Rapture Theory

[Kathi]

When did this happen?

I don't know I am confused.It sure is news to me.

 

[agua.]

When did this happen?

I don't know I am confused.It sure is news to me.

Did you take a nap ?

Mar 13:33 Be on guard, keep awake. For you do not know when the time will come.

 

[n2thelight]

Excerpts of Revelation Study by Gene Hawkins.

In 1 Thessalonians 5:2 we read that "The day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night." Now how do you reconcile that with "Behold He cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him?" If Jesus is only going to come one time and Thessalonians says He's coming as a thief, and Revelation 1:7 says that every eye shall see Him; those are two contradictory statements or they can't refer to the same time; they are two different appearances. He can't come as a thief if every eye is going to see Him and the interpretation is easy. 1 Thessalonians 5:2 happens before the tribulations even begins whereas Revelation 1:7 happens after the tribulation is all over.

1 Thessalonians 5:4. "But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief."

Revelation 3:2-3. "Be watchful, and strengthen the things which remain, that are ready to die: for I have not found thy works perfect before God. 3 Remember therefore how thou hast received and heard, and hold fast, and repent. If therefore thou shalt not watch, I will come on thee as a thief, and thou shalt not know what hour I will come upon thee." (This sounds very secret to me.)

Did you pay attention to v 4 ? "But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief."

Then you go to Rev ,If therefore thou shalt not watch, I will come on thee as a thief, and thou shalt not know what hour I will come upon thee."and you say it sounds secret to you....My question is how can you say it sounds secret when He just told us that it wouldn't come as a theif for those not in darkness?

 

[n2thelight]

Where on Earth are we to be during this so called literal 1000 year Millennium, because the New Heaven and New Jerusalem according to what you have said would not be ushered down yet. This would mean that Earth as we know it now will still be the same until that time. It's when Satan is cast into the lake of fire that the New Heaven and New Jerusalem will come down and then we will be with the Lord forever.

That question and the answer to it, leads to the question concerning,the purpose of the millennium....

Revelation 20:4 "And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the Word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years."

Revelation 20:6 "Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years."

I'll try to explain this as best I can....

When Christ returns "ALL" shall be changed,that means the saved and the unsaved as well,the difference will be in the state of their souls.....Those that are saved souls at that time shall be immortal,while the unsaved though also changed will have a mortal soul,meaning they can still die the second death,which is the death of their soul,while the saved,will not have to worry about this....(2nd death)....

Which brings me to the purpose of the millennium....We are going to teach and oversee, and judge those mortal souls, as they will learn and follow all directives of our Lord Jesus Christ.

Revelation 20:7 "And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison."

When everyone has been taught who are in their mortal (liable to die) soul bodies, then Satan will be loosed. Those teachings will have been given under perfect conditions, and all will have bodies with no ailments, perfect thought, and no temptations by Satan. In fact, all will know he was the deceiver of this earth age. Their understanding will be perfect.

Then Satan is released.

Please don't take this too mean people will be given a 2nd chance.....Look around on these forums,and you should see as I do,that most,if not I dare say,the majority didn't have a first chance....

So to answer the question of what we shall be doing,teaching.........

 

[Eugene]

In Galatians 1:8 Paul says...But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.
Now Paul's gospel by which we are saved is found in 1 Cor. 15: 3-4 which reads:
3. For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
4. And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

But, in Rev 14: 6-7 we have an angel preaching another gospel
6. And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people,
7. Saying with a loud voice, Fear God, and give glory to him; for the hour of his judgment is come: and worship him that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters.

Will this angel be cursed? Will the gospel by which we are saved preached by Paul, become null and void for us and now we will be saved by the new everlasting gospel?


What are you doing to help you "endure to the end"? Only the Jews in Petra will be fed and protected by God(I believe). Do you have enough food stored up, maybe some type of hidden shelter prepared out in the middle of nowhere to protect you and your family hopefully until the end? Maybe I am wrong about this stuff. But maybe, it is something we all need to start thinking about. I think the stage is being set for that time to come soon. If the rapture is false, maybe this is something we need to start thinking about and quit wasting our time on these forums. This could happen any day now. We know its coming, why not start getting prepared for it...?

