OSAS is biblical truth.

[Jethro Bodine]

More jumbo jumbo!

I have not mentioned the Kingdom of Heaven in this post. Those are you words to distract the subject matter of my post.

Kinda like a used car salesman would do to customer asking for the Carfax.

I want you to know, my mumbo Jumbo pays attention to actual words use and how they would have heard it. I am better than those salesmen, give me some credit. You need to understand that Kingdom of God and Kingdom of Heaven are Spelled different!!!!!

Cat is spelled different than Dog. I suppose since they both have fur, ears and tail you don't call them cat or dogs, but animals.

Kingdom of God = Kingdom of heaven

Kingdom of heaven = Kingdom of God

same dealio

 

[Jethro Bodine]

My salvation is in His Cross He did it I cant .... Yet my salvation is on going. How far away from God does one need to turn to be 'away' ? I kinda grew up being Christian in my teens I ran away from all I was taught looking back i can clearly see His hand His staff reaching for this lamb.... Could i have gone my own way ?

Pro_14:12 There is a way which seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death.

Pro_16:25 There is a way that seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death.

And that is the question for me.

Where does one cross the line with God and finally alienate him/herself from the grace of God that saved them? Is that even possible?

It's not in question at all to me what happens if you cross that line...just whether or not that is, based on my own experience, really possible.

 

[George Muller]

So OSAS then is not in effect.

If a person turns from Christ for whatever reason, it means they have the will and desire to do so, and therefore they no longer believe in His work on the cross.

Their salvation is no longer intact.

JLB

OSAS is true for those who trust in Grace, but not true for those who trust in the flesh and works of the flesh, by the law, as Paul said I could not speak to you as spiritual but as to carnal. The truth of OSAS is for those who "believe" not for those who "doubt".
The law is not of faith.

Maybe this was missed? But I have made the truth known and very clear to those who desire to hear the truth? Many have "itching ears" that seek to hear the flesh justified, but the truth will never do that.

Non-OSAS is not about the works of the flesh replacing faith in Christ. But, as I've said repeatedly, this is what is automatically heard by those who believe in the hyper-grace of OSAS.

It's about the 'work' of believing, which Paul CONTRASTS with the fleshly effort of the law, and how that believing must continue to the end to have the sure promise of God's salvation.

Well it always seems those who have this "non-OSAS" positions are ALWAYS legalist and in one way or another trust in their own flesh "free-will" etc... All who know the true gospel of grace, understand that in His Grace, we are forever secure. So this (the law) is always the issue no matter how some deny their legalism, its clear to those who understand the truth of the gospel.

 

[George Muller]

My salvation is in His Cross He did it I cant .... Yet my salvation is on going. How far away from God does one need to turn to be 'away' ? I kinda grew up being Christian in my teens I ran away from all I was taught looking back i can clearly see His hand His staff reaching for this lamb.... Could i have gone my own way ?

Pro_14:12 There is a way which seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death.

Pro_16:25 There is a way that seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death.

And that is the question for me.

Where does one cross the line with God and finally alienate him/herself from the grace of God that saved them? Is that even possible?

It's not in question at all to me what happens if you cross that line...just whether or not that is, based on my own experience, really possible.

Jethro, you know how many times you have missed the mark? You also know that Christ has never rejected or forsaken you in your errors. To judge others and condemn them by a standard that "YOU" fail at, is not the truth of Christ in your heart. Some issues are only known between a man and God, and that is how God intended the gospel to work. FOR I WILL BE THEIR GOD AND THEY SHALL BE MY PEOPLE, THEY SHALL NOT NEED EVERY MAN TEACH THEM SAYING KNOW THE LORD, FOR ALL SHALL KNOW ME FROM THE LEAST TO THE GREATEST. This Covenant we have is not in the "letter" not written down by which to judge others, but it is a Covenant in each mans heart. That's the deal and the deal breaker, there is no other.

 

[George Muller]

God's promise is not in doubt in non-OSAS.

This does not even make sense?

 

[jasoncran]

im not an eternal security type. let us refrain from sterotypes. im not a legalist. I know what that is like. I was raised a Jehovah's witness.

 

[reba]

Jethro, you know how many times you have missed the mark? You also know that Christ has never rejected or forsaken you in your errors. To judge others and condemn them by a standard that "YOU" fail at, is not the truth of Christ in your heart. Some issues are only known between a man and God, and that is how God intended the gospel to work. FOR I WILL BE THEIR GOD AND THEY SHALL BE MY PEOPLE, THEY SHALL NOT NEED EVERY MAN TEACH THEM SAYING KNOW THE LORD, FOR ALL SHALL KNOW ME FROM THE LEAST TO THE GREATEST. This Covenant we have is not in the "letter" not written down by which to judge others, but it is a Covenant in each mans heart. That's the deal and the deal breaker, there is no other.

