Perdition's Population Clock

[Beetow]

.
Shadows with no substance, in the shape of men;
round and down and sideways they go.
Adrift without direction, eyes that hold despair
then as one they sigh and they moan:

Help us someone, let us out of here.
Living here so long undisturbed,
dreaming of the time we were free
so many years ago
before the time when we first heard:
Welcome to the Home by the Sea

Sit down . . Sit down
Cause you won't get away,
no with us you will stay
for the rest of your days.
So sit down as we relive our lives in what we tell you.
Let us relive our lives in what we tell you.

Home By The Sea
Genesis 1983, Phil Collins, Tony Banks, Mike Rutherford

The lyrics of that song are so sad because it depicts how the only thing people have
to do down in the netherworld to help pass the time is tell each other about their
previous lives. There is, of course, nothing to tell about their lives by the sea since
the colloquialism "get a life" is a non sequitur in that place. Nobody has a life down
there; nor any hope of getting one.

POP CLOCK UPDATE: 10 days have transpired since beginning the thread. If the figures
in post No.1 are within reason, then something like 767,520 new arrivals have
checked into the fiery sector of Hades since Dec 15, 2024.
_

 

[Beetow]

.
● Rev 21:3-4 . . Now the dwelling of God is with men, and he will live with them.
They will be his people, and God himself will be with them and be their God. He will
wipe every tear from their eyes. There will be no more death or mourning or crying
or pain, for the old order of things has passed away.

Much of the the tears, the mourning, the crying, and the pain will most certainly be
related to the great white throne event depicted at Rev 20:11-15, which will likely
be a public spectacle.

In other words: people will have to watch as friends, associates, and loved ones are
literally pale with terror, lips trembling, mouths too dry to speak, shrieking,
sobbing, screaming, weeping, yelping, and bellowing like wounded dogs as their
eyes dart about in sheer white-knuckled panic, desperately looking for someone,
anyone, to come to their aid as powerful celestial beings drag them off to death
akin to a foundry worker falling into a kettle of molten iron.

Paul said the greatest of all gifts is love (1Cor 13:13). But let me tell you
something: Love is inconvenient. Sensitive folk cannot sit through a scene like the
one described above and not be moved by it. The effect will be so overwhelming
that nothing less than the power of God will suffice to get them over it.
_

 

[Beetow]

.
I sometimes wish there were tour buses to Hell so people could see what's in store
for them down there should they end up on the wrong side of things in the afterlife.

People in Hell will never again smell a sea breeze, sit in the shade of a tree, take
deep breaths of mountain-fresh air, play at sports, hear a bird chirp, see a sunset,
watch a lunar eclipse, jog in the park, strum a guitar, enjoy a Christmas dinner with
loved ones; nor make little pigs of themselves gobbling barbecued spare ribs and
corn on the 4th of July.

Sports and recreation are gone: no more World Series, no more Super Bowl, no
more Olympics, no more Las Vegas, no more Indian casinos, no more lottery, no
more Lego World, no more Sea World, no more NASCAR, no more golf, no more
surfing, et al.

No baths, no showers, no sleep, no iPhones, TV, no radio, no iPods, no computers, no
social media and no internet, no clean sheets, no breakfast, no lunch, and no dinner.
No snacks, no gum, no candy, no flowers, no parks, no rivers, no snow, no seasons,
no picnics, no malls, no fast food, no trades, no careers, no trendy fashions, no jewelry,
no cosmetics, no concerts, no operas, and no hobbies; absolutely nothing of this world
that brings people the pleasures and the satisfactions of just being alive. Mental atrophy
due to a perpetual lack of something stimulating to help pass the time is likely a common
problem down there.

* To my knowledge no pets are allowed in the Hell and no flowers or vegetation of
any kind. The absence of birds, fish, and animals of course precludes the citizens of
hell ever again spending a day at the zoo. The one advantage of the lack of pets
and vegetation in Hell is the absence of fleas, mosquitoes, and allergies. I suppose
you could say that's at least one good thing about it. There's a bright side to
everything I guess; even to that place.
_

 

[Beetow]

.
Death often catches people unprepared. We all know we're going to eventually die
some day, but we don't usually get up in the morning expecting today is that day.