Dear Brother veryberry, the problem you are facing is mixing the word for us today with that for the future, and that is not to be taken as a putdown, but it is common in scripture, and it comes down to rightly dividing the word of God.

Gal 1:8 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.

Who are the “WE,” and there are labels given the gospel. Paul happened to be the one for this present age to have been given the fulfilled or complete gospel revealed to him.

Col 1:25 Whereof I am made a minister, according to the dispensation of God which is given to me for you, to fulfill the word of God;
Col 1:26 Even the mystery which hath been hid from ages and from generations, but now is made manifest to his saints:
Col 1:27 To whom God would make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in you, the hope of glory:

Now does this restrict God from saying more in the future, and just what is that gospel?

Rev 14:6 And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people. Will the everlasting gospel represent a different message than God gave Paul to preach as to the manner of salvation? No, but it is an encouragement to God’s people in a time of unprecedented tribulation
Rev 14:7 Saying with a loud voice, Fear God, and give glory to him; for the hour of his judgment is come: and worship him that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters.

Just what is the gospel? Strongs 2097 & 2098 – a good message; good news. Now in the case of the everlasting good message it is to the people to believe in, and give glory to God instead of following the antichrist. The following examples in scripture show different good news messages that are a part of the gospel preached that Paul refers to. I personally believe the everlasting gospel incorporates all the word of God.

Matthew 4:23 Gospel of the kingdom.
Romans 10:15 Gospel of peace.
Romans 1:1 Gospel of God.
Acts 20:24 Gospel of the grace of God.
Romans 1:16 Gospel of Christ
Romans 2:16 & 2 Timothy 2:8 My (Paul's) gospel.
Galatians 2:7 Gospel of the uncircumcision, and Gospel of the circumcision.
Revelation 14:6 Everlasting gospel.

Blessings in Christ Jesus.

 

[Eugene]

Where on Earth are we to be during this so called literal 1000 year Millennium, because the New Heaven and New Jerusalem according to what you have said would not be ushered down yet. This would mean that Earth as we know it now will still be the same until that time. It's when Satan is cast into the lake of fire that the New Heaven and New Jerusalem will come down and then we will be with the Lord forever.

Rev 5:6 And I beheld, and, lo, in the midst of the throne . . Where is God’s throne?
According to John in Rev 5:9, he is shown saints in heaven redeemed to God by His blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation.

Heb 12:22 But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels,

Rev 14:1 And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads.

Where were these 144,000 at? Was it the heavenly Jerusalem in heaven? There is a time future after the millennium when the heavenly Jerusalem will come to earth as a bride prepared. Rev 21:2.

 

[veryberry]

Dear Brother veryberry, the problem you are facing is mixing the word for us today with that for the future, and that is not to be taken as a putdown, but it is common in scripture, and it comes down to rightly dividing the word of God.

Gal 1:8 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.

Who are the “WE,” and there are labels given the gospel. Paul happened to be the one for this present age to have been given the fulfilled or complete gospel revealed to him.

Col 1:25 Whereof I am made a minister, according to the dispensation of God which is given to me for you, to fulfill the word of God;
Col 1:26 Even the mystery which hath been hid from ages and from generations, but now is made manifest to his saints:
Col 1:27 To whom God would make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in you, the hope of glory:

Now does this restrict God from saying more in the future, and just what is that gospel?

Rev 14:6 And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people. Will the everlasting gospel represent a different message than God gave Paul to preach as to the manner of salvation? No, but it is an encouragement to God’s people in a time of unprecedented tribulation
Rev 14:7 Saying with a loud voice, Fear God, and give glory to him; for the hour of his judgment is come: and worship him that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters.

Just what is the gospel? Strongs 2097 & 2098 – a good message; good news. Now in the case of the everlasting good message it is to the people to believe in, and give glory to God instead of following the antichrist. The following examples in scripture show different good news messages that are a part of the gospel preached that Paul refers to. I personally believe the everlasting gospel incorporates all the word of God.