This reads to me as a judgment

 

[Jethro Bodine]

My salvation is in His Cross He did it I cant .... Yet my salvation is on going. How far away from God does one need to turn to be 'away' ? I kinda grew up being Christian in my teens I ran away from all I was taught looking back i can clearly see His hand His staff reaching for this lamb.... Could i have gone my own way ?

Pro_14:12 There is a way which seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death.

Pro_16:25 There is a way that seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death.

And that is the question for me.

Where does one cross the line with God and finally alienate him/herself from the grace of God that saved them? Is that even possible?

It's not in question at all to me what happens if you cross that line...just whether or not that is, based on my own experience, really possible.

Jethro, you know how many times you have missed the mark? You also know that Christ has never rejected or forsaken you in your errors.

You haven't been listening. This isn't about growing up into Christ with all it's troubles and tribulations all the while trusting in his blood. This is about walking away from the forgiveness of God. I, personally, have never done that. But apparently one can do that because the Bible warns the churches to not do that.

To judge others and condemn them by a standard that "YOU" fail at, is not the truth of Christ in your heart.

What are you talking about? I have never walked away from Christ. How have I failed at what the Bible, not me, warns about doing?

Some issues are only known between a man and God, and that is how God intended the gospel to work. FOR I WILL BE THEIR GOD AND THEY SHALL BE MY PEOPLE, THEY SHALL NOT NEED EVERY MAN TEACH THEM SAYING KNOW THE LORD, FOR ALL SHALL KNOW ME FROM THE LEAST TO THE GREATEST. This Covenant we have is not in the "letter" not written down by which to judge others, but it is a Covenant in each mans heart. That's the deal and the deal breaker, there is no other.

You have read the NT letters and their warnings to believers to not walk away from their trust in Christ, right?

Somehow it's 'judging' others to tell others what those letters contain? Really?

 

[Jethro Bodine]

God's promise is not in doubt in non-OSAS.

This does not even make sense?

God's promises are iron clad. It's impossible for God to be found a liar in regard to the promise of salvation.

But the promise of God's salvation is conditioned on believing. You know this.

The Bible is also very clear that you have to continue in that believing to the very end to retain the sure, steadfast, unmovable, unshakeable promise of God's salvation that believing secures. Even you know, for example, that if one turns away from believing in Christ to believing in one's own fleshly goodness that you lose the sureness of God's promise of salvation.

So you see I'm being very sensible.

 

[Brother Mike]

Kingdom of God = Kingdom of heaven

Kingdom of heaven = Kingdom of God

same dealio

check it out brother. One is a place. Heaven is a Male noun. God is a male noun also but a person. Kingdom denotes standing being a female noun so it can't convey itself without the article.

Thy Kingdom Come thy will be done on earth as it is in Heaven........................... Matt 6 was about the coming of the Kingdom of God, As it is in Heaven which is how Heaven operates under God's complete authority. So, Heaven can't be coming here on earth, it was the Kingdom of God coming here on earth, or God's rule and way of doing things here for us through Jesus.

Give it a look over if you have spare time and check it out.

God bless.

Mike.

 

[George Muller]

You haven't been listening. This isn't about growing up into Christ with all it's troubles and tribulations all the while trusting in his blood. This is about walking away from the forgiveness of God. I, personally, have never done that. But apparently one can do that because the Bible warns the churches to not do that.

Where is the warning that does not relate to turning back to the law? That's the turning away from the forgiveness of God, Is self-righteousness, not trusting and walking in His Grace?

 

[George Muller]

Jethro, you know how many times you have missed the mark? You also know that Christ has never rejected or forsaken you in your errors. To judge others and condemn them by a standard that "YOU" fail at, is not the truth of Christ in your heart. Some issues are only known between a man and God, and that is how God intended the gospel to work. FOR I WILL BE THEIR GOD AND THEY SHALL BE MY PEOPLE, THEY SHALL NOT NEED EVERY MAN TEACH THEM SAYING KNOW THE LORD, FOR ALL SHALL KNOW ME FROM THE LEAST TO THE GREATEST. This Covenant we have is not in the "letter" not written down by which to judge others, but it is a Covenant in each mans heart. That's the deal and the deal breaker, there is no other.

This reads to me as a judgment

Well if reminding another Christian of the forgiveness we all need is "judgment" ? I think we are seeing the point of this post in a very different way, and not trying to see the intention or the truth of its purpose.

 

[reba]

Kingdom of God = Kingdom of heaven

Kingdom of heaven = Kingdom of God

same dealio

check it out brother. One is a place. Heaven is a Male noun. God is a male noun also but a person. Kingdom denotes standing being a female noun so it can't convey itself without the article.

Thy Kingdom Come thy will be done on earth as it is in Heaven........................... Matt 6 was about the coming of the Kingdom of God, As it is in Heaven which is how Heaven operates under God's complete authority. So, Heaven can't be coming here on earth, it was the Kingdom of God coming here on earth, or God's rule and way of doing things here for us through Jesus.

Give it a look over if you have spare time and check it out.

