Some Won't Get Saved

[for_his_glory]

Yet, those verses do not say God will blot the names of his predetermined elect out of the Lamb's Book of Life.

Remember, Revelation scripture tells us there are many books of God at his judgement seat.

That's because God never predestined anyone other than His plan of salvation through Christ Jesus before the foundation of the world. God is no respecter of person and all have sinned and fallen short of His glory. Only those whose names were written in the book of life before the foundation of the world remain in that book as they are overcomers through Christ Jesus being God's plan of salvation for them as they believed on the name of Jesus and repented of their sins.

But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death. These are those who God blotted out of the book of life, Rev 21:8.

Rev 20:11 And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.
Rev 20:12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
Rev 20:13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.
Rev 20:14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
Rev 20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.


Rev 21:7 He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.
Rev 21:8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.

 

[Chocolate Roadrunner]

Some will be blotted out of His book of life.


He who overcomes shall be clothed in white garments, and I will not blot out his name from the Book of Life; but I will confess his name before My Father and before His angels. Revelation 3:5



For I testify to everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds to these things, God will add to him the plagues that are written in this book; and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part from the Book of Life, from the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book. Revelation 22:18-19





JLB

Revelation 3:5 does not say God blots names out of the Book of Life.

Nor does Revelation 22:18-19. Taking away his part refers to the rewards reserved for the elect whose names are already written in the Book of Life.

God knew his elect before our creation.

 

[for_his_glory]

This is taken from www.gotquestions.org How can I know if I am one of the elect. There are some of their articles I do not agree with, but this one makes God's elect very clear.

The doctrine of election according to scripture is that God chooses, determines, elects and predestines who will be saved. The fact that believers are elect is undisputable.

Romans 8:29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren. 30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

Ephesians 1:4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: 5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will, 6 To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved. 7 In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace; 8 Wherein he hath abounded toward us in all wisdom and prudence; 9 Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself: 10 That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him: 11 In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will: 12 That we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ.

1 Thessalonians 1:2 We give thanks to God always for you all, making mention of you in our prayers; 3 Remembering without ceasing your work of faith, and labour of love, and patience of hope in our Lord Jesus Christ, in the sight of God and our Father; 4 Knowing, brethren beloved, your election of God. 5 For our gospel came not unto you in word only, but also in power, and in the Holy Ghost, and in much assurance; as ye know what manner of men we were among you for your sake.

God calls us to believe, to receive Christ Jesus as Savior, by grace through faith.

John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Ephesians 2: 8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 9 Not of works, lest any man should boast. 10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

No one can receive Jesus as Savior unless God draws them to Him and one cannot repent unless God grants repentance.

John 6: 44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Acts 11:18 When they heard these things, they held their peace, and glorified God, saying, Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance unto life.

If you have received Jesus Christ as your Savior, trusting Him alone for salvation, believing that His sacrifice is the full payment for your sins then you are one of God's elect.

 

[Chocolate Roadrunner]

This is taken from www.gotquestions.org How can I know if I am one of the elect. There are some of their articles I do not agree with, but this one makes God's elect very clear.

The doctrine of election according to scripture is that God chooses, determines, elects and predestines who will be saved. The fact that believers are elect is undisputable.

Romans 8:29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren. 30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

Ephesians 1:4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: 5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will, 6 To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved. 7 In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace; 8 Wherein he hath abounded toward us in all wisdom and prudence; 9 Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself: 10 That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him: 11 In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will: 12 That we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ.

1 Thessalonians 1:2 We give thanks to God always for you all, making mention of you in our prayers; 3 Remembering without ceasing your work of faith, and labour of love, and patience of hope in our Lord Jesus Christ, in the sight of God and our Father; 4 Knowing, brethren beloved, your election of God. 5 For our gospel came not unto you in word only, but also in power, and in the Holy Ghost, and in much assurance; as ye know what manner of men we were among you for your sake.

God calls us to believe, to receive Christ Jesus as Savior, by grace through faith.

John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Ephesians 2: 8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 9 Not of works, lest any man should boast. 10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

No one can receive Jesus as Savior unless God draws them to Him and one cannot repent unless God grants repentance.

John 6: 44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Acts 11:18 When they heard these things, they held their peace, and glorified God, saying, Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance unto life.

If you have received Jesus Christ as your Savior, trusting Him alone for salvation, believing that His sacrifice is the full payment for your sins then you are one of God's elect.