Matthew 4:23 Gospel of the kingdom.
Romans 10:15 Gospel of peace.
Romans 1:1 Gospel of God.
Acts 20:24 Gospel of the grace of God.
Romans 1:16 Gospel of Christ
Romans 2:16 & 2 Timothy 2:8 My (Paul's) gospel.
Galatians 2:7 Gospel of the uncircumcision, and Gospel of the circumcision.
Revelation 14:6 Everlasting gospel.

Blessings in Christ Jesus.

I don't take that as a put down. But tell me how I am putting the future to today? I know it is a future event. The 2 gospel's conflict with each other. Paul says, believe this(1 Cor 15:3-4), not of works, it is of grace and not of yourselves, and you are eternally secure in the Lord. But in the tribulation you must "endure to the end"(how is this not of yourself?), You must not take the mark of the beast, or his number, or worship the beast or be damned for ever and loosing your salvation(how is this not of yourself?). How is it, in this time period(the time of Jacobs trouble) you are not ensuring your own salvation? Paul clearly tells us that our salvation is ensured through the Lord Jesus Christ.

Please don't take this as a put down, But most of you are not rightly dividing the word of truth.

2 Tim 2:15 - Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

 

[Eugene]

I don't take that as a put down. But tell me how I am putting the future to today? I know it is a future event. The 2 gospel's conflict with each other. Paul says, believe this(1 Cor 15:3-4), not of works, it is of grace and not of yourselves, and you are eternally secure in the Lord. But in the tribulation you must "endure to the end"(how is this not of yourself?), You must not take the mark of the beast, or his number, or worship the beast or be damned for ever and loosing your salvation(how is this not of yourself?). How is it, in this time period(the time of Jacobs trouble) you are not ensuring your own salvation? Paul clearly tells us that our salvation is ensured through the Lord Jesus Christ.

Mat 24:13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved. If this appears to oppose the following scriptures it must by necessity not be talking of the same thing.

Matthew Chapter Twenty-four is a time of great tribulation. Mat 24:21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be. Those righteous believing and surviving that time will be saved alive to enter into the millennium. Works were never the basis of eternal life.

Act 2:21 And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved.

Rom 10:13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

These principles of grace and belief never change, in this age or the ones to come.

 

[JLB]

I don't take that as a put down. But tell me how I am putting the future to today? I know it is a future event. The 2 gospel's conflict with each other. Paul says, believe this(1 Cor 15:3-4), not of works, it is of grace and not of yourselves, and you are eternally secure in the Lord. But in the tribulation you must "endure to the end"(how is this not of yourself?), You must not take the mark of the beast, or his number, or worship the beast or be damned for ever and loosing your salvation(how is this not of yourself?). How is it, in this time period(the time of Jacobs trouble) you are not ensuring your own salvation? Paul clearly tells us that our salvation is ensured through the Lord Jesus Christ.

Please don't take this as a put down, But most of you are not rightly dividing the word of truth.

2 Tim 2:15 - Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

The Gospel has always carried the requirement of enduring to the end.

It is the end of your faith, that is the salvation of your soul.

But he who endures to the end shall be saved, does not mean you have to live to the end of the tribulation to be saved, but rather be faithful unto death.

The end of your faith, means just that. The end of your faith is the end of your life. We are encouraged and admonished to live to the end of our life believing the Gospel message.

It is especially true to those who will be alive during the Tribulation, just as those who lived during the first century under great persecution, as well as all those who endured the great persecution of the inquisitions, down through the years to those who are living under great persecution in many third world countries today.


It is at the end of your faith that you will receive the salvation of your soul. ... receiving the end of your faith--the salvation of your souls. 1 Peter 1:9

"This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He sent." John 6:29 You must practice this believing unto the end.

He that endures, by believing and trusting in Jesus christ to the end, will be saved.

This has always been the Gospel message.

It is not just special for the tribulation.


JLB

 

[for_his_glory]

During the 1000 year Day of Rest, we will be here on earth shining like the sun, with our immortal resurrected bodies that will never die.

The wicked and lawless people will have been cast into hell.

1000 years of a sinless , resurrected, immortal body that will never die to enjoy heaven on earth.

A true Sabbath rest.


JLB

If the wicked and lawless people are no longer on earth then why would God wait 1000 years to send down the new Heaven and New Jerusalem?

