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The burden of proof

Gary said:
The Holy Spirit is not a book. You're attributing knowledge and wisdom given to you by God as something that comes from a book.

You shouldn't do that. Especially since the bible itself says we have one teacher.

The bible is not a living entity.
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That's not what I said. I said it is through the book, not from the book. We do have one teacher, which is the Holy Spirit...and the bible is our textbook for His class. It is to be held above all other books, but it is not God.

th1b.taylor said:
In the Spiritual sense, it does read us... if the Holy Spirit is present and is not quenched it gives, each of us, exactly what we need at that time. If we are lost, membership or not, personal declaration of faith or not, it gives no more than the route to salvation...
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There you go brother. What Brother Taylor said.
 
I guess when I posted the scripture in Matthew 13, I should've added verse 11 He replied (Jesus), "The knowledge of the secrets of the kingdom of heaven has been given to you, but not to them.

Speaking to those people who go to the Word with not the right intentions.

Edit: just cause I was on the side of going to the Word with not the right intentions and I could not read it.
 
LovethroughDove said:
Jesus is the Word/Scripture. He came in the flesh in fulfillment of the Word. We eat and digest him/Word. How can you literally eat him, unless it is the part of him that is the Word?
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I like how you think. There may be something to this, that is spiritual in nature so we hesitate to grasp it, and yet, we have no idea of the ways that the spiritual realm (the Kingdom) operate, so tend to reject these paranormal thoughts. But looking into scripture, we see this illustrated a few times...where an Angel or whomever will tell an earthly man, to...eat this scroll (or whatever), and they did. Literally, according to scripture.

So there may in fact be a spiritual significance to what she says.

We don't know. Eat is to consume and take into ones self for nutrition and growth, but why would this have to be be fleshly only? That bible is spiritual food for our spirits and essential for our growth. We have to eat daily to live. We are also told to search the scriptures daily...Hmmm.

Let's not deny potential spiritual realities just because it doesn't fit in with our prior teaching, which we already know is a pack of lies for the most part. These are just spiritual things which we do not fully understand yet, but that it does not agree with our prior beliefs or understanding is no reason to deny the potential truth involved. The bible sure does talk about it a lot. There's something there...
 
Obadiah said:
Maybe some of you are mistaking a figure of speech for a literal statement? I didn't take it that anyone meant that the Bible (the physical ink and paper book) is what was "reading" us, but rather that the Holy Spirit uses it in a way that it can appear to be reading us.
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I know the difference, im not. the word there in JOHN is from the greek idea of Logos, and the armaic word Memre which means to speak. the word of God aka the bible is spoken but not literally. but that is another topic.
 
Edward said:
I like how you think. There may be something to this, that is spiritual in nature so we hesitate to grasp it, and yet, we have no idea of the ways that the spiritual realm (the Kingdom) operate, so tend to reject these paranormal thoughts. But looking into scripture, we see this illustrated a few times...where an Angel or whomever will tell an earthly man, to...eat this scroll (or whatever), and they did. Literally, according to scripture.

So there may in fact be a spiritual significance to what she says.

We don't know. Eat is to consume and take into ones self for nutrition and growth, but why would this have to be be fleshly only? That bible is spiritual food for our spirits and essential for our growth. We have to eat daily to live. We are also told to search the scriptures daily...Hmmm.

Let's not deny potential spiritual realities just because it doesn't fit in with our prior teaching, which we already know is a pack of lies for the most part. These are just spiritual things which we do not fully understand yet, but that it does not agree with our prior beliefs or understanding is no reason to deny the potential truth involved. The bible sure does talk about it a lot. There's something there...
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It just seems this is placing the Bible up as an idol and placing it at the same level as Christ Himself, they are not the same. The Bible is inspired by God, it points us TO Christ, not that it IS Christ.

God does not live in a book.

How does a person have a relationship with a book?
 