Elect Meaning - Bible Definition and References

Discover the meaning of Elect in the Bible. Study the definition of Elect with multiple Bible Dictionaries and Encyclopedias and find scripture references in the Old and New Testaments.

www.biblestudytools.com

The chosen of God are those who he saves.
As God tells us, we are saved by grace through faith that are from him, grace and faith. They're not of ourselves.

Ephesians 2
For by grace you are saved[s] through faith,[t] and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God;

Ephrsians 2 Koine, common, Greek.https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Ephesians+2&version=mounce

 

[Chocolate Roadrunner]

Btw, you are aware that Gotquestions.org are 4 point Calvinists?

What is Arminianism, and is it biblical? | GotQuestions.org

What is Arminianism, and is it biblical? How is Calvinism different from Arminianism?

www.gotquestions.org

"Four-point Calvinism (the official position of Got Questions Ministries) finds the other four points of Arminianism to be unbiblical, to varying degrees. Romans 3:10-18 strongly argues for total depravity....."

 

[JLB]

Revelation 3:5 does not say God blots names out of the Book of Life.

Nor does Revelation 22:18-19. Taking away his part refers to the rewards reserved for the elect whose names are already written in the Book of Life.

God knew his elect before our creation.

if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part from the Book of Life,


God has warned us about being removed from the book of life.


Your denial of the truth wont change it.

 

[Butch5]

This is taken from www.gotquestions.org How can I know if I am one of the elect. There are some of their articles I do not agree with, but this one makes God's elect very clear.

The doctrine of election according to scripture is that God chooses, determines, elects and predestines who will be saved. The fact that believers are elect is undisputable.

Romans 8:29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren. 30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

Ephesians 1:4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: 5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will, 6 To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved. 7 In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace; 8 Wherein he hath abounded toward us in all wisdom and prudence; 9 Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself: 10 That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him: 11 In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will: 12 That we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ.

1 Thessalonians 1:2 We give thanks to God always for you all, making mention of you in our prayers; 3 Remembering without ceasing your work of faith, and labour of love, and patience of hope in our Lord Jesus Christ, in the sight of God and our Father; 4 Knowing, brethren beloved, your election of God. 5 For our gospel came not unto you in word only, but also in power, and in the Holy Ghost, and in much assurance; as ye know what manner of men we were among you for your sake.

God calls us to believe, to receive Christ Jesus as Savior, by grace through faith.

John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Ephesians 2: 8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 9 Not of works, lest any man should boast. 10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

No one can receive Jesus as Savior unless God draws them to Him and one cannot repent unless God grants repentance.

John 6: 44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Acts 11:18 When they heard these things, they held their peace, and glorified God, saying, Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance unto life.

If you have received Jesus Christ as your Savior, trusting Him alone for salvation, believing that His sacrifice is the full payment for your sins then you are one of God's elect.

I avoid GotQuestions at all costs. I've found so much error on that site. The idea that God has chosen people to be saved before the foundation of the world is a Reformation doctrine. It is not supported by Scripture. The passages that are typically sited to support the doctrine, when understood in context, actually don't. God has chosen Israel.

 

[Chocolate Roadrunner]

if anyone takes away from the of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part from the Book of Life,


God has warned us about being removed from the book of life.


Your denial of the truth wont change it.

Same to you.

Misunderstanding God's word through differing translations, versions, can lead us to believe God did not actually foreknow those who were to be his elect, and by name, when he wrote those names in his Book of Life/Lamb's Book of Life.
And that then calls into question his sovereignty and Omniscience.


"his part on the book of life." Per your New King James Version of scripture.
Your part. Not, your place Nor, your name, in the Book of Life, but your part or share.

What John is warning against, as in, anyone who takes away from the prophecies in this book of revelations he was writing.

We are told at our judgement each will be rewarded according to their works. Matthew 16:27, Romans 2:6

While works cannot save us, when we are saved we are then in service to God. We serve according to his will and what he calls us to do in service to his kingdom.

Ephesians 1:11 in Him, in whom also we have obtained an inheritance, having been predestined according to the purpose of the One working all things according to the counsel of His will.

