Sinless for as long as God lives

[reba]

I dont know anyone that believes 'works' will save ya.
We do good works because we are saved. not to 'get' saved

 

[GodsGrace]

Ok, say i ask Wondering why he is working so hard to be saved, if Jesus already saved him.
And he says, '" because i have to keep the commandments of Jesus and hold unto my faith, or i will lose my salvation".

So, i say, but you are ALREADY SAVED.... its a DONE DEAL......and God does not require a Part II to the finished work of Christ that has redeemed you already..

Then Wondering says....."yes, i know im already saved, but NOW I HAVE TO DO DO DO DO DO, to keep it".

Kidron says....."face palm".

So, that is the endless loop that you find yourself dealing with when someone says they know they ARE SAVED, but then they say they have to do do do do do do works works works commandments commandments to keep it.

Hi kidron,
I'm happy that you like me enough to mention me.
I just need you to know that I'm a girl.

I'm not working hard to be saved.
Being with Jesus is a joy -
NOT a work.

It's not easy to speak about spiritual matters. We are spirits in a material world. This makes it difficult.

The reason, I feel, that you separate Jesus and Paul is because Jesus was works oriented.
What was Mathew 5 about? The sermon on the mount. He does not come to abolish the Law.
no one is to annul even one of the commandments. Do not be angry with your brother. Leave your offerings. If your right eye make you stumble, pluck it out. (not literally!). Make no false vows. Turn the other cheeck, which means to not care what man thinks of you, give a man suing you your shirt also, give to him who asks of you,

Need I go on?

Works are there Kidron. You keep saying that they don't save us.
I AGREE.

But you do need to keep them after you're saved.
Mathew 7: 21

Wondering

 

[for_his_glory]

Not sure if anyone else caught this of what Kidron said in his OP, but this is what was said by him: "From the moment of conversion, 2 things happen and continue happening for you, that last for as long as God lives"............. Kidron, do you really believe God will die someday?

 

[Cygnus]

Not sure if anyone else caught this of what Kidron said in his OP, but this is what was said by him: "From the moment of conversion, 2 things happen and continue happening for you, that last for as long as God lives"............. Kidron, do you really believe God will die someday?

I thought it was a unique way of saying...forever.

 

[for_his_glory]

I thought it was a unique way of saying...forever.

To me there is no need for a unique way of putting it that way as it can apply that God will die and we know that can not ever happen.

 

[for_his_glory]

When we are Spiritually born again, John 3:3-6, Romans 10:9,10, we are regenerated in our human spirit as we are given a new nature, but yet the old nature has not been removed yet as we have not yet received our new glorified bodies as we still live in this fleshly body.

James makes it very clear in James 4:17 Therefore to him that knoweth to do good, and doeth it not, to him it is sin. How many of us have known better, but went ahead and sinned anyway.

Again, James gives us the reason why we still sin and it has nothing to do with Satan, but only us not guarding ourselves.

James 3:1 My brethren, be not many masters, knowing that we shall receive the greater condemnation. 2 For in many things we offend all. If any man offend not in word, the same is a perfect man, and able also to bridle the whole body. 3 Behold, we put bits in the horses' mouths, that they may obey us; and we turn about their whole body. 4 Behold also the ships, which though they be so great, and are driven of fierce winds, yet are they turned about with a very small helm, whithersoever the governor listeth. 5 Even so the tongue is a little member, and boasteth great things. Behold, how great a matter a little fire kindleth! 6 And the tongue is a fire, a world of iniquity: so is the tongue among our members, that it defileth the whole body, and setteth on fire the course of nature; and it is set on fire of hell. 7 For every kind of beasts, and of birds, and of serpents, and of things in the sea, is tamed, and hath been tamed of mankind: 8 But the tongue can no man tame; it is an unruly evil, full of deadly poison. 9 Therewith bless we God, even the Father; and therewith curse we men, which are made after the similitude of God. 10 Out of the same mouth proceedeth blessing and cursing. My brethren, these things ought not so to be.

 

[Free]

There is no scripture that shows that the flesh itself is evil. The flesh is against the Spirit and contrary to the Spirit PRECISELY because temptations, lusts and deceptions thereIN, withIN, are internal and are of our adversary.

That's also why the notion of "excusing our whole self" in the Name of Jesus is entirely futile, which is what most of the OSAS crowd tries vainly to do.