 

[for_his_glory]

for_his_glory - First the only doctrine I have is that of Gods word alone.
Eugene – Thanks dear sister, and I hope to use scripture.

for_his_glory - I can not find anywhere in scripture that speaks of a seven year trib period.
Eugene – Do you take into consideration Daniel’s prophesies of end times? I do, and so will at least give a couple related to them.

I hope to establish the fact that with Israel God used year/day counting as per Ezekiel 4:6 . . . I have appointed thee each day for a year, and that can be proved in the 490 years of Daniel 9:25 beginning in 444 BC when Artaxerxes sent forth a decree for the rebuilding of Jerusalem in Neh 2:6. until Jesus rode an ass into Jerusalem. Zech 9:9. Okay so far?

Daniel 9:26. I’m using this scripture to set the timeline for this prophesy. "And after threescore and two weeks (When the sixty-two weeks is completely finished) shall Messiah be cut off." That occurred at the cross, and then "And the people of the prince that shall come (After Jesus’ death) shall destroy the city." Which city, what prince, and when? Jerusalem, Satan, and in 70 AD.

Dan 9:27 And he (This isn't Jesus, but that prince that shall come) shall confirm the covenant with many for one week (7 years): and in the midst of the week (3 ½ yrs) he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation (Of what?), and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

Dear sister, I’ll have to consider the remainder of your reply based upon your answers to my reply here. Thanks.

Daniel 9
Vs.26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.

After 434 years that end in the year AD29 shall Messiah be cut off. Jesus was crucified after he was baptized in AD 29 three and a half years later. Jesus was cut off (killed) by the people of the prince, which means National Israel or other words the Pharisees, Sanhedrin and the high priest that destroy the city and the sanctuary (meaning Christ) and the end thereof shall be with a flood (Gods wrath) that will put an end to abominations by desolation or in other words a ruin to evil deeds. Daniel 9:27 explains the definitions of desolation of abominations or the ruin of evil deeds. There is no actual Desolations of Abominations where the so-called Antichrist will take a literal throne, but the desolation will be when the beast that Satan gives power to tries to take his throne in Jerusalem, (Ref: Daniel 11:36-45). Gods’ word never defines one great Antichrist, but says there are many antichrists. The seven years that some call the seven year tribulation means three and a half years of Jesus teaching before he was crucified and three and a half years of Stephen teaching before he was stoned to death, which took place after Jesus was taken up to heaven.

Vs.27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

The 70th seven began with Christ baptism in AD 29 and three years later at the end of the first half of the 70th seven sacrifices and offering ceased because Christ hung on the cross as he was the final sacrifice that fulfilled the law. From the giving of the law in 458BC when Ezra went to establish the law, or to rebuild the Spiritual city right up to the cross were the first 69 sevens. The 70th seven is from the time of the cross until Jesus comes and gathers his bride as they prepare to stand in the Holy place until the overspreading of abominations he will make desolate, or make an end to all that would not repent.

 

[for_his_glory]

In Galatians 1:8 Paul says...But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.
Now Paul's gospel by which we are saved is found in 1 Cor. 15: 3-4 which reads:
3. For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
4. And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

But, in Rev 14: 6-7 we have an angel preaching another gospel
6. And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people,
7. Saying with a loud voice, Fear God, and give glory to him; for the hour of his judgment is come: and worship him that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters.

Will this angel be cursed? Will the gospel by which we are saved preached by Paul, become null and void for us and now we will be saved by the new everlasting gospel?


What are you doing to help you "endure to the end"? Only the Jews in Petra will be fed and protected by God(I believe). Do you have enough food stored up, maybe some type of hidden shelter prepared out in the middle of nowhere to protect you and your family hopefully until the end? Maybe I am wrong about this stuff. But maybe, it is something we all need to start thinking about. I think the stage is being set for that time to come soon. If the rapture is false, maybe this is something we need to start thinking about and quit wasting our time on these forums. This could happen any day now. We know its coming, why not start getting prepared for it...?