Bible Gateway passage: Revelation 22:18-19 - Mounce Reverse Interlinear New Testament

I bear witness to everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: if anyone should add to them, God will add to him the plagues described in this book; and if anyone should take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God will take away his share from the tree of life and...

www.biblegateway.com

Revelation 22:18-19"God will take away his share."
share
meros

Mounce Reverse Interlinear
μέρος (meros)
Strong: G3313
GK: G3538

a part, portion, division, of a whole, Lk. 11:36; 15:12; Acts 5:2; Eph. 4:16; a piece, fragment, Lk. 24:42; Jn. 19:23; a party, faction, Acts 23:9; allotted portion, lot, destiny, Mt. 24:51; Lk. 12:46; a calling, craft, Acts 19:27; a partner’s portion, partnership, fellowship, Jn. 13:8; pl. μέρη, a local quarter, district, region, Mt. 2:22; 16:13; Acts 19:1; Eph. 4:9; side of a ship, Jn. 21:6; ἐν μέρει, in respect, 2 Cor. 3:10; 9:3; Col. 2:16; 1 Pet. 4:16; μέρος τι, partly, in some part, 1 Cor. 11:18; ἀνὰ μέρος, alternately, one after another, 1 Cor. 14:27; ἀπὸ μέρους, partly, in some part or measure, 2 Cor. 1:14; ἐκ μέρους, individually, 1 Cor. 12:27; partly, imperfectly, 1 Cor. 13:9; κατὰ μέρος, particularly, in detail, Heb. 9:5

Revelation 22:19 is a warning to not tamper with God's prophecies in that book of his revelations to us. He is sovereign we are not.

God's predetermining all things according to his will and purpose is evident in the prophecy's that are all through scripture.

Prophecy [N] [T]
or prediction, was one of the functions of the prophet. It has been defined as a "miracle of knowledge, a declaration or description or representation of something future, beyond the power of human sagacity to foresee, discern, or conjecture." (See PROPHET .)

 

[JLB]

Misunderstanding God's word through differing translations, versions, can lead us to believe God did not actually foreknow those who were to be his elect, and by name, when he wrote those names in his Book of Life/Lamb's Book of Life.
And that then calls into question his sovereignty and Omniscience.

No misunderstanding what God’s word say’s.


For I testify to everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds to these things, God will add to him the plagues that are written in this book; and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part from the Book of Life, from the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book. Revelation 22:18-19

• and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part from the Book of Life,

Do you believe if anyone takes away from the words of this book, God will take away his part from the book of Life?

 

[Episcopius]

1. to draw, drag off
2. metaph., to draw by inward power, lead, impel

TWO definitions given for G1670 - helko

Simon Peter drawing his sword to cut a guy's ear off would be #1
so would the disciples dragging their nets to the other side of the boat

People are drawn by inward power - led - impelled

 

[Chocolate Roadrunner]

No misunderstanding what God’s word say’s.


For I testify to everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds to these things, God will add to him the plagues that are written in this book; and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part from the Book of Life, from the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book. Revelation 22:18-19

• and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part from the Book of Life,

Do you believe if anyone takes away from the words of this book, God will take away his part from the book of Life?

I've told you what I believe.
God tells us, he will never take the name of his chosen elect from the Book of Life.
If I believed he would do this, I believe that would be taking away from God's words that assure me of eternal security in him. And I would also be challenging God's telling me of his foreknowledge and predestination of all things, according to his will and plan.

He is sovereign.I am not.
If I believe in God and his word, I must believe what he tells me of himself in his word.
He told me : John 6:37
All that the Father gives me shall come to me; and him that comes to me I will in no wise cast out. that. John 6:39,45 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day…

 

[Episcopius]

definition #2 of helko would be God impelling and drawing by inward power

"If I be lifted up - I will draw all men..."

Jesus is not up in heaven pulling on a million ropes to DRAG people to Himself

1. to draw, drag off
2. metaph., to draw by inward power, lead, impel

 

[Episcopius]

Calvinists simply DON'T WANT TO LOOK AT the second definition of HELKO - it messes up their system

There is an old hymn - "He leadeth me."

Calvinists would change it to "He draggeth me"

 

[Episcopius]

Jhn 6:44
No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw G1670 him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Jhn 12:32
And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw G1670 all men unto me.


The FATHER can impel and draw by inward power. Being Spirit - he does not DRAG anything physically.
Jesus - being lifted up on the Cross - draws all men to Himself.

There are only a half-dozen more instances of HELKO in the NT. It is easy to see which definition is being used in all cases.

 

[Episcopius]

Rev 3:5
He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels.

 

[Episcopius]

Exo 32:33
And the LORD said unto Moses, Whosoever hath sinned against me, him will I blot out of my book.