Jesse said:
What you have said is true, but the Holy Spirit also teaches us from other books. Not to mention, He teaches us through other people, through experiences and circumstances, from creation and on and on. God has given me answers to my questions through modern day authors, too.
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What you say is true. But the Word (The Bible) is in fact the premier book for seeking and obtaining righteousness and redemption. God's just smart enough to roll with it and use all available means to teach us. :)
 
Edward said:
That's not what I said. I said it is through the book, not from the book. We do have one teacher, which is the Holy Spirit...and the bible is our textbook for His class. It is to be held above all other books, but it is not God.
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It's still just a book and if I were to throw it in the trash, nothing bad would happen.
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Edward said:
What you say is true. But the Word (The Bible) is in fact the premier book for seeking and obtaining righteousness and redemption. God's just smart enough to roll with it and use all available means to teach us. :)
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Isn't God who we are to seek? As in seek His face and we obtain righteousness through Him?

What happens if there are groups of people who believe in Christ but they don't have a Bible? Can God not teach them because they lack one?
 
Jesse said:
Isn't God who we are to seek? As in seek His face and we obtain righteousness through Him?

What happens if there are groups of people who believe in Christ but they don't have a Bible? Can God not teach them because they lack one?
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True. But, it is easier to know someone though.....if you speak to them yourself.
 
Edward said:
What you say is true. But the Word (The Bible) is in fact the premier book for seeking and obtaining righteousness and redemption. God's just smart enough to roll with it and use all available means to teach us. :)
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One cannot obtain righteousness or redemption from a book!!!
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Jesse said:
It just seems this is placing the Bible up as an idol and placing it at the same level as Christ Himself, they are not the same. The Bible is inspired by God, it points us TO Christ, not that it IS Christ.

God does not live in a book.

How does a person have a relationship with a book?
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No, they are not the same, Jesus is Jesus and the book is the book.

God lives everywhere, He's in that book. He's in all. If we were bound to natural laws and so forth, then Paul would not have been able to effect the healing of people through his shadow merely falling on them, Jesus would have had to come down in person and lay hands on them or whatever. God's not a shadow and shadows don't live. But it happened.

The same way that you have a relationship with your girl and contact her through your texts or calls. It's not a relationship with a phone, it's the girl behind the phone, so it could be said that the phone can make you glad or sad, alone or together...along those lines. But when that girl speaks to you over the phone...you don't deny it or get confused and think you're having a relationship with a phone. There's an unseen force at work also. The girl at the other end. Or God.
 
Edward said:
No, they are not the same, Jesus is Jesus and the book is the book.

God lives everywhere, He's in that book. He's in all. If we were bound to natural laws and so forth, then Paul would not have been able to effect the healing of people through his shadow merely falling on them, Jesus would have had to come down in person and lay hands on them or whatever. God's not a shadow and shadows don't live. But it happened.

The same way that you have a relationship with your girl and contact her through your texts or calls. It's not a relationship with a phone, it's the girl behind the phone, so it could be said that the phone can make you glad or sad, alone or together...along those lines. But when that girl speaks to you over the phone...you don't deny it or get confused and think you're having a relationship with a phone. There's an unseen force at work also. The girl at the other end. Or God.
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Are you saying that the Bible is the life length to God (phone line)? If you don't mean that, I apologize, it's just that's what I am hearing.

I personally think our life length is the Holy Spirit because Jesus sent Him, He teaches us all things and with He in us, all things are a lesson from God, we are not bound by one book in our learning. The Bible has taught me about who God is and how he deals with people and it points us to Christ.

After this, we continue to read the Bible, of course, but our relationship is with Christ. He goes where I go and He teaches me out there in the world, without me having to read the Bible every minute.
 
LovethroughDove said:
I worship the Father. And I worship him because I have gotten to know him.
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I hope you have gotten to know Him outside of the Bible, too, because He wishes for you to have experiences with Him, as well. We can read about other people's experiences in the Bible but it's cool that He wants us to have our own personal experiences with Him, too.
 
Jesse said:
I hope you have gotten to know Him outside of the Bible, too, because He wishes for you to have experiences with Him, as well. We can read about other people's experiences in the Bible but it's cool that He wants us to have our own personal experiences with Him, too.
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Yes, but he made it crystal clear who he is through his word.
 
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