First their is only one gospel no matter who is doing the preaching. It's not Paul's gospel, but Paul's witness of his testimony of Christ. The angel in Rev 14 is giving a message to hold fast to God during these things which must come first. It's not only the Jews, but all of us that are in Christ that God will provide for and protect. There is nothing wrong with making provision, but in these times of persecution we also need to continue with the gospel message to those who need to hear before it's to late.

 

[reba]

The seven years that some call the seven year tribulation means three and a half years of Jesus teaching

for_his_glory

so nice to read another who sees the 3 1/2 years as the time of Jesus' earthy ministry

 

[for_his_glory]

the fact is, is that these are the last days, just as the bible states, Christ has come a second time already to defeat the beast and false prophet, now judgment day will come with him seated on the white throne as he said in Matthew. then I think the end of the world and heaven will come, and there will be a new earth and new heaven.. blessings!!

If Christ has already come then why are we still here and why hasn't Satan, beast and false prophet been cast into the lake of fire yet. Can you explain what you mean by Christ has already come a second time?

 

[for_his_glory]

That question and the answer to it, leads to the question concerning,the purpose of the millennium....

Revelation 20:4 "And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the Word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years."

Revelation 20:6 "Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years."

I'll try to explain this as best I can....

When Christ returns "ALL" shall be changed,that means the saved and the unsaved as well,the difference will be in the state of their souls.....Those that are saved souls at that time shall be immortal,while the unsaved though also changed will have a mortal soul,meaning they can still die the second death,which is the death of their soul,while the saved,will not have to worry about this....(2nd death)....

Which brings me to the purpose of the millennium....We are going to teach and oversee, and judge those mortal souls, as they will learn and follow all directives of our Lord Jesus Christ.

Revelation 20:7 "And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison."

When everyone has been taught who are in their mortal (liable to die) soul bodies, then Satan will be loosed. Those teachings will have been given under perfect conditions, and all will have bodies with no ailments, perfect thought, and no temptations by Satan. In fact, all will know he was the deceiver of this earth age. Their understanding will be perfect.

Then Satan is released.

Please don't take this too mean people will be given a 2nd chance.....Look around on these forums,and you should see as I do,that most,if not I dare say,the majority didn't have a first chance....

So to answer the question of what we shall be doing,teaching.........

So if I am understanding what you are saying is that everyone here on Earth will go to be with the Lord forever at the end of this 1000 years? I do not see the 1000 years as being a literal 1000 years as our timing is not that of Gods timing. It just doesn't set well as why would Jesus return to catch us up to meet him in the air to just bring us back down for another 1000 years. I find no scripture to support this.

 

[Sinthesis]

The 70th seven began with Christ baptism in AD 29 and three years later at the end of the first half of the 70th seven sacrifices and offering ceased because Christ hung on the cross as he was the final sacrifice that fulfilled the law. From the giving of the law in 458BC when Ezra went to establish the law, or to rebuild the Spiritual city right up to the cross were the first 69 sevens. The 70th seven is from the time of the cross until Jesus comes and gathers his bride as they prepare to stand in the Holy place until the overspreading of abominations he will make desolate, or make an end to all that would not repent.

I pretty much agree with you, but the above paragraph seems to contradict itself. Do you believe the 70th seven began at Christ's baptism or His crucifixion?

 

[Deborah13]

Daniel 9
Vs.26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.

After 434 years that end in the year AD29 shall Messiah be cut off. Jesus was crucified after he was baptized in AD 29 three and a half years later. Jesus was cut off (killed) by the people of the prince, which means National Israel or other words the Pharisees, Sanhedrin and the high priest that destroy the city and the sanctuary (meaning Christ) and the end thereof shall be with a flood (Gods wrath) that will put an end to abominations by desolation or in other words a ruin to evil deeds. Daniel 9:27 explains the definitions of desolation of abominations or the ruin of evil deeds. There is no actual Desolations of Abominations where the so-called Antichrist will take a literal throne, but the desolation will be when the beast that Satan gives power to tries to take his throne in Jerusalem, (Ref: Daniel 11:36-45). Gods’ word never defines one great Antichrist, but says there are many antichrists. The seven years that some call the seven year tribulation means three and a half years of Jesus teaching before he was crucified and three and a half years of Stephen teaching before he was stoned to death, which took place after Jesus was taken up to heaven.

