would dare stir him up.â€Â
* “Who can open the doors of his face, with his terrible teeth all around?â€Â
* “His rows of scales are his pride, shut up tightly as with a seal; one is so near another that no air can come between them; they are joined one to another, they stick together and cannot be parted.â€Â
* “His sneezings flash forth light, and his eyes are like the eyelids of the morning. Out of his mouth go burning lights; sparks of fire shoot out. Smoke goes out of his nostrils, as from a boiling pot and burning rushes. His breath kindles coals, and a flame goes out of his mouth.â€Â
* “Though the sword reaches him, it cannot avail; nor does spear, dart, or javelin. He regards iron as straw, and bronze as rotten wood. The arrow cannot make him flee; slingstones become like stubble to him. Darts are regarded as straw; he laughs at the threat of javelins.â€Â
* “On earth there is nothing like him, which is made without fear.â€Â
* Leviathan “played†in the “great and wide sea†(a paraphrase of Psalm 104 verses 25 and 26â€â€get the exact sense by reading them yourself).
* Leviathan is a “reptile [a] that is in the sea.†(Isaiah 27:1)

Source: http://www.clarifyingchristianity.com/dinos.shtml

1. there are a whole host of mystical creatures in every culture, from frogmen, to bigfoot, to mermaids, to loch ness, to batmen, etc. That doesn't mean they actually exist.

Bigfoot=ape thing
Loch ness = pleiosuar

:wink:

 

[Vic C.]

Whoa guys, keep the mud fights in the Science section where you are less likely to get "hosed off".... thanks.


Also onelove, I too agree that it was a little lengthy. Lets remember:

9 - Please keep posts down to a respectable length and provide source and/or links for your info. We want to respect copyrighted material. Plus, you stand a better chance of getting your post read if it contains a link with an excerpt from source that's relative to your point.

It sounds picky, but really is to the poster's benefit. 8-)

 

[John]

Re: Old Earth and literal reading of the Bible.

Do you believe catholic crusader that there are billions of years between verses one and two in Genesis?

Read up and watch this informative video. (don't worry its very short)
http://www.drdino.com/readNews.php?id=48


For thousands of years, nearly all Christians believed that the earth was about six thousand years old as revealed in God’s Word. But by the early 1800s the literal interpretation of Genesis fell under fire. Initially popularized by Scottish theologian Thomas Chalmers and later by the Scofield Reference Bible, the gap theory became a convenient method by which theologians compromise Holy Scripture with Darwin’s evolution theory.

The Bible teaches “In the beginning, God created the heaven and the earth†and continues by saying “the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep†(Genesis 1:1-2). Proponents of the gap theory suggest there is a gap between those two verses that accounts for Satan’s rebellion, dinosaurs, a geological record, and billions of years of evolution.

That “gap,†however, is nothing more than an attempt to harmonize God’s perfect Word with man’s imperfect thoughts. In fact, it is irreconcilable with the rest of Scripture. The words “without form, and void†in Genesis 1:2 come from the Hebrew phrase “tohu waw bohu,†which means “unformed and unfilled.†This indicates the earth was not yet formed or filled.

Further discrepancies between Scripture and the gap theory are seen when looking at the law God gave Moses. As God etched the Ten Commandments in stone, He said, “For in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is†(Exodus 20:11). God unmistakably says that everything was made in six days. This would include angels, heaven, earth, and mankindâ€â€everything.

The gap theory also disagrees with New Testament Scripture. The Bible is clear that “by man came death†(1 Corinthians 15:21-22) and “by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin†(Romans 5:12). These passages undeniably teach that the first sin came by Adam and that there was no death before sin. Threfore, it is incompatible to teach that a civilization existed before Adam, because it would place death before sinâ€â€a direct contradiction to Scripture.

 

[freeway]

Re: Old Earth and literal reading of the Bible.

Again my main thing is The Bible says 6 day.. that seem simple.. I don't see how you read 6 days and come up with millions...Agree we don't know how long it was before Adam ate of the fruit.. but when He did .... death enter into the world... if it entered then by my reading it was not there before.. so thing started to die... curse was upon the land .... great pain in child birth, work by the sweat of your brow.. and of course death..these things were not meant to happen. they are cause and effect.. so if death enter, then thats when the dino"s and everything else started dieing....including man...

yes parts of the bible has "metaphor" looking beast so to speak, but the bible then tells us what they mean... and I don't think we should start with a certain part of the bible and say OK we'll start here to take what it means literary..
is that enough mud on the window from me.... 8-) 8-)

 

[John]

Re: Old Earth and literal reading of the Bible.