God bless.

Mike.

Hey guys this needs its own thread moderator says lets stay on topic....

 

[Jethro Bodine]

You haven't been listening. This isn't about growing up into Christ with all it's troubles and tribulations all the while trusting in his blood. This is about walking away from the forgiveness of God. I, personally, have never done that. But apparently one can do that because the Bible warns the churches to not do that.

WHERE IS THIS WARNING THAT DOES NOT RELATE TO TURNING BACK TO THE LAW? that's THE TURNING AWAY FROM THE FORGIVNESS OF GOD, IS SELF-RIGHTEOUSNESS, NOT TRUSTING AND WALKING IN HIS GRACE.

Explain this difference between trusting in the law instead of Christ, and trusting in nothing instead of Christ?

The end is the same--you forfeit the grace of salvation.

But here is where we see a believer turning away but who did not turn back to law...

"The one on whom seed was sown on the rocky places, this is the man who hears the word and immediately receives it with joy; 21 yet he has no firm root in himself, but is only temporary, and when affliction or persecution arises because of the word, immediately he falls away." (Matthew 13:20-21 NASB)

"Those on the rocky soil are those who, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no firm root; they believe for a while, and in time of temptation fall away." (Luke 8:13 NASB)

This also bolsters what I've been saying about faith, and OSAS.

It isn't that the faith that fails in the OSAS argument was never able to save to begin with. It was not able to persevere...that is why it is not able to save.

 

[George Muller]

But the promise of God's salvation is conditioned on believing. You know this.

Who is it that believes but those who believe in ETERNAL SALVATION? Who is in doubt ,but those who doubt eternal salvation. So for one who argues against the faith of others (who are confident and steadfast in eternal salvation) to suggest their unbelief is needed is just complete error. What is being suggested is that faith is not faith, but doubt is faith.

 

[George Muller]

You haven't been listening. This isn't about growing up into Christ with all it's troubles and tribulations all the while trusting in his blood. This is about walking away from the forgiveness of God. I, personally, have never done that. But apparently one can do that because the Bible warns the churches to not do that.

WHERE IS THIS WARNING THAT DOES NOT RELATE TO TURNING BACK TO THE LAW? that's THE TURNING AWAY FROM THE FORGIVNESS OF GOD, IS SELF-RIGHTEOUSNESS, NOT TRUSTING AND WALKING IN HIS GRACE.

Explain this difference between trusting in the law instead of Christ, and trusting in nothing instead of Christ?

The end is the same--you forfeit the grace of salvation.

But here is where we see a believer turning away but who did not turn back to law...

"The one on whom seed was sown on the rocky places, this is the man who hears the word and immediately receives it with joy; 21 yet he has no firm root in himself, but is only temporary, and when affliction or persecution arises because of the word, immediately he falls away." (Matthew 13:20-21 NASB)

"Those on the rocky soil are those who, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no firm root; they believe for a while, and in time of temptation fall away." (Luke 8:13 NASB)

This also bolsters what I've been saying about faith, and OSAS.

It isn't that the faith that fails in the OSAS argument was never able to save to begin with. It was not able to persevere...that is why it is not able to save.

What is "rocky" ground? But that which is made hard by the hypocricy of supposed law-keeping.
The issue with turning away from faith IS ALWAYS THE LAW. "FOR THE LAW IS NOT OF FAITH"

 

[reba]

time to cool off reopen after a bit of sweeping

 

[reba]

reopened lets all remember



2.4: No Trolling. Do not make an inflammatory remark just to get a response. Address issues not personalities. Respect where people are in their spiritual walk, and respect all others in general. Respect where others are in their spiritual walk, do not disrupt the flow of discussion or act in a way that affects others negatively including when debating doctrinal issues, in the defense of the Christian faith, and in offering unwelcome spiritual advice.
Not necessarily directed at the last poster.

 

[JLB]

im not an eternal security type. let us refrain from sterotypes. im not a legalist. I know what that is like. I was raised a Jehovah's witness.

I always thought you came from a Jewish back ground.

Praise God He delivered you from JW.

Amen.


JLB

 

[Codger]

Revelation 3:1-6 (NIV2011)
1 “To the angel of the church in Sardis write: These are the words of him who holds the seven spirits of God and the seven stars. I know your deeds; you have a reputation of being alive, but you are dead.
2 Wake up! Strengthen what remains and is about to die, for I have found your deeds unfinished in the sight of my God.
3 Remember, therefore, what you have received and heard; hold it fast, and repent. But if you do not wake up, I will come like a thief, and you will not know at what time I will come to you.
4 Yet you have a few people in Sardis who have not soiled their clothes. They will walk with me, dressed in white, for they are worthy.
5 The one who is victorious will, like them, be dressed in white. I will never blot out the name of that person from the book of life, but will acknowledge that name before my Father and his angels.
6 Whoever has ears, let them hear what the Spirit says to the churches.

How can someones name be blotted out if it was never there in the first place?