169,752 killed, and 127,294 listed as missing, in more than eleven countries by the
tsunami of 2004, were taken by surprise, and given no warning it was to be their
last day on earth.

The 2,829 people who perished in a terrorist attack on the World Trade Center on
September 11, 2001, and the 189 who died in the Pentagon, didn't go in to work
expecting their lives to end before lunch that day.

Tuesday, Jan 12, 2010, a 7.0 earthquake struck Port au Prince Haiti right out of the
blue subsequently causing the loss of more than 200,000 lives. A similar act of
nature on March 11, 2011, left 25,000 dead and/or missing in Japan.

A rain-saturated hillside above the Stillaguamish River on the outskirts of the rural
town of Oso in the State of Washington gave way March 22, 2014 leaving behind a
current death toll of 41 souls. The landslide happened to suddenly and so rapidly
that nobody saw it coming and/or had the slightest chance of getting out of the
way. Listed among the dead and missing was a four-month old infant.

On a November morning in 1998, Alan Pakula climbed into his Volvo station wagon
and began the 100-mile drive from Manhattan to his Long Island house. The
acclaimed movie director of Sophie's Choice, All The President's Men, and The
Pelican Brief, had made that trip countless times with no incident.

As the 70 year-old Pakula neared exit 49 on the Long Island Expressway just before
noon, the tires of a vehicle ahead of him flipped a 7-foot piece of steel rod into the
air. Within seconds, the rod shot through Pakula's windshield, smashing into his
forehead, killing him almost instantly.

June 12, 2023 actor Treat Williams was killed on his motorcycle after colliding with
a car approaching in the opposite lane made an unexpected left turn practically
right over him. Ten seconds earlier and the car would've missed him, and ten
seconds later it would've missed him too. But no, Treat and the car met at just the
right moment to end his life: he never saw it coming.

Sudden death and freak incidents like those listed above can happen to anybody in
the form of a stray bullet from a drive-by, an act of nature, gas explosion, choking
on a piece of meat, electrocution, a drunk driver, a fall in the bath tub; bricks
dropped from an overpass, or any number of out-of-the-blue surprises like the big
truck that mowed down a crowd of people celebrating Bastille Day in France July
14, 2016

People need to start thinking about the afterlife now, while they have the chance;
rather than risk being caught off guard by sudden death where there will be no time
to think; and they find themselves suddenly thrust into the afterlife a lot sooner
than they ever expected when a car accident, train wreck, plane crash, crime, heart
attack, or stroke puts an abrupt end to whatever they had planned for that day.

● Ecc 9:10-12 . . For the time of mischance comes to all. And a man cannot even
know his time. As fishes are enmeshed in a fatal net, and as birds are trapped in a
snare, so men are caught at the time of calamity, when it comes upon them
without warning.
_

 

[Beetow]

.
Judas goats are trained for use in slaughterhouses and herd control. In stockyards,
they lead sheep to slaughter; and are also used to lead other animals to specific
pens and on to trucks. The term is a reference to the biblical traitor Judas Iscariot.

The phrase has also been used to describe goats utilized to locate feral goats
targeted for eradication. They're usually outfitted with a transmitter, painted in red
and then released. The goats then locate the remaining herds of feral goats,
allowing hunters with tracking devices to find and exterminate them. The red paint
marks the goat with the transmitter so the hunters know which one not to shoot.

You know what can be even worse than going to Hell? Your own children following
you there: and they trusted you.

Here's a sort of cute story I heard once. I don't know if it's true but I guess it sure
is pertinent.

A thirsty farmer went out to his barn in the dead of night after a snowfall to sneak a
pull from a hidden liquor jug. Just as he got to the barn door he heard something
behind him. Turning, the farmer recognized his young son coming towards him. In
amazement he asked the little guy how he ever managed to find his way out to the
barn in the dark. His son replied: It was easy; I walked in your footsteps.

Can you just imagine the anguish that parents feel in the netherworld knowing their
children are right behind them following in their ideological footsteps? How do those
parents cope with something like that on their conscience?

