SALVATION

[Panin]

Those who trust in their works think they can sin as long as they work hard.

Jesus tells us to be holy as He is Holy. Do you think you can be holy without any effort? No you cannot. You see, that's how you guys are deceiving the world with your kind of preaching.

We have told you tons of times that no one can do good works without God's help. God is seeking our heart, if we are striving to be faithful to Him, the Holy Spirit will help us to be holy.

.

Dear Holy Shad, can you please tell me how you maintain your Holy perfect state through your works. I would like to learn so that I can know how to earn my salvation.

God Bless Your Holyness, can I kiss your ring? :shades

 

[shad]

Dear Holy Shad, can you please tell me how you maintain your Holy perfect state through your works. I would like to learn so that I can know how to earn my salvation.

Oh you poor thing, Do you trust Jesus? Jesus says nothing is impossible with God's help. It is impossible to be saved without trusting Jesus' Word.

get the idea?

 

[Panin]

Dear Holy Shad, can you please tell me how you maintain your Holy perfect state through your works. I would like to learn so that I can know how to earn my salvation.

Oh you poor thing, Do you trust Jesus? Jesus says nothing is impossible with God's help. It is impossible to be saved without trusting Jesus' Word.

get the idea?

No, I have no idea what you mean, please explain? I thought I had to earn it by my works, are you saying I just need to trust in Jesus now??. I'm confused????

 

[glorydaz]

Those who are under the law...natural or Mosaic...will be judged solely on their work.

Where does the Bible say this. You seem to think that the Romans 2 judgement is only for the unregenerate or for some sub-set of humanity. Where does Romans 2 say this. My version says this:

God "will give to each person according to what he has done."...

I do not mean to flippant, but why not say that the Romans 2 judgement will be limted to Hungarians, or people with big noses? I see no evidence in the text at all that limits this judgement to the unregenerate. How do you justify limiting the scope to the unregenerate?

And how do you explain that Paul says that some will get eternal life at that judgment when, if I undertand you, you believe that no one will get eternal life at that judgement? Would you write that "God will give eternal life to those who persist in doing good when, in fact, you believed zero people will get eternal life in this way?

I certainly wouldn't.

Drew, the verse said they "seek" eternal life...not they receive eternal life.

It's quite similar to some on this thread who think they can add something to the cross to be saved.
They think if they do enough the Lord will let them into heaven.
Why? Because they don't believe what the Lord has told them.
They don't believe the message that the "gift" is freely given.
They limit God, and think they have to add their own works to the cross.
Every other religion believes the exact same thing...so I'm not surprised.

If man's works could have saved him, there would have been no need for our Lord to die on the cross.

God would have just said, do good and go to heaven.

Salvation is a gift...we have to reach out and take it.
Do we reach out and take it and then do good works to pay off the remainder of what we owe?

Judgment is for unregenerate man....all of them, even those who think they can justify themselves by their works.

There will be no condemnation on those who are washed in the blood of the Lamb.

John 5:24 - Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.

Romans 5:16 - And not as it was by one that sinned, so is the gift: for the judgment was by one to condemnation, but the free gift is of many offences unto justification.

Romans 8:1 - There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

 

[shad]

No, I have no idea what you mean, please explain? I thought I had to earn it by my works, are you saying I just need to trust in Jesus now??. I'm confused????

You see, you dont seem to know Jesus.

You have to get to know Jesus and read the New Testament thoroughly, and be faithful to Jesus until the end to be saved.

Happy reading, dude.

.

 

[vja4Him]

Re: Bump for Drew ....

Bump for Drew ....

Drew -- You continue to conveniently avoid the question I addressed several pages back. You DID contradict yourself, and you know it ... !!! How can you logically explain that ...

Here is what YOU said yourself:

"who assert the necessity of "good works" for salvation, such as I am asserting"

and:

"I would agree that "our own good works" are not necessary for salvation."

You see very clearly that you did admit that good works are necessary for salvation. BUT ... then you changed your stance and claim that our own good works are NOT necessary for salvation.

It appears as if you are playing games .... You can't have it both ways.

I am not playing games, as you suggest. Let me try to explain.

When I wrote this:

"who assert the necessity of "good works" for salvation, such as I am assertingâ€

…I mean what I say – good works are indeed a necessary condition for salvation – as Paul says in Romans 2.

When I wrote this:

"I would agree that "our own good works" are not necessary for salvation."

…I was careful to indicate that it my good works are not necessary for salvation. But good works are still needed – the ones produced by the Spirit.

In other words: Good works that arise from the unregenerate person based on “self-effort†do not “count†for salvation. But the works produced by the Spirit do.

I hope this clarifies things.

Hmmm ... That's an interesting twist, but I already knew that angle from your theological camp. So, Drew, who is actually performing those physical acts of good deeds? You, right?

Even though God works through us, we are still doing the physical works. We are not puppets. God is not forcing us, beating us, whipping us, threatening to torture or kill us if we don't do the good works.

We are still doing them, right? So, you are just putting a different twist to your belief, that works are necessary for salvation.

I still disagree .... There are absolutely NO works that you can do which will save you. If you trust in your works, then you have not trusted in the work of Christ on the cross, and His precious blood.

 

[jasoncran]

shad, one will never know all there's to know, and what you describe is salvation by works.

 

[shad]

Re: Bump for Drew ....

There are absolutely NO works that you can do which will save you.

So you are saying you dont have to obey Jesus to be saved. This is just absurd.

.

 

[shad]

shad, one will never know all there's to know, and what you describe is salvation by works.

You dont seem to honor Jesus' word and commandments.

.

