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Pork

I wouldn't drink around a recovering alcoholic and I wouldn't try to prove to an alcoholic in recovery that it's ok to drink.

Romans 14:19-21 Let us therefore follow after the things which make for peace, and things wherewith one may edify another. For meat destroy not the work of God. All things indeed are pure; but it is evil for that man who eateth with offence. It is good neither to eat flesh, nor to drink wine, nor any thing whereby thy brother stumbleth, or is offended, or is made weak.
 
JLB said:
YHWH, the Lord Jesus, purified all foods.

because it does not enter his heart but his stomach, and is eliminated, thus purifying all foods?” Mark 7:19
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The context is referring to the digestive process and eliminating the waste. The food is being "purged" or "cleansed" from the body.

Paul, who learned from Jesus Christ, made this statement:

I know and am convinced by the Lord Jesus that there is nothing unclean of itself...

unclean of itself is clear, and certainly does not pertain to a piece of meat that fell on the ground.
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I told you "unclean" is "common" based on the Greek. Explain why my understanding is wrong.

Pork meat,
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in and of itself is not unclean.
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I would like to be in on that conversation when you tell that to Yahweh come judgment day.

Which one has faith?
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The one who by faith in Jesus Christ is sanctified?
or
The one who refrains from eating pork because the law of Moses forbids it?

I'll give you a hint: The law is not of faith. Galatians 3:12
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One who has been sanctified and justified by faith in Yeshua will show his faith by his works (James 2:17-20).
 
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ezrider said:
You seem to overlook one important aspect of that passage from Isaiah, and that is it is to those who try to sanctify themselves and those who try to purify themselves. But those who are truly in Christ do not try and sanctify themselves, for they know that it is Christ that sanctifies them, and they know that the blood of Christ purifies them. This verse only states the same thing taught by Jesus and written of by Paul: those who try and justify themselves by the law shall be judged by the law. You are not condemned for eating swines flesh, you are condemned for trying to sanctify yourself by the works of the law instead of being sanctified in Christ by Faith.
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The text does not say they were trying to sanctify themselves BY eating swine's flesh. I see the eating of swine's flesh as something they were doing wrong in addition to self-sanctification.
 
Anybody for some pigs feet

  • th
  • stewedpigfeetwithmushroominoysterflavoredsauce.jpg

 
StoveBolts said:
I wouldn't drink around a recovering alcoholic and I wouldn't try to prove to an alcoholic in recovery that it's ok to drink.

Romans 14:19-21 Let us therefore follow after the things which make for peace, and things wherewith one may edify another. For meat destroy not the work of God. All things indeed are pure; but it is evil for that man who eateth with offence. It is good neither to eat flesh, nor to drink wine, nor any thing whereby thy brother stumbleth, or is offended, or is made weak.
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When Paul says, "All things indeed are pure", he does so in opposition to the weaker brother's belief that the meat was "common". There is no such thing as "common" meat of itself. In order for meat to be considered common, something had to happen to it to render it defiled and therefore, inedible in someone's mind. However, a brother who is strong in the faith would know that nothing can render clean meat defiled, including meat that was touched by unwashed hands which was the problem Yeshua addressed in Matthew 15:20. The Pharisees believed eating with unwashed hands defiled (rendered common) the food and that by eating the defiled (common) food, the eater would become defiled.
 
jocor said:
The text does not say they were trying to sanctify themselves BY eating swine's flesh. I see the eating of swine's flesh as something they were doing wrong in addition to self-sanctification.
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You are absolutely correct, the text from Isaiah 66:15-17 does not say they were trying to sanctify themselves "BY" eating swine's flesh, but then again I never implied that it did. Because swines flesh was made unclean according to the old covenant and law of Moses, the usage of "eating swine's flesh" in the context with the passage you cited from Isaiah only goes to demonstrate their hypocrisy in thinking they were sanctifying themselves by the works of the law.

In another of your posts, you stated that abstaining from pork is the fruit of your faith. If that is the case, then why did you find it necessary to post this particular passage from Isaiah? Are you trying to imply that those who eat swine's flesh somehow are not sanctified? Or are you trying to say that by your faith in abstaining from pork you are more righteous than someone who by faith enjoys a nice pork chop? Why the need to try and justify your faith in the face of others? After all the writings of Paul are quite clear, if you have faith, have it to thyself (Rom 14:22). So that causes me to wonder what your intent really is. If you wish to abstain form eating pork, then that is your faith and your choice, but that does not mean that you should be critical of anyone who chooses to each pork giving thanks to the Lord.