● Luke 16:27-29 . . Then he said: I beg you therefore, father [Abraham] that you
would send [Lazarus] to my father's house, for I have five brothers, that he may
testify to them, lest they also come to this place of torment.

That poor man had no way to contact his surviving kin and let them know his
whereabouts; but his biggest fear was that he knew them all well enough to know
that all five were coming down where he was-- there was nothing he could do to
prevent it. It was like the survivors of the Titanic watching their loved ones go to
Davy Jones and helpless to stop it.

For some families, the only thing they have to look forward to in the afterlife is a
sad reunion in fire and despair.
_

 

[Beetow]

.
There are two Hells revealed in the new testament-- one is called haides (hah'
dace) e.g. Luke 16:23-24, and the other is called geena (gheh' en-nah) e.g. Luke
12:5.

Not everyone in haides is suffering because the word simply indicates the
netherworld where everyone was sent prior to Christ's resurrection-- both the good
and the bad, the young and the old. Though Luke 16:23-24 describes haides as a
place of conscious suffering in heat and dehydration; that's only half of haides.
According to Luke 16:25, Luke 23:43, and Acts 2:29-32, the other half of haides is
quite pleasant.

The conditions in geena are somewhat worse than those of haides. Nobody is
sentenced to die in haides whereas according to Mtt 10:28, people are sent to
geena for the express purpose of execution.

Geena likely corresponds to the second death depicted at Rev 20:10-15, which is
an impound consisting of brimstone, i.e. flaming sulfur. The vapors emitted by
flaming sulfur are very toxic; so that the reservoir will suffice for both a gas
chamber and a crematorium where the corpses of the dead will be preserved intact
as perpetual nourishment for a curious species of fire-proof worm as per Isa 66:23
24 and Mark 9:47-48.

Matt 10:28 reveals another rather grim detail. Geena is capable of destroying
bodies and souls; however, its fire isn't formulated to destroy spirits. I know that's
true because the Devil is a spirit, and according to Rev 20:10 he will suffer in
geena; but not die there. What I'm saying is: though people's bodies and souls will
die in the reservoir, they will continue to exist because humans consist of not just
body and soul, but also spirit (1Ths 5:23, Heb 4:12). In point of fact, 1Pet 3:18-20
speaks of deceased antediluvians existing in the afterlife as spirits.

POP CLOCK UPDATE: 15 days have transpired since beginning the thread. If the
figures in post No.1 are within reason, then something like 1,151,280 new arrivals
have checked into the fiery sector of Hades since Dec 15, 2024.
_

 

[Beetow]

.
The final Hell is the last word in criminal justice. But before people are sent there,
they must first answer for themselves at the great white throne event depicted at
Rev 20:11-15.

The process is very thorough; even every thoughtless word that men speak will be
weighed in the balances; not just their serious words. (Matt 12:36-37)

People will even be confronted with all the things they did in private, in the dark,
and behind closed doors when they thought no one was looking.

● Heb 4:12-13 . . For the word of God is living and active. Sharper than any double
edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it
judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart. Nothing in all creation is hidden
from God's sight. Everything is uncovered and laid bare before the eyes of him to
whom we must give account.
_

 

[for_his_glory]

Revelation 20:11-15

John sees in his vision a great white throne and Him that sits in righteous judgment. The he is Christ Jesus in whom God has committed all judgment unto Him, Daniel 2:31-35; John 5:21-27, and now sits on His own throne beside the throne of God. Also at this time the heaven and earth will pass away as there is no place found of them anymore, Matthew 24:35.

All people from every nation that have been raised from the dead are gathered before the throne of God and His Son Christ Jesus seated on His throne of glory as He separates the sheep from the goats, Matthew 25:31-46. The books are opened with one of them being the Lamb's book of life where all the saints of God have their names written as they have part of the resurrection and already judged and receive eternal life on such the second death hath no power, Rev 20:6; 1 Corinthians 15:54-57.