 

[shad]

shad, one will never know all there's to know,

Jesus does not give us commandments we cannot obey. Where is your faith?

Do you know that Jesus tells us to make every effort to go into God's kingdom?

.

 

[vja4Him]

Round and Round We Go ....

There are absolutely NO works that you can do which will save you.

So you are saying you dont have to obey Jesus to be saved. This is just absurd.

.

Here we go, round and round ... Is anyone dizzy yet ... ???

 

[jasoncran]

are you the lord, and who are you to judge me, i came up from a far more legalistic system than you think,

are you married, when you do things for your wife is it because you love her, or is it to gain love?
one can not love and give and do things for another, but one cant not love without doing or giving.

that's what salvation is the latter,not the former. because he first loved us, we are able to love, we have that freedom to love.

we are saved by grace, and a that evidence will produce fruit that is worthy of the repentance.

have you not read that part where we see in part, and know in part, the end times and the whole bible is what i'm addressing, or are you so perfect in the law that you can see what is grey and say that it is black and white on some things that arent so defined in the bible that are in principle there. ie

medical ethics is one of those areas.

 

[vja4Him]

Re: Bump for Drew ....

There are absolutely NO works that you can do which will save you.

So you are saying you dont have to obey Jesus to be saved. This is just absurd.

.

Don't you believe God's promises? Don't you trust Jesus' word?

John 10:27-29

27 My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. 28 And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand. 29 My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of My Father’s hand.

 

[shad]

Re: Bump for Drew ....

[

Don't you believe God's promises? Don't you trust Jesus' word?

dont you listen to what Jesus says? He says to be faithful to Him until the end.

 

[vja4Him]

Do Works Really Save You ... ???

Do works really save you ... ???

1 Corinthians 3:11-15

11For no one can lay any foundation other than the one already laid, which is Jesus Christ. 12If any man builds on this foundation using gold, silver, costly stones, wood, hay or straw, 13his work will be shown for what it is, because the Day will bring it to light. It will be revealed with fire, and the fire will test the quality of each man's work. 14If what he has built survives, he will receive his reward. 15If it is burned up, he will suffer loss; he himself will be saved, but only as one escaping through the flames.

Notice that some people's works will be burned up. There was obviously something wrong with their works! So, according to your theology (that you must have works to be saved), they should lose their salvation!

BUT ... They did NOT lose their salvation! They lost their works, which were burned up. But they were STILL SAVED ... !!!

There's a huge hole in your theology ... Your Salvation by Works theology doesn't hold water ...

And that's not alll ... Read the above scriptures carefully, and you will see clearly that if my works survive, I will receive what ... ??? Not salvation, but rather my rewards ... !!!

You see, our works are for our rewards, not for our salvation. Jesus already did the work on the cross. His blood is what saves us. We need to put our faith in Jesus, not our works. We will have works, yes. And each person's works are different. I'm sure that some of my works will be burned up. But I'm confident that at least some of my works will stand the test, and I'll receive my rewards in heaven.

Romans 10:9-10, “9That if you confess with your mouth, "Jesus is Lord," and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. 10For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you confess and are saved.â€

 

[shad]

="jasoncran"
are you the lord, and who are you to judge me, i came up from a far more legalistic system than you think,

So you believe you dont have to obey Jesus to be saved. You are wrong friend.

.

 

[shad]

Re: Do Works Really Save You ... ???

Do works really save you ... ???

Are you really saved without being faithful to Jesus? Nope.

 

[jasoncran]

if you are going to quote me and post that at least read and look at the bottom of the post and then make that, never did i say that are not to obey christ, i said that we will follow him because out of his love for us and we are recripocoating that back to him(lord) as that is EVIDENCE OF OUR SALVATION, WE DO IT BECAUSE WE WANT TO PLEASE OUR FATHER, NOT OUT OF FEAR IF WE DONT IT'S HELL, BUT BECAUSE GENUINELLY WANT TO OUT OF LOVE FOR HIM.

when i was a sinner i could care less about what god wants, now as a beliver i care a whole lot more and desire to please him and it feels good when i do, i want to please him, because i know that he cares for me, and is worthy of such things.

 

[Panin]

No, I have no idea what you mean, please explain? I thought I had to earn it by my works, are you saying I just need to trust in Jesus now??. I'm confused????

You see, you dont seem to know Jesus.

You have to get to know Jesus and read the New Testament thoroughly, and be faithful to Jesus until the end to be saved.

Happy reading, dude.

.

Ive read it heap of times, I need your divine guidance though, Im not quite getting how to save myself. I really need your help with this one. Please let me know. Also how do I get to know Jesus??

Im feeling very lost? Do you feel like that? If not how do I stop feeling lost???

DO I just need to read my bible every day? If so how many capters perday will do it??

 

[vja4Him]

Go, Sell Everything You Have ... !!!

shad, one will never know all there's to know,

Jesus does not give us commandments we cannot obey. Where is your faith?

Do you know that Jesus tells us to make every effort to go into God's kingdom?

.

Shad -- Then why don't you follow Jesus' commandment:

Mark 10:

17As Jesus started on his way, a man ran up to him and fell on his knees before him. "Good teacher," he asked, "what must I do to inherit eternal life?"

18"Why do you call me good?" Jesus answered. "No one is good—except God alone. 19You know the commandments: 'Do not murder, do not commit adultery, do not steal, do not give false testimony, do not defraud, honor your father and mother.'[a]"

20"Teacher," he declared, "all these I have kept since I was a boy."

21Jesus looked at him and loved him. "One thing you lack," he said. "Go, sell everything you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me."