Sinless To Be Saved

[Free]

you don't think scripture says to worship Mary?

No, it absolutely does not. That would be blasphemy.

 

[Bruce Leiter]

you don't think scripture says to worship Mary?

I don't, donadams. Where do you find such a command in the Bible?

 

[JesusFan]

you don't think scripture says to worship Mary?

No, we are to worship ONLY God

 

[Fish153]

you don't think scripture says to worship Mary?

Absolutely not.

 

[GodsGrace]

Those who seek to be justified in sight of God by any Law keeping, by any works have fallen from grace, are relying uon a false gospel to save them

I sure do hope Free sees this.

It sounds like you don't believe in law keeping...
any works.
and if we do works we will have fallen from grace.

You're making the statemen that this is a false gospel.

I wonder if you're aware that all Jesus did for over 3 years was to teach that we are to
behave a certain way, do good works that are pleasing to God...and obey His commandments.

You did say ANY law keeping...this includes good works.

So tell us JesusFan....
What do YOU think Jesus preached for over 3 years?

NOT keeping His law.
NOT doing good works.
NOT behaving as God would want us to?

 

[GodsGrace]

God'sGrace----

Yes--- it does show that they were NOT TRUE believers. How do we know this? Jesus says "I NEVER KNEW YOU".

But the Bible says : "Nevertheless the foundation of God stands sure, having this seal, THE LORD KNOWS THEM THAT ARE HIS. And, let every one that names the name of Christ depart from iniquity". (2 Timothy 2:19)

This says clearly that the Lord KNOWS THEM THAT ARE HIS. But Matthew 7:22,23 says "I NEVER KNEW YOU" which means THEY WERE NEVER SAVED. Note also: Those who KNOW him are to depart from iniquity. Your works don't save you----you are saved TO DO GOOD WORKS.

I've already replied to the above.

YOU have not shown where it states that "they" were not true believers.
Sorry, but I don't see this statement anywhere.

The reason we have a problem in our faith is because some read into what the plain scripture states.

Let's try again:

Matthew 7:21-23
21“Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father who is in heaven will enter.
22“Many will say to Me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in Your name, and in Your name cast out demons, and in Your name perform many miracles?’
23“And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; DEPART FROM ME, YOU WHO PRACTICE LAWLESSNESS.’


Now let's see if we can answer these questions:

1. Who will enter into the Kingdom of heaven?

2. Why were some not allowed into the Kingdom of Heaven?

 

[GodsGrace]

So, what you're saying is, their lawless works were evidence they weren't saved, correct?


I grasp full well what you're saying. I strongly disagree with what you're saying. You think you're simply sticking to Scripture, but you're not. You're taking things out of context and so pitting Scripture against itself. Our works do not keep us saved, they are evidence of whether or not we're saved. God saves us and keeps us saved; that is his work, not ours.

No.
What I'm saying is that you're adding words to scripture.
Jesus said NOTHING about being saved or not being saved.

Here, again, is what Jesus stated:


Matthew 7:21-23
21“Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father who is in heaven will enter.
22“Many will say to Me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in Your name, and in Your name cast out demons, and in Your name perform many miracles?’
23“And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; DEPART FROM ME, YOU WHO PRACTICE LAWLESSNESS.’


I'll ask you the same questions I just asked another member:

1. Who will enter into the Kingdom of heaven?

2. Why were some not allowed into the Kingdom of Heaven?

 

[GodsGrace]

True, but it is the view held by Reformed and MANY Baptists like myself

I know this and can't remember why you're posting this and don't really care to discuss it anyway...
if you want to proceed, you'll have to bring me up to date...been too busy. Sorry.

 

[GodsGrace]

Which is not relevant. Any keeping of the law as a means to salvation--"If you want to be saved, you must keep the law of God"--is a false gospel.

As to your question, "Do you not even agree that we are to keep the MORAL LAW??," you're taking me out of context just as you do the Scriptures. Take everything I say together and stop taking things out of context. I have stated numerous times that we obey God, but that our obedience does not save us.


Yet, you previously said "I fully agree with the OP." So, which is it? Do you agree with me and Paul or with the OP?


Same difference. Adding any works is a false gospel. You're actually implying that "good works" can justify us, which is something you claim to deny.

2Ti 1:9 who saved us and called us to a holy calling, not because of our works but because of his own purpose and grace, which he gave us in Christ Jesus before the ages began, (ESV)

Tit 3:4 But when the goodness and loving kindness of God our Savior appeared,
Tit 3:5 he saved us, not because of works done by us in righteousness, but according to his own mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit,
Tit 3:6 whom he poured out on us richly through Jesus Christ our Savior,
Tit 3:7 so that being justified by his grace we might become heirs according to the hope of eternal life.
Tit 3:8 The saying is trustworthy, and I want you to insist on these things, so that those who have believed in God may be careful to devote themselves to good works. These things are excellent and profitable for people. (ESV)


Yes, you say that, but as I have pointed out several times, you have also said we are saved by works:

"our good works save us" (HERE); "What keeps us saved is obeying God to the best of our ability" (HERE); "We must believe AND obey in order to be saved" (HERE and HERE); "OBEDIENCE is NECESSARY for salvation" (HERE); and "Our works keep us saved" (HERE and HERE).

I've also pointed out that 'there is no difference between saying "works keep us saved" and "our works save us to begin with."' This is exactly what Paul is getting at in Gal. 3:3--"Are you so foolish? Having begun by the Spirit, are you now being perfected by the flesh?"


But you said this:

"Notice that the OP is addressing the MORAL LAW.
Do you not even agree that we are to keep the MORAL LAW??"

That is a work of the Law.

You believe that keeping the MORAL LAW is a work of THE LAW?

I have nothing further to discuss.

Your statements are not in keeping with what Jesus taught.
You are misleading many Christians, both new and old that have this odd belief that we are not required to obey God or do good works......

In one sentence you say you agree that we are to do good works....
In the next sentence you state that keeping the Moral Law is a work of THE LAW.

Very confusing indeed.