The other book is opened being the book of damnation where the enemies of God that were killed while trying to destroy the camp of the saints are now joined with those enemies of Christ that were also raised from their graves in the resurrection and are reserved unto the day of judgment, 2 Peter 2:9. They are now condemned, judged and will be cast into the lake of fire. And death (Spiritually dead) and hell (the grave) are cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

Reference for hell:
Strong's Exhaustive Concordance: Hell
Hebrew # 7585 Sheol, Hades, or the world of the dead, grave, hell, pit
Greek # 86 place of departed souls, grave, hell

In John's vision he sees thrones and those who sat upon them were those who were beheaded for their witness and testimony of Christ as they did not take the mark of the beast, Rev 13:11-18. They died a martyr's death and their souls now joined with those souls who also died a martyr's death and seen of John’s vision waiting under the altar to be avenged, Rev 6:9-11.

Now the time of fulfillment will have come as judgment on those who have been persecuted to death for their witness of Christ and all are now avenged for the blood they spilled for their witness and testimony for the sake of Christ and not only those who were persecuted to death, but all the saints of God from the beginning of time and those who are still alive at the coming of Christ are all a part of the first resurrection being the first fruits of His creatures, Daniel 12:1-4; John 6:40; John 5:28, 29; James 1:8; Romans 8:23.

IMO, as there are various teachings about the 1000 years, I do not see the thousand years being literal after Satan is bound even though a thousand is written, which I believe is symbolic or figurative number like that of Deuteronomy 7:9; 1Chronicles 16:15; Psalms 50:10; 90:4; 105:8 Ecc 6:6; 7:28; Daniel 5:1; 2Peter 3:8. What else is to take place within a literal thousand years that will need to be fulfilled as the only thing left is for Satan to be loosed for a time as he gathers all nations for the final battle against the saints, but his army will be consumed by fire that God sends down from heaven and then Satan cast into the lake of fire. Why would God wait a thousand years for His final judgment? What else could possibly take place during a thousand years before God ushers down the New Jerusalem?

 

[Beetow]

.
FAQ: The ordeal that Christ endured on the cross was so brief that it looks like
child's play in comparison to Hell. His suffering barely lasted six hours (Mark
15:25, Matt 27:46-50) not even one whole day. People in Hell go day, after day,
after day, after day, after day, infinitum. How can a mere six hours possibly atone
for people facing perpetual retribution?

REPLY: It wasn't Jesus' torture that atoned for humanity's sins; it was the unique
value of his life that did the trick, viz: there's no other like it in existence. Normal
human life cannot be used for redemptive purposes because God has set the bar
too high. Thus far, Jesus has been the only one who's managed to achieve sinless
perfection. (John 8:29, 2Cor 5:21, Heb 4:15, 1Pet 2:22, 1John 3:9)

Ordinary human lives are wholesale: they're cheap as the grass: just a dime a
dozen and quite useless for redemption purposes. (Isa 40:6-7, 1Pet 1:24) Normal
human life is of such low value that the most that anybody could hope to die for is
just one sin. In most cases; that would leave a pretty large balance to atone for. In
contrast; the value of God's son is such that his death can atone for an infinite
number of everybody's sins.

The dungeons of Hell can be likened to a debtor's prison because the only payment
for sins that God will accept is death. (Rom 6:23) Well; it's death for each sin. So if
somebody has, say, 200 sins to answer for; they'd only be able to pay for one, thus
leaving a balance of 199 unredeemed.

* Everyone's first life is tagged for Adam's mistake so we wouldn't be able to count
even that one towards our redemption.

● Rom 5:12 . .Sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, and
in this way death came to all men

According to Dan 12:2 and John 5:28-29 there's another life in the works, but
that's the last life, there are no other lives to expect after that.

Bottom line: Christ's crucifixion is the final option. Those who refuse to take
advantage of it will cross over to the other side with literally no way in Hell to
satisfy their debts to God so they'll be stuck.
_

 

[Beetow]

.
● Matt 10:28 . . Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul;
but rather fear Him which is able to destroy both soul and body in Hell.

FAQ: If somebody is already dead, then how can Hell kill their body?

REPLY: The current Hell doesn't do that because for now when people die, their
bodies stay here rather than going there. But out ahead in the future; people
locked up in the current facility will be resurrected to face justice at the great white
throne event depicted at Rev 20:11-15. It is then when people's bodies will be
terminated by yet another Hell; and since there is but one resurrection allotted per
person (Dan 12:2, John 5:28-29) then nobody is coming back from that place.