Though I too adhere to OSAS, I will never extend the Grace and Mercy of God in Christ to the evil present with me. I know for a fact that didn't happen. I also know that "works" are not going to change the conclusion either BUT they are a fantastic way to TORTURE our adversary, which is WHY I engage in "good works." It drives the devils crazy.

It seems to me that you're saying that you and all believers are indwelt by devils. Is that correct?

 

[JLB]

My dog of ten years also dies about 3 weeks ago. We do miss those animals.

But will they be in heaven? I'd like to think so...but is there any biblical support?

You have added the idea of then being in heaven.

We will be on earth, with the Lord, when He comes to gather His people at the resurrection/rapture.

The only question that really needs to be asked, is: Are their animals in heaven or in the spirit realm?

The answer is yes.

11 Now I saw heaven opened, and behold, a white horse. And He who sat on him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness He judges and makes war. 12 His eyes were like a flame of fire, and on His head were many crowns. He had a name written that no one knew except Himself. 13 He was clothed with a robe dipped in blood, and His name is called The Word of God. 14 And the armies in heaven, clothed in fine linen, white and clean, followed Him on white horses. Revelation 19:11-14

Then it happened, as they continued on and talked, that suddenly a chariot of fire appeared with horses of fire, and separated the two of them; and Elijah went up by a whirlwind into heaven. 2 Kings 2:11


And Elisha prayed, and said, “Lord, I pray, open his eyes that he may see.” Then the Lord opened the eyes of the young man, and he saw. And behold, the mountain was full of horses and chariots of fire all around Elisha. 2 Kings 6:17



JLB

 

[reba]

some time things said are not to be dissected .... or challenged...

Members can have emotions about their pets....
and we often say things " tongue in cheek'
example 'That last as long as God lives'
Disagreeing with theology or dogma is fine.. sometimes we need to back off

ADMIN

 

[ezrider]

Kidron,

You have now started multiple threads all basically on the same subject, that being the blood of Christ. I am not going to address any particular comment from any of these threads that you have started but I do have one simple question that I hope you might answer.

Were you born under the Old Covenant, where you born under the Law, that you should require redemption?

Galatians 4:4-5
But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law, To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons.

Hebrews 9:15
And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.

 

[smaller]

It seems to me that you're saying that you and all believers are indwelt by devils. Is that correct?

I believe the tempter tempts internally, deceives internally, blinds people to the Gospel internally and steals the Word from people's hearts internally and is directly connected to every sin. 1 Thes. 3:5, Rev. 3:9, Acts 26:18, Romans 11:8, 2 Cor. 4:4, Mark 4:15 (and all the other seed parables), 1 John 3:8 for quick scriptural references on every count. We "battle" enemies unseen, the devil. Eph. 6:11-12. Not flesh and blood.

I believe that class of entities was created precisely to perform all the above activities.

Please don't bother me with Hollywood movie depictions of possessed head spewing and vomit spewing if that is where you are headed.

 

[Chopper]

Everything that you write is absolutely right Brother, except the sinless part. For a few split seconds after being born again by the power of God and His Christ, one is sinless. It doesn't take very long before a sinful thought or action cancels out the sinless part and he needs to comply with....

1John 1:8 "If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
1:9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
1:10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us."

The sin/forgiveness continues until the grave. No man has ever or will never live a sinless life other than the God/man Jesus the Son of God. Sinless perfection is a false theory. It's false because of the evil one, Satan who is responsible for much, not all, of man's sins. Thank God, that even though we sin, we are kept by the power and promises of almighty God, Who Himself, as you explain, keeps us His children all thru our lives right up to, and including our entrance into God's Kingdom.

Our works simply identify our position in Christ Jesus. When we live according to Jesus' commands, we testify to the goodness and grace of God to the unsaved world which pleases God and that His delight in saving the lost was not in vain. Our "works" don't keep us saved. Only the power of Christ's shed blood does that. Our works are simply a sign that we are the children of God, nothing else.

You, Kidron, are an intelligent Believer in Christ Jesus, Your threads prove a deep thinking of the eternal effects of redemption. I have prayed this morning that the Holy Spirit would have you cease this sinless perfection hobby horse that you're riding, but continue to teach on the power of Christ Jesus' cross work in keeping us saved, plus nothing else.