 

[Chocolate Roadrunner]

Exo 32:33
And the LORD said unto Moses, Whosoever hath sinned against me, him will I blot out of my book.

Revelation 20:12 "I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne, and books were opened. Then another book was opened, which is the book of life. "


This is why I think God said we shouldn't lean on our own understanding.

Because the school of thought that insist we must labor to remain saved because we are not secure in the eternal covenant Jesus sealed on the cross with his spilled blood are taking away from God's word. And are invalidating Jesus sacrifice for our sin's.

What escapes such schools of thought are God's own words as pertains to his free irrevocable gift of grace. Eternal life. Eternal salvation. All whom the father calls, because he knows their names in his Book of eternal life, shall come to him. And he will never cast them out.
His sheep know his voice and he knows them. Because he wrote their names in the Book of Eternal Life. Jesus came to save those whom the father gave him.
We are sealed with Holy Spirit God.

Eternal life. Not conditional revocable salvation.
The Book of Life isn't part of the grace filled eternal salvation covenant when it is the book of conditional life.
God arrived to save whosoever believes in him. As Paul told us in Ephesians 2 faith/belief and salvation are free irrevocable gifts of God. As Jesus tells us , no one can come to him unless the father draws them. And Jesus said of that, no one will ever take us from his hand.
All pertains to God's foreknowledge and predestination of all things according to his will.

The verse that speaks to God blotting out names from his book is the same thing as saying those who transgress against him, though they thought themselves in the book, were,are, not.

"Psalm 69:28 May they be blotted out of the book of life and not be listed with the righteous.

Exodus 32:33 And the Lord said unto Moses
In answer to his request:
whosoever hath sinned against me, him will I blot out of my book;
not that anyone that is really in the book of life is ever blotted out, or that anyone predestinated or ordained to eternal life ever perish: but some persons may think themselves, and they may seem to be written in that book, or to be among the number of God's elect, but are not, and turn out obstinate impenitent sinners, and live and die in impenitence and unbelief; when it will appear that their names were never written in it, which, is the same thing as to be blotted out of it...."

Exodus 32:33 - Bible Verse Meaning and Commentary

What does Exodus 32:33 mean? Read commentary on this popular Bible verse and understand the real meaning behind God's Word using John Gill's Exposition of the Bible.

www.biblestudytools.com

Calvinists simply DON'T WANT TO LOOK AT the second definition of HELKO - it messes up their system

There is an old hymn - "He leadeth me."

Calvinists would change it to "He draggeth me"

Only if they didn't read the Bible in context and with the understanding granted them by holy spirit God.


Though they'd likely wonder why people say we are not saved by works, will later insist we can do something, work , to lose ,what God says is a free irrevocable gift of his grace.

Irrevocable.
Webster's Unabridged Dictionary:
Incapable of being recalled or revoked; unchangeable; irreversible; unalterable; as, an irrevocable promise or decree; irrevocable fate.

Greek
278. ametameletos -- not repented of
... Word Origin from alpha (as a neg. prefix) and metamelomai Definition not repented
of NASB Word Usage irrevocable (1), without regret (1). without regret. ...

This subject carries on making the same circles and arguments.
The one who insists they are not eternally secure in Christ live believing that.
That's not Biblical. But it is sad. Sadder still is they want to lead others to believe the same way.

Conditional salvation, work to stay saved,fear having salvation stripped away.
Very sad indeed

 

[Episcopius]

Heb 6:4

For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,

Heb 6:5
And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,

Heb 6:6
If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.


These verses definitely show that the "they" in 6:6 are NOT anyone that can be called "never saved to begin with".
They were once enlightened. They fell away. It's clear as a bell.

 

[Episcopius]

It is Calvinist John Gill who wrote the following paragraph - it is proper to document SOURCES.

"whosoever hath sinned against me, him will I blot out of my book;
not that anyone that is really in the book of life is ever blotted out, or that anyone predestinated or ordained to eternal life ever perish: but some persons may think themselves, and they may seem to be written in that book, or to be among the number of God's elect, but are not, and turn out obstinate impenitent sinners, and live and die in impenitence and unbelief; when it will appear that their names were never written in it, which, is the same thing as to be blotted out of it...."

It absolutely is NOT the "same thing" to never have your name written as to have it blotted out. It is two completely different things.

 

[Episcopius]

Luk 13:27
But he shall say, I tell you, I know you not whence ye are; depart from me, all ye workers of iniquity.

Not only "I never knew you" - but I know you not whence ye are.