OBJECTION: The final Hell is depicted as a lake of fire (Rev 20:11-15). Sorry; but
it's impossible to liquefy flame.

REPLY: I think it safe to assume that the lake of fire won't function as a normal
force of nature, rather, the hand of God will be active in perdition making things
behave in ways unexpected.
_

 

[Beetow]

.
There was a time when everyone went to the netherworld when they passed away:
Jesus too because when he passed away on the cross; Jesus didn't go up, rather,
he went down. (Matt 12:40, John 20:17, Acts 7:25-31).

When we take into consideration everybody who ever lived and died on this planet
beginning with Adam until the day when people started going to Heaven; then
we're talking about a very large number of people. How did they all fit in the
netherworld without overcrowding?

Well; it's evident that people exist in the afterlife as disembodied spirits. (Heb
12:22-23, 1Pet 3:18-20) and as souls too (Matt 10:28). Those components of
human existence are non physical, viz: they're basically pneumatic.

The feral man of Mark 5:1-13 and Luke 8:26-33 was possessed by a community of
evil spirits who labeled themselves Legion. Webster's defines a legion as the
principal unit of the Roman army comprising 3,000 to 6,000 foot soldiers with
cavalry.

The legion of spirits that Christ exorcised from the man went out and possessed a
herd of about 2,000 swine. That's a pretty good example of how spirits take up no
room in the physical world; nor do they crowd each other. All 3,000-6,000 of those
spirits managed to fit inside the bodily cargo area of just that one man.

That being the case, then the netherworld need not be a void. People can exist
down there in solid rock because non physical beings don't need space, they just
need a place.

NOTE: Any attempt to drill down to the heart of the Earth in search of the
netherworld would likely be futile because it isn't a physical world, rather, it's a
supernatural world. Drilling could, and would, pass right through the very center of
the netherworld and fail to detect it.
_

 

[Beetow]

.
FAQ: Do you not know it is the kindness of God that leads men to repentance
rather than threats of justice? (Rom 2:4)

REPLY: If the Bible's God weren't so kind, then He wouldn't bother with giving His
creatures advance notice of the horror in store for them in the afterlife.

● Luke 12:4-5 . . And I say unto you my friends; Be not afraid of them that kill the
body, and after that have no more that they can do. But I will forewarn you whom
ye shall fear: Fear Him, which after He hath killed hath power to cast into Hell; yea,
I say unto you: Fear Him.

Was Christ wrong to instill a fear of God within people's hearts? No; I think he was
110% justified. For example: when I was working as a professional welder for the
US Army Corps of Engineers, we had weekly and monthly safety meetings wherein
we were shown some grisly photographs of real life industrial accidents involving
burns, chain saws, punctured eyes, explosions, falls, crane collapses, suffocation,
crushing, and the like. Let me tell you something: those safety meetings got our
attention, and really made a sharp distinction between the fool and the wise.

● Prv 22:3 . . A prudent person foresees the danger ahead and takes precautions;
the simpleton goes blindly on and suffers the consequences.

The kindness of God has given the world fair and adequate notice of what to expect
in the afterlife. Those who don't care about it one way or the other would be well
advised to use what time they have remaining to begin mentally preparing
themselves for the worst when they cross over to the other side.

POP CLOCK UPDATE: 20 days have transpired since beginning the thread. If the
figures in post No.1 are within reason, then something like 1,535,040 new arrivals
have checked into the fiery sector of Hades since Dec 15, 2024.
_

 

[Beetow]

.
I heard tell of a preacher who was asked by a member of his congregation what
they would have to do in order to deserve going to Hell. The preacher answered:
Nothing at all; just bide your time and you'll get there because indifference is fatal.

● Heb 2:1-4 . .We must pay more careful attention, therefore, to what we have
heard, so that we do not drift away. For if the message spoken by angels was
binding, and every violation and disobedience received its just punishment, how
shall we escape if we ignore such a great salvation?
_

 

[Beetow]

.
FAQ: What's to become of the people unaware of your so-called "great salvation?

REPLY: They will be judged in accordance with faithfulness to their own intuitive
moral compass.