Maybe the law still has more of a grasp on you than you are willing to admit, but these are the principalities and powers with which we all wrestle with. But I am fully persuaded, as it is found in the law of Moses, that we have come unto the place chosen of the Lord, and have been permitted to kill and eat whatever we lust after according to the blessing of the Lord which he has given us, the clean and the unclean alike, only we are not to eat the blood (Deut 12:14-16).
 
ezrider said:
You are absolutely correct, the text from Isaiah 66:15-17 does not say they were trying to sanctify themselves "BY" eating swine's flesh, but then again I never implied that it did. Because swines flesh was made unclean according to the old covenant and law of Moses, the usage of "eating swine's flesh" in the context with the passage you cited from Isaiah only goes to demonstrate their hypocrisy in thinking they were sanctifying themselves by the works of the law.

In another of your posts, you stated that abstaining from pork is the fruit of your faith. If that is the case, then why did you find it necessary to post this particular passage from Isaiah? Are you trying to imply that those who eat swine's flesh somehow are not sanctified? Or are you trying to say that by your faith in abstaining from pork you are more righteous than someone who by faith enjoys a nice pork chop? Why the need to try and justify your faith in the face of others? After all the writings of Paul are quite clear, if you have faith, have it to thyself (Rom 14:22). So that causes me to wonder what your intent really is. If you wish to abstain form eating pork, then that is your faith and your choice, but that does not mean that you should be critical of anyone who chooses to each pork giving thanks to the Lord.

Maybe the law still has more of a grasp on you than you are willing to admit, but these are the principalities and powers with which we all wrestle with. But I am fully persuaded, as it is found in the law of Moses, that we have come unto the place chosen of the Lord, and have been permitted to kill and eat whatever we lust after according to the blessing of the Lord which he has given us, the clean and the unclean alike, only we are not to eat the blood (Deut 12:14-16).
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I did not post Isa 66:15-17 to make a statement about myself or others. I did so to make a statement about the doctrine of it being permissible to eat swine's flesh (pork). It is interesting to note that of all the sins that Yahweh could have used to characterize the recipients of His fiery end-time judgment, He chose eating swine's flesh and mice. Yahweh says something similar in Isa 65:1-7, using the eating of swine's flesh and the broth of abominable things as characteristics of those who provoke Him to anger. How is it that Yahweh will bring His fiery judgment upon those that anger Him by eating swine's flesh and yet, allow His New Covenant people to eat swine's flesh without judgment?

You quoted Deut 12:14-16 in support of eating "clean and unclean alike". That is not what the passage says,

Deu 12:15 Notwithstanding thou mayest kill and eat flesh in all thy gates, whatsoever thy soul lusteth after, according to the blessing of YHWH thy Elohim which He hath given thee: the unclean and the clean may eat thereof, as of the roebuck, and as of the hart.
​
In other words, it does not matter if a person was clean or unclean (for example, by touching a dead body). Both were permitted to eat of a burnt offering. Only clean animals could be offered.
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Deu 12:15 does not say,

Notwithstanding thou mayest kill and eat flesh in all thy gates, whatsoever thy soul lusteth after, according to the blessing of YHWH thy Elohim which He hath given thee: you may eat the unclean and the clean alike, as of the roebuck, and as of the hart.
​
And, Yes, the Law does have a major grasp on me. I endeavor to obey every word that proceeded out of Yahweh's mouth whenever possible. It is my meditation day and night and I have allowed it to be written on my heart. Why? Because I love Yahweh and know that by breaking His Laws I sin and sin grieves Him. I have no desire to grieve Him.
 
jocor said:
The context is referring to the digestive process and eliminating the waste. The food is being "purged" or "cleansed" from the body.
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Yes, if you read the context, you would see that food can not defile you, because it doesn't enter the heart, but rather the stomach and is eliminated.

So all food is ok to eat, and meant to be received with thanks giving.

Just as it was before the law of Moses was added.

Every moving thing that lives shall be food for you. I have given you all things, even as the green herbs. Genesis 9:3


JLB
 
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