“For in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is†(Exodus 20:11)

^ That pretty much sums it up.

 

[freeway]

Re: Old Earth and literal reading of the Bible.

Job 38
1Then the LORD answered Job out of the whirlwind, and said

This is God talking to Job.... its not a storm as we would see one... but a way of communication.

2Who is this that darkeneth counsel by words without knowledge?

God very well knows who this is, but he is putting the emphases on lowly state of man compared to God himself... like he is saying.... You have no knowledge compared to what I have..

3Gird up now thy loins like a man; for I will demand of thee, and answer thou me

to gird up mean to put up your robe and tuck in it under your belt... because you are going to be moving fast... or there is going to be some hard work ahead..

4Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth? declare, if thou hast understanding.

This is clear... where was Job when God made the whole creation...easy. not born.. but God knew that one day he would be of course, but at the time of eternity past Job was not....

5Who hath laid the measures thereof, if thou knowest? or who hath stretched the line upon it?

same here God is just confirming that He and He alone made the heaven and earth and everything in it...

6Whereupon are the foundations thereof fastened? or who laid the corner stone thereof

;
here God is asking Job.. do you know how the foundation were layed... or who build, created it all

7When the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for joy?

this is most likely a reference to angels.. the morning star we know was a beautiful angel, before his fall/// now we know him as Satan,, and the sons of God... also angels but much debate has been spoken and written over this... son of God sleeping with women.. angels, or just mighty men... but not man in "spirit" either..

In verse 7 we are the sons of God,we were with Him when He created the earth,at this time we were not in flesh,it is only because of Satan that we are in the flesh now.

No, that does not say we where in heaven, waiting for a body to be born to occupy. "lack of a better word".. ""in the flesh now"".. Adam and eve the parents of the human race, God created them and placed them in the garden.... and here we are now... so I don't see where you see that we where already in heaven with God... if so... I want to go home.. this place stinks.... 8-) 8-)

God Bless........................freeway01

 

[John]

Re: Old Earth and literal reading of the Bible.

I am still waiting for a reason why a literal reading of the Bible with in reason (Jesus is not a literal wooden door) is a harmful thing to do.

 

[VaultZero4Me]

Re: Old Earth and literal reading of the Bible.

* It “eats grass like an ox.â€Â
* It “moves his tail like a cedar.†(In Hebrew, this literally reads, “he lets hang his tail like a cedar.â€Â)
* Its “bones are like beams of bronze,
His ribs like bars of iron.â€Â
* “He is the first of the ways of God.â€Â
* “He lies under the lotus trees,
In a covert of reeds and marsh.â€Â

Ok did some research on this. I had remember some teacher in my private school trying to tell us that this was a dinosaur but I never really gave it much thought then since I knew better.

1. Judaic belief regards this animal as a mythical being. Jewish teachings regarding the behemoth is that this is a singular being that will do battle at the end of the world, and not that it is an actual species that existed. (much like the certain Christian sect's teachings on the beasts in revelations)
2. What dinosaur do you say this matches? If its a sauropod like many YEC's say, there would be more problems that saying that it referred to a hippo.
3. Mainstream belief outside of the mythical interpretation is that this is a hippo. The only problem with that is "moves his tail like a cedar". One solution to that is interpret that to be a genital reference (and there is some Hebrew contextual support for that).

Leviathan

1. Same here with traditional Judaic teachings . In fact some teachings put it at 300 miles long, which of course wouldn't fit any dino ;)
2. It fits the description of a croc, except for the breathing fire which no dino is known to have or even considered to have. Care to discuss the anatomy of a creature capable of breathing fire?

and btw, Loch Ness has been searched many many times with sonar, underwater cameras, dive teams, and nothing found. In fact I don't think Loch Ness could support a family of creatures that size. Also, Plesiosaurs are believed to have been cold blooded. Loch Ness is very cold and would not support a cold blooded animal. And Plesiosaur's necks are built to have the swan like movement people cite ol' Nessie as having. It's most likely that all of the reports are exaggerated, hoaxes, or optical illusions.

 

[John]

Re: Old Earth and literal reading of the Bible.

Yes God meant that "like a cedar" meant like a giant penis. That's almost as good as the theory that the dinos went extinct because of their own farts. :smt120

 

[VaultZero4Me]

Re: Old Earth and literal reading of the Bible.

Yes God meant that "like a cedar" meant like a giant penis. That's almost as good as the theory that the dinos went extinct because of their own farts. :smt120

That's your only response?