● Rom 2:12-16 . . All who sin apart from the Law will also perish apart from the
Law, and all who sin under the Law will be judged by the Law. For it is not those
who hear the Law who are righteous in God's sight, but it is those who obey the
Law who will be declared righteous.

. . Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the Law, do by nature things required
by the Law, they are a law unto themselves, even though they do not have the
Law, since they show that the requirements of the Law are written on their hearts,
their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts sometimes accusing
them, and sometimes excusing them.

In other words: it's actually hell-worthy to suppress the urges of your own
conscience, and nobody, no matter how sincerely they wish to be, is ever 100%
true to themselves. Sooner or later they will do something about which it can be
said they knew better.

However, there is some consolation to being judged on that level, According to
Luke 12:48, folks' unawareness of the Christian gospel will mitigate their
responsibility.
_

 

[Beetow]

.
I often encounter rational people who have logically concluded that God has set the
bar too high, i.e. He's made it humanly impossible to attain the kingdom of God; so
what's the point of even trying. Actually I kind of sympathize with them because
the bar is set at 100% sinless perfection. (Rom 3:23)

And there are others who have decided that as bad as Hell might be, it would be
even worse to squander this life in self denial and quite possibly end up going down
there anyway. Those people have decided that it's better to live a life of pleasure
here and a life of no pleasure there, rather than run the risk of having no pleasure
either place. I have to agree: that would be sad.

A third classification of folk are in a clash of wills with God. In other words: they are
so determined not to give in to His demands that they would rather be cremated
alive than fall in line. In their minds: giving in means God wins; which for them is
not only unacceptable; but thoroughly intolerable.

Those people are tough; just as tough as the anti-commie crowd who proudly
announce: Better dead than red, and/or the pro-gun people who defiantly
announce: If you want my guns; you'll have to pry them loose from my cold, dead
fingers.

I'm not saying it's bad to be anti-commie, nor bad to be pro-gun. I'm just using
those people's attitude to illustrate the bitter impasse going on between God and
those who would rather run wild in Hell than be domesticated in Heaven.

Then there are people who have chosen Hell over the kingdom of God because
they'll be more at home in Hell where they'll fit in; whereas in the kingdom they'd
never fit in. And like they say: birds of a feather flock together; viz: some prefer
the company of certain kinds of rather unsavory folk whereas people in the
kingdom will be so heavenly minded that they'd be no fun at all.

In addition; people in Hell are free to speak their minds, and use all the purple
epithets, double entendres, colorful metaphors, thoughtless remarks, and F-bombs
that they want; but in the kingdom, people have to be careful with their choice of
words.

So you see; for some folk Hell is the better choice; and were they to end up in the
kingdom of God instead; I think they would actually be very disappointed.

* We really have to kind of admire people who've made Hell their choice rather
than their luck. At least they know where they're going when they pass on and
have mentally prepared themselves for the worst; whereas a large percentage of
the world's approximately 2.5 billion Christians, and approximately 1.9 billion
Muslims, haven't a clue where they're headed. They're praying for the best while in
the back of their minds dreading the worst because for people giving it their best
shot to merit God's approval, the kingdom of God is never in the bag.
_

 

[Beetow]

.
It's logical to assume that only really bad people are in Hell. But according to Matt
7:23-27, John 3:3-8, John 3:14-20, John 3:36, and Rev 20:11-15, anybody can be
there; both the good, the bad, and the not so bad-- bikers, bakers, lawyers,
welders, actors and actresses, housewives, bankers, heavy equipment operators,
loggers, convicts, celebrities, homeless bums, clergy, prostitutes, drug lords,
postmen, Presidents, Kings, statesmen, astronauts,

. . school teachers, scientists, nurses, doctors, chemists, machinists, carpenters,
waiters, hotel managers, cops, judges, nuns, priests, Popes, deacons, rabbis,
Imams, salesmen, Miss Americas, news anchors, weathermen, and birdwatchers, et
al --people from every walk, every career, every religion, every culture, every
language, every ethnic, every craft, and every status: they're all down there.

Because when you strip away their gender, their titles, their distinctions, their
privileges, and their entitlements; and stand them before God naked; people are
only flesh and blood creatures-- naked apes, just human beings; and human beings
are intrinsically sinful beings.