 

[Kidron]

Never the less, those who practice the works of the flesh, will not inherit the kingdom of God.

-
JLB,

A born again Christian has ALREADY Inherited the Kingdom of God.
THIS IS REFERRED TO AT "THE ATONEMENT", "BORN AGAIN"......"SAVED".
HOW CAN YOU NOT KNOW THIS IF YOU ARE SAVED, JLB?
This is why you are "in Christ".
This is why you are become "bone of His (Jesus) bone, and flesh of His Flesh".
This is why ""Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son""
This is why you are "seated in Heavenly Place IN CHRIST", RIGHT NOW.
YOU ARE NOT WORKING YOUR WAY TO HEAVEN, YOU ARE ALREADY THERE, "IN CHRIST', If you are SAVED.
The only reason a Believer is not in the presence of God and Christ , LITERALLY, is because they are stuck down here, however, DEATH will solve that position and issue.

 

[Kidron]

Everything that you write is absolutely right Brother, except the sinless part. For a few split seconds after being born again by the power of God and His Christ, one is sinless. .

-

Brother, if the Blood of Christ does not keep you sinless, then hell is the end result of your journey and every believer's.
See, confession does not save you or get you into heaven,, as that is a work, (effort) and its not by our works we do but by Jesus's BLOOD according to God's GRACE that we are MADE RIGHTEOUS-Sinless......and this is a never ending Sinlessness that was purchased for you by the Blood of Jesus.

Chopper, i know your theology....Ok?.....I know what you believe, and i know you were taught to believe it by those who taught you.
Listen, everyone who is a Christian, when they get offtrack, theologically, its because they were led there by someone who led them off the track.
See, we dont know anything as a baby Christian, ....we are an empty page waiting for someone to write theology-doctrine into us, regarding what we will believe.
These are teachers that we find and follow, and if they are WRONG, then we are led astray.
So, here is your theology, and its the same for many here.

"""""" Jesus saved me, and then i messed up and sinned after HE SAVED ME,.... then i run to John 1:9 and "if we confess our sins he is faithful and just to forgive our sins, and cleanse us from all unrighteousness, and as long as i keep confessing I get to stay saved".
= NOPE. !!

So that is what you believe, and the problem with this is, ... that is isn't the truth.....that is not how Salvation, a GIFT, works.
What it is, is a legalist theology , a "keep myself saved by confession"....that does not understand 2 things about the Blood Atonement.
First, is that the blood of Jesus not only pays for all the sins we committed till we are saved, but it pays for all the sins you commit after you are saved.
Listen, if as you believe,, Salvation stops once you sin the day after you are redeemed by the Blood of the Lamb, then this means that you are unsaved again, you are lost again, and then Jesus would have to DIE AGAIN, to save you all over again.
Do you see it?

2nd, Read and Believe this verse........... Romans 4:8.
Chopper, when your New Testament (Paul) tells you that YOU are the blessed that God will never again charge you, or hold you accountable for your sins, any of them, once you are saved, then BELIEVE IT.
Paul is talking TO YOU and all BELIEVERS.
Realize that the reason God does not hold your sins against you anymore is because CHRIST HAS ALREADY BEEN KILLED FOR THEM ALL.

Its like this......
You sin.....Christ already died for that.
You sin.....Christ already died for that.
You sin 3456, 7890 times, and Christ has ALREADY PAID FOR THEM ALL ON THE CROSS.

Every sin, you sin, before or after you saved, ...Christ ALREADY DIED for them, before you were born.

You have this idea that salvation stops when you sin, but that is not true....the Truth is.... Salvation is created to pay for every sin, so that you dont have to after you die........and that is what Jesus is doing on that CROSS.
Salvation is created to establish you as a Sinless Son of God, so that you are then made worthy by the Blood Of Christ to live in a Sinless Heaven, with a Sinless God.
This is what Salvation, the Blood of Christ, The Death of Christ on a Cross, does for you.

 

[JLB]

-
JLB,

A born again Christian has ALREADY Inherited the Kingdom of God.

23 And whatever you do, do it heartily, as to the Lord and not to men, 24 knowing that from the Lord you will receive the reward of the inheritance; for you serve the Lord Christ. 25 But he who does wrong will be repaid for what he has done, and there is no partiality. Colossians 3:23-24

Those who are Christ's will be judged on the Day of Judgement before His throne:

What we did with the life He gave us will be evaluated.