Vs.27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

The 70th seven began with Christ baptism in AD 29 and three years later at the end of the first half of the 70th seven sacrifices and offering ceased because Christ hung on the cross as he was the final sacrifice that fulfilled the law. From the giving of the law in 458BC when Ezra went to establish the law, or to rebuild the Spiritual city right up to the cross were the first 69 sevens. The 70th seven is from the time of the cross until Jesus comes and gathers his bride as they prepare to stand in the Holy place until the overspreading of abominations he will make desolate, or make an end to all that would not repent.

I agree with you as well about the first half of the 70th, 31/2 yrs. being the time of Christ's ministry.

I don't understand the last paragraph as it seems to say two different descriptions of the 70th week?

 

[for_his_glory]

Rev 5:6 And I beheld, and, lo, in the midst of the throne . . Where is God’s throne?
According to John in Rev 5:9, he is shown saints in heaven redeemed to God by His blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation.

Heb 12:22 But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels,

Rev 14:1 And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads.

Where were these 144,000 at? Was it the heavenly Jerusalem in heaven? There is a time future after the millennium when the heavenly Jerusalem will come to earth as a bride prepared. Rev 21:2.

The first thing we need to understand is who the beast and the twentyfour elders are. Then learn of the 144,000 and the army that will return with Jesus when he plants his feet on the Mt of Olives.

The background is found in 1 Chronicles 24:7-19; 25:6-31; and 26:12-19. In chapter 24, the Levitical priesthood is divided into 24 divisions, according to the schedule of their service: they were officials of the sanctuary and of the house of God. In Chapter 25, the Levitical priests are further divided into 24 divisions, responsible for the worship of the sanctuary, and in particular the music of that worship. In Chapter 26, the Levitical priests are again divided into 24 gatekeepers for the house of God.

Remember the role of the twenty-four divisions of priests in the book of Chronicles? They were responsible for worship, in particular for the music in worship. They were also to stand as the gatekeepers of the house of God. As it was with the twenty-four divisions of the priests in the book of Chronicles, so it is with the twenty-four elders in the book of Revelation. They are responsible for worship, in particular for the music in worship; they also stand as the gatekeepers of the house of God.

The twenty-four elders, then, are elders--elders in the heavenly sanctuary of God--who are responsible for worship, for the music of worship, and as such they stand as the gatekeepers of the house of God.

We have identified the twenty-four elders that surround the throne as elders, but what is the significance of those elders around the throne? Why are they there? The answer is that the twenty-four elders of Revelation 4:4; 5:6 are symbolic of the ruling authority in the church. There is a correspondence between the twenty-four elders above and the office of elder below. This means that the government of the church is patterned after heaven itself. As there are elders in heaven above, so there are elders on earth below.

The seven Spirits are wisdom, understanding, counsel, knowledge, reverence, power and fear (respect) of the Lord. The four beasts represent that of the four Gospels being taught in the governing Church here on Earth that is patterned after heaven.

Rev 14:1-5 The 144,000 should not be taken literally. It’s 12 x 12 x 1000. The 12 being the number of completion for God’s people representing the 12 tribes of Israel and the 12 apostles and 1000 being a generic number suggesting a great multitude. So 144,000 is a way of saying all of God’s people under the old and new covenant. Virgins are we, the saints of God who have held onto truth. The army that Rev 19:14 speaks of that return with Jesus as he plants his feet on the Mt of Olives to fight the final battle are the angels and we, the saints of God, who were caught up to meet Jesus in the air and return with him, Rev 17:14; Matt 16:27; Jude 1:15, 16; Rev 19:19: Rev 3:4,5; Rev 7:13-15.

 

[for_his_glory]

I pretty much agree with you, but the above paragraph seems to contradict itself. Do you believe the 70th seven began at Christ's baptism or His crucifixion?

with His baptism

 

[for_his_glory]

I agree with you as well about the first half of the 70th, 31/2 yrs. being the time of Christ's ministry.

I don't understand the last paragraph as it seems to say two different descriptions of the 70th week?

I can see where that might be confusing. The whole 70 weeks are from the time of Christ baptism, his ministry and up until the time he hung on the cross