● Gen 8:21 . . Man's thoughts and actions are bent toward evil from childhood.

● Ps 58:3 . . Even from birth the wicked go astray; from the womb they are
wayward and speak lies.

● Eph 2:3 . .We were by nature objects of wrath.
_

 

[Beetow]

.
According to 1Cor 1:26, not many great people are called. If that's true, then we
have to expect that the majority of the world's really big names in finance, sports,
science, law, medicine, politics, technology, business, industry, religion,
exploration, entertainment, and education, etc. don't, and won't, make it to safety
when they pass on.

As I watched some of the splendor and pomp of President Gerald Ford's funeral
back in January of 2007, I couldn't help but wonder if he was in a position to really
appreciate it; as I suspect people on the wrong side of the netherworld would
certainly no longer really care anymore whether they were given an unknown
pauper's disposal in a City incinerator, or reverently placed in a grand tomb in the
National Cemetery with world-wide television coverage.

POP CLOCK UPDATE: 25 days have transpired since beginning the thread. If the
figures in post No.1 are within reason, then something like 1,918,800 new arrivals
have checked into the fiery sector of Hades since Dec 15, 2024.
_

 

[hawkman]

According to 1Cor 1:26, not many great people are called. If that's true, then we
have to expect that the majority of the world's really big names in finance, sports,
science, law, medicine, politics, technology, business, industry, religion,
exploration, entertainment, and education, etc. don't, and won't, make it to safety
when they pass on.

"Called " as in called to work in service to Christ to evangelize to the lost , is what Jesus is referring to in this passage . Although you are probably right on about the numbers will be lower for heavenly denizens in the big names who have glory of men .

1 Corinthians 1:26 Context​

23But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness; 24But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God. 25Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men. 26For ye see your calling, brethren, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called: 27But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty; 28And base things of the world, and things which are despised, hath God chosen, yea, and things which are not, to bring to nought things that are: 29That no flesh should glory in his presence.

 

[Hidden In Him]

I often encounter rational people who have logically concluded that God has set the
bar too high, i.e. He's made it humanly impossible to attain the kingdom of God; so
what's the point of even trying. Actually I kind of sympathize with them because
the bar is set at 100% sinless perfection. (Rom 3:23)

Beetow, if I may, there might be newer Christians viewing who could misconstrue what you are saying in this post if they were not careful.

Do you believe only those who walk in sinless perfection will be saved?

And there are others who have decided that as bad as Hell might be, it would be
even worse to squander this life in self denial and quite possibly end up going down
there anyway. Those people have decided that it's better to live a life of pleasure
here and a life of no pleasure there, rather than run the risk of having no pleasure
either place. I have to agree: that would be sad.

Aren't they forgetting that the eternity God has waiting for us will be filled with pleasure continually?

Then there are people who have chosen Hell over the kingdom of God because
they'll be more at home in Hell where they'll fit in; whereas in the kingdom they'd
never fit in. And like they say: birds of a feather flock together; viz: some prefer
the company of certain kinds of rather unsavory folk whereas people in the
kingdom will be so heavenly minded that they'd be no fun at all.

I agree with you here actually. but is it truly a life of happiness if everyone around you is miserable? You may be amongst your own kind, but if your own kind are awful people to be around, seems there would never be anything resembling true joy.

* We really have to kind of admire people who've made Hell their choice rather
than their luck. At least they know where they're going when they pass on and
have mentally prepared themselves for the worst

I suppose the primary point here is that some Christians are naively thinking they are ok when they are not. Sure you are nor overstating it to say we should admire those who have consciously rejected the Lord?

Asking for the sake of clarity for the typical viewer.
God bless,
Hidden

 

[Beetow]

Do you believe only those who walk in sinless perfection will be saved?

No

Sure you are nor overstating it to say we should admire those who have consciously rejected the
Lord?

Jesus expressed his disgust with folks in the Laodicean church whom he described
as lukewarm, i.e. neither hot nor cold (Rev 3:14-16) I take it that he would prefer
they make a decision about him one way or the other rather than be indifferent.
_