31 “When the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the holy angels with Him, then He will sit on the throne of His glory. 32 All the nations will be gathered before Him, and He will separate them one from another, as a shepherd divides his sheep from the goats. 33 And He will set the sheep on His right hand, but the goats on the left. 34 Then the King will say to those on His right hand, ‘Come, you blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:41 “Then He will also say to those on the left hand, ‘Depart from Me, you cursed, into the everlasting fire prepared for the devil and his angels: Matthew 25:31-34,41

• Those Christians who inherit the kingdom, will be welcomed by the Lord on the Day of Judgement.
• Those Christians who do not inherit the kingdom, will be sentenced to the fires of hell.

who “will render to each one according to his deeds”:
eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality;
but to those who are self-seeking and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness—indignation and wrath,
Romans 2:6-8

JLB

YOU ARE ALREADY THERE, "IN CHRIST', If you are SAVED.

If you continue to believe, which is to say, if you abide or remain in Him.

Those who no longer believe, have return to unbelieving.

How can you still be a believer, if you no longer believe?


JLB

 

[Kidron]

23 And whatever you do, do it heartily, as to the Lord


JLB

-
Listen JBL, we GET that you have a "do stuff yourself" to be "saved" gospel.
However, God's gospel is a Blood Atonement that Jesus did for us.
So, those 2 dont connect., and you might want to consider this before you post more "works to be saved, works to stay saved", theology that runs counter to the Grace of God.

 

[JLB]

-
Listen JBL, we GET that you have a "do stuff yourself" to be "saved" gospel.
However, God's gospel is a Blood Atonement that Jesus did for us.
So, those 2 dont connect., and you might want to consider this before you post more "works to be saved, works to stay saved", theology that runs counter to the Grace of God.

Another post with no scripture.

The Gospel of opinion.

who “will render to each one according to his deeds”:
eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality;
but to those who are self-seeking and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness—indignation and wrath,
Romans 2:6-8

Those who have been born again, and are partakers of the Holy Spirit are likened to:

the earth which drinks in the rain that often comes upon it, and bears herbs useful for those by whom it is cultivated, receives blessing from God; 8 but if it bears thorns and briers, it is rejected and near to being cursed, whose end is to be burned.


Full Context:

4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted the heavenly gift, and have become partakers of the Holy Spirit,5 and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6 if they fall away, to renew them again to repentance, since they crucify again for themselves the Son of God, and put Him to an open shame.
7 For the earth which drinks in the rain that often comes upon it, and bears herbs useful for those by whom it is cultivated, receives blessing from God; 8 but if it bears thorns and briers, it is rejected and near to being cursed, whose end is to be burned.

Hebrews 6:4-8


JLB

 

[Kidron]

but to those who are self-seeking and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness—indignation and wrath,
Romans 2:6-8

JLB

-
JLB,

You are teaching religion in place of the Blood Atonement.
Its all you do.,nearly every post.

>> Religion is man's effort to save himself, to reach God by his EFFORT, and to try to become like God through works- deeds.<<

That is your Gospel, and is not the Gospel of the GRACE of God.

JLB,
To obey the Truth is to realize WHO is the truth....... John 14:6
To have eternal life is to have the one who IS Eternal life... 1 John 5:12,13
To do the work of God is to BELIEVE ON the one God sent.... John 6:29

 

[JLB]

JLB,

You are teaching religion in place of the Blood Atonement.
Its all you do.,nearly every post.

>> Religion is man's effort to save himself, to reach God by his EFFORT, and to try to become like God through works- deeds.<<

That is your Gospel, and is not the Gospel of the GRACE of God.

Did I write these words?

who “will render to each one according to his deeds”:
eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality;
but to those who are self-seeking and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness—indignation and wrath,
Romans 2:6-8

If you don't like what is in the bible then take it up with the Lord.

 

[JLB]

JLB,
To obey the Truth is to realize WHO is the truth....... John 14:6
To have eternal life is to have the one who IS Eternal life... 1 John 5:12,13
To do the work of God is to believe on the one God sent.... John 6:29

“But why do you call Me ‘Lord, Lord,’ and not do the things which I say? Luke 6:46